Need advice: Android after iOS

[Davehow]

It would be a taste issue if the only difference was the hardware. But's it's a choice issue, because you are forced to use the software with the hardware. This is not something that is built in...Samsung could give you a choice if they wanted to, and it would cost them nothing. They are choosing not to give you a choice. It is a deliberate decision that has nothing to do with cost.


Samsung's hardware is capable of running Android every bit as fast and smooth as the Nexus. The "performance issue" is entirely the fault of the software that they will not let you uninstall.

I do understand people can choose not to buy the phone. Just explaining why there is resentment against skins. It's great we have choices in phones. It would be even great-er if we were not forced to use vendor skins as well.

I get the feeling our wires are crossed because we're having two different conversations here. I'm talking about how some branded phones will have a good set of features that will appeal to some buyers, therefore a good buy according to their tastes. You're responding by telling me why you dislike Samsung.

I dont have an issue with that (I don't like them either), just saying that's not really anything to do with what I'm talking about.

I don't feel forced to buy a vendor skin though. If I don't want one I'll buy a nexus, or GPE, or a 1+1 etc.

 

[JeffDenver]

I get the feeling our wires are crossed because we're having two different conversations here. I'm talking about how some branded phones will have a good set of features that will appeal to some buyers

Hardware and software features are completely separate things. Touchwiz (and it's features) are not actually part of the phone...it's something installed on the phone. The display and radio and camera are a part of the phone and cannot be replaced with something else...that is not true of touchwiz.

Everyone I know that buys Samsung buys it because of the hardware. The touchwiz features are not why they want the phone. They want the phone because it is waterproof, or because of the camera quality or because of the display quality or because it has expandable storage.

I don't feel forced to buy a vendor skin though. If I don't want one I'll buy a nexus, or GPE, or a 1+1 etc.

So you think it is unreasonable to want Samsung to allow us to remove touchwiz?

This is analogous to Toyota saying "The only radio stations we will allow you to listen to are heavy metal...if you don't like it, go buy a different car".

 

[JeffDenver]

I've had zero issues with the led lights,and I get a ton of messages on my m8.

FWIW the nexus is a very good phone,but I feel the m8 is every bit as good if not better with Sense 6, boom sound, 128gig sd card support,not to mention the overall build quality of the phone.

The thing that killed the M8 for me was the camera. The Nexus does have a better camera IMO. Some people actually think the M7 had a better camera as well.



The Nexus has OIS in addition to a much higher resolution.

 

[Davehow]

Hardware and software features are completely separate things. Touchwiz (and it's features) are not actually part of the phone...it's something installed on the phone. The display and radio and camera are a part of the phone and cannot be replaced with something else...that is not true of touchwiz.

Everyone I know that buys Samsung buys it because of the hardware. The touchwiz features are not why they want the phone. They want the phone because it is waterproof, or because of the camera quality or because of the display quality or because it has expandable storage.


So you think it is unreasonable to want Samsung to allow us to remove touchwiz?

This is analogous to Toyota saying "The only radio stations we will allow you to listen to are heavy metal...if you don't like it, go buy a different car".

Well... Yes! Isn't that what a free market is all about? One company doesn't make what you want, you buy from another company. Why on earth would I walk into a store and insist they sell me a product with features I like from another brand? I'd just go buy that brand.

Don't like touchwiz? OK then don't buy Samsung.

 

[JeffDenver]

Well... Yes! Isn't that what a free market is all about?

If you mean "Should they be allowed to do that"...of course they should.

That does not mean they should be free of criticism for it. If Toyota locked radio stations like that, a lot of people would complain...even people who bought Toyota anyway. The fact that you are legally allowed to do something does not necessarily mean it's a good idea.

One company doesn't make what you want, you buy from another company. Why on earth would I walk into a store and insist they sell me a product with features I like from another brand?

What features are we insisting they sell us?

All we're asking for is the ability to cut out what we don't want. Why is it unreasonable for them to provide that option?

 

[Davehow]

If you mean "Should they be allowed to do that"...of course they should.

That does not mean they should be free of criticism for it. If Toyota locked radio stations like that, a lot of people would complain...even people who bought Toyota anyway. The fact that you are legally allowed to do something does not necessarily mean it's a good idea.


What features are we insisting they sell us?

All we're asking for is the ability to cut out what we don't want. Why is it unreasonable for them to provide that option?

