[Ry]

I found a Wired apk at xda, but it crashes instantly. The CW Network app also crashes.

As others have mentioned, Apple caters to a customer base of technically ignorant sheep, BUT are we REALLY better off with our open OS when it requires rooting, searching forums for tips and files and hacks? The iHerds sneer, "It just works," but how are we really superior when our reply is, "It just takes some work to get it working."

It's a hard life being on the bleeding edge of technology.

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If you're digging around for APKs rather than the official Play Store, don't be surprised with issues.

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[xXBLACKBERRYXx5]

I'd even argue that the "DROID" brand is a more popular name than "Nexus".

I've heard numerous times people referring to their Android phone as a "DROID" phone even if they don't have a real DROID-branded device.

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Yup. I've heard a few people that know nothing of technology call their androids iphone... Da faq Is that?

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[Ry]

The Kindle Fire was released Nov 2011. Thas close to 8 months. Let's see after 8 months where the N7 will be at.

Keep in mind as stated before. This is JB now. Like when iOS is upgraded, it takes time to get apps to migrate over.

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My prediction: Android will have more overall market share but Apple will still sell more iPads than Google will sell Nexus 7s (within the same timeframe).

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[NickA]

As others have mentioned, Apple caters to a customer base of technically ignorant sheep, BUT are we REALLY better off with our open OS when it requires rooting, searching forums for tips and files and hacks? The iHerds sneer, "It just works," but how are we really superior when our reply is, "It just takes some work to get it working."

It's a hard life being on the bleeding edge of technology.

People have got to let this go. It comes off sounding ignorant and Android Fanboyism (iHerds, really?). I'm not saying you are because you make a legitimate argument after that comment. But because Apple makes products that are easy to use by everyone, you think that makes people technically ignorant? I'm an iOS developer, have you ever tried to code a complex application in Objective-C? There is a lot more to iOS then what you see.

Again, the goal of any software is to make it easy for people to use, right? So why bash Apple for doing just that?

[Jeremy8000]

The Kindle Fire was released Nov 2011. Thas close to 8 months. Let's see after 8 months where the N7 will be at.

The N7 will have been updated to the latest software versions and still have access to the entire Play store while still having the Kindle app. The Fire cannot be at all reliably used as a predictor of the N7's relevance in 8 months.

[armeddroid]

I have what this post is supposed to mean.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 2

ICS and JB are new systems even for our own android community much less our vendors. Hardly anybody has these systems. Everyone still stuck on gingerbread.
Also Hulu? Hulu has always had a problem integrating into android. Just last year it was only on a handful of devices running GB.

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[armeddroid]

The N7 will have been updated to the latest software versions and still have access to the entire Play store while still having the Kindle app. The Fire cannot be at all reliably used as a predictor of the N7's relevance in 8 months.

Exactly.

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[EJT]

So you are suggesting that Apple create an OS that is different from what people know and understand for the sake of change? I wouldn't like that. What I am comfortable with is that when I have gotten new iOS devices that I know what to expect from it. I know that I, my wife, and my 4 year old daughter will know how to use it as well. If I have to relearn an OS every time a new model in the line comes out then the device has failed me. I would only expect change when the OS is no longer efficient and/or meets my needs. When you state "they have very good hardware, and simple, elegant software" that sums up everything that I want. I like the progression that Android has shown. And I believe that soon, we will make the same statement about Android being simple, elegant, and just works. And that's a good thing.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

Not at all. I'm not saying Apple needs to change its whole OS. That would be a catastrophically bad idea. What I am saying, however, is that iOS needs to evolve. iOS is looking kind of long in the tooth. I mean, is it really all that different than it was a year ago? Or two years ago? Or hell, five years ago? iOS is iOS. It doesn't change much. Sure, they've added some functionality and polish, but at the same time, it's lagged behind while other OS's have evolved. I'm not sure what Apple's reasoning for this is.

I don't want to go out and buy a new car, and go to the Ford dealer, and find 1995 Taurus' on the lot, with upgraded cup holders and a better stereo. I want something that's current. All I'm saying is that there are a lot of things current generation phones and tablets are capable of, yet iOS lacks some of those cutting edge functions. Furthermore, it takes Apple a while to add functionality that should have been there since day one (like copy/paste and useful notifications). I'm not saying iOS is bad in any way, shape, or form. If it were that bad, it wouldn't have millions and millions of happy users. All I'm saying is that sooner or later (more likely sooner), people will begin to migrate away from iOS as it becomes less and less state of the art, and more and more like a dinosaur.

