Best Android experience with AT&T

[laydros]

I have been an iPhone user, and don't have any real problems with the iPhone or Apple, but after a trial with a Motorola Backflip, realize I like Android a lot. I then grabbed an EVO on release day and at this point feel like I like Android *better* than the iPhone. It isn't a huge difference either way for me, but as a "power user" I prefer Android's rough edges over the iPhones limitations.

The problem is that because I share a family plan with my wife and a couple of our parents, dropping my AT&T line would only cut our phone bill by about $40 or $45, and the difference in that and the $80 plan with Sprint gets very expensive over 2 years.

So I love the EVO, but I'll have to return it and stick with AT&T. Right now the only subsidized phone is the backflip, but it sucks. I have one but it is on craigslist right now. If someone rooted the thing and we could get it to 2.1 or 2.2 and install apk's, it might be ok, but I have lost faith that it will get rooted, it doesn't seem like many people are working on it.

So with that out, I can (1)get a Nexus One, (2)get another GSM device unlocked (like the Canadian Milestone or something like a European Hero), which wouldn't be as bang for buck as the Nexus One, or (3)wait for what comes out later. At this point it looks like the only high-res 1GHz Android phone AT&T has coming is the Samsung Galaxy S. It looks like a nice phone, but I don't like touchwiz, and I have doubts about the hackability, or if/when it will show up.

Since I'm going to be paying AT&T anyway, shelling out close to $600 with tax for a Nexus One seems rough, but right now it seems like the best option.

I was hoping people could provide some feedback. Thanks for any input.

A) Are there other options I'm not considering?
B) Will the Nexus One be a disappointment compared to the EVO?
C) Modding/ROMS: I have done some searching and it sounds like the ROMs made for the T-Mobile N1 will work on the AT&T model, but are there any limitations to the AT&T model since there are so few of them out there being hacked on compared to the T-Mobile version?
D) Is it possible to have AT&T downgrade my data service to the $15 dumbphone unlimited plan and use that with the Nexus One, since it isn't a subsidized phone?

 

[NickF227]

The Liquid E has ATT radios, but its a....I think a Rodgers phone?(Canada)

 

[Corey]

A) There are a few phones coming to AT&T soon. Depending on how patient you can be, you may be able to hold out for a few of them. Not recalling specifics (Verizon user here, so it's hard to pay attention), but I believe HTC has a few in the pipes for the next month or two. You could cruise eBay or Craigslist, or even check the classified section on this and other android forums for a mildly used ATT N1. With the Evo now out, you might be able to catch a few people looking to dump their N1 to pay for the Evo.

B) Hard to tell. That's really a personal thing. Are you tied to Sense UI? Is the front facing camera important? Do you need the 4.3 inch screen? Do you have access to 4G? If the answer to any of those is "yes", then it might be. Otherwise, I think the form factor and build quality of the Nexus is quite nice, and the phone holds up quite well to the Evo.
C) Not positive here (Droid user) but I believe the N1 Roms are good on the ATT and TMobile devices. Others may serve better to answer that, but I'm feeling that's the right answer.
D) I don't believe it's possible.

 

[icebike]

The nice thing about the AT&T version of Nexus One is the fact its unlocked, and can be e-Bay-ed when you want to move on. You will get most of that money back, if not all of it, when the next phone you gotta have comes out.

And you can pull a lot of value out of your iPhone at nextworth.
NextWorth: Buy and Sell Electronics, Sell iPhone and Video Games, Recycle your gadgets - NextWorth.com

You do the big pay in ONCE, and then you have equity in the device (unless, like a car, you keep it too long).

I was exactly in your shoes, except I am hanging on to my iPhone as an iPod Touch, and a hacking toy.

 

[RayStinkle]

yeah the nexus one is the only option for the most part at the moment for the ATT network. if you can wait, you might have some more options coming later this year.

 

[laydros]

Thanks for the follow ups.

Perhaps some vendors have kept stuff under better wraps than I expect, but at this point all the rumor mill has stirred up is the Dell Aero, possibly the Dell Streak, the HTC Aria/Liberty that showed up in that ATT video today, and the Samsung Galaxy S variant. The aero and HTC phones are older style low res phones, probably with the same G1 guts that are in almost all the Android phones. The streak is quite interesting, but might not even make it to AT&T, and is a bit more of a tablet than a phone. The Samsung is probably the top Android device we have seen so far, but TouchWiz looks miserable to me, and they haven't done a very impressive job with OS updates.

