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  • 1 Post By evq.003
  1. Thread Author  Thread Author    #1  

    Default The Scrolling Mystery

    Hello there...

    I'm a future Android user, coming from an iPod Touch background and being fascinated with these nice little robot phones on display in my local malls.
    It looks like my phone of choice will be the SIII, well at least it's the one with the most 'checks' in my book, but I have a problem with it. (Who doesn't, I guess.)

    Problem is, I can't find anything on the web discussing that problem. It's like it doesn't exist, because people never complain about it. But I noticed the issue less than a few seconds after my first demo of the S3 in a shop. It screamed to me, 'look at that!', and then I proceeded to explain/demonstrate it to every single tech guy in these shops, and everytime they agreed there was something wrong, and no, they didn't know how to fix, they didn't even notice the problem was there before.

    So, here it is.

    Go to the Settings page, or a browser page, anything that's scrollable, preferably a long page so you can easily spot the difference.
    Put your finger near the top of the screen. Move it below very quickly, and immediately move it up, then down, etc. It's important to do it quickly and not stop. Now look at how the screen is scrolling compared to your finger movements.
    It's like it's trying to keep up but it can't. The screen is still scrolling to the bottom when you're already moving your finger up.
    It's not a huge slowdown or anything, it just feels like the S3 is struggling to keep up.

    Problem is, it's a quad-core phone. I've tested lousy cheap phones that had absolutely no problems with the same little exercise.
    I was able to reproduce this on:
    - Galaxy Note 1
    - Galaxy S2
    - Galaxy S3

    The problem doesn't happen on:
    - Galaxy Note 2
    - any non-Samsung phones I've tested (mostly spent lots of time with Motorola Razr HD, Sony Xperia Arc S and Xperia S.)

    So, it looks like the Note 2 'fixes' the issue. Or maybe it's the Jelly Bean update...? But I tested a friend's S3 phone last month, and it was running the JB update, and it had the same problem.

    Now, even weirder -- the 'bump' scroll effect.
    It's harder to reproduce, but it happens just the same on Note 1, S2 and S3, and similarly, doesn't appear on Note 2. So I think that it's directly related to the first issue.

    Scroll through a long page, not too slowly, not too fast (don't send the page flying to the bottom.)
    Now, immediately lift your finger. If you were at the 'right' speed, you can see the page scrolling this way: it will quickly accelerate compared to its current cruise speed, then quickly decelerate in the same fashion (creating a 'bump' feeling), then slowly decelerate normally until it stops.
    On any other device, lifting the finger will result in the scrolling quickly slowing down to a halt. On my iPod Touch, the scrolling usually stops immediately as I lift my finger, which I really like.
    That, I'm afraid, is something that makes me hard for me to read a web page as easily as I can do on my iPod. Which is a shame.

    So... Can anyone reproduce this?

    Is it a known issue of the Samsung line?
    Does the fact that the Note 2 fix it, mean that a future software update will fix it for other phones as well? Or is it more of a hardware issue?
    Can it at least be fixed by switching to a different ROM? I'd rather avoid that as much as possible, at least in the beginning, as it could cancel my (future) warranty.

    This phone looks so great. I just can't accept the fact that browsing is ruined for me because of that. Just in case you're going to suggest one of these: I already tried modifying the Settings > Mouse & Trackpad > Pointer Speed, as well as disabling all animations in the Developer settings, both to no avail. It just isn't related to these things.

    Hopefully someone can help, thanks in advance
  2. #2  

    Default Re: The Scrolling Mystery

    Quote Originally Posted by Naowe View Post
    Hello there...

    I'm a future Android user, coming from an iPod Touch background and being fascinated with these nice little robot phones on display in my local malls.
    It looks like my phone of choice will be the SIII, well at least it's the one with the most 'checks' in my book, but I have a problem with it. (Who doesn't, I guess.)

    Problem is, I can't find anything on the web discussing that problem. It's like it doesn't exist, because people never complain about it. But I noticed the issue less than a few seconds after my first demo of the S3 in a shop. It screamed to me, 'look at that!', and then I proceeded to explain/demonstrate it to every single tech guy in these shops, and everytime they agreed there was something wrong, and no, they didn't know how to fix, they didn't even notice the problem was there before.

