[strikeIII]

It's a sad day.
https://www.androidcentral.com/black...ng-smartphones

[strikeIII]

Hopefully Blackberry will make their own devices or find a new partner.

[dendron01]

Lessons learned - never entrust the viability of your brand to a toxic fansite.

[jgreg02]

anyone know why this happened?

[Elky64]

anyone know why this happened?

IMO TCL/BBMo failed to do their homework, and weren't willing to take chances. They paid too much for the licensing deal w/Blackberry which in turn, overpriced devices, and they did little to offset. In other words, delays, missed opportunities, device availability being scarce, and expecting "the brand" to sell itself, stymied any momentum. Personally noticed things starting to falter in July/Aug of 2018 so it began in the early stages of their deal steadily declining until it reach this point, outcome wasn't any surprise to me.

[the_boon]

IMO TCL/BBMo failed to do their homework, and weren't willing to take chances. They paid too much for the licensing deal w/Blackberry which in turn, overpriced devices, and they did little to offset. In other words, delays, missed opportunities, device availability being scarce, and expecting "the brand" to sell itself, stymied any momentum. Personally noticed things starting to falter in July/Aug of 2018 so it began in the early stages of their deal steadily declining until it reach this point, outcome wasn't any surprise to me.

I think their main misstep was cheapening out on the adhesive used behind the early silver KEYone's displays.

It was negative PR they REALLY could not afford to have had

Then, the overpriced KEY2 that launched for $650 instead of $550 like the KEYone.

Also, whatever money they wasted developing the Motion was really wasted, that device had like zero success.

As far as pricing, sales may have been better if:

KEYone: $499 instead of $549 (and with Black Edition specs from the get-go)

KEY2: $549, maybe $589 for Red Edition

KEY2 LE: $349

[Morty2264]

Hopefully Blackberry will make their own devices or find a new partner.

That would be awesome!

[TgeekB]

I think the main issue is there isn't a market big enough to make a profit.

[Laura Knotek]

I think the main issue is there isn't a market big enough to make a profit.

Unfortunately, I agree. Since four licensees failed, I doubt if any others would be interested.

[the_boon]

I think the main issue is there isn't a market big enough to make a profit.

I can agree that there is no more market for BlackBerry branded smartphones, but I still believe there is some market for keyboard phones in general.

[dendron01]

I think the main issue is there isn't a market big enough to make a profit.

In order for there to be a market, you need to make a product worth buying. The business case to pay the prices BBMo expected for low spec phones dressed up in a BlackBerry tux is what didn't cut it. Consumers aren't idiots.

Then on top of that you have a fansite run by shills pushing the products pretending none of the shortfalls exist, and patronizing anyone who raises an issue.

Bad product + bad price + bad marketing = failure. Nothing to do with there being "no market" for BlackBerry products. There is no market for overpriced products that can't truly compete on anything other than a logo (and possibly a keyboard, if they hadn't messed that up as well).

[the_boon]

In order for there to be a market, you need to make a product worth buying. The business case to pay the prices BBMo expected for low spec phones dressed up in a BlackBerry tux is what didn't cut it. Consumers aren't idiots.

Then on top of that you have a fansite run by shills pushing the products pretending none of the shortfalls exist, and patronizing anyone who raises an issue.

Bad product + bad price + bad marketing = failure. Nothing to do with there being "no market" for BlackBerry products. There is no market for overpriced products that can't truly compete on anything other than a logo (and possibly a keyboard, if they hadn't messed that up as well).

I have to agree with most of your points, but come on, they practically had the entire keyboard market to themselves and still couldn't do it

[Elky64]

In order for there to be a market, you need to make a product worth buying. The business case to pay the prices BBMo expected for low spec phones dressed up in a BlackBerry tux is what didn't cut it. Consumers aren't idiots.

Then on top of that you have a fansite run by shills pushing the products pretending none of the shortfalls exist, and patronizing anyone who raises an issue.

Bad product + bad price + bad marketing = failure. Nothing to do with there being "no market" for BlackBerry products. There is no market for overpriced products that can't truly compete on anything other than a logo (and possibly a keyboard, if they hadn't messed that up as well).

Their targeted audience was too shallow due to pricing and specs. Surely there were many "non-BB Diehards" who took interest until pricing and specs were revealed. I was one of them bypassing KEY2 because of, haven't look back since. Not to say I was hoping for a demise, on the contrary, yet TCL/BBMo didn't give me a sense they were serious about this venture and time proved us right.

The BlackBerry brand took another huge hit because of TCL/BBMo's poor insight, not that it really matters now. But if you want to make sure something is absolutely and for sure dead just follow their act.

[Elky64]

I have to agree with most of your points, but come on, they practically had the entire keyboard market to themselves and still couldn't do it

So they practically had the entire keyboard market to themselves did they. It obviously showed paying a premium for a PKB alone wasn't enough when the rest of the specs paled in comparison to the competition did it? TCL/BBMo should have realized this very early on in the game yet stuck to their guns and paid the price for it. I'll bet price/specs even kept many BB Diehards away if seeing how many were still running BB-of-old was/is any indication.

