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  1. #26  

    Default Re: What do you think the best course of action is against mass shootings in schools?

    Quote Originally Posted by carolinadroid View Post
    No one here has said that. As a reformed, card-carrying NRA member and still a level-headed conservative, I find the need to conjure up irresponsible, sideshow arguments insulting to the memory of those innocents who have died from the barrel aimed at them from a coward's distance.

    Think Bushmaster AR-15s aren't easily available? Seriously?
    They used to be.

    Good luck finding one now

    sent from the best smart phone (not phablet) on the worst network- the Galaxy S3 unfortunately on T-Mobile
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  2. #27  
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    Default Re: What do you think the best course of action is against mass shootings in schools?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Hustleman View Post
    They used to be.

    Good luck finding one now
    That took about 15 seconds. I'm exhausted, I tell ya. Most recent review is 2 months old. Cabela's: Bushmaster Firearms AR-15 Rifles
  3. #28  
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    Default Re: What do you think the best course of action is against mass shootings in schools?

    Quote Originally Posted by carolinadroid View Post
    What nutcase believes turning public schools into prisons (think of the way their environment would be viewed by adolescent minds) is a progressive step in the right direction. Until handguns are removed from the public market, this stupidity will continue. Want a hunting rifle or shotgun? Fine, as long as it is registered federally, licensed by the State, and secured in a home safe. Handguns and long-barrell weapons are 2 VERY different animals in the post-Founders' world.

    Just as you have no right to an atomic cannon, there is no "absolute" right to own lethal weapons which can deliver death from a coward's distance.

    The NRA should be defined as a domestic terrorist organization.
    Quote Originally Posted by carolinadroid View Post
    Have I reason to be concerned of your personally attacking opinion when you avoid, like the plague, responsible positions which address my points? I think not.
    . . . "~ responsible positions which address my points?"
    What you obviously don't understand, carolinadroid, is that the only accurate point you've made, in this thread heretofore is: "I think not." :rolleyes:

    I was going to refute all your "points", if you can even call them that, on the day you posted the top quoted post above, but decided not tofor the very same reasonbeing that your "positions" are so irresponsible, and just plain ignorant and ridiculous. Every one of your "points" are wrong-headed and obviously stem from an uneducated perspective. Therefore, what's the point? Obviously, you are the one poster (on this thread) who should attempt to become more educated on the topic of guns, gun laws, and the 2nd Amendment to the U.S. Constitution, before spouting such nonsense.
    Thenceforth, perhaps you... may actually become able to express some "responsible positions" yourself.

    "The NRA should be defined as a domestic terrorist organization."
    . . . Really? :rolleyes: Along with the rest of your uneducated and ridiculous gobbledygook, that's one of the most asinine things I've ever read. But wait . . .you forgot to call them Haters and Bullies to boot; two additional favorite & ridiculous lefty labels.
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  4. #29  

    Default Re: What do you think the best course of action is against mass shootings in schools?

    Quote Originally Posted by carolinadroid View Post
    That took about 15 seconds. I'm exhausted, I tell ya. Most recent review is 2 months old. Cabela's: Bushmaster Firearms AR-15 Rifles
    That's a description, it says go to a store.

    Guess what?

    You won't find it there because as soon as they come in they are sold

    sent from the best smart phone (not phablet) on the worst network- the Galaxy S3 unfortunately on T-Mobile
  5. #30  
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    Default Re: What do you think the best course of action is against mass shootings in schools?

    Quote Originally Posted by winmod21 View Post
    /snip/
    It would have been more succinct of you to stick out your tongue and exclaim "I hate you!" since you could make no other point. Just sayin'.
    Last edited by carolinadroid; 01-19-2013 at 03:52 PM.
  6. #31  
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    Default Re: What do you think the best course of action is against mass shootings in schools?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Hustleman View Post
    That's a description, it says go to a store.

    Guess what?

    You won't find it there because as soon as they come in they are sold
    Welcome to the open, public market for the Bushmaster AR-15 (and other assorted semi-automatic, military-featured weapons). It is alive and well despite >200 years to gain the wisdom to curtail the public's access to weapons of extraordinary means.
  7. #32  

    Default Re: What do you think the best course of action is against mass shootings in schools?