As for Sense Ui, I probably really like some of the tweaks present in it, but what I really want is a device I can flash a sense Rom on when I want it, or a non sense Rom when I dont, which is possible with both the N1 and EVO. But if I didn't have that option, I prefer stock over any of the OEM interfaces.

 

[superflush]

Hm, the Backflip is crippled, and the fact that the Nexus One can only be bought full fare makes it harder (I don't believe you get a monthly rate cut when you buy it full fare at AT&T like you do at T-Mobile. I didn't realize that nobody has rooted the Backflip. I would have figured that you could do so.

If you still have the Backflip or your iPhone, I would maybe ride it out for a while and wait until a better Android phone hits AT&T. I would be shocked if it didn't happen before Christmas.

As for your D question, AT&T will know you are using the Nexus One, and may very well upgrade you to whatever the minimum data plan is for the Nexus One.

 

[laydros]

I just noticed the legend looks like a strong possibility for ATT also

HTC Legend coming to AT&T, according to FCC - Engadget

Still has the low res screen, but it sure is purty.

 

[whitenack]

A) Are there other options I'm not considering?
B) Will the Nexus One be a disappointment compared to the EVO?
C) Modding/ROMS: I have done some searching and it sounds like the ROMs made for the T-Mobile N1 will work on the AT&T model, but are there any limitations to the AT&T model since there are so few of them out there being hacked on compared to the T-Mobile version?
D) Is it possible to have AT&T downgrade my data service to the $15 dumbphone unlimited plan and use that with the Nexus One, since it isn't a subsidized phone?

I'm in the exact same shoes you are. Looking to switch from TMO to ATT, but waiting for a good phone to come out first.

Regarding Question D., AT&T did away with unlimited Data Plans last week. Now they have a $15 for 200mb and $25 for 2GB. So, if you could use less than 200mb, you could use the N1 (or any other phone) with the $15 data plan.

 

[maxiang]

A) You can use any quad-band (850; 900; 1800; 1900 GSM android phone on AT&T 2G. However, if you want 3G (I do!) you are limited to phones that use AT&T 3G bands of 850 and 1900 (*this is a separate radio from the quad-band*). As far as I know, phones that run European or Asian 3G bands won't cut it, but phones that run on Canadian GSM networks should be OK. The best android you can get on AT&T at the moment is the N1 IMHO.

B) Don't know.

C) The only difference between the two versions that I know of is the 3G radio. Everything else *should* be the same.

D) AT&T changed their data plan structure. There is NO unlimited option (actually a 5GB fair use softcap) unless you have it before the change went into effect. You are grandfathered in and can retain the unlimited as long as you don't change your data plan to one of the new options. Once you change it, you can never get it back. If you want to pay AT&T for tethering (stupid if you have an android) you will have to change plans.

The new plans and overage:
200MB for $15. Go over and its an additional 200MB for $15.
2GB for $25. Go over and its an additional 1GB for $10. Add tethering for $20, but it pulls from the same 2GB pool.

Check your data usage before you switch plans. I'm using a BlackBerry 9700 (way more data effcient because of compression than android and iPhone) and I'm at 1.2GB with a couple of weeks left on my billing cycle. I do not tether and my job doesn't give me a lot of stare at my phone time, but I've been using podtrapper a lot this month My lowest data usage was 300MB in a month, my average is about 500MB. During the time I was using an unlocked CLIQ (no 3G) I was around 1GB.

 

[icebike]

However, if you want 3G (I do!) you are limited to phones that use AT&T 3G bands of 850 and 1900 (*this is a separate radio from the quad-band*).

To be perfectly pedantic: No it isn't a separate radio.

Its all the same radio. In fact the N1 only has two radio modules, one the Broadcom 4329 (wifi and bluetooth). The second radio handles all flavors of Cellular data (plus GPS), it is a RTR6285 Transceiver by Qualcomm.

Datasheet here: http://www.datasheetarchive.com/pdf/Datasheet-024/DSA00418656.pdf

This SINGLE radio handles a boatload of bands, and frequencies.

But the frequencies, or RF interface, does not by itself define 3G.

Its HOW you use the frequencies, the radio protocol or "Air Interface", that determines if you get 3G or not.

Its unknown just how far you can wander with this Phone. Just because Qualcomm built all of those capabilities into the radio does not mean that Google or HTC have the system set up to use them properly.

