Why don't people like HTC anymore?

[masterpfa]

I personally don't dislike HTC, I have had a few HTC Hero, HTC Nexus One and the HTC Desire HD. But what I can imagine is people have, as I have in the past, tired of waiting for updates. This was not on the whole down to HTC, especially with my Hero, but my mobile provider delaying the update on the HTC Hero, but having said that the overall delay for the HTC phones and update has been Sense.

While, IMO, Sense was a bonus especially on these earlier phones (it was after all what convinced me to join the Android revolution), I feel the Sense overlay on ICS and JellyBean phones to be a distraction from the stock Android experience now afforded by Android 40. and 4.1.

I have preferred the Nexus experience wholly and I have been impressed lately with Samsung phones, maybe others are starting to just look elsewhere.

 

[briankariu]

I am in the minority, but my grief lies in their support for custom ROMS, and the dev community.
I have owned 1 N1, an Aria, 2 Inspires, and 2 Vivids. With all the phones prior to the vivids I could unlock and root pretty easily. Custom ROMS were a plenty. By the time I upgraded to the Vivids, HTC had started hoarding code, and monking with the backside making flashing kernels a pain. Most custom ROMs are either crippled ports or attempts to remove as much HTC as possible and still work. With the Vivid, you'll never be able to flash a true AOSP (that is sad), MIUI is meh, and you can just out and out forget about Cyanogen.

HTC tried to brighten their image by releasing ICS on the Vivid as an OTA faster than any other manufacturer. In their rush they released flawed code, and still refused to release binaries or code to allow devs to, well, develope. Instead of fixing this code they have just abandoned the Vivid as out of date and creates yet another bad impression for the general consumer. Instead of supporting the power user, they ignore them. This results in the hardware being panned as yet *another* joke from HTC, even though it has amazing hardware specs affording it the longevity of previous HTC devices.

Their lack of attention to both the average consumer *and* the power user has tarnished the great reputation built on the N1 and Droid/Droid 2. The crap Inspire hardware, and their continued lack of dev support for more devices than the Vivid really shows how they messed up.

You can piss off one or the other, but piss off both and you lose market share fast.

Just my opinion.

Thank you. I have always said that dev support is very important. Most people might not know what a custom ROM is, but purchasing decisions are always influenced by people(Close family members or friends) who are tech savy. And to be honest, there is no way I would tell anyone to get a HOX right now with no Jellybean in sight and no source code to boot. I will tell them to get the s3, since they will get updates faster, and they can always give it to me to flash a custom ROM in there if they feel updates are not coming out faster.

HTC lost our confidence as a dev community. Great hardware is good, great community and dev support is even better. HTC take a cue from samsung who release source codes for phones they are yet to announce

 

[Ethere]

I've had 2 HTC devices. My first was the Inspire, and to be honest I don't understand all the hate on that phone. I loved my Inspire. Sold it on Ebay only about 6 months ago for over $230. I have the HoX now and the only thing I was disappointed about was the 2.20 update where HTC and AT&T decided to lock the thing tighter than a drum. For some reason, I thought I couldn't go back to rooting my phone and installing custom roms, but found that since I had done it already on the 1.85 update, I'm back in love with this phone again.

However, all my friends are going to buy the new iPhone so I guess I should too </sarcasm>

HTC really just needs to open their phones (bootloader), and come up with a better marketing campaign.

 

[npaladin-2000]

Sense.. is still a little too heavy, the EVO LTE is just ugly and too tall, Sprint is a poor carrier with data issues so that would hurt EVO sale, poor marketing by htc...

No removable battery, the One S being on Tmobile.....

Sense is a problem, not only is it kinda bloated it has no where near the features of touchwiz in the gs3... Smartactions on motorola...

It's about software....HTC is falling behind on that.

It's either bloated or it doesn't have enough features but you can't say it's too bloated AND not bloated enough in the same sentence.

 

[va2azerik]

I used to like HTC but around 2010- 2011 their designs started to look outdated. When Samsung was getting thinner and curves, HTC stayed thicker and shaped as a block. I think they never got pass that public perception.

 

[HOLLYWOODANT215]

Never will I buy another HTC device. Originally Evo and Evo 3d is the reason must users switch to iphones, I was about to be 1 b4 I discovered the s2 thank god... My HTC over heated, random reboots. Freezing made my life so much harder. One x is a step up but I'm good. Samsung one nothing

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Android Central Forums

 

[8er]

It is a fantastic phone without a removable battery and removable storage. Removable storage and replaceable battery are issues. Either of which are show stoppers for some and is 100.0% of the time if I were the only study in the sample.

