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    Default Capital Punishment

    With a guilty conviction from a jury of his or her peers, I do support the death penalty (capital punishment) for certain crimes. Chief among them of course would be murder, rape. Personally if you murder someone I think you should loose your right to life.



    If you support the death penalty:
    1) What crimes in your opinion should qualify for that punishment?
    2) In what manner should the punishment be carried out?
    3) How long should the individual have on death row prior to the sentence being carried out?
    4) Anything else you feel is relevant to the discussion.

    If you are against the death penalty:
    1) What would you suggest in it's place?
    2) How would you suggest we rehabilitate such individuals so that they are no longer a threat to society?
    3) Anything else you feel is relevant to the discussion.
    I miss my friend Matt McQuinn he touched so many lives, and in the end gave his life to protect someone that he loved. I am proud to have known him, and of the choices he made when it mattered. You were a true hero.

    "You would not fear my weapon unless your intentions were to provoke my using it"
  2. #2  

    Default Re: Capital Punishment

    Quote Originally Posted by Live2ride883 View Post
    With a guilty conviction from a jury of his or her peers, I do support the death penalty (capital punishment) for certain crimes. Chief among them of course would be murder, rape. Personally if you murder someone I think you should loose your right to life.



    If you support the death penalty:
    1) What crimes in your opinion should qualify for that punishment?
    2) In what manner should the punishment be carried out?
    3) How long should the individual have on death row prior to the sentence being carried out?
    4) Anything else you feel is relevant to the discussion.

    If you are against the death penalty:
    1) What would you suggest in it's place?
    2) How would you suggest we rehabilitate such individuals so that they are no longer a threat to society?
    3) Anything else you feel is relevant to the discussion.
    I support the death penalty.

    1)murder and child molesting
    2) for Murder however the victim died is the way the killer should. For the child molester a slow and painful death will be good
    3) right away, no need on using up tax dollars on a dead man.
    rlindydiane likes this.
  3. #3  

    Default Re: Capital Punishment

    If you are against the death penalty:
    1) What would you suggest in it's place?
    Life in prison. Simple as that.
    2) How would you suggest we rehabilitate such individuals so that they are no longer a threat to society?
    They will be in prison for life so they won't be coming out, anyways our prisons all have rehabilitation centres inside.
    3) Anything else you feel is relevant to the discussion.
    Yes. If someone killed they didn't have the right to take life... So why should we choose who lives and dies? That doesn't make us any better. What happens if there was a miscarriage of justice. E.g the Cooke murders. Multiple people went to gaol for his crimes. It was only when he got pinged for one he admitted to all his others which than took a further 9 years for all those falsely imprisoned to be freed. Now if there was the death penalty they would be dead. A man who only had a verbal argument with his girlfriend before she went missing and Cooke killer her would of been killed as the court was so convinced he rang his girlfriend over.

    Second point we did have the death penalty. Our first hanging was a teenage boy, the evidence given in today's terms wouldn't even get a prosecution. He did confess than retract it. The confession was believed to be our of fear as he was removed from all family contact. Threatened to confess, sleep deprived for awhile etc. Than he retracted it. Now if they were wrong they could open cell doors but you cannot open heaven to bring them back

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    » Tom Fairclough «
    » Credo faber est quisque fortunae suae «
    » I believe every man is the artisan of his own fortune «
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  4. #4  
    rlindydiane's Avatar

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    Default Re: Capital Punishment

    Quote Originally Posted by Live2ride883 View Post
    With a guilty conviction from a jury of his or her peers, I do support the death penalty (capital punishment) for certain crimes. Chief among them of course would be murder, rape. Personally if you murder someone I think you should loose your right to life.



    If you support the death penalty:
    1) What crimes in your opinion should qualify for that punishment?
    2) In what manner should the punishment be carried out?
    3) How long should the individual have on death row prior to the sentence being carried out?
    4) Anything else you feel is relevant to the discussion.

    If you are against the death penalty:
    1) What would you suggest in it's place?
    2) How would you suggest we rehabilitate such individuals so that they are no longer a threat to society?
    3) Anything else you feel is relevant to the discussion.
    I do support the death penalty:
    1) I agree with you that first and foremost rape and murder sld be capital punishment offenses. I might also add any heinous act of child abuse.
    2) I feel lethal injection is the most efficient most humane way to carry it out. I think it sld be the only method used.
    3) I'm thinking that 5 years maximum and limiting the number of appeals to make this happen.
    4) Right now some ppl wld say "life without parole" is more cost effective to the tax payers, if this is true limiting the number of appeals and the money alotted for them may be that we cld even that playing field. Also keeping the prisoner alive poses a risk to us, prison staff, and to fellow prisoners. Putting them to death wld insure everyones safety.
    ~Life isn’t like a box of chocolates. It’s more like a jar of jalapenos. What you do today may burn your a** tomorrow.~
  5. #5  
    Jennifer Stough's Avatar
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    Default Re: Capital Punishment

