08-03-2013 10:41 PM
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  1. Clocks's Avatar
    Just no. The camera app and way it's activated is completely different. Similar? Maybe.

    And no Samsung phone has the voice control and recognition capabilities that the X does. Neither do HTC's, for that matter. I'm not singling out any one manufacturer here. Moto is trying to change the way you interact with your phone by including and developing some truly innovative things. What other phone has a dedicated co-processor for voice and contextual input recognition? I'll wait for your answer before continuing....
    Obviously my opinion, but the voice control on the x is about as valuable as windows 8 being touch-centric on the desktop. I've never seen anyone talk to a siri, use s-voice, or execute a voice search on a phone (or desktop, you can do vocie searches on google.com if you haven't noticed). Ever. Except to try to show off by repeating an apple commercial, it doesn't quite work right. And I've never seen anyone want to touch their laptop screen.

    Will it sell phones? Maybe, probably. Does adding two cores to a GS3 to handle this gimmick and to turn on car mode when you're riding the bus justify the top tier price?

    The X would be in my decision set if I was in the market for a new subsidized phone. But it would definitely be at a disadvantage. Gimmicks on mid tier hardware vs. gimmicks on top tier hardware.
    Roundpotato likes this.
    08-02-2013 11:19 AM
  2. Kevin OQuinn's Avatar
    Obviously my opinion, but the voice control on the x is about as valuable as windows 8 being touch-centric on the desktop. I've never seen anyone talk to a siri, use s-voice, or execute a voice search on a phone (or desktop, you can do vocie searches on google.com if you haven't noticed). Ever. Except to try to show off by repeating an apple commercial, it doesn't quite work right. And I've never seen anyone want to touch their laptop screen.

    Will it sell phones? Maybe, probably. Does adding two cores to a GS3 to handle this gimmick and to turn on car mode when you're riding the bus justify the top tier price?

    The X would be in my decision set if I was in the market for a new subsidized phone. But it would definitely be at a disadvantage. Gimmicks on mid tier hardware vs. gimmicks on top tier hardware.
    Are you one for benchmarks? If so, I would take a look at this. Huge grain of salt, but yeah. Pay attention to the on-screen comparison between the X and Nexus 4. Off-screen is as apples-to-apples as you can get. If you don't put stock in benchmarks, then I applaud you. But quad vs dual-core is a moot point now, since the extra horsepower is rarely taken advantage of.

    I use voice search on Google Now all the time, and I know a few non-techie people that do too. No, not on my laptop or desktop, but on my phone, yes. It's just easier, and it gets it right FAR more often than not.

    I'm going to single out your comparison to the GS3 because, well, it's misplaced. The Krait 300 cores are faster and more efficient than the Krait 200 cores in the S3. The GPU is far superior, also. The display isn't a standard RGB layout, but neither is it Pentile. The camera, beyond the mostly meaningless MP number, actually has some tech in it that should help with low-light performance.

    You can't accurately compare the internals of the X to anything else, because nothing else has the two independent co processors to off load the voice recognition and contextual input processing. We have no baseline for how much this will help battery life or performance in other tasks.
    ultravisitor and Aquila like this.
    08-02-2013 11:29 AM
  3. Scott Kenyon's Avatar
    I use voice input with Google Now daily as well. This is extremely useful in my life both at home and at work. If I could do that without touching the phone, it would be a bonus.
    VDub2174 likes this.
    08-02-2013 11:40 AM
  4. NoNexus's Avatar
    You have to realize the irony and hypocrisy of your statement... I mean look at your signature....
    Just no. The camera app and way it's activated is completely different. Similar? Maybe.

    And no Samsung phone has the voice control and recognition capabilities that the X does. Neither do HTC's, for that matter. I'm not singling out any one manufacturer here. Moto is trying to change the way you interact with your phone by including and developing some truly innovative things. What other phone has a dedicated co-processor for voice and contextual input recognition? I'll wait for your answer before continuing....
    I will bite the bullet no problem on the gestures. I haven't seen/read enough about it to quite fully understand them, hence my qualifying my initial post.

    The camera thing though, Samsung does it better and it is the same thing. Put your finger on the screen and turn the phone VS twisting your wrist back and forth.
    Roundpotato likes this.
    08-02-2013 11:43 AM
  5. msndrstood's Avatar
    How about everyone calm down until an actual physical phone is available for touchy feely?