All these complaints about the phone, battery, storage, blah, blah blah. It's all nonsense. This is a fantastic phone and that stuff is a non issue. I do agree with the inspire being a pos, but the things I liked about it are all here, and the things I didn't are all gone. HTC has my support and I will continue to buy their products

Sent from my HTC One X using Android Central Forums

 

[taylorz_412]

If the HTC one x came to Verizon I would have bought that instead of my s3 but I think ppl just aren't happy with their design of phones but I think the one x and s are both sexy devices

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2

 

[8er]

Not HTC probably is where we will go.

People shouldn't give a flip about android design guidelines precluding micro SD storage. Manufactures ought to wholly care about driving people away from their brand.

SD cards also go against the Android design guidelines. It might drive people away from a brand, but eventually every brand will ditch it. Where will you go then?

 

[etnpnys]

I had the OG EVO 4G and I loved it. ...For a while. To me, HTC has irked me in several ways. First off is the lack of longer-term support for updates. Second is their wavering stance on opening/not opening/kinda opening the bootloader. They don't seem to understand what they want to do, so how am I supposed to back a company like that? However, I can also attest to build quality being top-notch. My toddler took my naked EVO and threw it off the 2nd floor onto hard tile below and the phone (once put back together) didn't show any signs of the incident. Amazing.

Now, my wife, on the other hand, is not technical. She has the EVO also, and even she can compose a justified argument for her issues with the phone, and they don't have to do with the UI. The EVO basically has 512MB for internal/app storage. After a fresh reload of the stock ROM, she has way less than 400MB to play with. That might have been acceptable 2 years ago, but apps got bigger. So she promptly runs out of space now, even when shoving everything she can onto the SD card. So we rooted it to get rid of the bloat in an effort to get more space on it and went with an SOS ROM because it's very close to stock but adds just a tiny bit of usability features. But she finds that it's just not reliable. And she can't just keep flashing her phone and crap all the time like I do. She just wants it to work. So basically, she's forced into instability. But she doesn't care too much about continued support as long as the phone works.

That said, the EVO 4G LTE has a lot of internal storage, a bigger battery, and the build quality is still expected to be amazing. She'll probably be getting that in a matter of weeks when we are able to upgrade her phone. For me, I'm sticking with Nexus devices from here on out. I don't care if Samsung or Motorola or anybody makes them. To me, it's all about continued support.

 

[icebike]

Wait, all this hate over a two year old phone?

The Nexus One suffered the same 512 memory limitation. It was the norm in those days.

You were expecting HTC to issue a memory upgrade OTA?

It's time to upgrade your phone.
Oh, and one more thing... Your 10 year old car isn't as cool or as energy efficient as a brand new one. Yup, who knew?

Sent from my HTC One X using Tapatalk 2

 

[etnpnys]

Wait, all this hate over a two year old phone?

The Nexus One suffered the same 512 memory limitation. It was the norm in those days.

You were expecting HTC to issue a memory upgrade OTA?

It's time to upgrade your phone.
Oh, and one more thing... Your 10 year old car isn't as cool or as energy efficient as a brand new one. Yup, who knew?

Sent from my HTC One X using Tapatalk 2

Your argument says nothing to my perspective, just my wife's. My qualms are with the company's philosophy. And I told you - my wife's not a techie, so to her the phone just doesn't work like it should. Additionally, the Nexus One didn't have carrier bloat and Sense that immediately took up space. Several of the updates that HAVE come to the phone have further reduced the available space. So your argument is like saying it's no big deal that Subaru filled the tank in my WRX up with sand when all the other cars of the same age had empty tanks.

And calm down, dude - I also said we'll be getting the new EVO lol

 

[iN8ter]

Bad quality and they always skimp on something. I was a bit skeptical going with the Skyrocket over the One X because of the screen resolution difference but I did use an ion before the SR and in the end I actually don't GaF about that. The phone just works, I can rep the battery if that goes bad, it lasts over a day on moderate use on HSPA+, it has a good camera (once I Google up some Smartphone Photography 101 lessons ), it's fast, has an SD card slot ($20 for 16GB at Best Buy thank you very much) and it has all the social tie-ins I need. Upgraded to ICS a week after I got it, too.

A bigger, removeable battery. An SD Card Slot (those are too cheap now, omitting one is a disservice to your customers, IMO). A bigger battery.