Apple makes good, solid, elegant products that are easy to use......as I said. I just think they need to step up the OS game a bit, or they'll find themselves at the back of the pack when it comes to ability and usefulness.

[steve dave]

ICS and JB are new systems even for our own android community much less our vendors. Hardly anybody has these systems. Everyone still stuck on gingerbread.
Also Hulu? Hulu has always had a problem integrating into android. Just last year it was only on a handful of devices running GB.

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This is kind of making my point. When every update breaks random apps for undetermined amounts of time, why would anyone ever want to upgrade? So now you have the fragmentation caused by too many phones from too many vendors plus you are essentially punishing anyone that does manage to get timely updates because many of their apps just won't work.

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[DirkBelig]

If you're digging around for APKs rather than the official Play Store, don't be surprised with issues.

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The CW app WAS from the Play store. The Wired was pulled from a Fire so I'm not surprised it crashed, but the fact I had to resort to trying that proves my point about the lack of app support crippling the potential of the N7.

And to the Apple dev: Sorry, but the iHerds are categorically some of the dumbest life forms that exist outside of those stuck to the inside of an aquarium. They know nothing, but consider themselves the most elite because they overpaid for a shiny toy with a logo depicting gnawed fruit. This is not opinion, it's fact.

[Ry]

And to the Apple dev: Sorry, but the iHerds are categorically some of the dumbest life forms that exist outside of those stuck to the inside of an aquarium. They know nothing, but consider themselves the most elite because they overpaid for a shiny toy with a logo depicting gnawed fruit. This is not opinion, it's fact.

Pretty much invalidates any point you're trying to make.

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[NickA]

And to the Apple dev: Sorry, but the iHerds are categorically some of the dumbest life forms that exist outside of those stuck to the inside of an aquarium. They know nothing, but consider themselves the most elite because they overpaid for a shiny toy with a logo depicting gnawed fruit. This is not opinion, it's fact.

What a well thought out factual statement. Note the sarcasm. Also note the bold text above: sources? I'm looking for "facts" as you say.

It's statements like yours that indicate you have no idea whatsoever what you are talking about. Not only does it not hold any merit, it actually make you sound exactly like the person you describe. Name calling (iHerds, dumb), really? This is how you make your point?

And again, calling the iPhone a shiny toy? Come on, man. This is getting old. And who overpays? Last I checked the iPhone 4s 16GB was 199.99 on contract.

[xXBLACKBERRYXx5]

What a well thought out factual statement. Note the sarcasm. Also note the bold text above: sources? I'm looking for "facts" as you say.

It's statements like yours that indicate you have no idea whatsoever what you are talking about. Not only does it not hold any merit, it actually make you sound exactly like the person you describe. Name calling (iHerds, dumb), really? This is how you make your point?

And again, calling the iPhone a shiny toy? Come on, man. This is getting old. And who overpays? Last I checked the iPhone 4s 16GB was 199.99 on contract.

That's what he means by overpaying. Why did u ask the question if u gave the answer?

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[Bossxii]

While I have purchased, used and still own the iPad (3) I have purchased and used the Asus Transformer and really liked the keyboard/tablet combo. Unfortunately due to some serious light bleed I returned that tablet and have been on the iPad since. The Nexus 7 has peaked my interest once again with Jelly Bean in hopes of a smoother UI experience and the rest of what Google offers from maps, their voice search and features imo are much better than Siri. I have a Droid Razr with Verizon that I have an unlimited plan for tether so the Nexus 7 would seem to be a perfect GPS unit for me among other things.

As to the Nexus 7 over taking the tablet market share, doubtful in the next couple of years, but I do hope hardware vendors using Android OS take note on how to put out a nicely built tablet for a great price. They need to realize they are simply not going to get higher prices than what the iPad is brining with the delays to their updates, current lack of content. The best thing Google could have done is the Nexus 7. Attract a large user base, which will attract more developers. I"m sorry to say but if Google can control and clean up the Play Store in terms of more quality app, more security for the end user they can and will compete down the road. Granted the killing off of Flash support kills off one advantage I did enjoy on the Transformer, although it sounds like there are work arounds.

