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  1. #1201  

    Default Re: Joe Biden tips for self-defense: get a shotgun

    Quote Originally Posted by underdonk View Post
    The *vast majority* of M4 rifles fielded by all branches of the military are semiautomatic only. The select fire versions (capable of fully automatic fire) are typically reserved for special operations forces only. The reasons for this are numerous and outside the scope of this conversation, but a little Googling should turn 'em up pretty quickly. That major functional difference you note simply doesn't exist on any meaningful scale.
    Anyone with more recent military experience want to come in here?

    That's simply not true. While special forces use different versions of the m4, all branches of the military have either select fire 3 burst or older m16 versions in reserve capable of full auto.
  2. #1202  

    Default Re: Joe Biden tips for self-defense: get a shotgun

    Quote Originally Posted by psychoken View Post
    why do you guys want to own guns so much? So you can feel safer? Or just so for the sake of freedom of choices?
    For me it's more about freedom of choice and I do feel a little safer but no one is totally safe.

    Look at Chris Kyle, he couldn't protect his life, a Navy seal. You will find many examples of people losing their life even having or using their firearm.

    I believe, and its my right, there are forces out there going after all the guns. If we let them get the AR's, they will go after something else next and so on until they have them all.

    I'm not a conspiracy theorist, I'm just going by statements made by tireless crusaders who have stated that purpose, to get them all.

    We should be going after the criminals but the current administration hasn't addressed that issue and instead seems to be following another pursuit.
  3. #1203  
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    Default Re: Joe Biden tips for self-defense: get a shotgun

    Quote Originally Posted by cdmjlt369 View Post
    And you should be careful what you wish for. Here is more proof that they should go after the PEOPLE and not the WEAPON. People will find a way...now I guess 3d printers will be illegal.
    Given that the NRA is the gun manufacturer's interest group, it will prove interesting to see them put out a statement about this. Conflicted much, NRA? You can bet that GCA will be amended to address this stupidity.
  4. #1204  
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    Default Re: Joe Biden tips for self-defense: get a shotgun

    Quote Originally Posted by TheOtherBill View Post
    OK so I am ridiculous, delusional, and irrational according to you.
    Carlolinadroid says I am a chickenhawk and a flying monkey.
    I've never addressed you. Goodbye.
  5. #1205  

    Default Re: Joe Biden tips for self-defense: get a shotgun

    Quote Originally Posted by NothingIsTrue View Post
    Wizard's First Rule: (Terry Goodkind)
    "People are stupid; given proper motivation, almost anyone will believe almost anything. Because people are stupid, they will believe a lie because they want to believe it's true, or because they are afraid it might be true. People's heads are full of knowledge, facts, and beliefs, and most of it is false, yet they think it all true. People are stupid; they can only rarely tell the difference between a lie and the truth, and yet they are confident they can, and so are all the easier to fool."
    Most excellent quote, and book.

    Two more quick points:

    1) Going back to the original topic of Biden's statements, his son (an attorney general apparently) has now come out to say Biden's statements about firing the gun on personal property is not only dumb (in the case of warning shots as already discussed here), but illegal unless in immediate danger. Can't even soot someone simply trespassing there.

    2) There is a difference between the terms "assault weapon" and "assault rifle". An assault weapon is mostly a political term that describes a gun based on cosmetic features like a collapsible stock, magazine clips, pistol grips, etc. They are semi-auto fire, not burst/full auto, and are legal to own under current laws.

    Assault rifles are military guns that can share the cosmetic features of an assault weapon but are capable of burst/full auto fire. These have already been banned for years in the general public

    I don't care if you're 100% for or against guns, we all should make an effort to at least use the right terminology in regards to the types of weapons discussed. I've seen the two terms used interchangeably, and perhaps this note will help keep people from making ignorant statements like "I think assault rifles should be banned," or "I think the AR-15 is a great assault rifle."
    dcharleyultra and Darth Spock like this.
  6. #1206  
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    Default Re: Joe Biden tips for self-defense: get a shotgun

    Quote Originally Posted by carolinadroid View Post
    Tell it to this guy: http://www.suntimes.com/csp/cms/site...YPE=image/jpeg [Miami Police Chief John Timoney (pictured in 2007) says assault weapons were used in about 4 percent of all homicides in 2004 in Miami as the ban expired. Now, Timoney says, the number is about 21 percent.