HTC was known for 2-3 things leading up to the "Sensation/Raider" Series/One X:

1. Bad Cameras: With lots of noise, bad low light performance, and predictable white balance issues. Their earlier BSI sensors had excessive exposure compensation in lower lighting conditions (Vivid, Rezound - I haven't used a Sensation or MT4G or Amaze 4G to see how those perform in similar situations). Codec used for Videos was typically below Samsung/Apple, Sound Quality in Video was generally quite bad if not downright abysmal. They tended to compress their images more than Samsung and others as well.

2. Bad Screens: They hung on to the older LCD screen tech for WAY too long.

3. Low Internal Storage - Not until the Vivid/Amaze4G/Rezound did they give a respectable amount of internal storage in their devices. Remember the G2 storage debacle.

4. Volatile Build Quality (Z Hinge, Materials, Thickness, No Gorilla Glass, Excessively protruding camera modules that scratched easily when phone on back or cracked easily if dropped on back, weightiness (this and thickness is an issue for people who prefer cases like Otterboxes), etc.). Their counter to the Samsung GS2 on AT&T and Verizon was the Vivid and Rezound, for example, and the Amaze 4G on T-Mobile (though I rather liked the look of the phone, and it's camera buttons).

5. Small Batteries: 1230 mAh when everyone else was using ~1500 mAh batteries. 1620-1735 when everyone else is using 1850-2100 mAh batteries on similarly or better spec'd (in the case of devices with AMOLED screens, even more EFFICIENTLY spec'd devices). I'm glaringly omitting things like BT 2.1 when Samsung starting using 3.0 back in the GS3, which can have huge implications on battery life for people who use BT Headsets/Headphones, in car, etc.).

6. Tech Lagging: WiFi Direct, NFC, etc. all came later to HTC handsets than same-generation Samsung handsets.

Plain and simple, most people didn't really like HTC's devices all that much. They liked HTC Sense, but even that became a beast - and they liked HTC's support of the dev community (things turned quickly when they started locking bootloaders - people jumped ship to Samsung in droves). TW3/GS1 was so absolutely terrible (RFS, Lag, borderline InPp GPS, PenTile screen with Image Retention, constant force closures/black screens due to buggy TouchWiz, absolutely terrible updates especially for US variants, etc.) that HTC could have steamrolled Samsung if they wanted, but they choked, and Samsung's Marketing distortion field was enough to bury HTC, because HTC's devices simply weren't that good, anyways.

The One Series are good phones, but they took shortcuts that simply look bad especially when OEMs like Samsung take things to the next level (not only do you get an SD card slot, but you can use... OMGZ... 64GB cards!!! Yay! - not only is the battery removeable, but it's... OMG... 21% bigger than the One X's battery). These things do matter, because a lot of people buy with possibilities in mind, not just the here and now. What you can possibly do with a device often means a lot more than we thing. This works in a lot of markets, like automobiles. Someone may never have to tow an R.V., but they'll get a truck that can do it simply because it can.

- - - Updated - - -

It's either bloated or it doesn't have enough features but you can't say it's too bloated AND not bloated enough in the same sentence.

Yes you can. Being bloated and being feature packed aren't the same thing. I can write a bloated Hello World program, no problem, and a streamlined one. Neither has more features than the other. One is just coded worse than the other.

Sense IS bloated and it is heavy. It's been a constant complaint about it for quite a while.

TouchWiz was absolutely terrible at 3.0 and the Original Galaxy S was super bad for such a hyped Flagship and HTC let that opportunity slip between their fingers cause they had a few good quarters and wanted to milk the cow with 500 different smartphone models.

Didn't work out too well.

As for memory, HTC has generally been good about RAM. They actually moved from 512 to 768 eariler than I think any other Manufacturer. The problem they've had has been with actual Storage on their devices. They didn't give much at all.

 

[diskoman69]

Because they did 2 stupid things:

1) They signed exclusives with AT&T (One X) and T-Mobile (One S). This was a CRITICAL error. Samsung on the other hand worked with all nationwide carriers here in the states, and even several regional ones, to get the SAME phone out to all of them. Yes, Sprint then got the Evo 4G LTE and Verizon the Droid Incredible 4G LTE, but then what was the point of coming up with the One series?!! If they had released the One X AND One S on all carriers, with removable storage like the Evo 4G LTE, then this would be a whole different ballgame right now.

2) They then let the carriers cripple the phone compared to the GS3 competition. It's bad enough that the GS3 has removable storage and the HOX doesn't, but HTC allowed AT&T to cut the storage from 32GB on the international version to 16GB stateside. The version of the One S with all of the marketing hoopla was the black (ceramic-metallic) one, so which version is the only one T-Mobile wants to sell? That's right: the blue(ish) painted one. Once again: 16GB storage, no removable storage. HTC seems to have an "if we build it they will come" philosophy...but that only works when you build something clearly superior. They can't wow in one area (screen, build quality, camera) only to let their customers down in others (multitasking, no removable storage or battery, less RAM). This is especially true when you have competitors that you only slightly best with your strong suits, but they clearly best you in your weak areas like the GS3 does to the One X.