    Everything else is speculation.

    Everyone is arguing over specs and such for what? It may be a moot point since it might be the most fantastic mobile device ever invented by a human!

    Just wait for the phone to physically appear in the stores and go play with it. I have not heard one word on the supposed 24 hour battery life, not even from Phil who has one but hasn't had it long enough to comment on battery life.

    I know we love to speculate on every aspect of new devices, but can't we wait to argue about them until they are actually in our hands.

    Sheesh.

    Sent via Note II
    08-02-2013 11:47 AM
  6. Kevin OQuinn's Avatar
    I will bite the bullet no problem on the gestures. I haven't seen/read enough about it to quite fully understand them, hence my qualifying my initial post.

    The camera thing though, Samsung does it better and it is the same thing. Put your finger on the screen and turn the phone VS twisting your wrist back and forth.
    Phil said it was "like turning a door knob" which implies you don't have to do it back and forth. Like anything, probably something you master after doing it a few times. Also, no finger on the screen. If you're referring to his G+ post, and the pic that accompanied it, that's one of those auto-awesome things.

    So yes, similar. I will say that the camera app itself looks much nice on the S4, though.
    08-02-2013 11:54 AM
  7. NoNexus's Avatar
    ok if it just one single gesture then it is a dead heat as far as the motion goes. The auto-awesome got me like it did to others in the comments section of that posting

    You like the app better on the S4 than the X? Why?
    08-02-2013 12:43 PM
  8. Kevin OQuinn's Avatar
    ok if it just one single gesture then it is a dead heat as far as the motion goes. The auto-awesome got me like it did to others in the comments section of that posting

    You like the app better on the S4 than the X? Why?
    I haven't used the X, so there's that. In practice I might like it more, but appearances are that the S4 camera app is more full featured while being just as intuitive. A lot of bad things have been said about the S4, but not a single one of them has been about the camera app.
    08-02-2013 12:46 PM
  9. anon5664829's Avatar
    Just no. The camera app and way it's activated is completely different. Similar? Maybe.

    And no Samsung phone has the voice control and recognition capabilities that the X does. Neither do HTC's, for that matter. I'm not singling out any one manufacturer here. Moto is trying to change the way you interact with your phone by including and developing some truly innovative things. What other phone has a dedicated co-processor for voice and contextual input recognition? I'll wait for your answer before continuing....
    Pretty much. Why the hell are people trying to dismiss the awesomeness of the X phone?

    Posted via Android Central App
    08-02-2013 03:35 PM
  10. Kevin OQuinn's Avatar
    Pretty much. Why the hell are people trying to dismiss the awesomeness of the X phone?

    Posted via Android Central App
    Hype. And hype.

    Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk HD
    Aquila likes this.
    08-02-2013 03:37 PM
  11. n8ter#AC's Avatar
    Making it pure Android could be considered an "unfair advantage" and go against the agreement I linked to above.
    Stopped reading there.

    No one forces anyone to skin Android. They do it cause they can, and cause they want to. The statement above, is laughable.
    Roundpotato and cbales24 like this.
    08-02-2013 03:44 PM
  12. Farish's Avatar
    Obviously my opinion, but the voice control on the x is about as valuable as windows 8 being touch-centric on the desktop. I've never seen anyone talk to a siri, use s-voice, or execute a voice search on a phone (or desktop, you can do vocie searches on google.com if you haven't noticed).
    I also know many business men who would use Siri for voice dialing and to setup reminders/calender events. I do the same thing with S-Voice/Google Now as I did with Siri.

    The great thing about those features is saying the name and city of a business and getting immediate driving directions.

    The best difference now is if I had this phone I wouldn't have to press a button to activate voice search while driving.

    I hate having to hit the call button on my console to activate this over a simple voice command. I want to focus on the road in front of me as much as possible.

    A lot people's cars don't have bluetooth yet and many of them don't have controls on their steering wheel like I do.

    Also surveys have shown that many users use Siri commonly whether to be to play music or get directions, I wouldn't be surprise if it was a high number of users using Google Now.

    Saying you haven't seen it really doesn't mean much in this.
    08-02-2013 03:47 PM
  13. Farish's Avatar
    Stopped reading there.

