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  1. Thread Author  Thread Author    #1  

    Default Ending the Menu Key Argument for Good(Hopefully)

    Many here have complained about the lack of a menu key on the One and many have defended HTC's curious omission stating HTC was doing what Google wanted.

    Now comes word straight from Google that the as yet unannounced "Google One" will need either a dedicated menu button or a remapping.

    Can we please end this debate now?

    From the AC home page:

    "The existence of a Google Edition HTC One raises several questions, however. The current two-buttoned HTC One relies on an unsightly on-screen bar for legacy menu key support, so how would this work on a vanilla Android variant? It's unlikely that menu key functionality could be re-mapped to, say, a long-press of the back key, as it's previously been confirmed that Google doesn't want HTC hiding the menu button. The most direct (but unlikely) solution would be a change to the hardware key layout, assuming Google and HTC want to avoid losing screen space to an on-screen menu bar."
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  2. #2  

    Default Re: Ending the Menu Key Argument for Good(Hopefully)

    Quote Originally Posted by madlaw1071 View Post
    Many here have complained about the lack of a menu key on the One and many have defended HTC's curious omission stating HTC was doing what Google wanted.

    Now comes word straight from Google that the as yet unannounced "Google One" will need either a dedicated menu button or a remapping.

    Can we please end this debate now?

    From the AC home page:

    "The existence of a Google Edition HTC One raises several questions, however. The current two-buttoned HTC One relies on an unsightly on-screen bar for legacy menu key support, so how would this work on a vanilla Android variant? It's unlikely that menu key functionality could be re-mapped to, say, a long-press of the back key, as it's previously been confirmed that Google doesn't want HTC hiding the menu button. The most direct (but unlikely) solution would be a change to the hardware key layout, assuming Google and HTC want to avoid losing screen space to an on-screen menu bar."
    I could care less about the menu key.

    Further, it appears that you just want to get an argument going. The article on AC is only speculation as to how the GE One would handle a menu button. It doesn't say that anything has to change from the current setup.
  3. #3  

    Default Re: Ending the Menu Key Argument for Good(Hopefully)

    Good job madlaw. You found it all out. I still like the phone. Also, you should probably understand the wording in the article. The menu button is gone from android, get over it. Be upset at something worth being upset about.
  4. Thread Author  Thread Author    #4  

    Default Re: Ending the Menu Key Argument for Good(Hopefully)

    Quote Originally Posted by mrbootcrm View Post
    Good job madlaw. You found it all out. I still like the phone. Also, you should probably understand the wording in the article. The menu button is gone from android, get over it. Be upset at something worth being upset about.
    It's gone from Android yet it remains on the 2 most popular devices(S3 and S4)? Let's see what happens if/when the Google One is released.
  5. #5  
    Jennifer Stough's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ending the Menu Key Argument for Good(Hopefully)

    There is no need for an argument to ensue over this thread. While the wording of this thread is a little... condescending, it is a good point none the less. I think it would be interesting to see what they could do regarding the black menu bar, as it is not in google standards to have it. Bring it to a google phone? I can imagine the complaints now. However, I'm sure HTC has thought this out before agreeing with google to create a GE device. I honestly do not see them adding a physical menu button, unless they were to remove the HTC logo and slap it there.
  6. #6  
    ahaxton's Avatar

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    Default Re: Ending the Menu Key Argument for Good(Hopefully)

    Personally, I think it'll be exactly as it is in the current One. Legacy out-of-spec apps get a black bar with an overflow key. That's exactly how it works on a Nexus device now, except that black bar also happens to contain on-screen keys.
  7. #7  

    Default Re: Ending the Menu Key Argument for Good(Hopefully)

    Quote Originally Posted by ahaxton View Post
    Personally, I think it'll be exactly as it is in the current One. Legacy out-of-spec apps get a black bar with an overflow key. That's exactly how it works on a Nexus device now, except that black bar also happens to contain on-screen keys.
    Bingo. This is hard coded into the OS, yet people still seem to think it's something HTC has done.

    And there is no mystery or discussion needed about the menu button. The people who build Android have addressed it . Devices running Google Android do not use a menu, or need a menu button.
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  8. Thread Author  Thread Author    #8  

    Default Re: Ending the Menu Key Argument for Good(Hopefully)

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Hildenbrand View Post
    Bingo. This is hard coded into the OS, yet people still seem to think it's something HTC has done.

