08-27-2013 10:01 PM
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  1. Kevin OQuinn's Avatar
    I have no problem with the specs. I have a problem with the pricing. I don't care how fast you tell me this phone is, the fact is it is using lower priced internals and charging the same price as the s4 and One. At nexus 4 build levels, we expect nexus 4 pricing. You shouldn't be defending an attempt to over charge customers by Google.

    Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2
    If you look at the order of posts chronologically, you will see that he misinterpreted my definition of value and we then began a debate about the cost of parts. I did debate on that, however, that had nothing to do with my original, and currently standing opinion. If iFixit finds it costs $400,000 to make one Moto X, nothing will change about my opinion, but the post in which I debated him saying it was overpriced also because of part cost will be incorrect. I still will not pay 199 for this phone, or the 600 off contract which is how I buy a phone. 450? I'm there. Also, it wasn't a thinly veiled attack, I straight up called you out on your lack of professionalism on these boards. Have a good night Kevin.
    Chronologically, your first post in this thread specifically mentions "the fact that it is using lower priced internals". You provided no links to substantiate your claims, yet you state this as a fact. You then asked for proof of the BOM from someone else that doesn't share your opinion. Which is the point where I entered the debate about BOM (after many other posts about other things). Thus, the crux of the discussion we're having right now isn't about the validity of your opinion (it's completely valid), but the way you're presenting your side of the discussion.

    Basically, you can't have it both ways.
    08-02-2013 10:21 PM
  2. Premium1's Avatar
    Remember, everyone doesn't want a high-end phone. To those folks the X may appeal.

    Not rooted, Stock rom, just Awesome (NSA)
    If they don't want a high end phone then they won't pay $199 on contract. This isn't even marketed toward regular consumers with that price. I mean when they walk into a store and see the s4's and htc ones with their 1080p screens and quad core processors they are going to say why is this priced the same as these when clearly it has lesser specs. Like what is going to "sell" the x? voice actions? Doubtful, the only thing I could see selling it is maybe its smaller size...
    Roundpotato likes this.
    08-02-2013 10:22 PM
  3. blazin247's Avatar
    Chronologically, your first post in this thread specifically mentions "the fact that it is using lower priced internals". You provided no links to substantiate your claims, yet you state this as a fact. You then asked for proof of the BOM from someone else that doesn't share your opinion. Which is the point where I entered the debate about BOM (after many other posts about other things). Thus, the crux of the discussion we're having right now isn't about the validity of your opinion (it's completely valid), but the way you're presenting your side of the discussion.

    Basically, you can't have it both ways.
    You're right. I was active in a few threads and I did bring up lower priced internals in this thread. I should have just said that the components don't justify the premium price to me and left it at that, which is the crux of my argument. Last reply in this ordeal, take care.

    Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2
    08-02-2013 10:47 PM
  4. OTACORB's Avatar
    This is what happens when they (Google) always gives there **** away. Now they try to price a phone accordingly, suddenly it's just too expense. Yet Apple always does it and with 32 million iPhones sold last quarter, clearly Google wants a piece of the pie. Only problem they don't have Apple pie! LOL


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
    08-02-2013 10:54 PM
  5. dkhmwilliams's Avatar
    Do you believe these companies like Google and Motorola don't know what they are doing? I think they do. I'm not saying that I think you are wrong in your assessment of the device. In saying that consumers are going to eat this up because it appeals to mainstream. Different colors, gimmicks, made in America campaign; people are going to be drawn to this product and Google knows it. Just wait until the commercials come out and they become available on every carrier. They are going to fly off the shelves. That's what it's about. Not the specs, or even how it compares to other devices at the same price point. It's going to be about what the masses want and this is exactly what most consumers are going to want. Apple hang really produced a device that was superior in the specs department since the 3GS. But people have bought iPhone in droves. Why? Because they make products that the masses want. And they charge a premium for them.

    Sent from my Nexus 7
    08-02-2013 11:07 PM
  6. JHBThree's Avatar
    No, they can always introduce a REAL phone. This is what $12 Billion dollars bought Google, it certainly wasn't the patents since they suck wind in court rulings. I wanted a high end phone something to get other OEM's off their butts but not this joke. I could have lived with 720p but not the old processor, or the lack of storage, no F'in way.
    Its not an old processor.