 

[Kevin OQuinn]

This thread is making me LOL.

HTC as a manufacturer has done far more for Android than Samsung has. The definitive Android device, and still a TON of people's favorite, is the Nexus One. Made by HTC. That phone has set the tone for HTC's design language as a whole (yes, they don't all directly descend from the N1). Next in line is Motorola with the Droid. Do you think Android would've taken off on the coattails of the original Galaxy S line? Definitely not. GPS didn't even work right. I can bring that up, because people are bringing up two year old HTC phones that don't work the same way as brand new devices (isn't that kinda obvious anyway).

Sony has done more on the software side (Google has said they have given back more code then any other manufacturer).

Samsung, to be frank, is successful because they blatantly copy other companies (court cases to prove it). Samsung is the Apple of Android manufacturers. They sell millions of devices, have huge marketing budgets, and are more than happy to litigate to protect their stuff. They won't break the mold, won't significantly change Touchwiz, and will become stale over time because of this. They have reached the point where people want a "touchwiz" phone because they got used to it on their older device. Call it success if you want (financially it is), but some things they choose to do hold back the platform as a whole (blame Google for not having more control, but we love open source right?) (menu button, SD card both go against Google guidelines). Who cares about Google guidelines? Developers. How can they reliably code an app for the way Android should work if manufacturers are purposely throwing those out the window?

I'm not giving HTC a pass, though, either. They had a rough 2011 and didn't have any real blockbuster devices. I blame them solely relying on Qualcomm as part of the reason. Why not make a Tegra 2 device and take advantage of that marketing? They also didn't have any killer features, but they weren't terrible in any particular area either. They were mid-to-upper range in every area, with no glaring issues but also no standout feature to shove in people's face. Then there's the Thunderbolt. Arguably their flagship last year solely because it was the first LTE phone. The launch was borked, the phone looked terrible, the build quality wasn't great, and it didn't age well at all. It had older internals, and was quickly overshadowed by the Charge (another phone completely forgotten).

My issue is this....why get stuck on what they used to do? The One Series is great. It has some solid standout features (camera, screen, design), and a few questionable ones (minfree settings), but by no means are those deal breakers for most. And if you're going to hold HTC's history against it, then do the same for Samsung. The original Galaxy S line was a mess. GPS didn't work (seriously how did they ship that way?), the screens weren't good (even at the time they really weren't), and Touchwiz was absolutely terrible and looked exactly like iOS.

And stop getting stuck on battery capacity. I get through an entire day of use every day. It's efficient. The display is efficient, more so than AMOLED in most cases (AMOLED is only more efficient when displaying dark scenes, when dislpaying white like in web pages it's terrible). The material used might be the same, but HTC did better with it IMO. It doesn't feel as cheap (if you disagree that's fine, but then you probably haven't held both phones either).

 

[SenseMonkey]

This thread is making me LOL.

HTC as a manufacturer has done far more for Android than Samsung has. The definitive Android device, and still a TON of people's favorite, is the Nexus One. Made by HTC. That phone has set the tone for HTC's design language as a whole (yes, they don't all directly descend from the N1). Next in line is Motorola with the Droid. Do you think Android would've taken off on the coattails of the original Galaxy S line? Definitely not. GPS didn't even work right. I can bring that up, because people are bringing up two year old HTC phones that don't work the same way as brand new devices (isn't that kinda obvious anyway).

Sony has done more on the software side (Google has said they have given back more code then any other manufacturer).

Samsung, to be frank, is successful because they blatantly copy other companies (court cases to prove it). Samsung is the Apple of Android manufacturers. They sell millions of devices, have huge marketing budgets, and are more than happy to litigate to protect their stuff. They won't break the mold, won't significantly change Touchwiz, and will become stale over time because of this. They have reached the point where people want a "touchwiz" phone because they got used to it on their older device. Call it success if you want (financially it is), but some things they choose to do hold back the platform as a whole (blame Google for not having more control, but we love open source right?) (menu button, SD card both go against Google guidelines). Who cares about Google guidelines? Developers. How can they reliably code an app for the way Android should work if manufacturers are purposely throwing those out the window?