    He may just be more intellectually honest, experienced, and knowledgeable than all the 2nd amendment chickenhawks - combined.



    police-chiefs-are-right-ban-assault-weapons
    Criminals won't turn their guns in. Mainly because they're criminals and have litte or no respect for the rule of law. It's one thing to obtuse, but quite another thing to yell it for all to witness.
    Furthermore......what part of "shall not be infringed" do you not understand?
    As for as using a shotgun for home defense, it's an awesome tool to have at your disposal. I own one and have other weapons for defense of my house, my family and myself.
    But those of that would argue that a shotgun is all thats needed are missing something.......

    IT'S NOT YOUR DECISION.

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  7. #1207  

    Default Re: Joe Biden tips for self-defense: get a shotgun

    Quote Originally Posted by carolinadroid View Post
    Given that the NRA is the gun manufacturer's interest group, it will prove interesting to see them put out a statement about this. Conflicted much, NRA? You can bet that GCA will be amended to address this stupidity.
    The point is if you take a tool away from a person they will find another tool. No matter what you do people will find something else to use. There could potentially be a never ending list of banned items. Making something illegal has never been successful at stopping criminal activity. The best approach, I believe previously stated is to make it harder for the criminal element to obtain by making people who sale them responsible for who they sell them too. Background checks, etc. But most importantly make the punishments for offenses concerning firearms that no one will want to do them. Right now you get more time for drugs than weapons charges.

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  8. #1208  
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    Default Re: Joe Biden tips for self-defense: get a shotgun

    Military issued M4's and M16's have a selectable three round burst or semi-auto (one round per trigger squeeze).

    The full auto versions have been phased out for the "regular" military. Too much wasted ammunition. Your standard infantryman will not have an automatic weapon issued to them.

    Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2
    Kevin F.I.M.T.K. O'Quinn Esq.
  9. #1209  
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    Default Re: Joe Biden tips for self-defense: get a shotgun

    Quote Originally Posted by cdmjlt369 View Post
    The point is if you take a tool away from a person they will find another tool. No matter what you do people will find something else to use.
    He did not find another tool. He manufactured his own. There is a difference. Nothing precluded him, presumably, from driving to Walmart and making a purchase for the same 'tool'.

    There could potentially be a never ending list of banned items.
    Chicken Little statement without foundation.

    Making something illegal has never been successful at stopping criminal activity.
    Tell it to Miami-Dade's 66% reduction in assault weapon crime during the previous ban.

    The best approach, I believe previously stated is to make it harder for the criminal element to obtain by making people who sale them responsible for who they sell them too. Background checks, etc. But most importantly make the punishments for offenses concerning firearms that no one will want to do them.
    In that case, the NRA stands in your way of producing a more civilized result as they have hypocritically reversed their prior support for universal background checks which include gun show purchases/private sales. The NRA also rewards convicted criminals by restoring their 'right' to obtain firearms. Classy!

    Right now you get more time for drugs than weapons charges.
    Untrue.
  10. #1210  
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    Default Re: Joe Biden tips for self-defense: get a shotgun

    Quote Originally Posted by NothingIsTrue View Post
    There can be multiple reasons, some very well intentioned, for defending completely false statements.

    Wizard's First Rule: (Terry Goodkind)
    "People are stupid; given proper motivation, almost anyone will believe almost anything. Because people are stupid, they will believe a lie because they want to believe it's true, or because they are afraid it might be true. People's heads are full of knowledge, facts, and beliefs, and most of it is false, yet they think it all true. People are stupid; they can only rarely tell the difference between a lie and the truth, and yet they are confident they can, and so are all the easier to fool."
    I love Terry Goodkind! Finally! A post in this thread I can comment on without losing my mind. Lol

    What?! ...I'm msndrstood.
    via Gnex
    What?!...I'm msndrstood.

