Apple was built on theft, but Samsung is a better thief?

**sirheck** · 08-11-2012, 08:34 AM

Pretty good read.

**Lanhoj** · 08-11-2012, 08:41 AM

And if Apple beats Samsung it'll be worse IMO.

They should just settle already and get these lawsuits over with!

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**ab304945** · 08-11-2012, 04:34 PM

If Samsung win. It will be better

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**Splange** · 08-13-2012, 07:17 AM

I kind of agree with the article. If you look at the S3 and the new touchwiz, it's clear that both moved away somewhat from copying Apple (with some exceptions like s voice) . I'd like to see Samsung come into its own a little more and realize that the way apple does things isn't necessarily the best way to do things.

For example, s voice is pretty much a siri clone and it's inferior. Google Now and Voice Actions are more original and are better than s voice or siri. If Samsung can't copy Apple's design they'll be forced to be better than Apple.

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**Lanhoj** · 08-13-2012, 07:27 AM

Originally Posted by Splange

...
For example, s voice is pretty much a siri clone and it's inferior
...

Inferior, yes. But a clone, no. It's pretty much just a re-skinned Vlingo which came out before Siri like most of Android's Voice Assistant Apps that can be found on the Google Play Store.

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**harhis23** · 08-13-2012, 09:03 AM

The case between these two is all about who gets the license for the patents and who gets to sue first. The thing is, Apple was the first one to file complaints that its patents were infringed by Samsung. The fact that it is suing almost every manufacturer today is evidence Apple is trying to bully others.

For now, it seems like the upper hand is with Apple and Samsung's counsel just suck in pretending (ehem defending) they haven't "willfully" copied iPhone's designs.

For sure, Samsung's executives haven't foreseen this will happen after they rejected Apple's proposal of royal-bearing licenses in 2010 wherein they only had to pay around $250 million. Now, the company is facing $2.5 billion lawsuit and it's losing.

**Splange** · 08-13-2012, 09:07 AM

Originally Posted by Lanhoj

Inferior, yes. But a clone, no. It's pretty much just a re-skinned Vlingo which came out before Siri like most of Android's Voice Assistant Apps that can be found on the Google Play Store.

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I don't mean to imply that apple invented voice control on phones, so you're right, it's not a clone in that sense. But it's a clone in intent (as in Samsung clearly included it as an answer to siri) and in aesthetic.

Google Now and Voice Actions are what happens when Google thinks of how to best implement (and go beyond) voice controls. S Voice is what happens when Samsung thinks of how to best mimic Siri. The former is an innovative step up, the later ends up looking like a cheap imitation.

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**sirheck** · 08-13-2012, 10:16 AM

As for voice recognition software I think of On-Star before I think of siri or s-voice.

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**cgardnervt** · 08-13-2012, 11:58 AM

Screw Apple! I hope they lose and Sammy ends up on top. I'd love to see them go out.

**Jezz_X** · 08-16-2012, 10:02 PM

Well you can't half tell that the guy who wrote that story uses apple products

**lrgol33t** · 08-20-2012, 06:56 PM

Hi, this is my very first post on this forum. I was wondering, what happens if Apple wins? I can't believe anyone would listen to them. Some of the stuff they wrote in the lawsuit is unbelievable. For example: (and this is from page 3D of the Dallas Morning News, Aug 20)
"As part of the case, Apple has accused Samsung of copying patented features in the iPhone and Ipad -- such as the rectangular shape and rounded edges of the iPad's case and the bounce-back effect when an iPhone user tries to scroll beyond the end of a list or Web page." WTF? The rounded edges are patented? Excuse me, but can anyone find a copyright that says rounded edges on a rectangle are copyrighted? This is just hilarious. And the "bounce back" effect? I don't care one bit if my webpage stops dead or bounces back. I can't believe Apple won a patent for their silly "slide" lock. My old G1 phone can be unlocked that way even though the entire screen moves. By Apple's "reasoning," GE has the "right" to sue anyone for making a light switch and Land Rover has the right to sue Ford, GM and all the other car companies because their trucks have AWD and look "blocky." Apple seems to use frivolous excuses in its lawsuits.

Now what happens if Apple wins? Does that mean the entire Android system will be shut down? I KNOW that this is their goal. Something to educate the Apple lawyers: Android is a OS based on a Finnish system called Linux, which came out MANY years before Apple came up with its system so why is this lawsuit even allowed at all?

What will happen to Android phones if Apple gets everything its way? Will the network be shut down? Will the carriers have to remove their Android OS phones from their inventories if they even superficially LOOK like an iPhone? (remember, the accusations go as far as saying "Rectangular shape and rounded edges"!) Can anyone else chime in on this? Never have I seen a lawsuit based on such superficial stuff.

**Lanhoj** · 08-20-2012, 07:27 PM

No idea what will happen...though just the other day I walked into Best Buy & bought a 55inch Panasonic TV thinking it was a Sharp! Was so frustrated even though the set itself & box clearly said "Panasonic", I mean it's rectangular, thin, has rounded edges, I thought those "features" were only available on Sharp TV's, no?!
Someone's gotta patent that so more people don't make the same mistake...

**chubb** · 08-20-2012, 07:44 PM

Originally Posted by lrgol33t

Hi, this is my very first post on this forum. I was wondering, what happens if Apple wins? I can't believe anyone would listen to them. Some of the stuff they wrote in the lawsuit is unbelievable. For example: (and this is from page 3D of the Dallas Morning News, Aug 20)
"As part of the case, Apple has accused Samsung of copying patented features in the iPhone and Ipad -- such as the rectangular shape and rounded edges of the iPad's case and the bounce-back effect when an iPhone user tries to scroll beyond the end of a list or Web page." WTF? The rounded edges are patented? Excuse me, but can anyone find a copyright that says rounded edges on a rectangle are copyrighted?
.

