Chromebook Discussion

[iknownothing]

There is a positive hardware trade off with Chromebooks as well. Typically Chromebooks have better keyboards and trackpads than similarly priced windows machines, even in the four hundred dollar range. There is the storage trade off as well. If you want an ssd on your windows machine you'll generally need to spend upwards of 600.00. Chromebooks get away with doing it for less because they need less storage to run the operating system. If you intend to use online storage this may be an excellent trade off.

The other thing to think of is that remote desktop works really well. If it's not your only computer it may be a very good solution. It will essentially allow you to use your desktop from anywhere. The latency is all but unnoticable (perhaps in gaming it would be an issue).

If it's going to be your only computer it becomes a little bit more complicated, but here is my take.

Microsoft made a huge mistake with windows 8. They wanted to leverage their PC market share to gain in the mobile space. They therefore made the basis of windows 8 essentially a mobile interface. People don't want that though. People would prefer a mobile system that functions as much like a desktop as possible rather than the other way around. Google got this right. For many intents and purposes Chromebooks act more like windows machines than windows does now. That's what people who've never used one don't understand about Chromebooks. They get all the ux things right, which is a much bigger boon to productivity than you would imagine. Having an actual desktop environment with movable, resizable windows is a big deal. Google is making the case that the browser can be a virtual machine that is lightweight, can live on it's own, or inside a larger environment. It's still a bit limited, but their getting more convincing all the time.

 

[thatotherdude24]

There is a positive hardware trade off with Chromebooks as well. Typically Chromebooks have better keyboards and trackpads than similarly priced windows machines, even in the four hundred dollar range. There is the storage trade off as well. If you want an ssd on your windows machine you'll generally need to spend upwards of 600.00. Chromebooks get away with doing it for less because they need less storage to run the operating system. If you intend to use online storage this may be an excellent trade off.

The other thing to think of is that remote desktop works really well. If it's not your only computer it may be a very good solution. It will essentially allow you to use your desktop from anywhere. The latency is all but unnoticable (perhaps in gaming it would be an issue).

If it's going to be your only computer it becomes a little bit more complicated, but here is my take.

Microsoft made a huge mistake with windows 8. They wanted to leverage their PC market share to gain in the mobile space. They therefore made the basis of windows 8 essentially a mobile interface. People don't want that though. People would prefer a mobile system that functions as much like a desktop as possible rather than the other way around. Google got this right. For many intents and purposes Chromebooks act more like windows machines than windows does now. That's what people who've never used one don't understand about Chromebooks. They get all the ux things right, which is a much bigger boon to productivity than you would imagine. Having an actual desktop environment with movable, resizable windows is a big deal. Google is making the case that the browser can be a virtual machine that is lightweight, can live on it's own, or inside a larger environment. It's still a bit limited, but their getting more convincing all the time.

The keyboard comparison I do disagree with. I got the C720 and I think the keyboard is pretty bad, I think. Feels very cheap and the keys don't 'wholelly' press down when you push them. I do also realize I am using a $200 device. I love the touchpad.

Microsoft has always been the dominator in desktop OS's. Now they have competition and desktop devices are declining in favor of mobile devices. Their mentality was to create 1 OS to rule them all. That will not work. I don't speak for everybody but I work with standard users on a daily basis, when somebody picks up a tablet they have a different use in mind than sitting down with a laptop or desktop. I have used the Miix2, an 8'' W8.1 device and desktop mode is unusable because the desktop is so small.

Personally I have no problems with W8.1 but the way they went about it was not ideal, a VERY big change and sudden. I think the ideal option would have been to remove the desktop from RT and make that their mobile OS and keep W8.1 how it is.

 

[Aquila]

The keyboard comparison I do disagree with. I got the C720 and I think the keyboard is pretty bad, I think. Feels very cheap and the keys don't 'wholelly' press down when you push them. I do also realize I am using a $200 device. I love the touchpad.

Have you played with the HP11? The aesthetics and feel of that device are better than many $1000+ laptops. It's main hiccup is that it's the 2012 Samsung device on most of it's internals, with a much better shell and an amazing screen for a sub $1000 laptop. If only someone would have put the C720 specs or what Samsung is pushing out this year inside that wrapper...

 

[Algus]

1. Do you use a Chromebook and like it? Is it enough to be your daily device?

Yes, my second one in fact. Yes. I own a Mac Mini and I use Chrome Remote Desktop if I need some of the more sophisticated apps on the Mini but for the most part, I use my chromebook when I'm lounging around. Actually, I've got my Mini streaming some music right now w/visualizer while I kick back in my recliner and browse with my chromebook.