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  11. #1211  
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    Default Re: Joe Biden tips for self-defense: get a shotgun

    Quote Originally Posted by Markster1 View Post
    I believe, and its my right, there are forces out there going after all the guns. If we let them get the AR's, they will go after something else next and so on until they have them all.

    I'm not a conspiracy theorist.
    Thanks for the hearty belly-laugh.
  12. #1212  

    Default Re: Joe Biden tips for self-defense: get a shotgun

    Quote Originally Posted by carolinadroid View Post
    He did not find another tool. He manufactured his own. There is a difference. Nothing precluded him, presumably, from driving to Walmart and making a purchase for the same 'tool'.



    Chicken Little statement without foundation.



    Tell it to Miami-Dade's 66% reduction in assault weapon crime during the previous ban.



    In that case, the NRA stands in your way of producing a more civilized result as they have hypocritically reversed their prior support for universal background checks which include gun show purchases/private sales. The NRA also rewards convicted criminals by restoring their 'right' to obtain firearms. Classy!



    Untrue.
    I'm terribly sorry I didn't word that right. Let's say people will find a way since we are so technical. Dade county only mentioned assault weapon crime went down. What about overall crime? Did these people use a different type firearm? Conveniently left out statistics. Also, percentages can be misleading. Any hard numbers? 2 out of 3 is roughly 66%. Ar15 violence in Dade compared to other firearms is what? Lots of missing info here.

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  13. #1213  
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    Default Re: Joe Biden tips for self-defense: get a shotgun

    Quote Originally Posted by Markster1 View Post
    We should be going after the criminals but the current administration hasn't addressed that issue and instead seems to be following another pursuit
    Why allege something you can't possibly support (because it's fabricated)? Here's the record: School Massacres

    One way or another, final dispensation reaches the criminals. The judicial system is working. Enough of the bumper-sticker "we're not enforcing the laws on the books" monkey-dust already.
  14. #1214  
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    Default Re: Joe Biden tips for self-defense: get a shotgun

    Quote Originally Posted by cdmjlt369 View Post
    I'm terribly sorry I didn't word that right. Let's say people will find a way since we are so technical. Dade county only mentioned assault weapon crime went down. What about overall crime? Did these people use a different type firearm? Conveniently left out statistics. Also, percentages can be misleading. Any hard numbers? 2 out of 3 is roughly 66%. Ar15 violence in Dade compared to other firearms is what? Lots of missing info here.
    As a seeker of unvarnished truth, you tell me. On what basis of substance do you question why Miami-Dade, particularly, would substantiate success in reducing violent crime if it were not truthful?

    The only thing missing is a meaningful, honest discussion.
  15. #1215  

    Default Re: Joe Biden tips for self-defense: get a shotgun

    Quote Originally Posted by carolinadroid View Post
    Thanks for the hearty belly-laugh.
    Thanks for the snip you twit. Again taking things out of context.
  16. #1216  

    Default Re: Joe Biden tips for self-defense: get a shotgun

    Quote Originally Posted by carolinadroid View Post
    Why allege something you can't possibly support (because it's fabricated)? Here's the record: School Massacres

    One way or another, final dispensation reaches the criminals. The judicial system is working. Enough of the bumper-sticker "we're not enforcing the laws on the books" monkey-dust already.
    And show me anywhere in Obama's proposed gun ban he's done anything to impose stricter punishment for the criminals instead of the gun.
  17. #1217  
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    Default Re: Joe Biden tips for self-defense: get a shotgun

    Quote Originally Posted by Markster1 View Post
    Thanks for the snip you twit. Again taking things out of context.
    Actually, I was placing your thoughts in very appropriate context. Interesting how that worked out, isn't it? You're welcome.
  18. #1218  

    Default Re: Joe Biden tips for self-defense: get a shotgun

    Quote Originally Posted by carolinadroid View Post
    As a seeker of unvarnished truth, you tell me. On what basis of substance do you question why Miami-Dade, particularly, would substantiate success in reducing violent crime if it were not truthful?