Yes. Apple somehow actually managed to patent a shape. That right there shows just how much the patent system needs reform. First, though, I think I'll get a patent on a rectangle. Then I can sue all the remote makers!

**swyost** · 08-20-2012, 09:00 PM

As a point of clarification, people have been patenting design elements such as shapes for more than a century. All one needs to do, ironically, is go to Google Patents to demonstrate that fact. There are reasons why, for instance, no one copies coca cola's hobble skirt bottle. The various forms were patented decades ago and the associated labeling is trademarked. People have also regularly patented ideas that have never become actual products for equally long. Like other archaeologists, I do patent searches from time to identify artifacts for historic sites. One might be surprised at the array of items, design elements, and design concepts that have been patented.

People who express their indignation over patenting rules really should just do some very basic homework. The system has worked for over a century. Is it perfect? No it is not. I would still prefer, however, that ideas are protected so that corporations cannot just raid things that have long been defined as intellectual property whenever it is convenient. Neither consumers nor innovators are protected when there are no rules. It is a balancing act but it still works more than it doesn't.

**swyost** · 08-20-2012, 09:15 PM

Originally Posted by chubb

Yes. Apple somehow actually managed to patent a shape. That right there shows just how much the patent system needs reform. First, though, I think I'll get a patent on a rectangle. Then I can sue all the remote makers!

That does not mean the patent law needs to be reformed. It means you need to actually learn something about patent laws. Reactive comments about how awful the patent laws are completely ignore the reasons those laws exist. They are a necessary protection for innovators and (like any laws) there are times they may seem unfair. People have also patented style elements for as long as patent laws have existed. Samsung knows the rules and quite possibly broke them my designing the initial Galaxy products as iPhone/iPad stylistic knockoffs.

We do not need weaker patent laws. We need aggressive implementation of existing laws to ensure that (in as much as possible) innovators have a level playing field, whether they are Apple, Google, or some hardware or software designer not on the payroll of a billion dollar corporation.

**chubb** · 08-20-2012, 09:25 PM

But the design of phones and tablets is pretty much obvious. You wouldn't want a square or circle phone(wouldn't be comfortable or very portable in your pocket). Rounded or sharp corners are obvious. There is pretty much only one shape to make devices appealing. Even laptops are rectangles. TV's are now all rectangles. As are toaster ovens and refrigerators. I would give apple a chance if the Nexus had a aluminum side and round volume buttons, and a huge bezel. If this holds up in court, Apple will be the only smartphone and tablet in town. One I wouldn't want to be in.

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**ice2008** · 08-25-2012, 06:34 AM

Did Monet sue Picasso for using rectangular canvases as well? no he didn't because back then he would have probably been quartered drawn and hung (and rightfully so) if he had attempted that, but these days society lets Apple get away with exactly that.

And even if the ridiculous patents would be considered valid, then what option would any company have to compete with Apple? go for a circular shape? oh no, then the heirs of the inventor of the wheel could sue for infinity trillion $ damages.

In other words, basic shapes should never be protected by a patent.

As for the software, well, why is that even a matter between Apple and Samsung? shouldn't that rather be a matter between Apple and Google? Pinch to zoom for example is present in all android devices.

**thirteen_per_cent** · 08-25-2012, 11:31 AM

The iphools just want to bandroid !!

Ry · 08-25-2012, 04:01 PM

Originally Posted by chubb

But the design of phones and tablets is pretty much obvious. You wouldn't want a square or circle phone(wouldn't be comfortable or very portable in your pocket). Rounded or sharp corners are obvious. There is pretty much only one shape to make devices appealing. Even laptops are rectangles. TV's are now all rectangles. As are toaster ovens and refrigerators. I would give apple a chance if the Nexus had a aluminum side and round volume buttons, and a huge bezel. If this holds up in court, Apple will be the only smartphone and tablet in town. One I wouldn't want to be in.

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There are tons of phones that are rectangles with rounded corners that don't look like any iPhone.

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**adanick2** · 08-26-2012, 02:30 PM

When is apple gonna go after ihop? Or did they already?

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**Scugg** · 08-26-2012, 04:13 PM

Originally Posted by adanick2

When is apple gonna go after ihop? Or did they already?

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Lmao. Don't give them the idea!

**Scugg** · 08-26-2012, 04:15 PM

Lmao. Don't give then the idea!

**Scugg** · 08-26-2012, 04:22 PM

Oooops on the double post lol. So i watched this show on the history channel today called 100 gadgets that changed the world or what ever it was called. So my question is why didn't anyone sue apple over having a mouse for their computers? Steve Jobs got the idea when he saw a prototype in a Xerox factory! Is it because they only have one button instead of two? Still doesn't make any sense that apple can sue over a rectangle phone, slide unlock....you get the point. Someone else brought up a good point about cars, shapes, looks, truck, SUV blah blah. Really?

**radar320** · 08-26-2012, 05:30 PM

Myself and several others have mentioned that this whole thing could have and should have been avoided if the patent office wasn't broken and was actually doing their job. How can you grant a loosely worded patent on a concept you didn't create, just find another use for, and was prior art? These patents are so loosely worded that it is imo entrapment. This is going to be hurtful to innovation, and is an attempt to kill off any and all competition. I say it is going to hurt innovation because with how broad and loosely worded these patents are, by the time a company comes up with a new innovation, Apple is going to find a way to say that it infringes on one of their sham patents.

**thenameisnigel** · 08-26-2012, 05:39 PM

The patent laws DO need to reformed. Patents on shapes is TOTALLY out-of-the-question. Samsung would've probably won if they came stronger in defense methods , but Apple won. Now , I can guarantee that more lawsuits will come from Apple , and more corruption by companies reading between the line in laws.