    Quote Originally Posted by Live2ride883 View Post
    I lost a good friend at the Aurora, CO shooting, I honestly believe that if there had been a ccw there Matt would still be alive. I miss him everyday, and honestly my thoughts on what should be done to the criminal are not very christian of me.

    There is a federal mandated 1000 ft gun free zone around every public school in the U.S.

    Every shooter in these mass shooters is either a criminal or a mental health patient. In all cases the laws on the books did nothing to stop them from getting the guns.

    Another sad truth is the way gun owners are being demonized and turned into outcasts, around Christmas I posted a link to a gun my wife bought for me. I was immediately blasted for it by several members. Granted it probably wasn't the best forum for that post, but no mods stepped in and closed it or moved it so I am not sure what the problem was.

    Link http://forums.androidcentral.com/goo...tmas-ever.html
    I am prior military and I was also a NRA member in the past. I use go duck, pheasant and turkey hunting.

    I certainly support your right to protect yourself. This bit about protecting yourself from a rogue government is nuts nowadays. I was in the military and do you think I would follow an order to kill Americans? Of course not! That would be an illegal order.

    Once you go through CQC (Close Quarters Combat) training and discover how tense it is and how easily mistakes are made, you would know what a mess that Aurora theater would be if it was filled up with a bunch of CCW folks with good intentions. The theater was dark. The shooter was wearing protective gear. Even the police who first approached him thought he was a police officer. Even if these CCW folks followed the 4 gun safety rules, 101 mistakes would have been made and it would have looked like the OK Corral.

    The real trick to solving the problem with firearm related deaths is to look at other countries with high gun ownership and a low firearm related death rate. In the U.S. we have like 10 firearm related deaths per 100,000 people. Switzerland which also a high gun ownership rate have like 0.5 firearm related deaths per 100,000 people. What is Switzerland doing right?
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  8. #33  

    Default Re: What do you think the best course of action is against mass shootings in schools?

    Quote Originally Posted by carolinadroid View Post
    Welcome to the open, public market for the Bushmaster AR-15 (and other assorted semi-automatic, military-featured weapons). It is alive and well despite >200 years to gain the wisdom to curtail the public's access to weapons of extraordinary means.
    If you are being sincere with regard to your vast firearms knowledge, you would know that a Remington 742 chambered in 30.06 is a much better choice for the mass killing of unarmed people. It's far more accurate out of the box, easier to use, and available at Walmart. I've no use for an AK or AR variant, but I realize that folding stocks and bayonet mounts don't kill people -- they just scare them.

    Realistically, if you want to ban the weapons that are the most effective at producing lots of casualties in close quarters, start with the $200 Mossberg pump action .20 gauge. I think a better solution is keeping any weapon -- from a firearm to a pointy stick -- away from people off-kilter enough to hurt other people. That won't happen, because it's hard. Banning something is easy, and makes people feel like they did something, even though they didn't.
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  9. #34  

    Default Re: What do you think the best course of action is against mass shootings in schools?

    Quote Originally Posted by palandri View Post
    I am prior military and I was also a NRA member in the past. I use go duck, pheasant and turkey hunting.

    I certainly support your right to protect yourself. This bit about protecting yourself from a rogue government is nuts nowadays. I was in the military and do you think I would follow an order to kill Americans? Of course not! That would be an illegal order.

    Once you go through CQC (Close Quarters Combat) training and discover how tense it is and how easily mistakes are made, you would know what a mess that Aurora theater would be if it was filled up with a bunch of CCW folks with good intentions. The theater was dark. The shooter was wearing protective gear. Even the police who first approached him thought he was a police officer. Even if these CCW folks followed the 4 gun safety rules, 101 mistakes would have been made and it would have looked like the OK Corral.

    The real trick to solving the problem with firearm related deaths is to look at other countries with high gun ownership and a low firearm related death rate. In the U.S. we have like 10 firearm related deaths per 100,000 people. Switzerland which also a high gun ownership rate have like 0.5 firearm related deaths per 100,000 people. What is Switzerland doing right?

