06-28-2016 07:06 PM
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  1. Toltepeceno Delsur's Avatar
    It's pretty easy to notice there are a number of people not too happy with Marshmallow. This is not everyone but still it seems like a number of people are not happy with some of the changes including the handling of sd cards. The sd card changes will not apply to nexus devices or any phone without an sd card slot so this part will not apply. I thought maybe it might be a good idea to post changes to marshmallow that might might not be the best idea according to some of us or in my opinion where google jumped the shark with marshmallow. Feel free to add anything I miss or get wrong and I will add it here in the first post.


    There will probably be changes in the future to Marshmallow but for now this is it.


    1. Adoptive Storage.


    The sdcard becomes part of the internal storage, in reality it's not really as you cannot move some apps and it it were part of internal that would not happen.


    By Design.


    Apps that you could not add to portable storage before, as in lollipop and before, you still cannot add to adoptive storage.


    If your device will no longer boot up and you have to restore you have lost everything in adoptive mode. It is encrypted and you can no longer access it. I formatted my disk on the wife's windows laptop to windows 32 and then formatted by terminal on my mac to dos32 to use it again. For this reason it's not good for backups or storage.


    Bugs


    If you add an app that should not be on adoptive it will just disappear. I had it happen on 2 devices, I'm sure it's just some apps as the ones you could not move before.


    Automatic moving of apps does not always work. I reformatted and reinstalled many times and somethimes it would move apps automatically and sometimes I had to move them.


    Automatically moving some apps would mess it up. I remember using force2sd in the early years and forcing some apps would cause it to not boot up or boot loop. I had, on several occasions, this happen with automatically moved apps. I fund it better to manually move them, If you wait until you have a bunch of apps installed before formatting to internal it stays stuck on manual which was better in my case.


    2. Portable Storage


    It's for storage, period.


    By Design


    You can no longer move apps to portable storage as you could in earlier versions. That is eliminated, period.


    You can no longer place files, such as maps, for apps such as sygic on the sd card. It says it is not allowed in 6.0


    App access has been severely limited in marshmallow as for what they can do.


    You can no longer access internal storage. If an app downloads to internal storage, such as a music app, browser, etc. then it's there and you are not getting it unless you remove the sd card.


    Bugs


    So far I do not know of any bugs in this mode, let me know if you think of any.


    Marshmallow Plusses


    Doze, I do think it makes a difference.
    Ability to add percentage to battery icon.


    Again, post anything I have missed, I will add it and give credits at the bottom of the post. Maybe some will read this before updating and they will see a little of what is coming.
    02-26-2016 10:18 AM
  2. Aquila's Avatar
    What devices were you testing on? The adoptable storage description above doesn't match the specs.
    Deanig_12 likes this.
    02-26-2016 10:53 AM
  3. Toltepeceno Delsur's Avatar
    Moto x pure and nvidia shield tablet.

    There are posts in this forum on the very same issues.

    Post your experiences that differ if you have anh, I really don't care what tbe specs say. Read any threads on sd card problems in this very forum.

    You need to tell me where your experience dicfers.
    Marvin Gumba likes this.
    02-26-2016 12:40 PM
  4. Toltepeceno Delsur's Avatar
    Moto x pure and nvidia shield tablet

    I do not care what the specs say, I have seen the very same things posted by others. I would not have posted them if it was just me.

    Try looking through this whole forum (mm) and read tbe sdcard handling complaints.

    If you are not experiencing thes then it's worth disciussing, but just saying its not in the specs tben how about posting specs that day otherwise. I have not seen anything that neither confirms nor denys these things in wriring.
    02-26-2016 12:48 PM
  5. Aquila's Avatar
    I never put a card in my Moto X Pure, but this is not how it works on my Shield Tablet and I haven't tried it on my Shield Pro. On the Shield Tablet, 100% of downloaded apps and some preinstalled apps can be moved to SD and when the card is ejected they disappear until the card is reinserted. App developers in Marshmallow do not have a choice about whether or not their app can be put on SD cards, like they did in Lollipop - UNLESS the OEM changes the code, such as what Samsung and LG are doing when they remove adoptable storage and make tweaks to allow a small part of the functionality available in Lollipop.

    The all or none part is correct. In adoptive you can move an entire app and all its corresponding data to the card or leave it on internal, and switch it back and forth at will - but it is always 100% on one or the other. In portable storage, apps cannot be put on the SD card. 100% of apps are on internal and SD cards are for things like media, etc.

    Here's a decent video showing how it works:

    Laura Knotek likes this.
    02-26-2016 01:17 PM
  6. Toltepeceno Delsur's Avatar
    Wow, you have downloaded 100% of android apps and moved them to adoptive? Impressive. Otherwise you really do not know.