    So, here it is.

    Go to the Settings page, or a browser page, anything that's scrollable, preferably a long page so you can easily spot the difference.
    Put your finger near the top of the screen. Move it below very quickly, and immediately move it up, then down, etc. It's important to do it quickly and not stop. Now look at how the screen is scrolling compared to your finger movements.
    It's like it's trying to keep up but it can't. The screen is still scrolling to the bottom when you're already moving your finger up.
    It's not a huge slowdown or anything, it just feels like the S3 is struggling to keep up.

    Problem is, it's a quad-core phone. I've tested lousy cheap phones that had absolutely no problems with the same little exercise.
    I was able to reproduce this on:
    - Galaxy Note 1
    - Galaxy S2
    - Galaxy S3

    The problem doesn't happen on:
    - Galaxy Note 2
    - any non-Samsung phones I've tested (mostly spent lots of time with Motorola Razr HD, Sony Xperia Arc S and Xperia S.)

    So, it looks like the Note 2 'fixes' the issue. Or maybe it's the Jelly Bean update...? But I tested a friend's S3 phone last month, and it was running the JB update, and it had the same problem.

    Now, even weirder -- the 'bump' scroll effect.
    It's harder to reproduce, but it happens just the same on Note 1, S2 and S3, and similarly, doesn't appear on Note 2. So I think that it's directly related to the first issue.

    Scroll through a long page, not too slowly, not too fast (don't send the page flying to the bottom.)
    Now, immediately lift your finger. If you were at the 'right' speed, you can see the page scrolling this way: it will quickly accelerate compared to its current cruise speed, then quickly decelerate in the same fashion (creating a 'bump' feeling), then slowly decelerate normally until it stops.
    On any other device, lifting the finger will result in the scrolling quickly slowing down to a halt. On my iPod Touch, the scrolling usually stops immediately as I lift my finger, which I really like.
    That, I'm afraid, is something that makes me hard for me to read a web page as easily as I can do on my iPod. Which is a shame.

    So... Can anyone reproduce this?

    Is it a known issue of the Samsung line?
    Does the fact that the Note 2 fix it, mean that a future software update will fix it for other phones as well? Or is it more of a hardware issue?
    Can it at least be fixed by switching to a different ROM? I'd rather avoid that as much as possible, at least in the beginning, as it could cancel my (future) warranty.

    This phone looks so great. I just can't accept the fact that browsing is ruined for me because of that. Just in case you're going to suggest one of these: I already tried modifying the Settings > Mouse & Trackpad > Pointer Speed, as well as disabling all animations in the Developer settings, both to no avail. It just isn't related to these things.

    Hopefully someone can help, thanks in advance
    Where are you located? The gs3 in the us is dual core vs the note 2s quad

    Sent from my Red GS3
  3. #3  

    Default Re: The Scrolling Mystery

    Before the fanboi name calling and trolling accusations start and everyone saying go get the iPhone I'd like to try to give an honest response.

    First of all, in all my time using smart phones (including PDAs and pocket PCs) I have never had a reason to scroll up and down, back and forth so fast that the phone can't keep up and I do not foresee a time when I ever will. So I think that exercise is a moot point.

    As far as the scrolling not responding like an Apple product, It is NOT going to happen. If you will simply google Apple vs Samsung, you will find unlimited articles about the lawsuits between the two companies regarding numerous patent infringements, one of which is the "scrolling effect."
    evq.003 - More intelligent than the average *****!

    "If you can't spot the crazy person on the bus, it's you."
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  4. #4  
    funkylogik's Avatar

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    Default Re: The Scrolling Mystery

    Couldnt read whole thing soz but was the demo unit running ICS or JB? :thumbup:

    I could recreate what youre talkin bout on ICS but on JB i can scroll up n down like an ***** and my finger is at same word

    Unbranded international s3 with Official JB. Paisley, Slotland, Western Europe :beer:
    GT-I9300, UK
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    Naowe 
  5. Thread Author  Thread Author    #5  

    Default Re: The Scrolling Mystery

    (Oh, and sorry everyone about my mile-long posts, it's pretty much a character flaw of mine, being an old-school ex-journalist and all... Trying to get my message across without any room for doubt...)