    What does duck, pheasant hunting or membership in the NRA have to do with this?

    Gun control to me is 1) Using both hands, 2) Hitting your target.


    I am also former military, while my primary weapons training was prior to and after my military service I still feel qualified to decide what I need to defend myself with and against. Weather you believe I am a nut job or not doesn't matter. What matters is that I have the right under the second amendment to own such a weapon. Also as I stated as a veteran who swore the same oath to protect and defend the constitution you are obligated by that oath to support my choice. My oath of enlistment has no expiration date, does yours?

    During the revolution art war our founding fathers went up against the best trained and equipped standing army at the time, and they succeeded.

    Criminals use guns to commit these and other crimes, the AR-15 has been in production since the 1960's and there have been millions of them sold. Also AR stands for Armalite Rifle, not assault rifle. The AR-15 is the modern day version of the musket, that was used in the revolutionary war.

    I would hope that today our servicemen and women would also choose not to obey such an illegal order, history shows that is not always the case. That's why we had war crimes trials at the end of WWII.

    I will however state that the founding fathers could not have foreseen the technological advances that would allow these type of weapons to be developed when they drafted the Constitution. But they also could not have foreseen message boards, telephones, TV, or the internet. Yet we apply the first amendment to these advanced means of communication.

    I suggest you reread the Constitution, and maybe the federalist papers as well to refresh in your mind what it means to be an American, and exactly what it is you swore to protect and defend.

    For me this is how I feel the second amendment should be upheld. Hypotheticly (sp) If after all reasonable forms of negotiation has failed and the federal or state government comes to my house to take my weapons then it is not only my right to use those weapons, it becomes my moral duty to do so.

    Unfortunately I am on my N10 and not at home right now, so its not as easy for me to pull information from multiple sources to post here. But I will comeback and address your other points as well.
    Last edited by Live2ride883; 01-19-2013 at 07:01 PM.
    I miss my friend Matt McQuinn he touched so many lives, and in the end gave his life to protect someone that he loved. I am proud to have known him, and of the choices he made when it mattered. You were a true hero.

    "You would not fear my weapon unless your intentions were to provoke my using it"
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  10. #35  
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    Default Re: What do you think the best course of action is against mass shootings in schools?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Hildenbrand View Post
    Realistically, if you want to ban the weapons that are the most effective at producing lots of casualties in close quarters, start with the $200 Mossberg pump action .20 gauge.
    Following your logic, should the firearm most frequently associated with murder be banned (if any weapon is banned from production)?
  11. #36  

    Default Re: What do you think the best course of action is against mass shootings in schools?

    Quote Originally Posted by carolinadroid View Post
    Following your logic, should the firearm most frequently associated with murder be banned (if any weapon is banned from production)?
    Why not ban the weapon that is actually used in most homicides? Start with the Baseball bat, or the Hammer.

    palandri: If gun control actually worked to deter crime and murder wouldn't Chicago be the safest place in the US to live?
    I miss my friend Matt McQuinn he touched so many lives, and in the end gave his life to protect someone that he loved. I am proud to have known him, and of the choices he made when it mattered. You were a true hero.

    "You would not fear my weapon unless your intentions were to provoke my using it"
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  12. #37  

    Default Re: What do you think the best course of action is against mass shootings in schools?

    I think this thread and some of the responses demonstrate why people like Alex Jones should be banned from the air waves, or should be put in the same classification as professional wrestling. He has people paranoid and believing that the government or UN troops are going to take your weapons away. This thread is getting way too bizarre for me.
  13. #38  

    Default Re: What do you think the best course of action is against mass shootings in schools?

    Quote Originally Posted by Live2ride883 View Post
    Why not ban the weapon that is actually used in most homicides? Start with the Baseball bat, or the Hammer.

    palandri: If gun control actually worked to deter crime and murder wouldn't Chicago be the safest place in the US to live?
    Like I said, we are not doing what is right and the statistics show that. We need to take a serious look at Switzerland. In the U.S. we have like 10 firearm related deaths per 100,000 people. Switzerland which also a high gun ownership rate have like 0.5 firearm related deaths per 100,000 people. What is Switzerland doing right?
  14. #39  

    Default Re: What do you think the best course of action is against mass shootings in schools?