 

[laydros]

A) You can use any quad-band (850; 900; 1800; 1900 GSM android phone on AT&T 2G. However, if you want 3G (I do!) you are limited to phones that use AT&T 3G bands of 850 and 1900 (*this is a separate radio from the quad-band*). As far as I know, phones that run European or Asian 3G bands won't cut it, but phones that run on Canadian GSM networks should be OK. The best android you can get on AT&T at the moment is the N1 IMHO.

B) Don't know.

C) The only difference between the two versions that I know of is the 3G radio. Everything else *should* be the same.

D) AT&T changed their data plan structure. There is NO unlimited option (actually a 5GB fair use softcap) unless you have it before the change went into effect. You are grandfathered in and can retain the unlimited as long as you don't change your data plan to one of the new options. Once you change it, you can never get it back. If you want to pay AT&T for tethering (stupid if you have an android) you will have to change plans.

The new plans and overage:
200MB for $15. Go over and its an additional 200MB for $15.
2GB for $25. Go over and its an additional 1GB for $10. Add tethering for $20, but it pulls from the same 2GB pool.

Check your data usage before you switch plans. I'm using a BlackBerry 9700 (way more data effcient because of compression than android and iPhone) and I'm at 1.2GB with a couple of weeks left on my billing cycle. I do not tether and my job doesn't give me a lot of stare at my phone time, but I've been using podtrapper a lot this month My lowest data usage was 300MB in a month, my average is about 500MB. During the time I was using an unlocked CLIQ (no 3G) I was around 1GB.

You are right on A. I did a little hunting this AM and I think Rogers, Bell, or Telus phones all operate on the same bands as AT&T for 3G, and it looks like there is a Milestone, G1, Magic, and maybe a hero up there, maybe the legend, and I think some Samsung phone. The hackablility of the G1 and Magic seems good, and I think the Magic has a little more RAM so it has a better chance of running 2.2 well.

I am aware of the AT&T data rate changes, and at this point I have unlimited with the iPhone, so I could be grandfathered in. However I looked and they do offer unlimited data on feature phones for just $15. If you get a smartphone you have to pay either the $15 for 200 or $25 for 2GB. I was wondering if I could get away with that plan, but between my own SIM swapping between my iPhone and the Backflip, and a recent podcast where this was mentioned with the N1, apparently AT&T can tell what phone the SIM is in, so I'm sure they wouldn't let the N1 run on the dumbphone data plan.

I think at this point it will be a matter of getting someone to join me on a sprint family plan to get the cost down, or getting the N1 for my AT&T account.

 

[laydros]

To be perfectly pedantic: No it isn't a separate radio.

Its all the same radio. In fact the N1 only has two radio modules, one the Broadcom 4329 (wifi and bluetooth). The second radio handles all flavors of Cellular data (plus GPS), it is a RTR6285 Transceiver by Qualcomm.

Datasheet here: http://www.datasheetarchive.com/pdf/Datasheet-024/DSA00418656.pdf

This SINGLE radio handles a boatload of bands, and frequencies.

But the frequencies, or RF interface, does not by itself define 3G.

Its HOW you use the frequencies, the radio protocol or "Air Interface", that determines if you get 3G or not.

So does this mean that on a hardware level the T-Mo N1 and AT&T N1 are the same phone, just something is different on the firmware or lower level?

Also, I know the N1 was supposed to go to Verizon and Sprint originally, would it have been the same hardware, just with the GSM parts of the radio turned off and CMDA parts turned on?

Obviously this type of thing is possible, as it was done with the BB 8800 (and probably others)

 

[maxiang]

To be perfectly pedantic: No it isn't a separate radio.

Its all the same radio. In fact the N1 only has two radio modules, one the Broadcom 4329 (wifi and bluetooth). The second radio handles all flavors of Cellular data (plus GPS), it is a RTR6285 Transceiver by Qualcomm.

Datasheet here: http://www.datasheetarchive.com/pdf/Datasheet-024/DSA00418656.pdf

This SINGLE radio handles a boatload of bands, and frequencies.

But the frequencies, or RF interface, does not by itself define 3G.

Its HOW you use the frequencies, the radio protocol or "Air Interface", that determines if you get 3G or not.

Its unknown just how far you can wander with this Phone. Just because Qualcomm built all of those capabilities into the radio does not mean that Google or HTC have the system set up to use them properly.