Bottom line is Google stepped up and did the right thing, control the hardware and software so the consumer gets their first impression from the source and is happy and excited to use the product. Not confusion and lag from all the overlays the other vendors keep dropping on Android. I didn't pre order one, but am looking to buy a 16gig as soon as I find one on CL or the Google store has them out. Pretty exciting to see what uses I can come up with on a 7" tablet. Which by the way, since I live in the burbs outside Kansas City, KS Google just unleashed their Google Fiber here, OMG it looks sweet! Gigabit speed for $70 per month and they install the modem or go for TV + Gigabit service for $120 and they give you a Nexus 7 for your remote, a 2TB DVR + Modem free! Holy crap I can't wait to have that service expanded into my area!

[NickA]

That's what he means by overpaying. Why did u ask the question if u gave the answer?

Ugh, this thread has run it's course. Good luck to future posters in this thread.

[snookiesnoo]

Fantastic article. Really enlightening.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Android Central Forums

It's a really idiotic article designed for link bait. What do you expect from beta news.

[Bossxii]

Not at all. I'm not saying Apple needs to change its whole OS. That would be a catastrophically bad idea. What I am saying, however, is that iOS needs to evolve. iOS is looking kind of long in the tooth. I mean, is it really all that different than it was a year ago? Or two years ago? Or hell, five years ago? iOS is iOS. It doesn't change much. Sure, they've added some functionality and polish, but at the same time, it's lagged behind while other OS's have evolved. I'm not sure what Apple's reasoning for this is.

I don't want to go out and buy a new car, and go to the Ford dealer, and find 1995 Taurus' on the lot, with upgraded cup holders and a better stereo. I want something that's current. All I'm saying is that there are a lot of things current generation phones and tablets are capable of, yet iOS lacks some of those cutting edge functions. Furthermore, it takes Apple a while to add functionality that should have been there since day one (like copy/paste and useful notifications). I'm not saying iOS is bad in any way, shape, or form. If it were that bad, it wouldn't have millions and millions of happy users. All I'm saying is that sooner or later (more likely sooner), people will begin to migrate away from iOS as it becomes less and less state of the art, and more and more like a dinosaur.

Apple makes good, solid, elegant products that are easy to use......as I said. I just think they need to step up the OS game a bit, or they'll find themselves at the back of the pack when it comes to ability and usefulness.

I read these types of post on various forums and am always wondering what exactly do you want iOS to look like or evolve too? There is one school of thought that if you build something that works, don't break it just to change. Microsoft Windows has looked the same for the better part of a decade or more. The automobile has had 4 wheels, 2 or 4 seats, a front windshield, engine hooked to a transmission in the same general configuration for 100 years. Sure they slap some new shape body and color on them the basica underlying "OS/engine" is the same. Everything going forward in the current tablet market is going to all look alike, it's a row of icons on iOS, it's a row of icons with a widget here and there on android. iOS has folders, Android now has folders, drag and drop one icon onto another... I could list a few dozen things that are pretty much the same on both OS.

The tablet is currently a slab of plastic, alum or some future material with some form of glass panel over a display surface. There are certain design limits from either technology of battery, LCD or CPU that limits everyone to a certain looking device.

Yes I would love a totally revamped iOS, but I'm the first to admit I don't know how to do that or even what I would want it to look like. Android and iOS have basically been the same since both OS's have launched. Android has more flexibility, but down to the basics not much has changed in terms of core appearance of the icons and dealing with apps.

Just my 2 cents

[DirkBelig]

I forgot to include in my previous post that the iHerds are also the thinnest-skinned, easily butthurt emo crybabies, but the hysterical overreactions sorta made the point for me.

Even allowing for the undying blind loyalty of the iHerds, it's going to be a futile effort to challenge the iPad unless the app picture improves. As I said before the hysterical iHerds took over the thread, the N7 is inferior to the Fire at the moment and I'm not particularly sanguine about things improving soon.

The N7 is the best slab of hardware running the latest OS, but without enough WORKING apps, it's nothing.

[corydorcutt]

it doesn't matter if the Nexus 7 and then the other Android tablets steal marketshare from Apple if Apple continues to make money hand over fist.