    Quote Originally Posted by Shanicenicolle View Post
    Where are you located? The gs3 in the us is dual core vs the note 2s quad
    As my profile says, I'm from Paris, and my post did say as well that I was testing on quad-cores

    Quote Originally Posted by evq.003 View Post
    Before the fanboi name calling and trolling accusations start and everyone saying go get the iPhone I'd like to try to give an honest response.
    I planned to go for the iPhone 5 when it would come out, but iOS 6 didn't cut it for me, and I didn't like the design. I like curves on my devices. Like on my iPod Touch... And like on the S3. Whatever's got a design that doesn't look like a brick, I'm in.
    Anyway, really the main reason is that I tried the Android SDK and its simulator last summer, and was hooked. Ever since, I've wanted to have an Android OS for developing (web compatibility mostly, maybe apps too). Oh, who am I kidding, I'm just a sucker for innovation, and innovation comes from Android these days.

    First of all, in all my time using smart phones (including PDAs and pocket PCs) I have never had a reason to scroll up and down, back and forth so fast that the phone can't keep up and I do not foresee a time when I ever will. So I think that exercise is a moot point.
    Well, it isn't, because it's simply a quick way of taking note of something that occurs on the phone, and that gives you a feeling of general slowness or unwillingness to cooperate when browsing in a frenzy. Like, I'm in a hurry, I need to find this paragraph I saw here when I was on my desktop browser, let's scroll...
    My iPod has always been very reactive when it comes to that. And in fact, everything I used so far was reactive. There were slight differences in scrolling feedback, but it was acceptable in every case. Even on my old Fujitsu-Siemens PocketPC it was okay

    The Note 1/S2/S3 (maybe other Samsung phones as well but not the Note 2) issue is something that I've never felt anywhere else, be it Sony or Motorola or whatever.

    As far as the scrolling not responding like an Apple product, It is NOT going to happen. If you will simply google Apple vs Samsung, you will find unlimited articles about the lawsuits between the two companies regarding numerous patent infringements, one of which is the "scrolling effect."
    No, the 'scrolling effect' that you're mentioning is the bounce-back effect when you reach the end of a page. I'm not sure why people are confused about that. What Samsung is being sued for, is that they had that bounce-back effect (something I don't really care about -- I think bounce-back looks cool, but I'm not obsessed by it). There is absolutely no patent related to the behavior of a scrolling animation when one's finger is lifted from the screen.

    (Also, I believe the bounce-back effect is available in some custom ROMs or apps or something, innit..? I mean I did see it in action on my friend's S3 back in October...)

    Quote Originally Posted by funkylogik View Post
    Couldnt read whole thing soz but was the demo unit running ICS or JB? :thumbup:
    All demo units were running ICS. I tried them in at least a dozen different shops in various cities. I've actually been looking hard for a unit that was NOT running ICS... But it looks like phone salesmen can be lazy. :P

    I could recreate what youre talkin bout on ICS but on JB i can scroll up n down like an ***** and my finger is at same word
    When you say you can recreate it on ICS, do you mean you have another S3 under the hand, running ICS, and you tried on both?

    Also, if you can -- can you confirm you can reproduce the 'bump' effect when scrolling?
    My main trouble right now with this, is that it's already hard to explain what it is in French, so I can only guess it's next to impossible to get it right in English...

    Unbranded international s3 with Official JB. Paisley, Slotland, Western Europe :beer:
    Slotland? One more typo and I'm flying there to meet the girls
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  6. #6  

    Default Re: The Scrolling Mystery

    I could recreate it on tapatalk, and I'm running jb on the international (quad core) version. That said I have a list of stuff in the background at the moment.

    My big observation is that this is my first time noticing for a reason. I have and see no use for scrolling back and forth at high speed repeatedly with the screen keeping up to pin point accuracy. By the time I had released the screen the display had caught up and my eyes aren't good enough to read the screen until its stopped flying by at 100mph anyway.

    I would say it's common but no it isn't a known issue because it it's not an issue. I would say your one of about 5 people that would perform this test and use it as a benchmark for phone selection. I would also hazard a guess that of those 5 none (including you) have a real world example where it's important.