    Lets please keep the political conversation to the topic at hand. The abortion conversation was a separate thread, which due to it's controversial nature and the inability to stay within the forum rules of civil discussion, was closed. If we would like for this thread to continue, it would be best to leave that conversation out. This thread has been cleaned up. Thank you.
  6. #6  

    Default Re: Capital Punishment

    I pose a question to you all.
    If they were put to death... What happens if there is new evidence that they weren't guilty? How do you explain to a wife, husband, child, parent, friend that the system made a mistake, a wrong judgement, they killed him or her for no reason? I'll leave if with that because nothing can take back a life.

    Posted via Android Central App
    » Tom Fairclough «
    » Credo faber est quisque fortunae suae «
    » I believe every man is the artisan of his own fortune «
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  7. #7  

    Default Re: Capital Punishment

    I do not support the death penalty because in some cases it is too quick and humane way of a punishment.
  8. Thread Author  Thread Author    #8  

    Default Re: Capital Punishment

    Honestly I'm not to concerned with the humane way to put these animals down. A bullet to the head is about as much as I wanna spend, now in rape cases etc. I'd have to come up with a slow and painful way to send them on their way....
    I miss my friend Matt McQuinn he touched so many lives, and in the end gave his life to protect someone that he loved. I am proud to have known him, and of the choices he made when it mattered. You were a true hero.

    "You would not fear my weapon unless your intentions were to provoke my using it"
  9. #9  
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    Default Re: Capital Punishment

    Whether there is a death penalty or not, some people will still be animals regardless and they'll still do whatever they want to do. Nothing will stop them.

    Either way, they should be killed the same way they killed. Putting them to sleep like an old pet is the easy way out for them and they don't fear it. Nor do they fear prison.

    ••
    Last edited by llamabreath; 08-12-2013 at 12:28 PM.
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  10. #10  
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    Default Re: Capital Punishment

    Quote Originally Posted by Fairclough View Post
    I pose a question to you all.
    If they were put to death... What happens if there is new evidence that they weren't guilty? How do you explain to a wife, husband, child, parent, friend that the system made a mistake, a wrong judgement, they killed him or her for no reason? I'll leave if with that because nothing can take back a life.

    Posted via Android Central App
    What about the multitude of husbands, wives, children, parents that suffered the loss of a loved one due to a person committing the act out of no fear of consequence?

    There are ALOT more examples of that.

    ••
  11. #11  

    Default Re: Capital Punishment

    Quote Originally Posted by Fairclough View Post
    I pose a question to you all.
    If they were put to death... What happens if there is new evidence that they weren't guilty? How do you explain to a wife, husband, child, parent, friend that the system made a mistake, a wrong judgement, they killed him or her for no reason? I'll leave if with that because nothing can take back a life.

    Posted via Android Central App
    Quote Originally Posted by llamabreath View Post
    What about the multitude of husbands, wives, children, parents that suffered the loss of a loved one due to a person committing the act out of no fear of consequence?

    There are ALOT more examples of that.

    ••
    I believe that is quite possible with cases especially older cases where DNA wasn't involved. That can be questionable as we have seen some of those cases overturned due to DNA evidence being tested now and not matching. Also there has been a couple executions recently were it was found out that the prosecution withheld evidence and witness recanted their statements citing being pressure and the person was executed anyways. I do believe in these situations people should be given a chance.


    Now today's day and age, DNA can nailed down lot of cases. I don't know if you read about the serial ****** in Los Angeles. His name was the Grim Sleeper because he would rape some women and then murder them, then stop for a few years. His son was arrested and later on his DNA triggers a familial hit so they knew that he was related to the killer.

    These kind of convictions are golden and I have no problems with them being use to apply capital punishment with no remorse.
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  12. Thread Author  Thread Author    #12  

    Default Re: Capital Punishment

    Personally I think there are more guilty people that get away with murder than there are wrongly convicted people.

    The death penalty verdict may not be perfect, and honestly I wouldn't know what to say to the family of a person that was wrongly put to death.
    I miss my friend Matt McQuinn he touched so many lives, and in the end gave his life to protect someone that he loved. I am proud to have known him, and of the choices he made when it mattered. You were a true hero.