2. How is Google Docs for daily use?

Meh, I don't like it to be honest. A little buggy and slow. Just doesn't seem very responsive. It's better on my HP 14 than it was on my Samsung 3 but overall I am just not impressed with Google Docs Writer. There are some good solutions "in the cloud" like roll.app (slow but usable) and ZoHo Writer (excellent but online only). To be honest though, I boot Ubuntu so I can have LibreOffice run locally. Google Docs needs a bit more work IMO. It is AMAZING for collaboration though.

3. Do you think they will continue to grow in the business world?

Sure. As virtualization tech improves and online infrastructure improves. If we can reach the point where running apps over the internet is as seemless as running them locally, there really won't be a need for a device with super robust hardware. Chrome OS's problem isn't that it isn't capable of powering this kind of software, it's problem is that Google didn't have that software ready to go at launch. Chrome OS is much more sophisticated now than when it first came out a couple years ago.

4. In a podcast I watch somebody said Google and business should never be used in the same sentence, is Google bad for businesses?

I'm not touching this one. The software is certainly valuable for its collaborative use, sharing, and ability to access from anywhere. Whether Google is the company you want managing your business software is another question entirely.

5. Will future Chromebooks be released in the $200-$250 price range?

Acer's had some real winners with their C7 line. I think we'll see more high end model and luxury units but I don't think Acer's getting rid of their low end devices anytime soon.

6. Can a Chromebook be used for Android app development?

Passing on this one as I don't know

 

[thatotherdude24]

Have you played with the HP11? The aesthetics and feel of that device are better than many $1000+ laptops. It's main hiccup is that it's the 2012 Samsung device on most of it's internals, with a much better shell and an amazing screen for a sub $1000 laptop. If only someone would have put the C720 specs or what Samsung is pushing out this year inside that wrapper...

I have seen a lot about the HP11 but the aged internals is what pushed me away from it. I really liked how the charger was a Micro USB.

 

[Algus]

Oh, I've been pretty happy with the keyboard on the HP 14. Some people don't like chiclet keyboards though. I don't really get it but then I don't need my chromebook for long typing sessions so maybe it is just something I don't notice but it serves pretty well as a casual keyboard. I did like the look of the ThinkPad Lenovo released last year but that was limited to education markets so I never really got a chance to play around with it.

I'm all about doing Linux voodoo on my chromebooks so for me I don't really have the issue of Chrome OS being limited. I see a lot of value in what I'm paying vs what tech is included. Ubuntu is pretty robust on it, even running Steam and stuff. I'm sure it couldn't do much in the way of modern 3D gaming but I don't really about that as its what my desktop is for. As long as I can run Angband lol.

 

[B. Diddy]

I got the C720 and I think the keyboard is pretty bad, I think. Feels very cheap and the keys don't 'wholelly' press down when you push them

Is it that all the keys don't feel like they press down, or only some? When I got my C720, I noticed that the Backspace key didn't feel sproingy, like how you describe. I exchanged it immediately, and the replacement feels much better. I agree that it isn't a high end keyboard, but I find that typing on it is pretty smooth.

 

[thatotherdude24]

Is it that all the keys don't feel like they press down, or only some? When I got my C720, I noticed that the Backspace key didn't feel sproingy, like how you describe. I exchanged it immediately, and the replacement feels much better. I agree that it isn't a high end keyboard, but I find that typing on it is pretty smooth.

For example if I push down on the left side of the key only the left side of the key goes down....the right side stays up.

Oh, I've been pretty happy with the keyboard on the HP 14. Some people don't like chiclet keyboards though. I don't really get it but then I don't need my chromebook for long typing sessions so maybe it is just something I don't notice but it serves pretty well as a casual keyboard. I did like the look of the ThinkPad Lenovo released last year but that was limited to education markets so I never really got a chance to play around with it.

I'm all about doing Linux voodoo on my chromebooks so for me I don't really have the issue of Chrome OS being limited. I see a lot of value in what I'm paying vs what tech is included. Ubuntu is pretty robust on it, even running Steam and stuff. I'm sure it couldn't do much in the way of modern 3D gaming but I don't really about that as its what my desktop is for. As long as I can run Angband lol.

I don't think Chrome OS is as limited as some like to think. Before I bought mine I went through the extensions in the web store......there are extensions for EVERYTHING.

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What apps/extensions do you guys have on your Chromebooks?

 

[Aquila]

What apps/extensions do you guys have on your Chromebooks?

