Too Much Negativity

[IceDree]

You guys have a really good & valid points
You are first people in a long time who actually have sense

 

[TuxDotKing]

I remember having this thread when the Nexus S came out. All I can say is haters gonna hate!

 

[kharrigan]

What the OP isn't seeing is this: Discrediting a viable alternative is a first step towards embracing a change.

iOS has the hearts and minds of the media. Upon the release of the 4S, the crowd was disappointed... but bought into it anyway. Upon the release of the GN and RAZR, there is now proof that that decision was unwise. The media can't be caught backing the wrong horse, right? Thus, the media comes to the rescue:

"The sky isn't falling! There's something wrong with those Androids! We'll find out for you."

Then out comes the negativity. All to save face and keep the status quo.

Unfortunately, the world has changed. The sky did fall and Apple's visionary is dead.

It is Android's turn to shine in the sun.

 

[digitalslacker]

I'd like to add that constructive conversation about the specs IS beneficial. It's interesting, gives us something to talk about while we wait and I know personally I have learned a lot in the last few days about bits of the hardware that I didn't know before.

And, yes, it's also very important to point out any shortcomings that the phone may have. Samsung and Google do want and need our feedback. My point is simply that we should be sure they ARE shortcomings first. Until we have the phones in our hands they are just specs on a piece of paper.

 

[s14tat]

The more I read about this thread, the more it upsets me. It upsets me for all the wrong reasons because I cannot understand how anyone can defend this phone when it could have been so much more. I constantly read links about how the Omap 4460 is better at certain things, but why da hell are they not using a mali400? That is still inexcusable. There is a reason why a lot of people are upset, and we are all upset about the same thing. We have never met in our life!! How can something so great upset so many strangers? Especially if its about the same damn thing?!? I will still check out this phone in person when it hits stores. If i'm blown away by it, I would buy it. If not I'll wait till Google decides to bring us a "real" phone with bleeding edge hardware from Samsung, not some off the shelf crap. What makes this phone any better than the Razr? They are almost identical hardware wise. I'll be damned if a motorola phone have the same performance potential as a phone with word Samsung on it.

Admit it, google cheaped out on the heart of this phone. My dream phone would be a epic 4g touch running ICS.

edit: I actually hope this phone becomes a flop for what they did with the hardware. It was a total slap to my face when I found out the specs. People were praying that there was 2 different hardware versions remember? I wonder why? This would hopefully have them not cut corners anymore when designing a phone... end rant.

 

[Eric Kane]

Its comments like these that prove my point about negativity. Not that the Mali is a bad gpu (its extremely proficient), but you've probably read everywhere that because it and the Exynos aren't being used that this phone will be slow and that the SGSII is better. Do you honestly believe that if the Exynos and Mali, both at Samsungs disposal, were better options, they wouldn't have used them? You're looking too much at the hardware and not enough at how optimization of the OS makes it better.

When the time comes when the Epic 4G Touch gets ICS and if you happen to have one, refer back to this post so when my Galaxy Nexus outperforms it you can remember how stupid what you posted above sounded.

 

[s14tat]

Its comments like these that prove my point about negativity. Not that the Mali is a bad gpu (its extremely proficient), but you've probably read everywhere that because it and the Exynos aren't being used that this phone will be slow and that the SGSII is better. Do you honestly believe that if the Exynos and Mali, both at Samsungs disposal, were better options, they wouldn't have used them? You're looking too much at the hardware and not enough at how optimization of the OS makes it better.

When the time comes when the Epic 4G Touch gets ICS and if you happen to have one, refer back to this post so when my Galaxy Nexus outperforms it you can remember how stupid what you posted above sounded.

I will have to hold you up to you. I may not be a programer, but do you really think that Google chose this combination because they honestly thought it was the best? I mean didn't they just acquire moto mobility? Don't moto's historically favor Ti processors? Isn't all the new moto phones coming out with omap processors? I'm not the one to wear tin foil hats here but I'm not going to believe everything until i see it for myself.

Google used the first gen snap dragon as a reference chip right? Its suppose to be so great, then how come it got smoked by every other 1ghz processor?

When this phone's official processor was announced, I don't think i've a read single person say " yay a omap 4460 with a over clocked sgx540!, this combo will be unbeatable" The reactions are more "meh" or "WTF!?!?"

