[Official] 3G/"4G" Discussion thread

[Nutzer]

All,

I understand you can't tell if you are on 3G or 4G with the "H" symbol...but when you go to about phone -> network -> Mobile Network Type -> I only see HSDPA, never HSDPA+.

Is it supposed to show HSDPA+? Or its just a guessing game with "H" and HSDPA?

Just want to know if I'm on 4G or not.

Thanks!

 

[Nissan4LIFE]

HSDPA is 3G
HSPA+ is 4G

Now I've traveled to Los Angeles and San Diego both of which HAS HSPA+ service but when I check it does not say HSPA+ so I dunno if the service is actually listed on the phone itself in those areas. If someone in an actual confirmed HSPA+ area could check and confirm that the phone indicates it would help a lot.

 

[fury2g]

HSDPA is 3G
HSPA+ is 4G

Now I've traveled to Los Angeles and San Diego both of which HAS HSPA+ service but when I check it does not say HSPA+ so I dunno if the service is actually listed on the phone itself in those areas. If someone in an actual confirmed HSPA+ area could check and confirm that the phone indicates it would help a lot.

I am in Milwaukee which is supposed to be HSPA+. Although like the both of you my phone says HSDPA. However I have hit 8.5mb/s download on numerous occasions, so I'm pretty sure I?m on 4G.

 

[Nissan4LIFE]

^ Which is what I thought when I was deep in LA and San Diego and both said HSDPA. I'm going to San Francisco for Thanksgiving and I will test it there too with prolly the same result so I guess the only way you can tell is if you run a speed test as the phone itself cannot differentiate between 3 and 4G.

 

[GSUFan513]

I am pretty sure it says "E" with the Edge network. "G" with the HSDPA network. "H" with the HSPA+ network.

That's what I've determined anyhow as I have seen all 3 come up on my screen at different times.

 

[tazzy695]

no g is the slowest network speed H would cover 3g/4g but being as 4g isn't in my area yet officially then I hope it would say something different for the 4g

 

[anon62607]

G is GPRS, the slowest of them all.

Sent from my SGH-T849 using Tapatalk

 

[Kevin OQuinn]

HSPA+ is NOT 4G

Please see THIS thread for a thorough explanation of 3G bands by veleuche.

Yes the speed is amazing and fantastic, but it's not 4G. T-Mobile can still make HSPA+ faster so it'll keep up with WIMAX and LTE, and then when they max it out they can jump on whichever 4G has matured the best and offers the best performance.

I'm not trying to start an argument but I just want to enlighten everyone a little bit.

 

[anon62607]

I'd probably add that the phones that t-mobile is using aren't even HSPA+

Sent from my SGH-T849 using Tapatalk

 

[anon62607]

So in general, here's what the different indicators probably mean:

G = GPRS, 114 kbps theoretical max, part of the overall GSM world
E = EDGE, 238 kbps max (around 2x GPRS), also on GSM
3G = HSDPA, or HSDPA+HSUPA - likely to be on different frequencies than if on G/E.
H = on a network that supports HSPA+, but not necessarily operating in one of the HSPA+ modes. However, it might not mean that, I'm not totally sure about it.

From slowest to fastest:

tech / download (forward channel) speed in kbps:
GPRS / 114
EDGE / 238
HSDPA category 11 / 900 kbps (QPSK modulation)
HSDPA category 2 / 1200 kbps (16QAM)
HSDPA category 12 / 1800 kbps (QPSK modulation)
HSDPA category 4 / 1800 kbps (16QAM)
HSDPA category 6 / 3600 kbps (16QAM)
HSDPA category 8 / 7200 kbps (16QAM)
HSDPA category 10 / 14000 kbps (16QAM - 14400 kbps counting error correction bits)
HSPA+ category 13 / 17600 kbps (64QAM)
HSPA+ category 14 / 21100 kbps (64QAM)

There are further categories but I think none of them are currently implemented in the US. The important thing to remember about 64QAM modes is that they're probably only going to be usable in very clean radio environments.

Also I am calling HSPA+ anything in the release 7 3GPP spec and HSDPA anything in the release 5 spec. By that rule, while t-mobile has an HSPA+ network, none of the mobile phones currently connecting to it are actually HSPA+ phones. They might be trying to fudge that rule a bit by saying that since it's an all-IP network and that's an optional part of HSPA+, and the chipsets use "some aspects of" HSPA+ the phones are therefore HSPA+ but I think that's stretching it.

By not labeling things 2G, 3G and 4G they're avoiding having to defend arguments like that - I can go to them and say "but it's not even an HSPA+ phone and certainly not 4G" and they can defend it by saying they never called the phone HSPA+ - only the network - and they aren't calling it 4G - their indicator only says "H" which can just mean HSDPA.

The whole thing is getting pedantic though. T-mobile is stuck in an obscure marketing situation in which their performance is, in actuality, going to be better than 3G phones on most other networks by a noticeable amount, and it is something they should be marketing but calling it "faster 3G" really doesn't get the point across that it is usually just as fast as what sprint is calling 4G.

I think the real 4G requirements are far too aggressive and the generational gaps should have been indicated by powers of ten, e.g.,
2G: ~100 kbps
3G: ~1000 kbps
4G: ~10000 kbps
or in other words log-10 of the download performance. Edge could be called 2.3G, EVDO 3.5G and so on. What we're getting formally is 3G about 2x faster than 2.5G, and then 4G 500x faster than that. It doesn't make a lot of sense to me.

 

[fredmr85]

Interesting - I haven't been checking what I am on usually...but at home it says I'm on UMTS -- which gets me close to 3 Mbps down.

 

[BlackPrince310]

Nice read. Hopefully T-Mobile will keep updating HSPA+ to keep up with LTE.

 

[Kevin OQuinn]

Renamed and merged threads. Let's try to keep all 3G/"4G" discussion here.