11-03-2019 06:32 AM
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  1. SupraLB's Avatar
    That's my opinion. Samsung has teased starting their own phone operating system several times, always to stay with Android. Samsung is the giant market leader in sales, over 20% each quarter worldwide. Apple usually 10-14%.

    If Google introduces a killer phone that crushes Samsung in hardware, Samsung would simply launch their own OS and kill off Android. Android would be left with LG and Motorola. Samsung would probably switch browsers too, further hurting Google.

    There is obviously some agreement between Google and Samsung, that the Pixels will stay a year or two behind Samsung in hardware, and simply compete with their camera software.

    Btw, I know Microsoft tried this and failed, but they didn't have brand loyalty, hardware infrastructure, production facilities, or experience to do it right, nor the existing market reach into every major retail store.
    10-18-2019 05:49 PM
  2. Lepa79's Avatar
    The 2 dominant OSs are now apple and Android. Anything else won't cut it. Not at this time. Samsung phones won't survive without Android OS. I would dump my Samsung in a hurt beat. No Android OS means no Google play store, means no apps. Nope wont work. Maybe the future is not all IOS or Android but the time is not now.
    10-18-2019 06:08 PM
  3. Almeuit's Avatar
    I don't think so. Launching an OS doesn't just instantly work. They would have to have the OS out, have devs who make actual apps, etc.

    If Samsung could easily do it as you think then why haven't they yet? Why continue to rely on Android and not just swap and be done?
    tekjunkie28 and Golurk like this.
    10-18-2019 06:50 PM
  4. SupraLB's Avatar
    I don't think so. Launching an OS doesn't just instantly work. They would have to have the OS out, have devs who make actual apps, etc.

    If Samsung could easily do it as you think then why haven't they yet? Why continue to rely on Android and not just swap and be done?
    They already have it developed, called Tizen. Used in their new smart watches and one phone. They haven't gone full board with it I believe because as mentioned, the apps part. But more importantly, Google hasn't challenged them significantly with the Pixel.
    10-18-2019 07:03 PM
  5. bhatech's Avatar
    I don’t think Samsung will be successful with tizen but I kind of agree that Google really might be making phones not to **** off the main android OEMs at least in terms of hardware. I buy lots of phones and have my 4 XL on my way and this is not trying to bash google.

    But I’m slowly coming around the theory that Google might purposefully not have the hardware specs competing with Samsung or other Android OEMs. After 4 generations of pixel there is no other way to explain with some of the decisions they make on hardware which is so easy to do given the price.
    10-18-2019 09:39 PM
  6. SupraLB's Avatar
    To illustrate how much power Samsung has over Google, look at how big of a user Samsung is for them. Its 44% of their phone software business. And they just lost their 2nd largest Huawei, which will no longer use Android going forward.

    If Samsung was to abandon Android, it would crush Google's phone business. They make a fortune off phone data collection and would lose a huge chunk.

    Also interesting tidbit, if Samsung went with their own operating system, their market share would be larger than Apple's, so the app developers would follow.

    Google is afraid of Samsung, which is why the Pixel 4 is lackluster.-android-market-share.jpg
    10-18-2019 10:53 PM
  7. bhatech's Avatar
    To illustrate how much power Samsung has over Google, look at how big of a user Samsung is for them. Its 44% of their phone software business. And they just lost their 2nd largest Huawei, which will no longer use Android going forward.

    If Samsung was to abandon Android, it would crush Google's phone business. They make a fortune off phone data collection and would lose a huge chunk.

    Also interesting tidbit, if Samsung went with their own operating system, their market share would be larger than Apple's, so the app developers would follow.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    I get what you are saying, google needs Samsung and at the same time Samsung needs google/android.

    Samsung may have tizen but still it’s a huge ask to get developers learn another platform and start developing apps. As a developer myself it’s not easy. What’s to say if Samsung leaves Android someone else may step up and start gaining marketshare that Samsung leaves. Samsung knows that risk as well.

    But I’m with you on may be google and Samsung had a chat few years back and google kind of assured Samsung that hardware wise they will not compete with them but instead compete with Apple. But the problem is if you want to compete with Apple you got to compete with Samsung as well.
    10-18-2019 11:06 PM
  8. dsignori's Avatar
    No way. Let’s see how many users buy phones with no Gmail app, no Google Maps, Google Docs, Google Photos, Nest app, Google Home, and lose all other Google apps, as well as the Google Play Store.

    No way this happens. Samsung would not risk this at all.
    10-18-2019 11:25 PM
  9. Laura Knotek's Avatar
    No way. Let’s see how many users buy phones with no Gmail app, no Google Maps, Google Docs, Google Photos, Nest app, Google Home, and lose all other Google apps, as well as the Google Play Store.