    In case you missed it as well, the new Nexus 7 uses what is called an S4 Pro, but in fact uses the newer Krait core designs. We have no idea if that's the case here, but it is certainly a possibility. Given the fact that some benchmarks are putting the S4 pro in the X at the same level as the S4 pro QUAD CORE from last year, its very likely its the same case as the Nexus 7.



    Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 4 Beta
    08-03-2013 12:40 AM
  7. Premium1's Avatar
    Do you believe these companies like Google and Motorola don't know what they are doing? I think they do. I'm not saying that I think you are wrong in your assessment of the device. In saying that consumers are going to eat this up because it appeals to mainstream. Different colors, gimmicks, made in America campaign; people are going to be drawn to this product and Google knows it. Just wait until the commercials come out and they become available on every carrier. They are going to fly off the shelves. That's what it's about. Not the specs, or even how it compares to other devices at the same price point. It's going to be about what the masses want and this is exactly what most consumers are going to want. Apple hang really produced a device that was superior in the specs department since the 3GS. But people have bought iPhone in droves. Why? Because they make products that the masses want. And they charge a premium for them.

    Sent from my Nexus 7
    Except unless you're on att they wont get that customization for who knows how long. Not to mention normal consumers buy a phone that day they aren't going to wait weeks/months for something they will most likely put a case on anyway
    08-03-2013 11:11 AM
  8. KWKSLVR's Avatar
    Its not an old processor.

    In case you missed it as well, the new Nexus 7 uses what is called an S4 Pro, but in fact uses the newer Krait core designs. We have no idea if that's the case here, but it is certainly a possibility. Given the fact that some benchmarks are putting the S4 pro in the X at the same level as the S4 pro QUAD CORE from last year, its very likely its the same case as the Nexus 7.



    Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 4 Beta
    Exactly!

    This entire argument is stupid. Buying devices because of a spec sheet is stupid. Some people must brand, "My Smartphone has a QuadCore XXX" on their belt buckles or something. People can say that "specs don't matter is an Apple argument" all they want, but at the end of the day it's freaking valid. Go buy an S4 and brag about a spec sheet and pretend like the lag doesn't matter because of that spec sheet. It's retarded. Give me the device with the best experience.

    Why have a phone with Quad Cores when Android isn't optimized for them (or freaking apps either for that matter)? What's the point? Why suffer with battery life for what is essentially a featureless feature? Someone logically explain that to me.
    Aquila likes this.
    08-03-2013 11:49 AM
  9. JungleLarry's Avatar
    http://www.youtube.com/v/3ZX8graseUQ&hl=en_US&fs=1&

    One can skip to the end to see the difference in marketing value proposition to mainstream consumers versus spec sheet geeks.
    Hadn't seen this yet. Thanks for posting.
    08-03-2013 12:02 PM
  10. JungleLarry's Avatar
    If they don't want a high end phone then they won't pay $199 on contract. This isn't even marketed toward regular consumers with that price. I mean when they walk into a store and see the s4's and htc ones with their 1080p screens and quad core processors they are going to say why is this priced the same as these when clearly it has lesser specs. Like what is going to "sell" the x? voice actions? Doubtful, the only thing I could see selling it is maybe its smaller size...
    I'm guessing if they're in the store they're going to be actually using the phone to see how it compares to the others you mentioned....

    ...which is far more than you can say.
    08-03-2013 12:04 PM
  11. Premium1's Avatar
    I'm guessing if they're in the store they're going to be actually using the phone to see how it compares to the others you mentioned....

    ...which is far more than you can say.
    you would be surprised what you see in the stores.
    08-03-2013 12:08 PM
  12. JungleLarry's Avatar
    you would be surprised what you see in the stores.
    Nothing surprises me anymore, unfortunately -- not even the responses in this thread.

    Let's look at this from another lens. Say you want to buy a really fast car. You get your options narrowed down to Ferrari, Lamborghini, and McLaren. Looking at the prices and the spec sheets, you just can't figure out why they're valued so differently and you go to a test drive thinking you're going to buy the one with the most horsepoooooooooower. Seems sensible, right? More power = more fast.

    Well, you get there and quickly realize that this isn't the case. Around a track other things start to contribute to how quick a car is perceived and the time it can put down. Much to your surprise, the car with the worst "specs" is actually faster around a track than the one with the most horsepooooooooooower; the one you, in your infinite wisdom, picked to the be the fastest based on numbers. Things like handling, suspension design, weight distribution, throttle response, brakes, on-board computing, etc. seem to contribute far more to the overall speed than you had originally estimated. Moreover, the car with the most horsepower might have the worst driver's seat, which would seriously put a damper on your driving experience, yes?