    That isn't an attack just an observation that you are maybe looking too deep into something with zero impact. I wouldn't worry about it.
  7. Thread Author  Thread Author    #7  

    Default Re: The Scrolling Mystery

    Quote Originally Posted by bakeri666 View Post
    I could recreate it on tapatalk, and I'm running jb on the international (quad core) version.
    Ah, bugger...

    That said I have a list of stuff in the background at the moment.
    But it isn't really important. The S3 definitely is reactive and everything. It always has the screen lag, even with zero other application in the background.

    My big observation is that this is my first time noticing for a reason. I have and see no use for scrolling back and forth at high speed repeatedly with the screen keeping up to pin point accuracy. By the time I had released the screen the display had caught up and my eyes aren't good enough to read the screen until its stopped flying by at 100mph anyway.
    As I said in my post that has yet to be 'approved', this experiment is just the easiest way to reproduce the usual lag I'm getting in the S3. It's a quick way to say, "see? Something is amiss, because this wouldn't happen in any non-Samsung devices I tested". It's just a way to catch people's attention. When I'm browsing, I'm browsing "normally", i.e. I'm not moving the screen at high speed or whatever silly, but I still have trouble with the very short lag I experience whenever I change directions in the scroll, or when I lift my finger. But it's harder for people to see this without me showing the exact steps in real life. It's just something I can't explain without a real life example and demo unit in front of me.

    I would say it's common but no it isn't a known issue because it it's not an issue. I would say your one of about 5 people that would perform this test and use it as a benchmark for phone selection. I would also hazard a guess that of those 5 none (including you) have a real world example where it's important.
    I've seen people ditch something for worse reasons.
    I mostly use my iPod for web browsing. So to simplify things, I want to buy the best browsing machine. Hence I need a bigger screen, so it's going to be an Android device. I'm in love with the HTC One designs but I've never been able to try one out (either X or S), while there are plenty of S3 and Note 2 demo units around in my local malls. The Note 2 is too large to make itself forgettable in my pocket when I'm sitting, and the S3 fits it perfectly, and it has a 'check' on all my other requests, such as a MicroSD slot, good speakerphone quality (albeit not even as good as the Lumia 920 but I don't want that Windows Phone crap... Anyway that's for another topic maybe), good battery life as I'm told, good camera, etc.
    But the #1 thing is, I want to be comfortable when browsing. So I need to feel that the device is answering to my finger moves as soon as it registers them.
    My iPod is two years old, it's got an old CPU, 256 MB of Ram, and it still manages to deal with that properly. I can NOT, for the life of me, conclude that the S3 is unable to handle that. It has the processor power to do 10 times what the iPod does, so it's got to be either a software bug (fixable) or a screen sensitivity issue (non-fixable), not something related to the S3's CPU itself.

    That isn't an attack just an observation that you are maybe looking too deep into something with zero impact. I wouldn't worry about it.
    I can assure you -- I've played around with Android phones for about 5-6 hours in total (if I count all the times I went to these stores or borrowed the S3 from my acquaintance), so you can say I'm a bit obsessive about that problem because without this 'scrolling mystery', I would have bought myself the S3 back in August when I first played with it. I fell in love with it (well, not as much as the HTC One X/S but these came to me much later and as I said I was unable to even turn them on), and I was devastated that the browsing experience felt rushed and 'unfinished' to me. I need more processing power, but I don't see myself buying an iPod/iPhone 5 just for that, I have nothing against them, they're nice and all, but I want my freedom. (And a bigger screen. 4.3'' seems like the threshold these days.)
  8. #8  

    Default Re: The Scrolling Mystery

    Kind of like going to look at a new car and finding that if you cycle the ignition key 30 times in rapid succession the dome light will flash. (actually it takes 31 times) It's a result that few would ever notice. Even fewer would care. Interesting find though.
    Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves, for they shall never cease to be amused.

  9. #9  
    rexxman's Avatar

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    Default Re: The Scrolling Mystery

    I noticed you said quad core and then saw your location as Paris, France.

    OK, I tried both exercises on my USA S3 (dual core 2gig) and could not reproduce either effect.

    Having never taken the "Evelyn Wood" courses, I would never scroll this way anyway!