I've heard of that before I think. However, I was trying to point out that stock quad-band capabilities do not equal 3G capability. I've seen a few people confused who thought that the quad-band radio coverage, on say a euro Hero, meant they could use it on AT&T 3G.
Thanks for the info

 

[maxiang]

You are right on A. I did a little hunting this AM and I think Rogers, Bell, or Telus phones all operate on the same bands as AT&T for 3G, and it looks like there is a Milestone, G1, Magic, and maybe a hero up there, maybe the legend, and I think some Samsung phone. The hackablility of the G1 and Magic seems good, and I think the Magic has a little more RAM so it has a better chance of running 2.2 well.

I am aware of the AT&T data rate changes, and at this point I have unlimited with the iPhone, so I could be grandfathered in. However I looked and they do offer unlimited data on feature phones for just $15. If you get a smartphone you have to pay either the $15 for 200 or $25 for 2GB. I was wondering if I could get away with that plan, but between my own SIM swapping between my iPhone and the Backflip, and a recent podcast where this was mentioned with the N1, apparently AT&T can tell what phone the SIM is in, so I'm sure they wouldn't let the N1 run on the dumbphone data plan.

I think at this point it will be a matter of getting someone to join me on a sprint family plan to get the cost down, or getting the N1 for my AT&T account.

I pretty much came down to this:
1. Switch to Sprint and the EVO. (Sprint's OK hereabouts, but I love my simultaneous voice and data and do not want another contract)
2. Wait for AT&T to have a decent android. (Which is like watching Oprah. Sober )
3. Find a decent price for the N1.

I picked #3 and in between responses on this very thread, pulled the trigger Should be here next week

 

[icebike]

So does this mean that on a hardware level the T-Mo N1 and AT&T N1 are the same phone, just something is different on the firmware or lower level?

Not sure, because T-mo uses a different set of bands for the 3G portion than does AT&T but this single radio handles them all (except Umets 900Mhz, band 7).

However, somewhere I read that T-Mo may be just mis-using 900 Mhz GSM band as one of their UMTS bands.


T-Mo version: Supports three 3G/UMTS bands (900/AWS/2100 MHz) and four GSM radio frequencies (850/900/1800/1900 MHz) :Note: AWS=1700 MHZ

AT&T version: Supports three 3G/UMTS bands (850/1900/2100 MHz) and four GSM radio frequencies (850/900/1800/1900 MHz)

So Either phone will work on the any normal GSM network for 2G or 2.5G GSM.
But the 3G portion.

See UMTS frequency bands - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia for descriptions.

 

[Duvi]

I pretty much came down to this:
1. Switch to Sprint and the EVO. (Sprint's OK hereabouts, but I love my simultaneous voice and data and do not want another contract)
2. Wait for AT&T to have a decent android. (Which is like watching Oprah. Sober )
3. Find a decent price for the N1.

I picked #3 and in between responses on this very thread, pulled the trigger Should be here next week

Congrats... the more I think about it, I prefer the
N1 to the EVO. Yes, the EVO does have some
good hardware, but the form factor on the N1 is
huge for me. This is the first phone since the
iPhone I liked. I like it more than the iPhone as
well.

 

[maxiang]

Congrats... the more I think about it, I prefer the
N1 to the EVO. Yes, the EVO does have some
good hardware, but the form factor on the N1 is
huge for me. This is the first phone since the
iPhone I liked. I like it more than the iPhone as
well.

Thanks!
I actually like the EVO in hand (size reminds me of the Bold) but I decided to follow my own advise and pick my carrier first...or maybe it because I've been watching Blade Runner lately
Do you know any good threads for finding Berry app replacements?

 

[RayStinkle]

So does this mean that on a hardware level the T-Mo N1 and AT&T N1 are the same phone, just something is different on the firmware or lower level?

Also, I know the N1 was supposed to go to Verizon and Sprint originally, would it have been the same hardware, just with the GSM parts of the radio turned off and CMDA parts turned on?

Obviously this type of thing is possible, as it was done with the BB 8800 (and probably others)

Unfortunately they are not the same, they each have different hardware so It's not possible to just enable the other's 3g via a firmware update. Each version has physical hardware that only works with either 850/1900 mhz 3g, or 1700/2100. But both support the euro 2100 (which by the way is NOT the same as the t-mobile usa 2100, each has different frequency ranges).

 

[Duvi]

Thanks!
I actually like the EVO in hand (size reminds me of the Bold) but I decided to follow my own advise and pick my carrier first...or maybe it because I've been watching Blade Runner lately
Do you know any good threads for finding Berry app replacements?

http://forum.androidcentral.com/android-applications/5267-recommended-applications-games.html

or

http://forum.androidcentral.com/android-applications/522-your-top-5-android-applications.html