    Quote Originally Posted by palandri View Post
    I think this thread and some of the responses demonstrate why people like Alex Jones should be banned from the air waves, or should be put in the same classification as professional wrestling. He has people paranoid and believing that the government or UN troops are going to take your weapons away. This thread is getting way too bizarre for me.
    Palandri: exactly what countries military did you serve in?

    While Alex Jones is Passionate about his point of view, he is also rightfully angry at the apathy of the average US citizen because very few of us are vocal about what we see happening daily. The constant errosion of our freedom and rights. If not Alex Jones, how about Ted nugent, or Jesse ventura. what is it that makes their opinions any less valuable than some Hollywood libtard like Matt Damon who makes hundreds of millions of dollars on movies featuring guns then cries that we we need more gun legislation.

    I believe I am morally right in my defense of myself, my family, our home and my country and I would much rather be morally right than politically correct.

    If you cannot see that the only reason we have the other rights at all is because they are protected by the second amendment then you deserve what the rest of us see coming.

    Here is another example of how our rights and freedoms are slowly being taken away:
    I miss my friend Matt McQuinn he touched so many lives, and in the end gave his life to protect someone that he loved. I am proud to have known him, and of the choices he made when it mattered. You were a true hero.

    "You would not fear my weapon unless your intentions were to provoke my using it"
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  15. #40  

    Default Re: What do you think the best course of action is against mass shootings in schools?

    Quote Originally Posted by carolinadroid View Post
    Following your logic, should the firearm most frequently associated with murder be banned (if any weapon is banned from production)?
    Following what I wrote, where I explained my position, banning anything is only a feel-good measure for people who don't want to do the right (hard) thing -- find out what makes people go off and hurt other people. If you don't do that, those people will just use a different, and available, weapon to do what they think they must do.

    William Unek killed 21 people with an axe in the Belgian Congo in 1954. Gun control wouldn't have helped any of them.

    Edited to add:
    I'm in favor of tough gun laws, like the ones we already have. Let's start enforcing them, then decide where we need to go further.
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  16. #41  

    Default Re: What do you think the best course of action is against mass shootings in schools?

    Polandri: Take a look at this..

    Army Manual Outlines Plan To Kill Rioters, Demonstrators In America Alex Jones' Infowars: There's a war on for your mind!


    Feds identify 2nd Amendment activists as terrorists in Ohio drill - Virginia Beach Conservative | Examiner.com

    From the link above "Department of Homeland Security (DHS) Secretary Janet Napolitano who has described gun owners and veterans of the Iraq and Afghanistan wars as potential terrorists." and "However, it is painfully obvious that the Obama administration feels more threatened by men and women who have sworn an oath to protect this nation from tyrants, as well as by Americans who simply exercise and refuse to relinquish their Constitutional rights.

    Every American, regardless of their political affiliation should be wary of any president who seems to view our founding principles with such disdain."


    Another interesting video: Gun Appreciation Day w/ Emily Miller - Tucker Carlson - Fox & Friends Weekend - 1-19-13 - YouTube
    Last edited by Live2ride883; 01-19-2013 at 08:17 PM.
    I miss my friend Matt McQuinn he touched so many lives, and in the end gave his life to protect someone that he loved. I am proud to have known him, and of the choices he made when it mattered. You were a true hero.

    "You would not fear my weapon unless your intentions were to provoke my using it"
  17. #42  

    Default US Constitution

    Below you will find a link to the Constitution of The United States. Most people state incorrectly that we are a democracy. The truth is we are a Constitutional Republic, we elect our leaders in a democratic election. Before you can decide if our Rights are being slowly stripped from us you should know and understand what they are.