    Sent from my SCH-I535 using Android Central Forums
  10. Thread Author  Thread Author    #10  

    Default Re: The Scrolling Mystery

    Good! I see that my posts above were published. Plus I get to post without pre-moderation now.

    So... Went back (again) to my local mall, spent another hour on the S3, Note 2, Motorola Razr HD and Xperia T.
    What I can say:
    - The Note 2 actually has the scrolling lag problem, although it no longer has the scrolling 'bump' which is my #1 issue.
    - The S3's scrolling lag is certainly due to a software concept. From what I could see, and due to my tests on the Note 2, this is not due to an actual 'lag' (i.e. a delay between the moment I change the scrolling direction and the moment the S3 notices it and complies), but because the S3 insists on systematically smoothing the scroll effect, whatever my intent is. So, when I change the scrolling direction, it probably immediately understands that I want to go in the other direction, then it tells the GPU to stop the scrolling, which it does by slowing down very quickly, and then it tells it to go in the other direction, which it does by quickly accelerating in the other direction.

    All in all it's a very fast effect internally, but because changing directions is something that I expect to be 'quick' (and the Razr HD and Xperia T have absolutely no problem doing it the way I would expect it), it's a bit disappointing to see the effect in action, because while it does look 'smooth', there's a time for being smooth, and a time for being quick. It's just as if the S3 puts the priority on making everything smooth. Perhaps this is something that most people will appreciate, but it just doesn't cut it with me.

    So, am I to expect that using a custom ROM (Cyanogenmod, or whatever else, I haven't looked into them yet) won't actually fix the problem..?
    Maybe the Android 4.1.2 update, which is supposed to add a few of the Note 2's features, will finally fix this..? I'm only saying because it seems to be a Samsung-wide problem and the fact that the Note 2 tones down the issue made me think that perhaps some of the Samsung engineers realized there was a problem.

    Other than that, the car comparison is something that seems to systematically come back when talking about hardware, which I find amusing (I also do it a lot...)
    I would say, it's more like having a driving assistance device in your car, which makes direction changes smoother and thus easier to take in. However, when you're headed into another car and you need to immediately turn right and it turns out that the device insists on smoothing your experience and thus making it slower to turn, you can end up cursing the manufacturer for being so thoughtful because you just ruined your car (and probably another one in the process.)

    Perhaps I should create my own custom ROM, specifically to address this issue... I don't know, lol. I don't know a thing about the internals and don't want to spend a year or two learning about them just to get the 'perfect' S3 scrolling when the S4 will be out by then and might fix it.

    Oh, and for what it's worth... The Note 2 is supposed to be faster than the S3, but the one I handled today showed noticeable signs of fatigue. The scrolling was jerky, and I'm really talking about 20 FPS or so, instead of a fluid motion. And that was after closing all of the other programs...
  11. #11  

    Default Re: The Scrolling Mystery

    Quote Originally Posted by Naowe View Post
    No, the 'scrolling effect' that you're mentioning is the bounce-back effect when you reach the end of a page. I'm not sure why people are confused about that. What Samsung is being sued for, is that they had that bounce-back effect (something I don't really care about -- I think bounce-back looks cool, but I'm not obsessed by it). There is absolutely no patent related to the behavior of a scrolling animation when one's finger is lifted from the screen.

    (Also, I believe the bounce-back effect is available in some custom ROMs or apps or something, innit..? I mean I did see it in action on my friend's S3 back in October...)
    There wasn't any confusion with the "bounce when scrolling" effect. It was merely a point of reference (just not clearly stated) as to how Apple is continuously trying to sue the pants off of Samsung and with the amount of lawsuits/patents/devices seemingly increasing every day, that you will likely find less and less similarities between Samsung and Apple.
    Last edited by evq.003; 11-28-2012 at 10:55 AM.
    evq.003 - More intelligent than the average *****!

    "If you can't spot the crazy person on the bus, it's you."
  12. #12  
    funkylogik's Avatar

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    Default Re: The Scrolling Mystery

    I just remember testing my s3 wen i 1st got it (ICS), it is a good way of testing smoothness.
    With JB theres none of what youre discribing

    Unbranded international s3 with Official JB. Paisley, Slotland, Western Europe :beer:
    GT-I9300, UK
  13. #13  

    Default Re: The Scrolling Mystery

    Quote Originally Posted by funkylogik View Post
    I just remember testing my s3 wen i 1st got it (ICS), it is a good way of testing smoothness.
    With JB theres none of what youre discribing

    Unbranded international s3 with Official JB. Paisley, Slotland, Western Europe :beer:
    I wonder if it is because of Project Butter on JB?
    evq.003 - More intelligent than the average *****!