    "You would not fear my weapon unless your intentions were to provoke my using it"
  13. #13  

    Default Re: Capital Punishment

    Even if it may kill more guilty than innocent, can please tell me how you would explain to a relative why they were killed by the government? I believe most have overlooked this. I will ask this second question, if it was your child on death row - wrongly convicted, you believe their wrongly convicted would you accept an apoligy saying... "sorry we messed up. However most the time we don't, so you can see our justification for killing your child" Personally I would rage. Even if there is a more cost to keep people in gaol I thinking saving 50k a year isn't enough to justify the life of a wrongful injection.
    » Tom Fairclough «
    » Credo faber est quisque fortunae suae «
    » I believe every man is the artisan of his own fortune «
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  14. #14  
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    Default Re: Capital Punishment

    I'm curious if we believe that the point of the criminal judicial and penal systems is to:

    1. protect society from predators
    2. punish "wrong-doers"
    3. seek justice or recompense for victims

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  15. #15  
    llamabreath's Avatar
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    Default Re: Capital Punishment

    Quote Originally Posted by Fairclough View Post
    Even if it may kill more guilty than innocent, can please tell me how you would explain to a relative why they were killed by the government? I believe most have overlooked this. I will ask this second question, if it was your child on death row - wrongly convicted, you believe their wrongly convicted would you accept an apoligy saying... "sorry we messed up....
    First of all, while the accidental killing of an innocent is certainly horrible, the justice system is not in the business of explaining mistakes.
    The justice system is supposedly there to punish convicted criminals and to make potential criminals think twice before they do something stupid.

    How would you explain things to the family of a loved one killed by a criminal doing life instead of being six feet under that escapes and kills again? That happens too, right?

    And to answer your second question; If one of my loved ones was wrongfully convicted and given the death penalty, yes, of course it would be devastating, but I would have to keep in mind that it was done in an attempt to help society, not hurt it, and was a tragic accident.



    ••
  16. #16  

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by NothingIsTrue View Post
    I'm curious if we believe that the point of the criminal judicial and penal systems is to:

    1. protect society from predators
    2. punish "wrong-doers"
    3. seek justice or recompense for victims
    In short.
    1.Yes
    2. Yes/No. Its also meant to be served has a rehabilitation programme which maybe different compared to yours as that's what ours offer.
    3. Yes for justice, the civil courts are more tailored for recompense. However since the merging of the court of chancellery / equity with the main courts judges do take recompense partly into consideration. This last bit is the same for you guys as we have both based on the 500 year old system, were it is derived from.

    Generally life in gaol is life, they would be only able to kill within. Now in our system we house similar types of criminals together and their danger risks together.


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    » Tom Fairclough «
    » Credo faber est quisque fortunae suae «
    » I believe every man is the artisan of his own fortune «
  17. Thread Author  Thread Author    #17  

    Default Re: Capital Punishment

    It wouldn't be the government, it would be a jury of his peers...
    I miss my friend Matt McQuinn he touched so many lives, and in the end gave his life to protect someone that he loved. I am proud to have known him, and of the choices he made when it mattered. You were a true hero.

    "You would not fear my weapon unless your intentions were to provoke my using it"
  18. #18  

    Default Re: Capital Punishment

    The judges decides the penalty. Least over here. Now could you please answer the question, if this was a court case you have to answer it not step around

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    » Tom Fairclough «
    » Credo faber est quisque fortunae suae «
    » I believe every man is the artisan of his own fortune «
  19. Thread Author  Thread Author    #19  

    Default Re: Capital Punishment

    Quote Originally Posted by Fairclough View Post
    The judges decides the penalty. Least over here. Now could you please answer the question, if this was a court case you have to answer it not step around

    Instead of implying that I am avoiding answering a question, how about asking me one dierectly.

    I have not seen a question directed to me specifically.... But then again I could have missed it so please feel free to repeat it.

    Posted via Android Central App
    I miss my friend Matt McQuinn he touched so many lives, and in the end gave his life to protect someone that he loved. I am proud to have known him, and of the choices he made when it mattered. You were a true hero.

    "You would not fear my weapon unless your intentions were to provoke my using it"
  20. #20  

    Default Re: Capital Punishment

    My bad didn't see your reply up there. I have a second question. What is wrong with detaining Simone in gaol for rehabilitation?

    Posted via Android Central App
    » Tom Fairclough «
    » Credo faber est quisque fortunae suae «
    » I believe every man is the artisan of his own fortune «
  21. #21  
    llamabreath's Avatar
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    Default Re: Capital Punishment

    Quote Originally Posted by Fairclough View Post
    My bad didn't see your reply up there. I have a second question. What is wrong with detaining Simone in gaol for rehabilitation?

    Posted via Android Central App
    Who's that? And where?

    ••
    Live2ride883 likes this.
  22. Thread Author  Thread Author    #22  

    Default Re: Capital Punishment

    Quote Originally Posted by Fairclough View Post
    My bad didn't see your reply up there. I have a second question. What is wrong with detaining Simone in gaol for rehabilitation?

    Posted via Android Central App
    I have no idea who you are talking about, but since you and I are having a discussion answer this for me.