You need to think about this a little bit. What happened shortly after Microsoft took over the computer market? It became harder and harder to find programs that run on Apple, finally arriving at the point where we are at now where over 99% percent of computer programs do not run on Macs. The reason being, that there was more money in PCs, due to a larger audience. Devs go where the money is at. If Google totally dominates the market, most apps will start being only on Android, which will be the end of iOS.

I dont know why I try and use rational thought in a forum. What is it they say about arguing with a fool? They'll bring you down to their level and beat you on experience? Of course they will lose market share when they were so early on the modern smartphone and tablet fronts. Its like saying Ford has lost market share since the early 1900s. Recently, smartphone share has remained relatively stable. As far as tablets, even doubling share doesn't say a lot about units.

This is more super iFan arrogance. "There must have never been a smartphone before I picked up an iPhone". Hate to break it to you, but Apple didn't create the smartphone market. I was using Blackberry and Windows Mobile smartphones years and years before Apple ever showed up to the scene.

Apple actually just gained tablet market share.

They may have just gained a tiny bump in marketshare. However, here's a chart to show you how Apple is hemorrhaging tablet marketshare.



They're being lowly usurped. Here's a chart showing you how googles takeover of mobile played out.





Hmm, looks pretty similar.

Android as a singularity cannot dominate the market no matter what against Apple. Think about it you have 25 different vendors and manufacturers all using android and by this is the only reason why they been able to dominate the market by price options. Apple is ONE company against one OS and a dozen pro-android manufacturers.

This is the same thing that happened in the early computer market. Apple dominated market until Windows came along with numerous manufacturers, and now Apple has like 7% of the computer market, and most programs don't run on Mac. The reason this happened is not because of all the opposing manufacturers. People still liked Apple products. The real reason Apple loses is that they refuse to lower the sickeningly high profit margin they make to be somewhat competitive and they refuse to open up their ecostem at all. If they did they would compete just fine. Their entire business model is based off convincing people that they should buy their product because it's hip, it costs more and therefore, it must be better. If having more models at different price points made a platform successful, than Blackberry would be dominating. Your argument there is tired out and not based on facts.

If you wanna say OS vs OS then its iOS 5 vs Android 2.1, 2.2, 2.3, 3.0, 4.0 & 4.1. Each of Android's fragmented OS has features of their own.

Pff, that's just utterly ridiculous. More like vs, iOS, iOS2, iOS3, iOS4, iOS5 and the numerous incremental updates in between. iOS5 didn't just poof into existence and it's not what they used to gain their marketshare. You could argue that no device with anything before iOS4 are still being sold. Well, no devices with anything before Gingerbread are still being sold either.

I read these types of post on various forums and am always wondering what exactly do you want iOS to look like or evolve too? There is one school of thought that if you build something that works, don't break it just to change. Microsoft Windows has looked the same for the better part of a decade or more. The automobile has had 4 wheels, 2 or 4 seats, a front windshield, engine hooked to a transmission in the same general configuration for 100 years. Sure they slap some new shape body and color on them the basica underlying "OS/engine" is the same.

If they don't change, they'll fail like Blackberry. They built something that worked and then tried to ride on that success. As their competitors started having more features, everyone jumped ship.

Does anyone think this could play out like the console wars?

Apple = Xbox360 - big lead in home nation, less in the world. Spending more money to keep it that way but are creating most of their own problems. Sometimes lack a unifying voice. Both a plagued by greed issues (Xbox Gold to use internet functions - higher hosting fees from Appstore)

Google = Sony - an arguably superior device (smaller screen but better resolution and CPU performance). Going for global domination but is having a problem overcoming some obstacles. many issues are due to poor decisions.

Amazon = Nintendo - going for price and ergonomics over hardware power. Both have moments of insane domination followed quickly by moments of high level niche status. Both are creating a market more than tapping into one.

More like apple is Sony. They fail to maintain dominance because their console is way more expensive. Google is the Xbox 360. They haven't been in the game as long, but they offer consoles at different price ranges, and their cheaper devices game just as well as the expensive PS3. They are quickly dominating the market.

Seriously, the massive amount of denial, arrogance and ignorance being thrown around by many Apple apologists in this thread is staggering and does nothing to dispel the notion that Apple fans use their products either because they fail to understand technology at all, or just think that every other product is crap because they payed Apple a bigger product margin and assume that more expensive equals a better product.

[Tom S.]