    "If you can't spot the crazy person on the bus, it's you."
  14. #14  

    Default Re: The Scrolling Mystery

    Quote Originally Posted by Naowe View Post
    Good! I see that my posts above were published. Plus I get to post without pre-moderation now.

    So... Went back (again) to my local mall, spent another hour on the S3, Note 2, Motorola Razr HD and Xperia T.
    What I can say:
    - The Note 2 actually has the scrolling lag problem, although it no longer has the scrolling 'bump' which is my #1 issue.
    - The S3's scrolling lag is certainly due to a software concept. From what I could see, and due to my tests on the Note 2, this is not due to an actual 'lag' (i.e. a delay between the moment I change the scrolling direction and the moment the S3 notices it and complies), but because the S3 insists on systematically smoothing the scroll effect, whatever my intent is. So, when I change the scrolling direction, it probably immediately understands that I want to go in the other direction, then it tells the GPU to stop the scrolling, which it does by slowing down very quickly, and then it tells it to go in the other direction, which it does by quickly accelerating in the other direction.

    All in all it's a very fast effect internally, but because changing directions is something that I expect to be 'quick' (and the Razr HD and Xperia T have absolutely no problem doing it the way I would expect it), it's a bit disappointing to see the effect in action, because while it does look 'smooth', there's a time for being smooth, and a time for being quick. It's just as if the S3 puts the priority on making everything smooth. Perhaps this is something that most people will appreciate, but it just doesn't cut it with me.

    So, am I to expect that using a custom ROM (Cyanogenmod, or whatever else, I haven't looked into them yet) won't actually fix the problem..?
    Maybe the Android 4.1.2 update, which is supposed to add a few of the Note 2's features, will finally fix this..? I'm only saying because it seems to be a Samsung-wide problem and the fact that the Note 2 tones down the issue made me think that perhaps some of the Samsung engineers realized there was a problem.

    Other than that, the car comparison is something that seems to systematically come back when talking about hardware, which I find amusing (I also do it a lot...)
    I would say, it's more like having a driving assistance device in your car, which makes direction changes smoother and thus easier to take in. However, when you're headed into another car and you need to immediately turn right and it turns out that the device insists on smoothing your experience and thus making it slower to turn, you can end up cursing the manufacturer for being so thoughtful because you just ruined your car (and probably another one in the process.)

    Perhaps I should create my own custom ROM, specifically to address this issue... I don't know, lol. I don't know a thing about the internals and don't want to spend a year or two learning about them just to get the 'perfect' S3 scrolling when the S4 will be out by then and might fix it.

    Oh, and for what it's worth... The Note 2 is supposed to be faster than the S3, but the one I handled today showed noticeable signs of fatigue. The scrolling was jerky, and I'm really talking about 20 FPS or so, instead of a fluid motion. And that was after closing all of the other programs...
    That makes sense... explains why it's on the demo models and mine but not everyone's!

    You can change the animation effects, if you shorten the time or switch them off problem solved.
    Go into settings, then developer settings to change them. Also you may want to change pointer speed in language and input
  15. #15  

    Default Re: The Scrolling Mystery

    Quote Originally Posted by Naowe View Post
    (Oh, and sorry everyone about my mile-long posts, it's pretty much a character flaw of mine, being an old-school ex-journalist and all... Trying to get my message across without any room for doubt...)


    As my profile says, I'm from Paris, and my post did say as well that I was testing on quad-cores


    I planned to go for the iPhone 5 when it would come out, but iOS 6 didn't cut it for me, and I didn't like the design. I like curves on my devices. Like on my iPod Touch... And like on the S3. Whatever's got a design that doesn't look like a brick, I'm in.
    Anyway, really the main reason is that I tried the Android SDK and its simulator last summer, and was hooked. Ever since, I've wanted to have an Android OS for developing (web compatibility mostly, maybe apps too). Oh, who am I kidding, I'm just a sucker for innovation, and innovation comes from Android these days.