    Transcript of the Constitution of the United States - Official Text

    Amazon.com also has a great book on The Bill of Rights, just search for "The Know Your Bill of Rights Book." I believe it is less than 10.00.
    Last edited by Live2ride883; 01-19-2013 at 10:04 PM.
    I miss my friend Matt McQuinn he touched so many lives, and in the end gave his life to protect someone that he loved. I am proud to have known him, and of the choices he made when it mattered. You were a true hero.

    "You would not fear my weapon unless your intentions were to provoke my using it"
  18. #43  
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    Default Re: What do you think the best course of action is against mass shootings in schools?

    Quote Originally Posted by Live2ride883 View Post
    Why not ban the weapon that is actually used in most homicides? Start with the Baseball bat, or the Hammer
    If hammers and/or baseball bats were designed to be used as deadly weapons first, and were the instrument being primarily used to murder others, you would have a problem with manufacturers being banned from producing them?
  19. #44  
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    Default Re: What do you think the best course of action is against mass shootings in schools?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry Hildenbrand View Post
    Following what I wrote, where I explained my position, banning anything is only a feel-good measure for people who don't want to do the right (hard) thing -- find out what makes people go off and hurt other people. If you don't do that, those people will just use a different, and available, weapon to do what they think they must do
    When manufacturers are made to end production of a product for public safety reasons, you do understand that those products already in "the market" will shrink with time, correct? Or do you foresee that those hell-bent on emotional, irrational acts of violence to build their own firearms in advance of their rampages? This is not "feel-goodism". This is how the big, bad, real world operates. Why can't you purchase an RPG launcher on the open, public market again? ......
  20. #45  

    Default Re: What do you think the best course of action is against mass shootings in schools?

    Quote Originally Posted by carolinadroid View Post
    When manufacturers are made to end production of a product for public safety reasons, you do understand that those products already in "the market" will shrink with time, correct? Or do you foresee that those hell-bent on emotional, irrational acts of violence to build their own firearms in advance of their rampages? This is not "feel-goodism". This is how the big, bad, real world operates. Why can't you purchase an RPG launcher on the open, public market again? ......
    It's exactly how the "big, bad, real world" operates. That's why it doesn't work, will never work, but people like yourself will preach down at others about it. You keep moving the goalposts, from bushmasters to RPGs, yet you ignore the fact that an unskilled person can take the lives of everyone in a movie theater or classroom faster and more efficiently with weapons you deem "acceptable". There's a giant hole in your bucket of logic.

    To address your question -- I expect a person hell bent on irrational acts of violence to use whatever weapon they have at hand. I'll be blunt -- a person possessed with a desire to do harm could kill a hell of a pile of little kids with a machete, or a shovel, or a cheap .22 from Walmart. I don't even want to consider what they could do with $15 worth of items from the camping section and a piece of iron pipe. Unless you want to ban those items, you'll need to figure out how to identify and stop those people. Thinking "that won't happen, and hey -- what about RPG launchers?" is a cop out.

    This is why nobody wants to discuss it with you, you're blind to any truth you don't agree with, and resort to an insulting tone. Carry on without me.
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  21. #46  

    Default Re: What do you think the best course of action is against mass shootings in schools?

    Quote Originally Posted by Live2ride883 View Post
    Polandri: Take a look at this..

    Army Manual Outlines Plan To Kill Rioters, Demonstrators In America Alex Jones' Infowars: There's a war on for your mind!


    Feds identify 2nd Amendment activists as terrorists in Ohio drill - Virginia Beach Conservative | Examiner.com

    From the link above "Department of Homeland Security (DHS) Secretary Janet Napolitano who has described gun owners and veterans of the Iraq and Afghanistan wars as potential terrorists." and "However, it is painfully obvious that the Obama administration feels more threatened by men and women who have sworn an oath to protect this nation from tyrants, as well as by Americans who simply exercise and refuse to relinquish their Constitutional rights.

    Every American, regardless of their political affiliation should be wary of any president who seems to view our founding principles with such disdain."