But when the time comes and if they both went side by side and the galaxy nexus hardware proves to be superior I will eat my own words and buy that phone. Believe me that I will not be a early adopter, I will not be feed crap because it came from Google, that makes me no different than being a blind Apple fanboy. I will have to wait and see what happens down the road.

 

[Eric Kane]

Put it this way; if this combination of the OMAP 4460 and sgx540 running gingerbread went up against my Galaxy S2 (AT&T) with the exynos/mali, it wouldn't be a contest. The catalyst here is Android 4.0, but we can't put that on a spec sheet to prove hardware superiority. If you look at the SunSpider 9.1 and V8 benchmark tests on Google's site listing the ICS features and then match them against numbers on the same tests run for the iPhone 4S, the Nexus wins. By a lot.

Hardware isn't everything. Fall in love with Android; she won't break your heart.

 

[s14tat]

Put it this way; if this combination of the OMAP 4460 and sgx540 running gingerbread went up against my Galaxy S2 (AT&T) with the exynos/mali, it wouldn't be a contest. The catalyst here is Android 4.0, but we can't put that on a spec sheet to prove hardware superiority. If you look at the SunSpider 9.1 and V8 benchmark tests on Google's site listing the ICS features and then match them against numbers on the same tests run for the iPhone 4S, the Nexus wins. By a lot.

Hardware isn't everything. Fall in love with Android; she won't break your heart.

You must not be understanding me because I do not doubt the Galaxy Nexus on ICS would out perform the exynos GS 2 running gingerbread. But when we are running the same software, or the actual maximum that both of these hardware can get, I *feel* the mali gpu would win.

I'm a car guy so its like saying a Bugatti Veyron SS (hardware) is not a big deal because who can actually go 274mph? Well its good to know you can if the driver/road (software)is capable. You put that same driver on the same road with a Lamborghini Aventador and it will only do 217mph. Why restrict the hardware? This is why us original Galaxy S owners love our OG Galaxy S's because the stock software is horrendous but once you flash a rom, the hardware is a freaking beast. We always stand by the get the best hardware aval mantra because you can always improve software but you are stuck with hardware. Why limit yourself? Its all about the actual limit, sure its fast enough, but fast enough just seems like such a cop out don't you think?

 

[kharrigan]

Admit it, google cheaped out on the heart of this phone. My dream phone would be a epic 4g touch running ICS.

Hold on, playa!

If the Playstation 3 did anything, it was to remind companies that ALL consumer electronics need to MAKE MONEY FROM THE INITIAL LAUNCH. To achieve that end AND highlight all that ICS can be, Google and Samsung decided to back off on the GPU. Yes, it is disappointing that they aren't willing to take a financial loss to gain a leadership position. But frankly, what is more disappointing:

* A badass hardware-focused Nexus at $900 that FLOPS
* A hardware/software balanced Nexus that matches the price of the mid-tier 4S that COMPETES

I say the first case above is a TRUE disappointment.

 

[Eric Kane]

That's what I was saying. If we took the hardware of the Galaxy Nexus and took away ICS and had it run on Gingerbread, the SGSII would most likely smoke it. If we take the Galaxy Nexus and SGSII and have them both run ICS, the advantages the Galaxy S2 has in hardware wouldn't be enough as the Nexus will reap the benefits of being optimized for ICS. The greatest thing about the Nexus is that Android 4.0 and it are in perfect harmony.

When the Galaxy Nexus comes out, go see it and you'll understand what I'm talking about.

 

[s14tat]

kharrigan you have a point there but your forgetting one key factor. The Galaxy S2 on sprint is only $500 off contract and the hardware is already aval. So its not like they were taking huge risk in investments with some crazy R & D. Infact I think the route with the super amoled HD probably cost more to develop than the exynos did.

Basically the phone could have been better using already existing components that probrably would not make too much of a price difference to the manufacturer since the off contract price is already only$499.99. I'm sure the galaxy nexus would cost more for whatever the reason may be.

and ericsckane, you can believe that hardware optimization all you want based on the omap being used as a reference chip, but the og snapdragon got the biggest boost in performance when going to froyo via JIT. Sure it really did get a big boost that the hummingbird and the omap didn't get, but guess what? In the end it still could not perform like them because the hardware it was at its limit.