    Well, it isn't, because it's simply a quick way of taking note of something that occurs on the phone, and that gives you a feeling of general slowness or unwillingness to cooperate when browsing in a frenzy. Like, I'm in a hurry, I need to find this paragraph I saw here when I was on my desktop browser, let's scroll...
    My iPod has always been very reactive when it comes to that. And in fact, everything I used so far was reactive. There were slight differences in scrolling feedback, but it was acceptable in every case. Even on my old Fujitsu-Siemens PocketPC it was okay

    The Note 1/S2/S3 (maybe other Samsung phones as well but not the Note 2) issue is something that I've never felt anywhere else, be it Sony or Motorola or whatever.


    No, the 'scrolling effect' that you're mentioning is the bounce-back effect when you reach the end of a page. I'm not sure why people are confused about that. What Samsung is being sued for, is that they had that bounce-back effect (something I don't really care about -- I think bounce-back looks cool, but I'm not obsessed by it). There is absolutely no patent related to the behavior of a scrolling animation when one's finger is lifted from the screen.

    (Also, I believe the bounce-back effect is available in some custom ROMs or apps or something, innit..? I mean I did see it in action on my friend's S3 back in October...)


    All demo units were running ICS. I tried them in at least a dozen different shops in various cities. I've actually been looking hard for a unit that was NOT running ICS... But it looks like phone salesmen can be lazy. :P


    When you say you can recreate it on ICS, do you mean you have another S3 under the hand, running ICS, and you tried on both?

    Also, if you can -- can you confirm you can reproduce the 'bump' effect when scrolling?
    My main trouble right now with this, is that it's already hard to explain what it is in French, so I can only guess it's next to impossible to get it right in English...


    Slotland? One more typo and I'm flying there to meet the girls
    Yea... Too lazy to go into your profile to see where you're from lol.

    Edit: in regards to your actual post, I can't recreate this on these forums but no where else really and the if there is a delay its negligible. It keeps up with my scrolling well enough for me not to notice even in rapid succession as you suggested and I tried.

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Android Central Forums
    Last edited by Shanicenicolle; 11-30-2012 at 09:43 AM.
  16. Thread Author  Thread Author    #16  

    Default Re: The Scrolling Mystery

    Quote Originally Posted by bakeri666 View Post
    That makes sense... explains why it's on the demo models and mine but not everyone's!

    You can change the animation effects, if you shorten the time or switch them off problem solved.
    Go into settings, then developer settings to change them. Also you may want to change pointer speed in language and input
    I'd tried these options already on demo units, both Dev settings and Pointer Speed setting.
    I've really done my best to deal with pretty much the only issue that bothered me on the S3...

    (Well, I also have an issue with it having a dedicated Menu button that has no point at all, and getting rid of the multitasking button :P)

    So, in place of the S3, I bought myself a Razr i because it comes with a 10-day warranty (from the shop that sells it, not the device itself), so I can have it refunded in case I'm not happy with it.
    Turns out I'm pretty happy with it overall, but I miss the glamorous design of the S3.

    And -- this is why I'm posting -- I've been surprised to find out that actually, all devices seem to have the Scrolling Mystery problem that I mentioned...
    The difference being, the S2 and S3 make it very obvious, while other devices don't. I tried the S2 again this week, problem reproduced in Under a second. Tried the S3 Mini in a shop -- problem seems not to be there on the screen. It had a S3 right next to it, and the S3 mini was ten times more comfortable to scroll with. (Of course, it also has a really pathetic screen... Oops.)

    So, as I said: I reproduced the problem on my Razr i, but it was very, very faint, almost non-existent. It seems that the concept of "quickly accelerating, then quickly decelerating, then slowly decelerating" when lifting your fingers is an Android "thing", an algorithm that's built into the system. The difference being, the S2/S3 modify some system settings that trigger this way more often, and in a way more obvious manner.
    - S3: put finger on screen, move at moderate speed, then lift finger. Quasi-guaranteed Bump effect.
    - Razr i: put finger on screen, move at much higher speed (not maximum speed though), then lift finger. Small chance of hitting the Bump effect, albeit a more subtle one, but it's clear (after long staring sessions...) that the thing is accelerating before it dclrtes, *because* your finger was moving quickly and it's determined that you wanted to move quickly on the page.