    There are those of us who live in the real world and put stock in practical value, and there are those of you that geek out over spec sheets because talking about gigacore processors makes you happy. That's fine. But if a company can squeeze more out of less -- make a phone that people will use and enjoy without having their brains numbed by spec sheet data -- then what in the world are you complaining about? Don't like it? Don't buy it.

    Until you folks can pick up this phone, test it, and comparatively show that the Moto X is slower than its high-spec'd competitors in real world tests, all that's currently being spouted is ignorance and speculation akin to the hype that was generated before it was even announced.

    I have used both the GS4 and HTC One extensively. I've given them both as gifts and I think they're wonderful devices. I am still excited for the Moto X and I'm trying to approach it with an open mind; all I care about is what the phone actually does...in the real world...not on a spec sheet.

    Phone specs, like horsepooooooooooower, are just numbers. Get over it.
    08-03-2013 12:40 PM
  13. NoYankees44's Avatar
    Lets also remember that this is the first smartphone made in the US. The cost to produce ANY PRODUCT in the united states much outweighs the cost to produce OCONUS. This will obviously be reflected in the retail price of the device.
    This is true, but in no way a pass. If they cannot produce the product for the right price, that's not my problem. I will buy from a company that can.

    Sent from my SCH-I535
    08-03-2013 12:49 PM
  14. Farish's Avatar
    This is true, but in no way a pass. If they cannot produce the product for the right price, that's not my problem. I will buy from a company that can.

    Sent from my SCH-I535
    But your statement is only correct if the majority of people believe that the Moto X is overpriced at 199. We will find out in about 3 months time if that is really the case.
    08-03-2013 12:55 PM
  15. Jennifer Stough's Avatar
    Google would be expected to swallow the cost of CONUS production, and cost of parts in order for it to be the price many of you want. While it's a nice concept, it isn't a realistic one.
    This is true, but in no way a pass. If they cannot produce the product for the right price, that's not my problem. I will buy from a company that can.

    Sent from my SCH-I535
    08-03-2013 01:00 PM
  16. benhmadison's Avatar
    But you're getting technology that's far more cutting edge than what's being used on the phone in your signature. Nobody knows how this will work out for Moto, it may fail, it may even catch fire in a week, but it's something far more advanced than anyone else has done so far.
    As far as the processor goes it seems like you may be right. The new screen notifications and such seem innovative. Although I am on AT&T and could get the 32gig version, many people are not on AT&T and therefore are stuck with a 16 gb version. Couple that with a downgrade in display quality from what we have grown accustom to on high end devices and it just seems there are better choices available. Again it looks like a great device, but definitely not something I would trade a S4 or a ONE for.
    08-03-2013 04:55 PM
  17. Premium1's Avatar
    Nothing surprises me anymore, unfortunately -- not even the responses in this thread.

    Let's look at this from another lens. Say you want to buy a really fast car. You get your options narrowed down to Ferrari, Lamborghini, and McLaren. Looking at the prices and the spec sheets, you just can't figure out why they're valued so differently and you go to a test drive thinking you're going to buy the one with the most horsepoooooooooower. Seems sensible, right? More power = more fast.

    Well, you get there and quickly realize that this isn't the case. Around a track other things start to contribute to how quick a car is perceived and the time it can put down. Much to your surprise, the car with the worst "specs" is actually faster around a track than the one with the most horsepooooooooooower; the one you, in your infinite wisdom, picked to the be the fastest based on numbers. Things like handling, suspension design, weight distribution, throttle response, brakes, on-board computing, etc. seem to contribute far more to the overall speed than you had originally estimated. Moreover, the car with the most horsepower might have the worst driver's seat, which would seriously put a damper on your driving experience, yes?

    There are those of us who live in the real world and put stock in practical value, and there are those of you that geek out over spec sheets because talking about gigacore processors makes you happy. That's fine. But if a company can squeeze more out of less -- make a phone that people will use and enjoy without having their brains numbed by spec sheet data -- then what in the world are you complaining about? Don't like it? Don't buy it.

    Until you folks can pick up this phone, test it, and comparatively show that the Moto X is slower than its high-spec'd competitors in real world tests, all that's currently being spouted is ignorance and speculation akin to the hype that was generated before it was even announced.

