Google Looking to lose monumental case

**phonejunky** · 04-18-2012, 07:31 PM

Larry Page had a terrible showing on the stand in landmark case with Androids future on the line.

**tony bag o donuts** · 04-18-2012, 07:33 PM

Let's face it....they all steal from each other.

**phonejunky** · 04-18-2012, 07:54 PM

Who is they though. Oracle isnt RIM or Apple?

**tony bag o donuts** · 04-18-2012, 08:00 PM

didn't oracle sue Microsoft at one point?

**phonejunky** · 04-18-2012, 08:04 PM

Yea and they won that case too.

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Ry · 04-18-2012, 10:12 PM

This is HUGE. Every fan of Android should be paying VERY close attention to this case.

**phonejunky** · 04-19-2012, 05:57 PM

Yea I don't see why Android websites aren't making this a priority on there cover pages.

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**LegalAmerican** · 04-19-2012, 07:26 PM

As important as it is, I have a difficult time following it because everyone is suing different parts of Android lately. Getting so sick of corporations acting like they created the Earth

**pazzo02** · 04-19-2012, 08:18 PM

Originally Posted by phonemaster123

Yea I don't see why Android websites aren't making this a priority on there cover pages.

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Because there will be little or no affect to Android. Worst case will be that Google will have to pay Oracle for the use of Java. It's not like Google would abandon Android if they lose the case. It's the most prolific mobile OS out there.

**herpofderpius** · 04-19-2012, 10:25 PM

Originally Posted by pazzo02

Because there will be little or no affect to Android. Worst case will be that Google will have to pay Oracle for the use of Java. It's not like Google would abandon Android if they lose the case. It's the most prolific mobile OS out there.

It gets a bit more involved than that. Oracle will have made the case that programming languages and APIs can be copyrighted, and protected by the same set of laws that keep Steamboat Willie from going into the public domain. Then, it becomes possible to sue other companies/projects for using a same or similar namespace (IBM and their use of OpenJDK, Apache Harmony), and anyone using Java will need to 'license' its use from Oracle.

All the evidence i've seen shows systematic failures from the highest levels of Google management. This seems to be chronic given all the legal issues they've been dragged into over the years, with blatant personal feelings towards the state of various laws driving them. This is the behavior that will cause Google's shareholders to throw Larry, Sergey, Eric, and any other managers out the door.

And I can't blame them. I've had my fill with this.

**SellnCLT85** · 04-20-2012, 03:39 AM

Keep in mind a couple of things. Steve Jobs and Larry Ellison(Oracle CEO) were best friends. Google is being sued for using a technique with Java (37 api's) that was considered Ok with Sun Micro systems. I read somewhere that Google could have settled for less than 50 million.

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**jaguar10301** · 04-20-2012, 05:46 AM

Google stands up for what it believes in, free and open internet and computing. I can see why they are fighting something that would mean programming language is protected, if they settled they would be saying they don't believe in that openness that has marked their history.

**pazzo02** · 04-20-2012, 07:30 AM

Originally Posted by herpofderpius

It gets a bit more involved than that. Oracle will have made the case that programming languages and APIs can be copyrighted, and protected by the same set of laws that keep Steamboat Willie from going into the public domain. Then, it becomes possible to sue other companies/projects for using a same or similar namespace (IBM and their use of OpenJDK, Apache Harmony), and anyone using Java will need to 'license' its use from Oracle.

All the evidence i've seen shows systematic failures from the highest levels of Google management. This seems to be chronic given all the legal issues they've been dragged into over the years, with blatant personal feelings towards the state of various laws driving them. This is the behavior that will cause Google's shareholders to throw Larry, Sergey, Eric, and any other managers out the door.

And I can't blame them. I've had my fill with this.

Obviously it's very intricate, it's a lawsuit. I was just trying to simplify what the final outcome will be, that Android will still be around.

**Bballbenb** · 04-20-2012, 12:31 PM

So whats the worst case scenario that happens here? Like how big is this case for Google and android and the future of their phones, OS, etc.

**phonejunky** · 04-20-2012, 02:37 PM

Originally Posted by bballbenb1

So whats the worst case scenario that happens here? Like how big is this case for Google and android and the future of their phones, OS, etc.

Realistically the worst case scenario is google loses has to pay 1 Billion dollars in damages, as well as royalties to Oracle, and other companies who manufacture the phones might come across some type of payment plan as well. That's just me talking though.

**herpofderpius** · 04-20-2012, 03:44 PM

Originally Posted by pazzo02

Obviously it's very intricate, it's a lawsuit. I was just trying to simplify what the final outcome will be, that Android will still be around.

I'm not going to doubt that. Oracle will make a lot of money off Android if they win.

**ab304945** · 04-20-2012, 10:42 PM

Originally Posted by herpofderpius

I'm not going to doubt that. Oracle will make a lot of money off Android if they win.

That prob the only reason they are suing all for $$$$

**Speedygi** · 04-21-2012, 03:44 AM

I don't entirely want to defend Larry and Co for not being upfront by admitting they use Oracle's patents. If I were them I would have just paid the fees for Oracle to license a set of their properties for Android's use, or even tried to work out a partnership if that is possible. With the large resources Google has, I am sure this is a neccessary evil for Android to carry on thriving.

**RocketJeff** · 04-21-2012, 01:22 PM

is an excellent source of information on the Oracle/Google trial. If you don't know about Groklaw, it was started during the SCO vs Linux lawsuits and provided interesting and accurate information and analysis about those lawsuits and their possible outcome.

They're now also covering this lawsuit - it's interesting seeing the misinformation on this thread when you read the analysis of the actual information about the lawsuit. Most of Oracles patents have been either dismissed or reduced in scope by the patent office, the question of how much is owed is down from 'Billions' to only a few million (if Oracle wins).

The copyright issues seem to be very minimal, if anything - Google is using their own Virtual Machine with no Oracle source (much of it is from the Mozilla Foundation's clean-room developed source). They seem to be mainly down to a handful of actual lines that seem to be copied, but they are also so generic that it could just be the best way to implement the routines.

Also, Oracle has hired some well known 'Analysts' to spin their point of view in the media and online. Growlaw has analysis about where their 'analysis' is flawed also.

**phonejunky** · 04-22-2012, 09:10 AM

Well here is the week one article put out in the nytimes. So pretty much it comes down to this money. Android right now is free of course but if Oracle wins (which I'm not seeing this happen as the case goes on) Android possibly will not be free anymore. Oracle could get the right to place licensing fees and so on. But this is just me pointing out the worst of what could happen.

http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/04/21/oracle-vs-google-week-one/