    No way this happens. Samsung would not risk this at all.
    I agree with you. I've had Android phones for over 4½ years, but I just got my first Samsung phone this week. I even used my Google Account as my Samsung Account. No Play Store = no Samsung phone for me.
    mustang7757 and ecr80 like this.
    10-18-2019 11:37 PM
  10. ezdoit's Avatar
    I agree with you. I've had Android phones for over 4½ years, but I just got my first Samsung phone this week. I even used my Google Account as my Samsung Account. No Play Store = no Samsung phone for me.
    You're not keeping the Samsung phone?
    Laura Knotek likes this.
    10-18-2019 11:41 PM
  11. Laura Knotek's Avatar
    You're not keeping the Samsung phone?
    I definitely am keeping my new S10+, since I love it. However, I wouldn't have bought it if it ran Tizen, rather than Android.
    mustang7757 likes this.
    10-18-2019 11:43 PM
  12. ezdoit's Avatar
    I definitely am keeping my new S10+, since I love it. However, I wouldn't have bought it if it ran Tizen, rather than Android.
    Got it.
    Laura Knotek and ecr80 like this.
    10-18-2019 11:47 PM
  13. SupraLB's Avatar
    No way. Let’s see how many users buy phones with no Gmail app, no Google Maps, Google Docs, Google Photos, Nest app, Google Home, and lose all other Google apps, as well as the Google Play Store.

    No way this happens. Samsung would not risk this at all.
    All those Google apps are on the Apple store for Apple phones. Gmail, maps, photos, chrome, youtube, etc, all of them. They would quickly be available to any operating system with Samsung's 33% market share worldwide
    Golurk likes this.
    10-19-2019 12:00 AM
  14. dsignori's Avatar
    All those Google apps are on the Apple store for Apple phones. Gmail, maps, photos, chrome, youtube, etc, all of them. They would quickly be available to any operating system with Samsung's 33% market share worldwide
    No. Samsung would not have anywhere near that % without Android the Google apps/ecosystem. I think you have it backwards.
    Laura Knotek and bhatech like this.
    10-19-2019 12:02 AM
  15. gebco's Avatar
    Microsoft tried
    BlackBerry tried

    Nuff said.
    10-19-2019 12:35 AM
  16. bembol's Avatar
    Like I said Google is just following Apple.

    android and iOS are the standard hence why others have failed.
    10-19-2019 06:30 AM
  17. alodar101's Avatar
    Sidebar:. When Microsoft introduced the DUO last week, it went with Android, rather than intro another OS. The reason, you heard Panos say it....APPS, it's all about the apps. Google is about apps and service. Keep that in mind. The only Samsung app î use is Samsung Pay. The rest are either Google or other.
    End Sidebar:
    ezdoit and EMGSM like this.
    10-19-2019 02:17 PM
  18. Mike Dee's Avatar
    That's my opinion. Samsung has teased starting their own phone operating system several times, always to stay with Android. Samsung is the giant market leader in sales, over 20% each quarter worldwide. Apple usually 10-14%.

    If Google introduces a killer phone that crushes Samsung in hardware, Samsung would simply launch their own OS and kill off Android. Android would be left with LG and Motorola. Samsung would probably switch browsers too, further hurting Google.

    There is obviously some agreement between Google and Samsung, that the Pixels will stay a year or two behind Samsung in hardware, and simply compete with their camera software.

    Btw, I know Microsoft tried this and failed, but they didn't have brand loyalty, hardware infrastructure, production facilities, or experience to do it right, nor the existing market reach into every major retail store.
    I'm not buying that theory. Regardless of how great a product Google puts out. If Google would improve their hardware, Samsung would just answer back with their own improvements. Google has to first catch up to Samsung in design and sales. It also would hard for Samsung to run with their own OS. IOS and Android are very entrenched and that would be a major risk on Samsung's part.
    10-19-2019 02:30 PM
  19. alodar101's Avatar
    I'm not buying that theory. Regardless of how great a product Google puts out. If Google would improve their hardware, Samsung would just answer back with their own improvements. Google has to first catch up to Samsung in design and sales. It also would hard for Samsung to run with their own OS. IOS and Android are very entrenched and that would be a major risk on Samsung's part.
    Amen on the risk part. I also read last week about Samsung quarterly earnings. They are in the red on phone, primarily because the offer high trade in value and they subsidize the hardware cost. They walk a fine edge here. I would not begrudge Google for holding to a different line. Another thing about design. Lots of people say.. Them seem to forget, the point, the Nexus design. A core device. No frills, no extras. A core experience device. I think the pixel is a more core experience device than it is a cutie market innovation device.... Just like the Nexus.

    That is why I buy it, but also why a lot of folks don't
    Apple2Droid likes this.
    10-19-2019 02:42 PM
  20. C5Longhorn's Avatar
    I don’t think Samsung will be successful with tizen but I kind of agree that Google really might be making phones not to **** off the main android OEMs at least in terms of hardware. I buy lots of phones and have my 4 XL on my way and this is not trying to bash google.