    I have used both the GS4 and HTC One extensively. I've given them both as gifts and I think they're wonderful devices. I am still excited for the Moto X and I'm trying to approach it with an open mind; all I care about is what the phone actually does...in the real world...not on a spec sheet.

    Phone specs, like horsepooooooooooower, are just numbers. Get over it.
    I got over it and won't be buying because for full retail which I need for unlimited data its not worth it IMO. But thanks for telling me what I should buy with MY money. Plus most people don't "try" out a phone before they buy it regardless of what you think. I know people who work in cellular stores so think I have a solid understanding and first hand experiencing from being in stores and seeing what people actually do when buying a phone.
    08-03-2013 05:40 PM
  18. Farish's Avatar
    As far as the processor goes it seems like you may be right. The new screen notifications and such seem innovative. Although I am on AT&T and could get the 32gig version, many people are not on AT&T and therefore are stuck with a 16 gb version. Couple that with a downgrade in display quality from what we have grown accustom to on high end devices and it just seems there are better choices available. Again it looks like a great device, but definitely not something I would trade a S4 or a ONE for.
    1 out of 3 are on ATT, 1 out of the other 3 is on Verizon. The other 1 gets divided by everybody else.

    Scary but true.
    08-03-2013 05:42 PM
  19. Speedygi's Avatar
    I actually liked that they did not emphasize on the specs and they went with the experience changing route. You can literally see how sublime the Moto X is as a phone to hold and use. They , like Blackberry and Apple, knows that the specs only matter to a certain point and even if you have ****ty software anyways, all the highest end specs aren't going to mean jack.

    Also, I think this helps drive the prices down so that more consumers can afford them. We have seen so many times how Samsung has priced their highest end phones, and while that is in accordance to the demand they have, that does not cater to the crowd more willing to pay lower.

    With that, it could be a really good midrange phone that will sell a lot.

    Sent from my Nexus 7 using AC Forums mobile app
    08-03-2013 09:30 PM
  20. JungleLarry's Avatar
    I got over it and won't be buying because for full retail which I need for unlimited data its not worth it IMO. But thanks for telling me what I should buy with MY money. Plus most people don't "try" out a phone before they buy it regardless of what you think. I know people who work in cellular stores so think I have a solid understanding and first hand experiencing from being in stores and seeing what people actually do when buying a phone.
    The extent of my financial advice was, in summary, to not buy something you don't like. If you find that disagreeable in some way, then please, by all means, do the exact opposite.

    I also know people who have worked in cellular stores, but unlike you I don't seem to have mastered the technique of developing expertise via social osmosis. One day....one day.
    08-03-2013 10:17 PM
  21. anon(27512)'s Avatar
    I wonder if there's a way to disable the "Post New Thread" button in this forum. I come here for information and this is the trash I have to sift through.

    Seems to me all the complaints about the Moto X are that it isn't the Samsung Galaxy S4...or the HTC One...or whatever. Guess what, kids? There's already a phone like the GS4. It's called the GS4. There's even a phone just like the HTC One. It's called the HTC One. And get this kicker....they're both available for purchase!

    Not sure what all the whining is about. You sound like Motorola ran over your dog and owes you something. Last I checked, they don't. They simply made a phone they thought would sell (and it will). Just because it doesn't fit your needs doesn't mean it's not an attractive alternative to someone else.

    And that's the key word for today -- "alternative." There's plenty of them on the market right now, blessed be thy Android.

    Now shaddap already.
    ^that.
    08-04-2013 07:06 AM
  22. SteelGator's Avatar
    Nothing surprises me anymore, unfortunately -- not even the responses in this thread.

    Let's look at this from another lens. Say you want to buy a really fast car. You get your options narrowed down to Ferrari, Lamborghini, and McLaren. Looking at the prices and the spec sheets, you just can't figure out why they're valued so differently and you go to a test drive thinking you're going to buy the one with the most horsepoooooooooower. Seems sensible, right? More power = more fast.

    Well, you get there and quickly realize that this isn't the case. Around a track other things start to contribute to how quick a car is perceived and the time it can put down. Much to your surprise, the car with the worst "specs" is actually faster around a track than the one with the most horsepooooooooooower; the one you, in your infinite wisdom, picked to the be the fastest based on numbers. Things like handling, suspension design, weight distribution, throttle response, brakes, on-board computing, etc. seem to contribute far more to the overall speed than you had originally estimated. Moreover, the car with the most horsepower might have the worst driver's seat, which would seriously put a damper on your driving experience, yes?