    And there is no mystery or discussion needed about the menu button. The people who build Android have addressed it . Devices running Google Android do not use a menu, or need a menu button.
    Are you suggesting the HTC didnt have a choice to put a menu key in and avoid the black bar problem? Clearly they did have a choice and either thought major apps like Facebook, Angry Birds etc. would have updated by now or they just didn't think the black bar eating into an already sub-market screen size was a big deal.
  9. #9  
    Jennifer Stough's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ending the Menu Key Argument for Good(Hopefully)

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Hildenbrand View Post
    Bingo. This is hard coded into the OS, yet people still seem to think it's something HTC has done.

    And there is no mystery or discussion needed about the menu button. The people who build Android have addressed it . Devices running Google Android do not use a menu, or need a menu button.

    If app developers would just adhere to the google structure...
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  10. #10  

    Default Re: Ending the Menu Key Argument for Good(Hopefully)

    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer Stough View Post
    There is no need for an argument to ensue over this thread. While the wording of this thread is a little... condescending, it is a good point none the less. I think it would be interesting to see what they could do regarding the black menu bar, as it is not in google standards to have it. Bring it to a google phone? I can imagine the complaints now. However, I'm sure HTC has thought this out before agreeing with google to create a GE device. I honestly do not see them adding a physical menu button, unless they were to remove the HTC logo and slap it there.
    I honestly don't see the point at all. He mis-characterized the article. Where is his source for "Now comes word straight from Google that the as yet unannounced "Google One" will need either a dedicated menu button or a remapping." He has it completely bass-akwards. An I still think he did it just to start an argument.
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    Jennifer Stough's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ending the Menu Key Argument for Good(Hopefully)

    Quote Originally Posted by madlaw1071 View Post
    Are you suggesting the HTC didnt have a choice to put a menu key in and avoid the black bar problem? Clearly they did have a choice and either thought major apps like Facebook, Angry Birds etc. would have updated by now or they just didn't think the black bar eating into an already sub-market screen size was a big deal.
    HTC was honestly just adhering to the structure frameworks of google. Some phone manufacturers choose to go against this, still, and some app developers, as well. Therefore making the unsightly black bar necessary.
  12. Thread Author  Thread Author    #12  

    Default Re: Ending the Menu Key Argument for Good(Hopefully)

    Quote Originally Posted by SCjRqrQCnBQ19QoYCtdl View Post
    I honestly don't see the point at all. He mis-characterized the article. Where is his source for "Now comes word straight from Google that the as yet unannounced "Google One" will need either a dedicated menu button or a remapping." He has it completely bass-akwards. An I still think he did it just to start an argument.
    It's a direct quote Erik. Hit the home page and then take it up with Alex, not me.
  13. #13  

    Default Re: Ending the Menu Key Argument for Good(Hopefully)

    Quote Originally Posted by madlaw1071 View Post
    Are you suggesting the HTC didnt have a choice to put a menu key in and avoid the black bar problem? Clearly they did have a choice and either thought major apps like Facebook, Angry Birds etc. would have updated by now or they just didn't think the black bar eating into an already sub-market screen size was a big deal.
    Yes, they had a choice, and made the correct one. Feel free to read the link I posted, then contact Google to voice your concern.
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  14. Thread Author  Thread Author    #14  

    Default Re: Ending the Menu Key Argument for Good(Hopefully)

    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer Stough View Post
    HTC was honestly just adhering to the structure frameworks of google. Some phone manufacturers choose to go against this, still, and some app developers, as well. Therefore making the unsightly black bar necessary.
    That's where I'm confused I guess, according to Alex on the front page and the linked tweets, Google doesnt want the menu key hidden. Am I reading it wrong?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Hildenbrand View Post
    Yes, they had a choice, and made the correct one. Feel free to read the link I posted, then contact Google to voice your concern.
    Your link is a year and half old. I'm read what Alex wrote on the home page.
  15. #15  

    Default Re: Ending the Menu Key Argument for Good(Hopefully)

    Quote Originally Posted by madlaw1071 View Post
    ... just didn't think the black bar eating into an already sub-market screen size was a big deal.
    Can some one get him back in the s4 forum? "Sub-market screen size". I am really tired of reading nonsense every time I open the forum.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by madlaw1071 View Post
    That's where I'm confused I guess, according to Alex on the front page and the linked tweets, Google doesnt want the menu key hidden. Am I reading it wrong?