    No one forces anyone to skin Android. They do it cause they can, and cause they want to. The statement above, is laughable.
    Carriers in the United States want skinning and that has been documented. They want the phones to be differentiate among other carriers and among other competing phones.
    08-02-2013 03:48 PM
  14. MikeLip's Avatar
    Guys, neither specs or "innovative features" tell the tale. Did you HAVE an S4? I did. And when it came out, despite the neat features and screaming hardware it was laggy and frustrating. Even turning off ALL the neat new features didn't fix it. Innovative features sometimes suck, is what I'm saying. If Google and Moto are keeping that kind of so called innovation to a minimum and adding some horsepower, it ought to be a darn good performing phone.
    08-02-2013 05:03 PM
  15. Jerry Hildenbrand's Avatar
    Look at Samsung. People say some of their stuff is gimmicky, but Samsung is innovating. Look at HTC, they're innovating. What is innovative about the X? Android flagships should be about innovating. For this being the second half of 2013, what is innovative about this phone? They made iphone-esque "improvements" over what is already existing but brought absolutely nothing new that is even a slight game changer.
    They've created an entirely new processor "micro-architecture" and programmed the OS and kernel to dedicate tasks in certain addresses and across dedicated buses.

    Any EE or electronics tech can tell you that we would have none of the gadgets we have today without the Motorola of the 80's and 90's. This is the kind of innovation we need in the industry.
    08-02-2013 05:13 PM
  16. anon5664829's Avatar
    Look at Samsung. People say some of their stuff is gimmicky, but Samsung is innovating. Look at HTC, they're innovating. What is innovative about the X? Android flagships should be about innovating. For this being the second half of 2013, what is innovative about this phone? They made iphone-esque "improvements" over what is already existing but brought absolutely nothing new that is even a slight game changer.
    Apple doesn't make small upgrades to the iPhones. Just because the outer shell isnt new and pretty it's not a major upgrade? Oh dear god save me from this stupidity.
    08-02-2013 06:11 PM
  17. Raptor007's Avatar
    How can Moto & Google even consider this a "Flagship" phone when the specs are old, 2011 old. No thanks and NOTHING to see here.
    Roundpotato likes this.
    08-02-2013 06:22 PM
  18. Jerry Hildenbrand's Avatar
    How can Moto & Google even consider this a "Flagship" phone when the specs are old, 2011 old. No thanks and NOTHING to see here.
    If you can name me a phone that had three separate processors in 2011, I'll buy you a Moto X.
    If you can't, you promise to read a little about Motorola's history in the electronics industry.
    Deal?
    08-02-2013 06:24 PM
  19. tdizzel's Avatar
    They've created an entirely new processor "micro-architecture" and programmed the OS and kernel to dedicate tasks in certain addresses and across dedicated buses.

    Any EE or electronics tech can tell you that we would have none of the gadgets we have today without the Motorola of the 80's and 90's. This is the kind of innovation we need in the industry.
    You don't have to tell me about Moto's contributions. I've always been a moto guy. I've only had one cellphone in my life that wasn't moto. I started out back in the day with their bag phones. The first car stereo I ever installed myself was a moto. I've always used their products and was excited about the X. But this phone seems very "meh" to me and it feels like they're out to use marketing to make it out to be something special instead of just making the phone special. Maybe the X8 architecture will prove to be an innovation that takes Androids or cellphones in general to another level, but right now it just seems like another marketing move. I hope I'm wrong and if I end up being wrong I'll be happy to admit it(even though this is the internet and you're never supposed to admit to being wrong) but right now this is a big disappointment to me.
    Roundpotato likes this.
    08-02-2013 07:47 PM
  20. tech_head's Avatar
    If you can name me a phone that had three separate processors in 2011, I'll buy you a Moto X.
    If you can't, you promise to read a little about Motorola's history in the electronics industry.
    Deal?
    Droid Bionic
    Droid Bionic - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Motorola Droid Bionic Teardown - Page 2 - iFixit
    Hardware:
    Processor: OMAP4 Dual-Core
    Processor speed: 1000 MHz
    Memory: 1024 MB RAM / 2048 MB ROM
    3D Graphics hardware accelerator: PowerVR SGX540 - Imagination Technology
    There was also a separate LTE Chip -> Motorola T6VP0XBG-0001, believed to be the (LCM 2.0) LTE baseband processor.