    But I’m slowly coming around the theory that Google might purposefully not have the hardware specs competing with Samsung or other Android OEMs. After 4 generations of pixel there is no other way to explain with some of the decisions they make on hardware which is so easy to do given the price.
    I agree with this completely. Google wants to keep services going and hardware is not the same priority.
    10-19-2019 05:34 PM
  21. imma_rage_quit's Avatar
    I personally HATE Samsung phones. I will never buy one again. They pack too much crap onto their phones that you can't remove and it only shows the dang thing down or drains the battery like crazy. TouchWiz is miserable. Seriously who needs 4 channel changer apps? If more people knew exactly what the Pixel and other almost vanilla Android devices were really all about (simplicity, speed, customization, NO BLOATWARE, etc.) they'd probably be more popular. Not to mention Samsung does a lot better job with their advertising. I guess 82 selfie apps that put bunny ears on you can only go so far...
    Apple2Droid likes this.
    10-19-2019 08:31 PM
  22. Golfdriver97's Avatar
    They already have it developed, called Tizen.
    While Tizen probably is theoretically a viable option for an OS, it's been official for 7 years. And only 5 phones have run it on Samsung devices. 5. If Samsung truly had the power that they did, they would have crippled Google about 5 years ago. I think they already knew then that launching an OS isn't as easy as it sounds. I recall hearing that Samsung was offering incentives for people to develop for the OS, and there weren't many takers.

    To illustrate how much power Samsung has over Google
    To quote a great Jedi Master: 'Size matters not.'
    Google and Samsung are in a symbiotic relationship. If Samsung were to walk away and try to go all in with Tizen, it would hurt both, and severely. Samsung probably a lot more than Google. Once people found out the app selection was minimal, they probably would be returning devices so fast Samsung's head would spin.

    All those Google apps are on the Apple store for Apple phones.
    Not really a fair comparison. Launching an app on iOS is a feasible option, as there is a solid user base for the OS itself. In Tizen's case, you would need to convince users to leave what is familiar to try something new and different. There is a user base who would do that; they are prolific on forums, like us. And even then, not everyone would be willing to do it.

    In general, the only company that has the ability to try and take on both Apple and Google for an OS would be Microsoft. They have the resources, both technical and capital to do it. If they could do it by creating their own OS and still being able to use Google Play Services, they might have a chance. However, they tried and failed....miserably.

    I am not saying that neither one will topple; it would just take a lot of things happening at the right time for it to all work out.
    mustang7757, Laura Knotek and qnet like this.
    10-19-2019 10:13 PM
  23. Mike Dee's Avatar
    I personally HATE Samsung phones. I will never buy one again. They pack too much crap onto their phones that you can't remove and it only shows the dang thing down or drains the battery like crazy. TouchWiz is miserable. Seriously who needs 4 channel changer apps? If more people knew exactly what the Pixel and other almost vanilla Android devices were really all about (simplicity, speed, customization, NO BLOATWARE, etc.) they'd probably be more popular. Not to mention Samsung does a lot better job with their advertising. I guess 82 selfie apps that put bunny ears on you can only go so far...
    When was the time you looked at a Samsung? TouchWiz is gone and not much bloatware. If something can't be removed it can be disabled and those apps don't take you a lot of room.
    Laura Knotek likes this.
    10-19-2019 10:33 PM
  24. mustang7757's Avatar
    While Tizen probably is theoretically a viable option for an OS, it's been official for 7 years. And only 5 phones have run it on Samsung devices. 5. If Samsung truly had the power that they did, they would have crippled Google about 5 years ago. I think they already knew then that launching an OS isn't as easy as it sounds. I recall hearing that Samsung was offering incentives for people to develop for the OS, and there weren't many takers.


    To quote a great Jedi Master: 'Size matters not.'
    Google and Samsung are in a symbiotic relationship. If Samsung were to walk away and try to go all in with Tizen, it would hurt both, and severely. Samsung probably a lot more than Google. Once people found out the app selection was minimal, they probably would be returning devices so fast Samsung's head would spin.

    Not really a fair comparison. Launching an app on iOS is a feasible option, as there is a solid user base for the OS itself. In Tizen's case, you would need to convince users to leave what is familiar to try something new and different. There is a user base who would do that; they are prolific on forums, like us. And even then, not everyone would be willing to do it.

    In general, the only company that has the ability to try and take on both Apple and Google for an OS would be Microsoft. They have the resources, both technical and capital to do it. If they could do it by creating their own OS and still being able to use Google Play Services, they might have a chance. However, they tried and failed....miserably.

    I am not saying that neither one will topple; it would just take a lot of things happening at the right time for it to all work out.
    Samsung tried with tizen failed , Microsoft tried with windows and failed... it will happen but not anytime soon, nothing last forever .
    Laura Knotek likes this.
    10-19-2019 10:33 PM
  25. imma_rage_quit's Avatar
    When was the time you looked at a Samsung? TouchWiz is gone and not much bloatware. If something can't be removed it can be disabled and those apps don't take you a lot of room.
    Long time. I've had Nexus/Pixel phones for years now. I honestly hate all the crap these companies do to Android. It just slows the phones down. As long as there's a Pixel I'll never go back and probably not even then. Samsung is trash IMO...
    Apple2Droid likes this.
    10-19-2019 10:51 PM
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