    - - - Updated - - -



    Your link is a year and half old. I'm read what Alex wrote on the home page.
    Yes, you are reading it wrong. They don't want it behind another button, i.e. long press back.
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  16. #16  

    Default Re: Ending the Menu Key Argument for Good(Hopefully)

    Quote Originally Posted by madlaw1071 View Post
    That's where I'm confused I guess, according to Alex on the front page and the linked tweets, Google doesnt want the menu key hidden. Am I reading it wrong?

    - - - Updated - - -



    Your link is a year and half old. I'm read what Alex wrote on the home page.
    You need to make the distinction between a menu button that's hidden from the user, and not having one present.
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    Default Re: Ending the Menu Key Argument for Good(Hopefully)

    Quote Originally Posted by madlaw1071 View Post
    That's where I'm confused I guess, according to Alex on the front page and the linked tweets, Google doesnt want the menu key hidden. Am I reading it wrong?

    - - - Updated - - -



    Your link is a year and half old. I'm read what Alex wrote on the home page.
    They don't want HTC to hide the black bar button. Not a physical button.

    Edit for clarity: Google doesn't want HTC to hide the black bar on apps that are not up to guidelines.
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  18. Thread Author  Thread Author    #18  

    Default Re: Ending the Menu Key Argument for Good(Hopefully)

    Here is the link Alex referred to:

  19. #19  

    Default Re: Ending the Menu Key Argument for Good(Hopefully)

    Quote Originally Posted by madlaw1071 View Post
    Here is the link Alex referred to:

    And Drew was talking about a hidden menu function as they had with the One X. Ask him, he's a nice fellow to talk to.
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    Default Re: Ending the Menu Key Argument for Good(Hopefully)

    Quote Originally Posted by madlaw1071 View Post
    It's a direct quote Erik. Hit the home page and then take it up with Alex, not me.
    That isn't what it says. It says they don't want the menu key hidden behind another key. They don't say that google has any problem with the current One button structure. They (AC) speculate how they could change the menu key, but make no claims that it must be changed.
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  21. #21  
    Jennifer Stough's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ending the Menu Key Argument for Good(Hopefully)

    Quote Originally Posted by madlaw1071 View Post
    That's where I'm confused I guess, according to Alex on the front page and the linked tweets, Google doesnt want the menu key hidden. Am I reading it wrong?

    - - - Updated - - -



    Your link is a year and half old. I'm read what Alex wrote on the home page.
    They don't want the onscreen menu button to be hidden and remapped to a hardware key. They have made it standard to have a soft menu button, whether it be a black bar at the bottom of the screen, or incorporated into the app.

    Sent from my HTC6435LVW using Android Central Forums
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  22. #22  
    ahaxton's Avatar

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    Default Re: Ending the Menu Key Argument for Good(Hopefully)

    Quote Originally Posted by madlaw1071 View Post
    That's where I'm confused I guess, according to Alex on the front page and the linked tweets, Google doesnt want the menu key hidden. Am I reading it wrong?
    As I understand it, they want some visible manifestation of the menu button. Preferably, by their standard, an on-screen overflow button. But if not, the manufacturer can buck the standard and put a physical button on, as long as there is a dedicated visual manifestation of the menu function. What they do NOT want is a menu button that is not visible and obvious, ala long pressing the back button or some other "hidden" way, as I believe HTC did on the One X and the Evo LTE.
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    Default Re: Ending the Menu Key Argument for Good(Hopefully)

    Just lock this thread. It is useless. "Sub-market screen size"? Seriously? This is just troll-bait.
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  24. #24  

    Default Re: Ending the Menu Key Argument for Good(Hopefully)

    Quote Originally Posted by Kylazin View Post
    Just lock this thread. It is useless. "Sub-market screen size"? Seriously? This is just troll-bait.
    Personally I'm enjoying it. I think we are ending the argument once and for all, just not in the direction madlaw was thinking.
  25. Thread Author  Thread Author    #25  

    Default Re: Ending the Menu Key Argument for Good(Hopefully)

    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer Stough View Post
    They don't want the onscreen menu button to be hidden and remapped to a hardware key. They have made it standard to have a soft menu button, whether it be a black bar at the bottom of the screen, or incorporated into the app.

    Sent from my HTC6435LVW using Android Central Forums
    OK, then more confusion. I dont have a black bar on my Nexus 7. So Google is ok with an HTC One that has a black menu bar while the Nexus and S4 dont?
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