    Let's say that an 18 year old man rapes and murders a 20 year old college student that rejected him. At trial he is sentenced to 20 years in prison. Now with good behavior he is released a after 15 years due to over crowding. After his stay at the halfway house, and the parole officer see's that he has a job, and is going to night school they start to think he is a success proof that the system works as it is intended. A year later he looses his job, or a girl he has been chatting up after school/work finds out about his past. So off he goes and gets drunk, this of course heightens his anger and frustration. As he is out looking for a way to vent his frustrations he spots another 20 year old girl out for an evening run.

    Now here's my question, how do you explain to the second girls parents that this animal was let out of prison due to over crowding and his good behavior, he was put out on the street to rape and murder again.
    ---------------------
    The question above was directed to fairclough, hoewever everyone is free to join our conversation.
    I miss my friend Matt McQuinn he touched so many lives, and in the end gave his life to protect someone that he loved. I am proud to have known him, and of the choices he made when it mattered. You were a true hero.

    "You would not fear my weapon unless your intentions were to provoke my using it"
  23. Thread Author  Thread Author    #23  

    Default Re: Capital Punishment

    Quote Originally Posted by Farish View Post
    I believe that is quite possible with cases especially older cases where DNA wasn't involved. That can be questionable as we have seen some of those cases overturned due to DNA evidence being tested now and not matching. Also there has been a couple executions recently were it was found out that the prosecution withheld evidence and witness recanted their statements citing being pressure and the person was executed anyways. I do believe in these situations people should be given a chance.


    Now today's day and age, DNA can nailed down lot of cases. I don't know if you read about the serial ****** in Los Angeles. His name was the Grim Sleeper because he would rape some women and then murder them, then stop for a few years. His son was arrested and later on his DNA triggers a familial hit so they knew that he was related to the killer.

    These kind of convictions are golden and I have no problems with them being use to apply capital punishment with no remorse.

    I know the cases that are turned over by DNA evidence usually make news, and while they do exonorate (sp) an innocent person once in awhile, I don't think it happens as often as most people think.

    Also take into account the honesty of the lab doing the DNA work. Wasn't there a lab in DC (I think) that was intentionally faking DNA results so the prosecution would have an easier case??
    Last edited by Live2ride883; 08-15-2013 at 11:50 AM.
    I miss my friend Matt McQuinn he touched so many lives, and in the end gave his life to protect someone that he loved. I am proud to have known him, and of the choices he made when it mattered. You were a true hero.

    "You would not fear my weapon unless your intentions were to provoke my using it"
  24. #24  
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    Default Re: Capital Punishment

    Quote Originally Posted by Live2ride883 View Post
    Now here's my question, how do you explain to the second girls parents that this animal was let out of prison due to over crowding and his good behavior, he was put out on the street to rape and murder again.
    Very horrible situation. There is nothing you can say to the family, both first or second victims, that would offer them solace. The system went awry and my answer would be 20 years is pathetically short sentence for somebody who committed murder. I would wonder why he wouldn't get life without parole.

    Quote Originally Posted by Live2ride883 View Post
    I know the cases that are turned over by DNA evidence usually make news, and while they do exonorate (sp) an innocent person once in awhile, I don't think it happens as often as most people think.

    Also take into account the honestly of the lab doing the DNA work. Wasn't there a lab in DC (I think) that was intentionally faking DNA results so the prosecution would have an easier case??
    Just one innocent person wrongfully executed is enough of a reason for me to be opposed to the death penalty and limiting appeals. Though extreme and rare there are cases of dirty cops, investigators, prosecutors, judges, lab techs, and cases of people being framed.

    In addition to the one you mentioned above, another good example recently in the news of being at the mercy of lab techs -- though not related to murder -- is the junkie hospital nurse who had Hepatitis C who infected prison inmates with it because he was taking his patient's pain meds for himself and then turning around and using the needle he infected to inject a placebo into his patients.
  25. #25  

    Default Re: Capital Punishment

    Simone was a typo before, it was meant to be someone. Under Australian law, the minimum sentence for murder is 20 years without parole, so 15 is very unlikely unless he broke out. The murder of a minor minimum sentence is 25 years. Meaning the person would nearly be 50 when their released. So theoretically I think a young girl could defend that.

    Now let's get started with my reply, first and foremost the family would be angry. Now I would explain that he underwent at least 20 years of therapy, with an attendance of education most would view his on path, which would indicate he reasonable success, I would presume he would of still been doing his check ups which would justify why he would in the public. So I would explain its a rare relapse which occurred. I would much prefer a gaol sentence and the risk of relapse from rehabilitation (20+ years of!) Than to put multiple people falsely to sleep.

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    » Tom Fairclough «
    » Credo faber est quisque fortunae suae «
    » I believe every man is the artisan of his own fortune «
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