From a business standpoint yes. I would LOVE to have a-la carte feature selection every time I buy a car, but car makers won't do that because it's a logistical nightmare to cater to every individual. So they sell us option packages. Don't like that brand's options? Then you have to look at another company. Don't like Samsung's option packages? They offer you galaxy, galaxy prime, ruggeds, notes, GPEs. Then buy another brand.

I get it Jeff - Samsung doesn't have a package in that list that YOU want. OK then, so go buy a nexus. Or whatever. I think you're being kind of high maintenance expecting anything more

 

[MDMcAtee]

If you mean "Should they be allowed to do that"...of course they should.

That does not mean they should be free of criticism for it. If Toyota locked radio stations like that, a lot of people would complain...even people who bought Toyota anyway. The fact that you are legally allowed to do something does not necessarily mean it's a good idea.


What features are we insisting they sell us?

All we're asking for is the ability to cut out what we don't want. Why is it unreasonable for them to provide that option?

Eventually they will. Even if they abandoned Android for their own Tizen. The reason is it will even become more cluttered and it won't get the reviews to generate the sales. Look at what there numbers are saying. People are getting Fed up with them. Even though they are decent phones when rooted.

I'll say the same thing to you as I did to the op go on this forum to the picture thread of the m8 and do your own comparisons. What has been shown is by using the manual mode and appropriately using better settings for the light,the pictures are very good. While not as good in a few cases,but better for others like macros and low light. Casual shots with moderate distances are very clear. Long range landscapes not...this is not what the camera is about. For its intended purpose it does very good. There is no cell phone camera that can out shoot a dedicated camera. None....not even the vaulted Nokia 1020. I know this first hand. If people would learn how to actually use a cameras manual mode,they would find they can do better when they have the settings on board like the m8 has.

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[Jean Rodriguez1]

Honestly do what I did I looked at reviews I picked 3 phones I liked which at the time we're LG G2 the S4 and the moto X just did research on them too fell in love with the LG G2 waiting to have my upgrade to the LG G3 can't wait I'm coming over from blackberry but android is the **** haha

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[JeffDenver]

From a business standpoint yes. I would LOVE to have a-la carte feature selection every time I buy a car, but car makers won't do that because it's a logistical nightmare to cater to every individual.

Well, that analogy doesn't hold here. It would not be a logistical nightmare for Samsung to offer this option. In fact, it'd probably be the exact opposite. It would be less for them to maintain, not more. All they'd need to provide is drivers, which they already make for touchwiz anyway.

Lets not pretend that logistics is the reason they are not offering this option.

I get it Jeff - Samsung doesn't have a package in that list that YOU want.

You think I am the only one complaining about this?

Samsung is allowed to sell whatever they want. I am allowed to complain about it on a tech forum, and advise people to avoid them because of it. What is the problem exactly?

 

[Davehow]

Well, that analogy doesn't hold here. It would not be a logistical nightmare for Samsung to offer this option. In fact, it'd probably be the exact opposite. It would be less for them to maintain, not more. All they'd need to provide is drivers, which they already make for touchwiz anyway.

Lets not pretend that logistics is the reason they are not offering this option.


You think I am the only one complaining about this?

Samsung is allowed to sell whatever they want. I am allowed to complain about it on a tech forum, and advise people to avoid them because of it. What is the problem exactly?

I have no problem with you voicing your opinion whatsoever. I just disagree that they should be catering to your wishes to the extent you're looking for, that's all.

 

[ldragon76]

I only read the first few replies to this thread, but wanted to add my experience with my phone...

I got a droid Maxx about a month ago, yes it's not the newest one but I don't regret the decision one bit. I dig the vanilla interface, the voice commands, the active display, the fact that it's well supported (I'm running 4.4.4), etc. I've also installed and uninstalled various apps and games (been rather on a play store binge lately), and all have run flawlessly, including my favorite genre, the shooters, despite this unit having hardware that isn't as up to date as what's currently available in regards to CPU and ram. I haven't had a single lockup or crash, and my battery life is rocking.

OK I'm done plugging Motorola now LOL. Just wanted to talk about my experience to exemplify that there are great phones that have been available for some time.

As far as Samsung, to each his own. I hated my last phone, and granted, it was a terrible phone anyway, but it was also Samsung and when an update fubared it the support was lacking even though I had just gotten it a month previous. Also... Now that I know what vanilla is like I am unlikely to ever go back to a branded interface again.

Sent from my Droid Maxx via Tapatalk

 

[JeffDenver]

I have no problem with you voicing your opinion whatsoever. I just disagree that they should be catering to your wishes to the extent you're looking for, that's all.