I'm not giving HTC a pass, though, either. They had a rough 2011 and didn't have any real blockbuster devices. I blame them solely relying on Qualcomm as part of the reason. Why not make a Tegra 2 device and take advantage of that marketing? They also didn't have any killer features, but they weren't terrible in any particular area either. They were mid-to-upper range in every area, with no glaring issues but also no standout feature to shove in people's face. Then there's the Thunderbolt. Arguably their flagship last year solely because it was the first LTE phone. The launch was borked, the phone looked terrible, the build quality wasn't great, and it didn't age well at all. It had older internals, and was quickly overshadowed by the Charge (another phone completely forgotten).

My issue is this....why get stuck on what they used to do? The One Series is great. It has some solid standout features (camera, screen, design), and a few questionable ones (minfree settings), but by no means are those deal breakers for most. And if you're going to hold HTC's history against it, then do the same for Samsung. The original Galaxy S line was a mess. GPS didn't work (seriously how did they ship that way?), the screens weren't good (even at the time they really weren't), and Touchwiz was absolutely terrible and looked exactly like iOS.

And stop getting stuck on battery capacity. I get through an entire day of use every day. It's efficient. The display is efficient, more so than AMOLED in most cases (AMOLED is only more efficient when displaying dark scenes, when dislpaying white like in web pages it's terrible). The material used might be the same, but HTC did better with it IMO. It doesn't feel as cheap (if you disagree that's fine, but then you probably haven't held both phones either).

+1 to kev. Smart guy. And its true,why judge on their past.? Their current phone are killer compared to other phones. The one x is by far my favorite Htc (keep in mind i said htc,iv had plenty others) phone i ever owned. I owned the original htc evo,the 3D,and the one x. The one x out preforms,out beautifies,out does any other previous htc phone. Why.? Time. Technology changes real quick in such little time. Member when having a single core 1Ghz processor was said to be lightning fast.? Then dual-core showed up,and not even a year later nvidia announced their quad-core chip. Everything gets better,and more advanced over time,The past is the past and we should be judging on the now. Keep in mind high tech computers was the first company for manu things,1st android phone,1st Ghz processor in a phone,first 4.3 inch screen,first ina bunch of things. Htc is one of the best cell makers in all time; keep in mind moto,nokia,and others where making phones yeeeaaaarrrrs b4 htc was first founded,and they made their way to the top 5phone makers cause obviously they make great azz phones. Now,one x is awsome phone. Switch phones or Stop complaining guys,not that hard.

Sent from my super awe-esome Htc one x

 

[cbc0201]

I love HTC and will ride her into the ground along with their current mngt team!


Sent from my HTC One X using Tapatalk 2

 

[anon(94115)]

The ONE X is not the answer to the SGSIII as stated above, the one that is coming is the answer and will help to pull HTC out of the spin they are on right now. They just need to get it out by about mid-November, to most carriers, and throw some money at it.

 

[Kevin OQuinn]

The ONE X is not the answer to the SGSIII as stated above, the one that is coming is the answer and will help to pull HTC out of the spin they are on right now. They just need to get it out by about mid-November, to most carriers, and throw some money at it.

Wouldn't it be the other way around? The S3 was the answer to the One X. When/if the upgraded version comes out then Samsung will need to answer that.

 

[Ry]

Because they did 2 stupid things:

1) They signed exclusives with AT&T (One X) and T-Mobile (One S). This was a CRITICAL error. Samsung on the other hand worked with all nationwide carriers here in the states, and even several regional ones, to get the SAME phone out to all of them. Yes, Sprint then got the Evo 4G LTE and Verizon the Droid Incredible 4G LTE, but then what was the point of coming up with the One series?!! If they had released the One X AND One S on all carriers, with removable storage like the Evo 4G LTE, then this would be a whole different ballgame right now.

2) They then let the carriers cripple the phone compared to the GS3 competition. It's bad enough that the GS3 has removable storage and the HOX doesn't, but HTC allowed AT&T to cut the storage from 32GB on the international version to 16GB stateside. The version of the One S with all of the marketing hoopla was the black (ceramic-metallic) one, so which version is the only one T-Mobile wants to sell? That's right: the blue(ish) painted one. Once again: 16GB storage, no removable storage. HTC seems to have an "if we build it they will come" philosophy...but that only works when you build something clearly superior. They can't wow in one area (screen, build quality, camera) only to let their customers down in others (multitasking, no removable storage or battery, less RAM). This is especially true when you have competitors that you only slightly best with your strong suits, but they clearly best you in your weak areas like the GS3 does to the One X.

1) and 2) HTC is not Apple or Samsung. They are not in a position to dictate their terms to carriers.



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