[mustang7757]

I hate to see any company go under especially a long history one , I wonder if someone can buy them and continue their brand .

[the_boon]

I hate to see any company go under especially a long history one , I wonder if someone can buy them and continue their brand .

Especially a company that offered products that very clearly distinguished themselves from every other manufacturers'.
Times are frightening for keyboard die-hards like me.
At this point I don't care if my next device has the BB logo slapped on the back, but I want those 35 buttons underneath my display.

A portrait slider would be awesome too.

There are probably several reasons why things went down like they did, but the early Silver KEYone screen lift didn't help, said KEYone's slow launch didn't help, the overpriced KEY2 didn't help, the money wasted on the Motion didn't help, then there was the quirky KEY2 spacebar as well as Bluetooth issues, things that no one should have to deal with on a $649 device.

However, they did not start the brand from scratch.

They started in the negative because "BlackBerry = outdated" in the eyes of most consumers even back in spring 2017 at KEYone launch.

Had they slapped keyboards on their TCL branded phones or others, at least the negative "failed brand" perception would not have gotten in the way.

And lastly, lack of carrier support in the US is a huge disadvantage.

[mustang7757]

Especially a company that offered products that very clearly distinguished themselves from every other manufacturers'.
Times are frightening for keyboard die-hards like me.
At this point I don't care if my next device has the BB logo slapped on the back, but I want those 35 buttons underneath my display.

A portrait slider would be awesome too.

There are probably several reasons why things went down like they did, but the early Silver KEYone screen lift didn't help, said KEYone's slow launch didn't help, the overpriced KEY2 didn't help, the money wasted on the Motion didn't help, then there was the quirky KEY2 spacebar as well as Bluetooth issues, things that no one should have to deal with on a $649 device.

However, they did not start the brand from scratch.

They started in the negative because "BlackBerry = outdated" in the eyes of most consumers even back in spring 2017 at KEYone launch.

Had they slapped keyboards on their TCL branded phones or others, at least the negative "failed brand" perception would not have gotten in the way.

And lastly, lack of carrier support in the US is a huge disadvantage.

Exactly a company that can carry over some BB stuff and it's own flair , it's a risk for a company to take over but might pull it off if done right .

[the_boon]

Exactly a company that can carry over some BB stuff and it's own flair , it's a risk for a company to take over but might pull it off if done right .

I feel like any company who will have that thought cross their mind will have to look at TCL's failure, and then will they want to go down that road too lol

It would be so much cheaper for them to just make their own keyboard phones without paying BlackBerry Ltd for the keyboard patents and brand name.

[TgeekB]

In order for there to be a market, you need to make a product worth buying. The business case to pay the prices BBMo expected for low spec phones dressed up in a BlackBerry tux is what didn't cut it. Consumers aren't idiots.

Then on top of that you have a fansite run by shills pushing the products pretending none of the shortfalls exist, and patronizing anyone who raises an issue.

Bad product + bad price + bad marketing = failure. Nothing to do with there being "no market" for BlackBerry products. There is no market for overpriced products that can't truly compete on anything other than a logo (and possibly a keyboard, if they hadn't messed that up as well).

Agree with your first points, disagree that it’s not about there being a market.
Why hasn’t anyone been able to make it work? Multiple companies have tried and failed. There are lots of overpriced and underpriced slab phones with various specs and they all sell like hot cakes. This dream that a PKB phone is going to come back from the dead anytime soon has no merit.

[mustang7757]

I feel like any company who will have that thought cross their mind will have to look at TCL's failure, and then will they want to go down that road too lol

It would be so much cheaper for them to just make their own keyboard phones without paying BlackBerry Ltd for the keyboard patents and brand name.

Yeah , I agree there!

[TgeekB]

I can agree that there is no more market for BlackBerry branded smartphones, but I still believe there is some market for keyboard phones in general.

I guess I’m just having a hard time seeing it.
What data makes you think there is?
I’m someone who looks at things realistically, not based on hopes and dreams. If you could show me something that makes sense I might be more willing to believe it.

[Elky64]

I hate to see any company go under especially a long history one , I wonder if someone can buy them and continue their brand .

Sure anyone could but would they be able to make a go of it in the profitable sense?

[mustang7757]

Sure anyone could but would they be able to make a go of it in the profitable sense?

That's a risk someone would have to take and really think they can make a profit .

[Elky64]

Why hasn’t anyone been able to make it work?

From my perspective it's because they all seem to end up pissing the end users off by NOT delivering on promises or not delivering at all. Doesn't take long for non-end user to get wind of it too so if they were potential buyers, they for sure aren't now. Can write a book on the things BlackBerry Ltd, TCL/BBMo, Optiemus, and so on, failed on bringing to their customers.

[Elky64]

That's a risk someone would have to take and really think they can make a profit .

Well if they followed any of the previous goers in their approaches, nope they'd be sunk in no time.