    For one thing I do not have this listed as specs, I have it listed as a bug. I don't think google lists the bugs so I am waiting for what I said in "by design, which means google designed it that way" to be disproved. THAT would be in the specs so my question still stands. Where am I wrong on the stuff I DO NOT have listed as bugs that can be disproved by specs?

    Try this. To name a few World of goo, cogs, badland. These are three I remember but putting them on adoptive they just disappeared. Every single time on both devices. I had to leave them internal. It has *nothing* to do with removing the sdcard. I do not know if they have been updated as i am on lollipop now.

    Like I said:

    If you add an app that should not be on adoptive it will just disappear. I had it happen on 2 devices, I'm sure it's just some apps as the ones you could not move before.
    I said it's a bug and "some" apps. It has nothing to do with the specs.



    I never put a card in my Moto X Pure, but this is not how it works on my Shield Tablet and I haven't tried it on my Shield Pro. On the Shield Tablet, 100% of downloaded apps and some preinstalled apps can be moved to SD and when the card is ejected they disappear until the card is reinserted. App developers in Marshmallow do not have a choice about whether or not their app can be put on SD cards, like they did in Lollipop - UNLESS the OEM changes the code, such as what Samsung and LG are doing when they remove adoptable storage and make tweaks to allow a small part of the functionality available in Lollipop.

    The all or none part is correct. In adoptive you can move an entire app and all its corresponding data to the card or leave it on internal, and switch it back and forth at will - but it is always 100% on one or the other. In portable storage, apps cannot be put on the SD card. 100% of apps are on internal and SD cards are for things like media, etc.

    Here's a decent video showing how it works:

    02-26-2016 01:35 PM
  7. Toltepeceno Delsur's Avatar
    Here's a post stating not all apps are compatible with moving:

    http://forums.androidcentral.com/and...ml#post5011405

    Bugs that delete apps on sdcard

    http://forums.androidcentral.com/and...ml#post4982239

    That's just a quick check. Just because you have not had it happen does not mean it's not happening.

    Regardless I have never seen a bug that affected everyone and I have been building computers since dos and doing android since eclair. Even ios for a while, have a mac also. Bugs are bugs, they don't always affect everyone. I'm not sure why you are picking out something I have listed as a bug and saying "not according to the specs".

    I think you are upset some do not like the new functions and bugs of marshmallow and upset I posted it.
    02-26-2016 01:42 PM
  8. Aquila's Avatar
    Like I said: If you add an app that should not be on adoptive it will just disappear. I had it happen on 2 devices, I'm sure it's just some apps as the ones you could not move before. I said it's a bug and "some" apps. It has nothing to do with the specs.
    What do you believe makes an app into one that "should not be on adoptive"? You have "Apps that you could not add to portable storage before, as in lollipop and before, you still cannot add to adoptive storage." listed as "By Design". This is false. It doesn't work that way (there's no option in the app code) and if it were functioning this way, it would be a bug. But I am wondering, why do you think that this is designed that way? Are you citing Google here? The first post of this thread is kind of very difficult to follow. It is unclear what the source of the information is and when you are citing that source versus adding your opinions. For example, in "by design" you mention your wife's laptop, which reads as anecdotal support by example for the point that you were making - but neither of the predicative sentences reference anything that seems like it is attributable to documentation. In the first example I put in quotations, the information seems to be in direct opposition to the design, yet it is listed as "by design" - again, attributing this to Google or the OEM that modified code to design it this way would be useful, because it currently reads as your opinion about a bug being listed as "working as intended".
    Laura Knotek likes this.
    02-26-2016 02:10 PM
  9. Kevin OQuinn's Avatar
    I do not understand why you're trying to manually manage your storage with Marshmallow anyway. The point of the feature is to NOT have to manage storage.

    The app developer can specify where they would prefer the app to be installed. Even if you have an SD card adopted as internal you can still have apps that will install to the "physical internal" storage and not to the adopted SD card internal storage.