I don't think my demands are unreasonable at all. I'm not asking them to produce anything extra...just allow me to get rid of stuff I don't want.

Toyota will allow me to replace the stereo if I don't like the one the car comes with. And I don't have to beg them to unlock it to do it.

 

[JeffDenver]

Eventually they will. Even if they abandoned Android for their own Tizen.

I do not think they will go to Tizen...once they see the disappointing sales (mark my words, this will come to pass), they will realize quickly that Tizen is not a viable alternative.

I also don't think they'll abandon Touchwiz. It's been years and they are still convinced that touchwiz is the reason people buy their phones at all. They will hold on to it all the way to the grave.

For these reasons I am predicting a gradual decline in Samsung's smartphone marketshare over the next few years. I doubt they'll die out completely, but they will fade to just one of many Android vendors instead of "the" Android vendor they are now. Kinda sucks, because they do make top notch hardware. But short of them being bought out by someone else, I do not see them changing. And without changing, I think companies like LG or Moto will eventually catch up and even surpass them. They're, ironically, making the same mistakes Apple made...except that they won't be able to coast on their image like Apple did. Having great hardware is going to matter a lot less going forward since all the big companies (Moto, LG, and maybe HTC if they can get their crap together) have great hardware now.

I'll say the same thing to you as I did to the op go on this forum to the picture thread of the m8 and do your own comparisons.

I agree he should try the M8. It has the best build quality and the best speakers. If he is satisfied with the camera and can tolerate Sense, there no reason not to get an M8.

Here is the Nexus 5 Photo thread: http://forums.androidcentral.com/go...nexus-5-camera-photos-videos-thoughts-18.html

What has been shown is by using the manual mode and appropriately using better settings for the light,the pictures are very good. While not as good in a few cases,but better for others like macros and low light.

Do you have any comparison samples?

(EDIT - I deleted the photos I posted...I thought it was the M8, but it was the M7, which is obviously not a fair comparison. )

Could not find any comparisons for Macro...but these are Nexus 5 macro samples (click for full resolution):







I only used my own images, because I am 100% sure they are unaltered (except for cropping)...but in that photo thread there are tons more and some much better than these.

 

[Davehow]

they will fade to just one of many Android vendors instead of "the" Android vendor they are now.

I would like to see this. It's too unbalanced right now and awesome handset makers are in danger because of it

 

[JeffDenver]

I would like to see this. It's too unbalanced right now and awesome handset makers are in danger because of it

Ironically, I'd prefer it if they stayed on top. I'd rather they just adapted than died, but I don't think they're going to be willing to do that. They won't want to embrace vanilla Android because they will see it as being dependent on Google.

 

[A895]

I would like to see this. It's too unbalanced right now and awesome handset makers are in danger because of it

The problem is the definition of awesome varies greatly when a mass consumer wants and what a techie or well read tech consumers want.

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[JeffDenver]

Samsung's "Spam tons of software gimmicks and see what sticks" method is just not going to work well in this new era of minimalism. Even the normies are embracing it. It's not just the nerds.

 

[A895]

Samsung's "Spam tons of software gimmicks and see what sticks" method is just not going to work well in this new era of minimalism. Even the normies are embracing it. It's not just the nerds.

That's the thing though, Samsung still is selling millions of devices. The thing is people are noticing other smart phones too, but there is still a overwhelming majority who buy Samsung.

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[JeffDenver]

That's the thing though, Samsung still is selling millions of devices. The thing is people are noticing other smart phones too, but there is still a overwhelming majority who buy Samsung.

That used to be true of Apple as well. Things change.

Apple had a mitigating factor...their image. People will buy there stuff for the logo alone. It won't save them, but it will make their decline take a lot longer.

Samsung doesn't have that...they have to actually compete on the merits of the device. And in a minimalistic world, touchwiz is going to be increasingly unappealing IMO. The minimalist trend is not just an Android thing...it is happening across platforms.

 

[A895]

That used to be true of Apple as well. Things change.

Apple had a mitigating factor...their image. People will buy there stuff for the logo alone. It won't save them, but it will make their decline take a lot longer.

Samsung doesn't have that...they have to actually compete on the merits of the device. And in a minimalistic world, touchwiz is going to be increasingly unappealing IMO. The minimalist trend is not just an Android thing...it is happening across platforms.

That minimalist trend is a backdrop to a thing I doubt any mass consumer is aware of or cares for. As it is minimalism is just something that is happening without consumer noticing just like how smart phones have gotten so big or how specs of smart phones have gotten near laptop levels.

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