I have my made my points based on my observations of past hardware and software boosts. I am a very very objective person, I would be lying if I said I was not interested in this phone. I will definitely keep a close eye on it but I will not flock to this thing on at launch. I will decide once I see how the exynos respond to ICS after its been ported over.

 

[Droid800]

kharrigan you have a point there but your forgetting once key factor. The Galaxy S2 on sprint is only $500 off contract and the hardware is already aval. So its not like they were taking huge risk in investments with some crazy R & D. Infact I think the route with the supra amoled HD probably cost more to develop than the exynos did.

Basically the phone could have been better using already existing components that probrably would not make too much of a price difference to the manufacturer since the off contract price is already only$499.99. I'm sure the galaxy nexus would cost more for whatever the reason may be.

and ericsckane, you can believe that hardware optimization all you want based on the omap being used as a reference chip, but the og snapdragon got the biggest boost in performance when going to froyo vis just in time compiler. Sure it really did get a big boost that the hummingbird and the omap didn't get, but guess what? In the end it still could not perform like them because the hardware it was at its limit.

Exynos is not compatible with LTE. That, right there, is the reason why it uses OMAP. (well, that and the fact that Exynos is a PROPRIETARY processor, and Nexus is supposed to be a hardware blueprint for other manufacturers, not a showcase for parts other OEMs can't get their hands on)

With the OMAP, the only possibility is the SGX540. It is PART of the SoC. There is NO other option. And honestly, there are very few GPUs out there better than the 540 that would be readily available. (the 543 is constrained by Apple's needs, and the Mali is out of the question because Ti does not use anything other than Imagination GPUs in their chips)

So you tell me this: other than OMAP, what easily accessible chip should they have used? What chip/GPU combo could match the performance of the 4460 and 540?

(here's a hint: there isn't one. Google chose this combination for a reason.)

 

[Eric Kane]

And Droid800 beat me to my next post. Only thing I was going to add was IVA 3 for HD video that makes the TI OMAP 4460 an appealing choice.

 

[s14tat]

Doh, how could I have forgotten about the Exynos not working with LTE. That is too big of a short coming to ignore.

 

[Eric Kane]

Now if only we could hijack CNET and Engadget and help to educate their brainwashed readers. I'd love to see the sales figures from all carriers if everyone knew what these phones could do rather than suffering from "If you don't have an iPhone, you don't have an iPhone" syndrome.

 

[JkdJedi]

That's what I was saying. If we took the hardware of the Galaxy Nexus and took away ICS and had it run on Gingerbread, the SGSII would most likely smoke it. If we take the Galaxy Nexus and SGSII and have them both run ICS, the advantages the Galaxy S2 has in hardware wouldn't be enough as the Nexus will reap the benefits of being optimized for ICS. The greatest thing about the Nexus is that Android 4.0 and it are in perfect harmony.

When the Galaxy Nexus comes out, go see it and you'll understand what I'm talking about.

Sounds like the iPhone in a way.

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk

 

[Droid800]

Doh, how could I have forgotten about the Exynos not working with LTE. That is too big of a short coming to ignore.

Let's put it this way: If Exynos had the ability to work with LTE, and Samsung could commit to making it available to other manufacturers, I'm sure Google would have chosen that chipset over OMAP. As it stands, however, the OMAP was the very best choice and will still be a beast of a processor.

 

[anon(512898)]

Let's put it this way: If Exynos had the ability to work with LTE, and Samsung could commit to making it available to other manufacturers, I'm sure Google would have chosen that chipset over OMAP. As it stands, however, the OMAP was the very best choice and will still be a beast of a processor.

I am not so sure about that, if google wants this device to do what the nexus one did for android they probably would have still chosen an off the shelf component.

 

[cdf3]

A great post and my thoughts exactly. Haters come out at the release of every device. It's inevitable to hear complaints about how it's not using components that aren't even going to be released until 2012.

I agree. Haters do tend to come out at the beginning of every device that's released. Phone or Tablet. Doesn't matter.
After the device has been out a while, the Trolls go back under their bridge, then you can actually see the real user experience posts without all of the hater posts taking up space.
I tend to think the haters are those that want the device, but can't get it because they're locked into a contract and unable to upgrade at the time.
So they tend to bash the product, hoping others will do the same, thus making them not feel as bad about not having that device.

Sent from my GT-P7510 using Tapatalk