    I just installed Badland and World of Goo in a Marshmallow device that has an SD card adopted as internal storage. Both of those apps are installed ON THE SD CARD. They both also work perfectly. They launch, I can play them, and they have not disappeared. Perhaps they have been updated for Marshmallow since you tested?
    Laura Knotek likes this.
    02-26-2016 02:13 PM
  10. Aquila's Avatar
    I think you are upset some do not like the new functions and bugs of marshmallow and upset I posted it.
    This is definitely not the case. I'm not upset at all - I'm asking for clarification on the "by design" points that you made, which appear to be bugs that, real or imagined, cannot possibly be designed to function that way. You obviously do not have to do this, but I would suggest rewriting the first post in a way that clearly delineates between how things are intended to function, citing where you are getting that information and making it absolutely clear when you are moving away from the source to add your own thoughts or examples for points of clarification - and addressing bugs separately. I haven't picked apart anything that you listed as a bug, except to ask for clarification on the "app that should not be on adoptive" - because this is a nonexistent concept and requires an explanation of what terms you are creating here.
    ezdroid likes this.
    02-26-2016 02:15 PM
  11. Laura Knotek's Avatar

    If you add an app that should not be on adoptive it will just disappear. I had it happen on 2 devices, I'm sure it's just some apps as the ones you could not move before.
    What apps have "disappeared"?
    02-26-2016 02:23 PM
  12. Toltepeceno Delsur's Avatar
    It doesn't work that way. When I allowed marshmallow to manage the storage it:

    1: Either filled up the phone and moved nothing to the sdcard in adoptive mode, had to uninstall a bunch of apps and move them by hand. Or

    2: When it DID move apps by itself on reboot it would hang up or boot loop. When I moved games by hand it but left apps internal it would boot up. Obviously it was moving apps that needed to start up but could not properly on the sdcard and would hang up.

    Waaaait. Mr. Google says the dev's have no say in whether the app can be moved. which is it? I know some can be left on internal and I did, but not the point.

    I said in a post above that maybe they have been updated by now and it was probably just some affected, but Mr. Google says no 100% can be moved.


    I do not understand why you're trying to manually manage your storage with Marshmallow anyway. The point of the feature is to NOT have to manage storage.

    The app developer can specify where they would prefer the app to be installed. Even if you have an SD card adopted as internal you can still have apps that will install to the "physical internal" storage and not to the adopted SD card internal storage.

    I just installed Badland and World of Goo in a Marshmallow device that has an SD card adopted as internal storage. Both of those apps are installed ON THE SD CARD. They both also work perfectly. They launch, I can play them, and they have not disappeared. Perhaps they have been updated for Marshmallow since you tested?
    02-26-2016 02:24 PM
  13. Toltepeceno Delsur's Avatar
    This is definitely not the case. I'm not upset at all - I'm asking for clarification on the "by design" points that you made, which appear to be bugs that, real or imagined, cannot possibly be designed to function that way. You obviously do not have to do this, but I would suggest rewriting the first post in a way that clearly delineates between how things are intended to function, citing where you are getting that information and making it absolutely clear when you are moving away from the source to add your own thoughts or examples for points of clarification - and addressing bugs separately. I haven't picked apart anything that you listed as a bug, except to ask for clarification on the "app that should not be on adoptive" - because this is a nonexistent concept and requires an explanation of what terms you are creating here.
    Then why would it not boot up after it moved some apps to adoptive automatically? Because them not being able to start properly was messing it up. It's an existing concept whether you like it or not.

    You claim the dev has no choice on where it is installed, if it is true then it's by design by google.
    02-26-2016 02:26 PM
  14. Toltepeceno Delsur's Avatar
    What apps have "disappeared"?
    I posted them above, 3 of them.
    02-26-2016 02:27 PM
  15. Kevin OQuinn's Avatar
    It doesn't work that way. When I allowed marshmallow to manage the storage it:

    1: Either filled up the phone and moved nothing to the sdcard in adoptive mode, had to uninstall a bunch of apps and move them by hand. Or

    2: When it DID move apps by itself on reboot it would hang up or boot loop. When I moved games by hand it but left apps internal it would boot up. Obviously it was moving apps that needed to start up but could not properly on the sdcard and would hang up.

    Waaaait. Mr. Google says the dev's have no say in whether the app can be moved. which is it? I know some can be left on internal and I did, but not the point.

    I said in a post above that maybe they have been updated by now and it was probably just some affected, but Mr. Google says no 100% can be moved.
    You are correct that it is best to begin with SD card adopted. Then apps that you download from the Play Store will go to it automatically if the developer allows it. Adopting first and then downloading apps simply eliminates a step, thus eliminating areas where potential issues could creep up.

    I suspect that Moto changed some things and that it isn't working exactly the way Google intends it to. Adopted storage all by itself should never cause any sort of reboots or bootlooping issues.
    Laura Knotek likes this.
    02-26-2016 02:28 PM
  16. Toltepeceno Delsur's Avatar
    Both my moto x pure and nvidia shield tablet.

    You are correct that it is best to begin with SD card adopted. Then apps that you download from the Play Store will go to it automatically if the developer allows it. Adopting first and then downloading apps simply eliminates a step, thus eliminating areas where potential issues could creep up.