I used to have quite a lot, but I recently scaled back. Currently I use AdBlock, AndroidCentral.com, TxT, Buffer, F.B. Purity, Google +1 Button, Google Cast, Gliffy, Google Keep, Google Docs, Google Translate, Hangouts, Lucidchard, Magisto, Motorola Connect, Photo Sphere Viewer, Photo Zoom, Scientific Calculator and sometimes I enable Black Menu, but it usually gets old and in the way more than it's useful and the new "home" screen for Chrome with the square for quick access to plug-ins and services eliminates most of the need.

 

[Algus]

Pixlr Touchup, Entanglement, Songist, Secure Shell, Crosh Window, NYTimes (awesome interface but buggy), AirDroid, and Netflix

Pushbullet, Adblock Plus, Momentum, Save to Google Drive for extensions.

Pixlr Touchup and Entanglement are the two packaged apps I have been most impressed by.

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy Note 3 using Tapatalk

 

[dkhmwilliams]

The keyboard comparison I do disagree with. I got the C720 and I think the keyboard is pretty bad, I think. Feels very cheap and the keys don't 'wholly' press down when you push them.

I love the feel of the keyboard on the C720. I don't think that it feels cheap at all. I do wish that it was backlit though.



Sent from my Nexus 5

 

[thatotherdude24]

Chromebooks will always be a secondary device. It will never be a primary device where any serious work needs to get done.

Speaking of which, I finally pulled the trigger and ordered my new PC build off NewEgg:

i7-4770k
GTX 760 with 4GB GDDR5
16 GB RAM
240 GB SSD, 4 TB HDD

All for about $1200. It's a pretty modest build, but I'm hoping the 8 threads will futureproof me for the next generation of games.

A Chromebook would never be able to do what my PC can.

I don't feel Chromebooks are meant to replace pure power workstations like you built, that's why Google employees use Goobuntu and not Chromebooks at work. However you are an exception, not many typical users will ever need anything close to as powerful as what you bought. The typical user most of the time will open their laptop and go directly to the browser.....chromebook. Recently Time Warner Cable was over fixing our signal problem, he used a W7 laptop but everything he did had a browser interface......chromebook.

As an educator, I can see the allure of chrome books in the classroom, having had my fair share of headaches and frustrations with windows laptops.

For one, since the laptops our pupils use are locked down with admin restrictions, the only things they can do is browse the web and use Office. For the latter, I am finding that google docs is simply more versatile for collaborative work. It is so convenient to have pupils work on a shared piece of writing without needing to huddle collectively over one laptop, or to simply share the document link with me rather than emailing it to me (and I still have to download and open it). Plus, I can make my own corrections and any changes will be reflected win real time automatically.

Fewer features is a good thing when this means that pupils can't email you essays with a black background and light blue font.

Second, chrome OS would actually mean we don't have to deal with all the problems inherent with windows (further exacerbated by all the security and administrative software preloaded on them). Fewer problems mean less time spent troubleshooting them (imagine doing this for 40 pupils), leaving more time for actually getting things done.

Third would be price. We can easily get 2-3 chrome books for every full-powered laptop.

In this context, I would argue that chrome books can actually suit the pupils' needs better. The biggest challenge here would be convincing old-fashioned school leaders who believe that we must use windows or Office for content creation.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

I couldn't agree more with everything you said.

An example of the old-fashioned school leaders....I have a buddy who is the tech director for a local school district. They recently got a state grant to go 1 to 1 for every student 5th grade and up. The superintendent is very much older and not from the computer era, my buddy recommended the Surface 2 and/or chromebooks for students. He was against them all, he wanted the W7 Dell laptop that he had sitting on his desk for all the students. Somehow it came about they ordered 1 Toshiba chromebook as a trial, they put it in the hands of a teacher, school admin and a student to see how it did in a school day. They just placed an order for 250 of them. Managing chromebooks is extremely easy, it's all web based and instant. No need to connect them 1 by 1 to your AD domain and no running GP update after every admin change. This allows his tech dept to work on advancing the school system technologically. You can't advance if you're spending all your time working on current problems. Now chromebooks will need troubleshooting still but based on experiences so far it is much less.

I also like how you mentioned Google docs and no need to huddle around a single screen. The sharing feature on docs I can see would be very helpful, so you the teacher can be working on a document and it shows up on each individual screen of every student.

I also have seen school systems widely launch iPads, including mine. iPads do have a use in education but it is limited. The school system I went to gave every kid 7th grade up an iPad, on this iPad are their textbooks, they do all their homework and communicate with teachers. For reading a book or taking a multple choice test the iPad is fine, but start taking tests where you need to write essays or short answers while quoting your text book that is only on your iPad....it's frustrating and very time consuming.