    Another interesting video: Gun Appreciation Day w/ Emily Miller - Tucker Carlson - Fox & Friends Weekend - 1-19-13 - YouTube
    Excellent! Could you also link me to the Alex Jones video where he proves that Cinderella and Seven Dwarfs is really a North Korean mind control plot to take over the U.S. and put us in FEMA slave camps? Thanks!
    Last edited by palandri; 01-19-2013 at 11:08 PM.
  22. #47  

    Default Re: US Constitution

    If a majority a people wanted to change the constitution to fit the realities of today, would you be against it? Just asking.
  23. #48  

    Default Re: What do you think the best course of action is against mass shootings in schools?

    Quote Originally Posted by carolinadroid View Post
    When manufacturers are made to end production of a product for public safety reasons, you do understand that those products already in "the market" will shrink with time, correct? Or do you foresee that those hell-bent on emotional, irrational acts of violence to build their own firearms in advance of their rampages? This is not "feel-goodism". This is how the big, bad, real world operates. Why can't you purchase an RPG launcher on the open, public market again? ......
    If we are going to force manufacturer's to stop making products based on public safety we won't have any manufacturer s left. Anything produced by man can and will be abused by man.

    True military grade weapons are extremely expensive and difficult to obtain in the US. They require special permits from the FBI, and you must notify local law enforcement if you are even transporting them. I am only speaking of the machine gun I am not aware if a private citizen can even own an RPG launcher. However I do believe you are shifting the point. I don't recall any mall, school, or theater shootings in the US using an RPG.

    Earlier someone said something about defending yourself against a tyrannical government was nuts. Why don't you do a YouTube search for the battle of Tennessee. A brief account of the story is this. After WWII returning veteran's in this small Tennessee town found the corrupt sheriff and governor was rigging elections. Well these vet's broke into the Armory and held the sheriff and his deputies and also retrieved the stolen ballot boxes so a proper count could take place. Here is a link to the video



    A gun is a defensive weapon, it is the choice of the person holding it that decides what it is used for. I have never been to a gun show or seen any gun advertised that it is designed for the criminal act. I do not see posters of muggers, thieves, or rapists stating how much better that particular weapon is for them.

    The truth is there are evil men in this world and they will find a way to do evil things. Personally I think we should get rid of gun free zones, every mass shooting in the last 20 years except one was in a gun free zone. Every person that has committed one of these crimes has been under some type of mental health care, which under current law should have prevented them from getting the guns legally. They are CRIMINALS, they are not going to obey the laws currently in effect so do you honestly think one or one hundred more laws are going to make a difference to them?

    Why did VP Joe Biden make the statement that we don't have the time to prosecute people that lie on the background check paperwork, but yet they want more restrictive gun laws?

    My 11 year old daughter is a better marksman than my 15 year old son simply because she enjoys shooting more than he does and she practices A LOT. Hardly a weekend goes by that we do not go to the farm or a range. My kids know gun safety, they know that they are not toys and they do respect the inherit danger in handling a weapon. I carry a weapon every time I leave the house, if I have to enter a gun free zone I simply leave it in the car or on the bike. My kids always stay on my left side when we go out simply because my gun is always on my right side unless I am on the bike.
    Last edited by Live2ride883; 01-19-2013 at 11:11 PM.
    I miss my friend Matt McQuinn he touched so many lives, and in the end gave his life to protect someone that he loved. I am proud to have known him, and of the choices he made when it mattered. You were a true hero.

    "You would not fear my weapon unless your intentions were to provoke my using it"
    Thanked by 2:
    Markster1 likes this.
  24. #49  
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    Default Re: What do you think the best course of action is against mass shootings in schools?

    Me personally don't c a problem with at least 1 armed police officer at a school. I had one at Amundsen high on the NORTH SIDE of Chicago and it did way more good than harm and we had gangs and we fought but no guns and no stupid killing

    Sent from my Sprint Galaxy Nexus rockin 4.2.1 using Tapatalk 2
  25. #50  

    Default Re: What do you think the best course of action is against mass shootings in schools?

    Quote Originally Posted by Live2ride883 View Post
    .... I carry a weapon every time I leave the house...
    Honest to gawd, if you think you need to carry a weapon every time you leave your house, you need help.
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