    I suspect that Moto changed some things and that it isn't working exactly the way Google intends it to. Adopted storage all by itself should never cause any sort of reboots or bootlooping issues.
    02-26-2016 02:29 PM
  17. Kevin OQuinn's Avatar
    Both my moto x pure and nvidia shield tablet.
    What apps were moved specifically that caused your SHIELD tablet to reboot and boot loop? I would like to try those on mine.

    EDIT: Especially since nothing in the system folder actually gets moved over to the SD card, so booting should not be affected.
    Laura Knotek likes this.
    02-26-2016 02:33 PM
  18. Almeuit's Avatar
    What apps were moved specifically that caused your SHIELD tablet to reboot and boot loop? I would like to try those on mine.
    That would be a good idea. If you can recreate his issue maybe you can narrow down the cause.
    Laura Knotek likes this.
    02-26-2016 02:37 PM
  19. Aquila's Avatar
    From Moto updates to MM:


    Marshmallow - SD card - Tips and Tricks

    Marshmallow: what is changing
    Android 6.0 brings new and exciting features to your device.

    Android 6.0 introduces Adoptable Storage. Adoptable Storage enables a user to set up his SD card as internal storage, and store applications, their data, and media on an adopted SD card.

    With Android 6.0, we are also deprecating the existing ‘Apps 2 SD’ Motorola feature which enabled the user to move applications to a SD card in favor of the richer experience natively provided by Android.

    Let’s get to the details

    When you insert a SD card for the first time on a Marshmallow device, you can choose to either use the card as Portable Storage orInternal Storage.


    Portable Card Internal Storage
    Select this mode if you frequently swap your SD card between devices, use your SD card for media storage only. Select this mode if you want to completely extend your device storage with the card, and need the card to store large applications, games, and their data.
    You have a Class 2, 4, or 6 card. You have a high-speed card (UHS-1)
    If you frequently swap cards, use SD card to transfer content between devices and do not download many large app, we recommend configuring your card as “portable”. If you want to store large games on the card, if your device storage is always filling up, and you plan to always keep this card in the device, we recommend keeping your card as internal.
    Only pictures and media can be stored on the card.
    Downloaded applications, their data, is always internal. they can not be moved to the card.
    The card is readable by other devices. (another phone, Mac, PC, digital camera)

    Content on the card is not encrypted by default.

    The card will NOT be reformatted when Portable storage is selected.
    The SD card can become your device primary storage

    Downloaded applications, their data and media can be moved to the card

    The card is not readable by other devices. (another phone, Mac, PC, digital camera)

    The card is always encrypted, and can not be decrypted on any other device.

    The card will be formatted when Portable storage is selected.

    Performance warning
    We recommend use of a high speed card , such as a UHS-1 type. Class 4 and Class 2 micro SD cards are not recommended foradopted internal storage usage. The performance of these cards is typically 10x slower than internal storage performance.

    High speed card are identified by these logos:




    https://motorola-global-portal.custh...34/p/1449,9582
    12Kels and Marvin Gumba like this.
    02-26-2016 02:51 PM
  20. ugadawg239's Avatar
    I want to go to android from ios but it looks like it may be too painful to do so. Marshmallow seems like a mess.
    03-05-2016 07:27 PM
  21. LeoRex's Avatar
    I want to go to android from ios but it looks like it may be too painful to do so. Marshmallow seems like a mess.
    I wouldn't worry... I've been running 6.0 since the first preview builds and it's the most stable and polished version I've run. Both the Nexus 6 and 6P run great... And from OEM-land the LG G4 I just updated also runs much better than it did at 5.1.1

    Keep in mind that we have selection bias here. There's going to be a disproportionate number of issues reported simply because this is a place where people with issues come looking for help. It's like hanging out in a hospital and thinking everyone in the world is ill.
    Laura Knotek and MikeB17 like this.
    03-05-2016 08:03 PM
  22. Daniel Wofford's Avatar
    I installed the update on my note 5 now my WiFi won't work! Any suggestions
    03-07-2016 08:44 PM
  23. TheChosenDoge's Avatar
    I installed the update on my note 5 now my WiFi won't work! Any suggestions
    Elaborate on what with wifi isn't working?
    03-11-2016 12:58 AM
  24. Daniel Wofford's Avatar
    Elaborate on what with wifi isn't working?
    I did a factory reset and it reset with the update I lost all my music but everything seems to be working fine
    tube517 likes this.
    03-12-2016 07:04 AM
  25. TheChosenDoge's Avatar
    I did a factory reset and it reset with the update I lost all my music but everything seems to be working fine
    Awesome
    03-12-2016 11:45 AM
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