    I think it's all due to the fact that Android devices don't, by default, offer a "tap top to move to top" option like iOS does. Which means, if you want to go back to the top of a large page, you'd usually need to swipe the page several times, hence the need for a much, much higher speed at maximum swipe speed. (The S3 provides the tap top option if I'm not mistaken. Making the accelerating speed even more useless than on other devices...)

    All in all, what I need is the ability to modify the speed at which the screen is moved when I lift my finger. i.e., the velocity applied to it when I swipe it.

    It seems that Android allows you to modify a variable called 'fling_velocity' (e.g. ro.max.fling_velocity=10000), but I'm not sure where this has to be set, and if I need to root my Razr i to modify it... (Even then, if it turns out it works, I'll need to unroot it to have it exchanged for a S3... Eh.)

    Does anyone know about these internal settings...?
  17. #17  
    Kevin O'Quinn's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Scrolling Mystery

    I wonder if third party browsers would act the same way....also....this just seems extremely nit-picky....if you like everything else about the phone I wouldn't let this one thing ruin it for you.
    Kevin F.I.M.T.K. O'Quinn Esq.
  18. Thread Author  Thread Author    #18  

    Default Re: The Scrolling Mystery

    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin O'Quinn View Post
    I wonder if third party browsers would act the same way....also....this just seems extremely nit-picky....if you like everything else about the phone I wouldn't let this one thing ruin it for you.
    Same behavior on stock, Chrome, Opera Mobile, Dolphin Browser... All I could test for now. Same in stock, Chrome, Firefox and Opera Mobile on the JB-powered S3 I tested last month.
    They all use the same tricks.
  19. Thread Author  Thread Author    #19  

    Default Re: The Scrolling Mystery

    I'm not a bad person, so I thought I should post here the latest developments

    So, I ended up buying a S3 a few days ago... It has a Jelly Bean 4.1.1 ROM installed by default.
    And my first reaction was, "What?! Why the hell isn't the scrolling mystery happening on my unit?!"

    And it's definitely most true.
    After hours and hours of tests, I absolutely wasn't able to trigger the hideous scrolling problem I had on demo units.
    The only way to do it is to enable Power Saving mode in the default ROM. Which I reckon isn't made for browsing anyway

    I also quickly enabled root and installed custom ROMs. Although I've been unhappy with the Omega AOKP ROM (probably my favorite of all I tested), because it's unable to connect to my Wifi (all AOKP ROMs I tested have the problem, while Samsung- and CM-based ROMs don't), I've settled on a bare CM 10.1 nightly which seems to be working fine for me.

    And no scrolling problems either.

    Thank you all for your time!
  20. #20  
    crester's Avatar

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    Default Re: The Scrolling Mystery

    I cannot believe a person is so obssessed over this...!

    Why would you sit there and scroll up and down repeatedly over like a 1 cm difference over and over anyways???
  21. #21  

    Default Re: The Scrolling Mystery

    Wow, really? I tried this on my S3 just now. In gmail, I don't notice any lag at all. In Chrome, I see it very, very slightly. There's a very tiny lag when my finger changes direction before the screen catches up, but it's so slight I can't even begin to consider it a "problem."

    If this really bothers the OP, then I suggest he get a different phone. Or learn to lighten up a little bit. Is this something that will really affect normal use of the phone?
    PLEASE, when asking for help provide as much information as possible. We can't help unless we know what the symptoms are and what you did before they began.

    LG G3 on Sprint. [Stumped and Bumped, Debloated, Startup apps managed, Trickster, Nova Prime, Swiftkey, G3 Tweakbox]--> Runs smooth as silk, now.
  22. Thread Author  Thread Author    #22  

    Default Re: The Scrolling Mystery

    As I said... Lag was present in earlier builds, but stock Sammy ROMs no longer have the problem, or at least it's severely toned down, to levels similar to competitor implmentations.

    Also, I never said that I was bothered by the lag in scrolling, I was actually referring to this as one of the possible symptoms of the 'scrolling acceleration/deceleration' issue that really bothered me. Both of these problems are gone for me.

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