    The only thing missing is a meaningful, honest discussion.
    Why are you so stuck on Miami-Dade, is that the only area that released the statistics that you wanted?
    You are such a seeker of the unvarnished truth let's see nationwide stats for the same time period as the 66% drop that you are obviously so impressed with.

    Columbine happened during the last AWB.
    I miss my friend Matt McQuinn he touched so many lives, and in the end gave his life to protect someone that he loved. I am proud to have known him, and of the choices he made when it mattered. You were a true hero.

    "You would not fear my weapon unless your intentions were to provoke my using it"
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  19. #1219  

    Default Re: Joe Biden tips for self-defense: get a shotgun

    Quote Originally Posted by carolinadroid View Post
    Actually, I was placing your thoughts in very appropriate context. Interesting how that worked out, isn't it? You're welcome.
    No, you took them out of context as you are so apt to do!
  20. #1220  
    backbeat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Joe Biden tips for self-defense: get a shotgun

    Quote Originally Posted by Markster1 View Post
    No, you took them out of context as you are so apt to do!
    Feel free to sue me.
  21. #1221  
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    Default Re: Joe Biden tips for self-defense: get a shotgun

    Quote Originally Posted by Markster1 View Post
    And show me anywhere in Obama's proposed gun ban he's done anything to impose stricter punishment for the criminals instead of the gun.
    Speaking of context ..... You might like to re-read the post, in full, that you're responding to before asking something inane again. The judicial system works. Or, are you referring to the NRA restoring convicted felons' 'rights' to obtain firearms?
  22. #1222  
    backbeat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Joe Biden tips for self-defense: get a shotgun

    Quote Originally Posted by Live2ride883 View Post
    Why are you so stuck on Miami-Dade, is that the only area that released the statistics that you wanted?
    You are such a seeker of the unvarnished truth let's see nationwide stats for the same time period as the 66% drop that you are obviously so impressed with.
    It's been your claim from the beginning that no reduction in crime/loss of life occurred during the previous assault weapons ban. Correct? Mysteriously, in all these pages of sputum, you've not supplied a single shred of unbiased statistical evidence to support your statement. Care to back it up now?
  23. #1223  
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    Default Re: Joe Biden tips for self-defense: get a shotgun

    Quote Originally Posted by carolinadroid View Post
    Chicken Little statement without foundation.
    Bull......with regard to "Gun Control" present day Chicago and Washington D.C. a few years back.
    Some other stuff that Washington D.C. tried to put the kabosh on.....Alchohol and Drugs.

    How many of those were sucessful?






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  24. #1224  
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    Default Re: Joe Biden tips for self-defense: get a shotgun

    Quote Originally Posted by rossbow View Post
    Bull......with regard to "Gun Control" present day Chicago and Washington D.C. a few years back.
    Some other stuff that Washington D.C. tried to put the kabosh on.....Alchohol and Drugs.

    How many of those were sucessful?
    You're not addressing something which was said. You're just trying to deflect the discussion where you would prefer. Here is what was said, in context:

    Quote Originally Posted by cdmjlt369 View Post
    There could potentially be a never ending list of banned items.
    My Response: Chicken Little statement without foundation.

    My statement stands.
  25. #1225  

    Default Re: Joe Biden tips for self-defense: get a shotgun

    Quote Originally Posted by carolinadroid View Post
    You're not addressing something which was said. You're just trying to deflect the discussion where you would prefer. Here is what was said, in context:



    My Response: Chicken Little statement without foundation.

    My statement stands.
    Then nearly everything you've posted in this thread is chicken little. I stand by the statement and that your half truth of the 66% in Dade is just as chicken little. You found the one article that boasted of such things and it didn't even include complete statistics. The problem with statistics is for the most part negative ones are the only ones reported.

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