    There are those of us who live in the real world and put stock in practical value, and there are those of you that geek out over spec sheets because talking about gigacore processors makes you happy. That's fine. But if a company can squeeze more out of less -- make a phone that people will use and enjoy without having their brains numbed by spec sheet data -- then what in the world are you complaining about? Don't like it? Don't buy it.

    Until you folks can pick up this phone, test it, and comparatively show that the Moto X is slower than its high-spec'd competitors in real world tests, all that's currently being spouted is ignorance and speculation akin to the hype that was generated before it was even announced.

    I have used both the GS4 and HTC One extensively. I've given them both as gifts and I think they're wonderful devices. I am still excited for the Moto X and I'm trying to approach it with an open mind; all I care about is what the phone actually does...in the real world...not on a spec sheet.

    Phone specs, like horsepooooooooooower, are just numbers. Get over it.
    I love this analogy. You can take it one step further and be pissed they are not selling them as cheaply as a Corvette, because the Vette is really just as fast.
    08-04-2013 09:28 AM
  23. STARGATE's Avatar
    I love this analogy. You can take it one step further and be pissed they are not selling them as cheaply as a Corvette, because the Vette is really just as fast.
    Lol
    You dare compare a Vette to some of the best of the best from Italy and England! Are you out of your mind!

    Sent From a Galaxy S4 Away!
    SteelGator likes this.
    08-04-2013 09:45 AM
  24. Puzzlegal's Avatar
    I sold phones for a year. Not once did anyone ever come in and say "I want the phone that has the Snapdragon xxxx and 2gb of RAM. Make sure it's the one that's clocked the highest." Not once. Ever.

    They came in and either 1) didn't know what they wanted 2) wanted the Galaxy 3) wanted the iPhone. That covers 90% of the people that walked in to the store. The other 10% were flip and feature phone users (yeah, they still exist). They wanted the Galaxy and the iPhone because they saw it on tv. Marketing. It's all marketing.

    "People shopping for $200+ phones are shopping specs." No they aren't. I think I'm qualified to say that I know a LOT about the smartphone world. I've been on three sides of it. Regular consumer (non-techie and techie), salesperson (for AT&T), and now, the tech news side.
    I think you are right.

    I'm not going to buy this phone. The only reason I am shopping for a new phone is that Motorola screwed over Photon owners and locked us out of updated beyond Gingerbread. So there's no way I'm going to reward them for that by buying a new Motorola. Also, I don't really trust them re unlocking stuff and upgrading stuff, what with the (incredibly deceitful, as well as unpleasant) way they treated Photon owners.

    BUT, that being said, this phone looks like a decent choice if you don't mind buying from Motorola.

    The specs on most mid-range phones are plenty good enough for most users. The issues people have are battery life, signal strength, and some convenience/confusion/usability issues. This phone seems to have taken a serious look at improving battery life, Moto's generally have good radios, and Moto also seems to have thought carefully about how people use phones, and what gimmicks would actually be helpful. And hey, people who have seen it say that screen looks good and the camera takes nice photos. Those are other features people care about.

    And I think the customized back thing will be very popular. Everyone likes their stuff to be "theirs", and people care about color and texture. You look at the case every day. (Well, I don't use a protective cover, and most of the phones I see on the train are naked, too. If you always hide your phone in an otterbox, that feature won't matter to you. So, popular among lots of prospective customers, not all.)
    08-04-2013 10:46 AM
  25. STARGATE's Avatar
    I'm not going to buy this phone. The only reason I am shopping for a new phone is that Motorola screwed over Photon owners and locked us out of updated beyond Gingerbread. So there's no way I'm going to reward them for that by buying a new Motorola. Also, I don't really trust them re unlocking stuff and upgrading stuff, what with the (incredibly deceitful, as well as unpleasant) way they treated Photon owners.
    That's exactly why I didn't wait to see what Moto brought to the table! I was told and promised by them that my Photon was getting ICS and at the last moment...:banghead::banghead:

    Motorola will not see more money from me!

    Like I have said before; they can go to hell for all I care!

    Sent From a Galaxy S4 Away!
    08-07-2013 08:39 AM
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