These are my opinions and experiences, as a teacher you have a totally different need and experiences than I do.

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I would never say never...but I agree it is nowhere close to that right now. Chrome OS needs a LOT of work before it is ready to replace a Windows machine for productivity.

What do you think it needs improvements in to be used for productivity?

I love the feel of the keyboard on the C720. I don't think that it feels cheap at all. I do wish that it was backlit though.



Sent from my Nexus 5

Also as I mentioned in that post I do realize I am typing on a $200 device and as much as I would like a backlit keyboard I would give it up to keep chromebooks down in price.

- - - Updated - - -

Pixlr Touchup, Entanglement, Songist, Secure Shell, Crosh Window, NYTimes (awesome interface but buggy), AirDroid, and Netflix

Pushbullet, Adblock Plus, Momentum, Save to Google Drive for extensions.

Pixlr Touchup and Entanglement are the two packaged apps I have been most impressed by.

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy Note 3 using Tapatalk

Are any of these good for slight picture editing? Like resizing and applying effects.

 

[Aquila]

Are any of these good for slight picture editing? Like resizing and applying effects.

https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/pixlr-touch-up/jklljiahjgoglchglekebfljnmbaleig?hl=en-US Pixlr Touchup is pretty solid,

Pixlr Editor is the one I use: https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/pixlr-editor/icmaknaampgiegkcjlimdiidlhopknpk?hl=en-US (for when the one in Google+ isn't enough)

 

[thatotherdude24]

https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/pixlr-touch-up/jklljiahjgoglchglekebfljnmbaleig?hl=en-US Pixlr Touchup is pretty solid,

Pixlr Editor is the one I use: https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/pixlr-editor/icmaknaampgiegkcjlimdiidlhopknpk?hl=en-US (for when the one in Google+ isn't enough)

the one in Google+?

 

[Aquila]

the one in Google+?

From Google+ if you click on any of your photos, there is an edit button next to share that brings up a fairly simple but powerful crop/balance/contrast/brightness/effects/frame editor (etc, etc) and the Google+ app on Android has many of the same options built into it. https://plus.google.com/u/0/photos

 

[Algus]

Recently Time Warner Cable was over fixing our signal problem, he used a W7 laptop but everything he did had a browser interface......chromebook.

Man, this reminds me of a time I had a guy from Cox working on my line. He insisted he needed access to my computer and then was utterly perplexed by Linux. I had to explain that Iceweasel was the same as Firefox.

I dunno if some of these guys are ready to learn new interfaces heh

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy Note 3 using Tapatalk

 

[thatotherdude24]

Man, this reminds me of a time I had a guy from Cox working on my line. He insisted he needed access to my computer and then was utterly perplexed by Linux. I had to explain that Iceweasel was the same as Firefox.

I dunno if some of these guys are ready to learn new interfaces heh

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy Note 3 using Tapatalk

I recently dealt with a Century Link tech at a local business I was doing IT work for at the time.

I find that these techs, I'm sure this isn't the case for them all but they don't seem tech savy at all. They know how to hook up their equipment and that's about it, some don't even know what their hooking up does, they know it's a modem but don't know what a modem does or why it's necessary.

I'm guessing you run Fedora or one off its spinoffs?

From Google+ if you click on any of your photos, there is an edit button next to share that brings up a fairly simple but powerful crop/balance/contrast/brightness/effects/frame editor (etc, etc) and the Google+ app on Android has many of the same options built into it. https://plus.google.com/u/0/photos

I didn't know Google+ had this. Another instance where all you need is a web browser......chromebook.

 

[dkhmwilliams]

I'm surprised Microsoft hasn't come out with their version of the Chromebook like a "Bingbook" or something. They seem to have the cloud services to do it. It would really fill the gaps in their product line.

 

[thatotherdude24]

I'm surprised Microsoft hasn't come out with their version of the Chromebook like a "Bingbook" or something. They seem to have the cloud services to do it. It would really fill the gaps in their product line.

That's coming with Windows with Bing.

Sent From My Woven Black and Yellow Moto X

 

[CHIP72]

I'm surprised Microsoft hasn't come out with their version of the Chromebook like a "Bingbook" or something. They seem to have the cloud services to do it. It would really fill the gaps in their product line.

I'm not surprised. Microsoft (and Apple) was/were founded in the pre-internet 1970s. Google was founded as a result of the internet in the 1990s. Which one of those companies do you think was most likely to create an internet-based operating system? An internet-based operating system also runs counter to Microsoft's historical business model with consumers.

It should be noted that Mozilla has also created a cloud-based operating system, Firefox OS. Like Google, Firefox as an entity is a product of the internet.