..I love how people use the term "jailbreaking" when talking about Android. Lol.

It doesn't matter if said person was/is an "Apple person". Android has the perception of being for the tech savvy so your story doesn't surprise me at all.



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She was referring to her former phone, the iPhone. Try reading.

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[corydorcutt]

I forgot to include in my previous post that the iHerds are also the thinnest-skinned, easily butthurt emo crybabies, but the hysterical overreactions sorta made the point for me.

Even allowing for the undying blind loyalty of the iHerds, it's going to be a futile effort to challenge the iPad unless the app picture improves. As I said before the hysterical iHerds took over the thread, the N7 is inferior to the Fire at the moment and I'm not particularly sanguine about things improving soon.

The N7 is the best slab of hardware running the latest OS, but without enough WORKING apps, it's nothing.

Well I agree in your case that the fire may be better, for most it's not. The browser is slower, the device is laggier, it runs far less apps than the N7 and the screen is significantly worse. Not everyone relies on Amazon for content. If you do, you will probably prefer the fire. I have not run into a single app that I use that doesn't run on my N7, not to say that many people don't have a problem with their apps working. Using my old fire (I got one as a gift) is like torture compared to my N7. Also, I'd add that the N7 hasn't even been out a month yet and already the amount of apps being made compatible with it is staggering. Probably faster and more widespread app support than I've seen for any Android device.

[Ry]

You need to think about this a little bit. What happened shortly after Microsoft took over the computer market? It became harder and harder to find programs that run on Apple, finally arriving at the point where we are at now where over 99% percent of computer programs do not run on Macs. The reason being, that there was more money in PCs, due to a larger audience. Devs go where the money is at. If Google totally dominates the market, most apps will start being only on Android, which will be the end of iOS.

When do you think we'll be at the point where app developers will make the switch from iOS to Android because that's where the money is at? Android already has the market share but I don't see a turning point with regards to revenues for app developers coming anytime soon.

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[corydorcutt]

When do you think we'll be at the point where app developers will make the switch from iOS to Android because that's where the money is at? Android already has the market share but I don't see a turning point with regards to revenues for app developers coming anytime soon.

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It hasn't even been a year since android became the top dog. Blackberry didn't become devoid of devs overnight. Google continues to take more market share at an increasing pace. When there are 3 or 4 times as many Android phones being sold (mid 2013 at current trends) it will be far less profitable to develop apps for iOS.

And it's already starting to happen. Here's a report from last week.



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[Ry]

I hope this measured "interest" actually leads to developers making money on Android. I'm in game and application development for mobile platforms and a lot of people developing for all platforms just aren't seeing a good return on investment on Android apps in direct comparison to their return on investment on iOS. It's not getting significantly better for anyone I know either.

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[corydorcutt]

I hope this measured "interest" actually leads to developers making money on Android. I'm in game and application development for mobile platforms and a lot of people developing for all platforms just aren't seeing a good return on investment on Android apps in direct comparison to their return on investment on iOS. It's not getting significantly better for anyone I know either.

Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Android Central Forums

Really, because I talk to a lot of Devs on XDA who jumped ship from iOS and say just the opposite because Google takes a smaller cut. I'm currently making an awesome (to toot my own horn) game for Android in GML, as I want to get a larger profit margin, and I find working with this platform more interesting. I'm not worried about piracy, I'm including a good phone home option and anyone who goes to the trouble of foiling that is a legit pirate and deserves the free app for their effort. I'm down with legit pirates, just not average consumers googling the apk and sideloading it.

BTW, I'll be offering my game free on AC for a week before putting it on play, to get some good testing, I'm excited. It's called Super Drug Boy. It uses drawn art for all the backdrops and sprites, It's looking pretty nice so far. You use different drugs (including lots of cool new research chems) to get different powers to get through levels and change how the game looks. Certain combinations of drugs do even crazier things. I've used 47 different drugs myself so I'm trying to make the drugs effect filters and powers as realistic as possible.There's also a depression meter, and overdose meter. If you go too long without taking more drugs, your depression meter will max out and you kill yourself. If you take past a certain amount of drugs you will max out the overdose meter and die. Certain drug combinations can also cause the overdose meter to go up much faster. There's a lot more cool stuff too, I've put a lot of work into the storyline, so keep an eye out for a free copy.

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