    The baseband processor in cellphones is typically a DSP and is used for processing the GSM,CDMA and/or LTE signals.
    It will do all kinds of fun stuff you just can't do with an ARM processor.

    I count two cores for CPU, one for GPU, and one in the LTE chip from Motorola.
    You can add the baseband processor for GSM/CDMA if you like.

    So please specify what you mean by separate processors.
    Roundpotato likes this.
    08-02-2013 08:13 PM
  21. tech_head's Avatar
    They've created an entirely new processor "micro-architecture" and programmed the OS and kernel to dedicate tasks in certain addresses and across dedicated buses.

    Any EE or electronics tech can tell you that we would have none of the gadgets we have today without the Motorola of the 80's and 90's. This is the kind of innovation we need in the industry.
    Nothing new.
    It's a asymetric muti-processor core.
    They have a dedicated task running on the co-processors that do voice and sleep notification, etc.
    The two ARM cores are dedicated to running the OS and applications.
    This isn't new or revolutionary. I've worked on chips that had more cores than this doing more things than this.

    Before you ask - BSEE and MSEE in Computer and Processor Architecture; so yes, I do know chips.

    But I do agree that Motorola changed the mobile phone industry and they have mad revolutionary strides.
    Google bought them to get the patent portfolio of thousands of individual patents.
    This x8, just isn't revolutionary.
    It's also not clear if this is one piece of silicon under that metal cap or a MCM module on a substrate.
    Roundpotato likes this.
    08-02-2013 08:22 PM
  22. Jerry Hildenbrand's Avatar
    Nothing new.
    It's a asymetric muti-processor core.
    They have a dedicated task running on the co-processors that do voice and sleep notification, etc.
    The two ARM cores are dedicated to running the OS and applications.
    This isn't new or revolutionary. I've worked on chips that had more cores than this doing more things than this.

    Before you ask - BSEE and MSEE in Computer and Processor Architecture; so yes, I do know chips.

    But I do agree that Motorola changed the mobile phone industry and they have mad revolutionary strides.
    Google bought them to get the patent portfolio of thousands of individual patents.
    This x8, just isn't revolutionary.
    It's also not clear if this is one piece of silicon under that metal cap or a MCM module on a substrate.
    I'm under the impression that these are not processor cores, but separate microprocessors on their own bus.

    Edit to clarify: Motorola has stated that there is a separate PMIC, on it's own bus with it's own microcontroller. If this is not the case, I'm slightly less excited about the system.
    08-02-2013 08:37 PM
  23. tech_head's Avatar
    I'm under the impression that these are not processor cores, but separate microprocessors on their own bus.
    Their own bus?
    Exactly what does that mean, peripheral, memory? It's an ambiguous statement.
    They *MUST* share a bus of some type to get data back to the main CPU that runs the OS, so that the desired operation is done on those two ARM cores.
    So even if they have a share peripheral or memory bus, it still doesn't make it something new and different.
    All I'm trying to say is that the x8, is not some great or groundbreaking new technology.

    The nVidia Tegra3 has five cores. Four for regular processing and a fifth low power, lower performance core to handle the non intensive monitoring tasks while the other cores sleep.
    The Tegra 4 is variable SMP architecture where each core is activated independently based on workload. This thing has a GPU with 72 cores.

    Processor technology has come a long way.The x8 is nice, but just isn't at the forefront of that technology.
    Roundpotato likes this.
    08-02-2013 08:51 PM
  24. Jerry Hildenbrand's Avatar
    Their own bus?
    Exactly what does that mean, peripheral, memory? It's an ambiguous statement.
    They *MUST* share a bus of some type to get data back to the main CPU that runs the OS, so that the desired operation is done on those two ARM cores.
    So even if they have a share peripheral or memory bus, it still doesn't make it something new and different.
    All I'm trying to say is that the x8, is not some great or groundbreaking new technology.

    The nVidia Tegra3 has five cores. Four for regular processing and a fifth low power, lower performance core to handle the non intensive monitoring tasks while the other cores sleep.
    The Tegra 4 is variable SMP architecture where each core is activated independently based on workload. This thing has a GPU with 72 cores.

    Processor technology has come a long way.The x8 is nice, but just isn't at the forefront of that technology.
    That means that more than one processor, not a processor core, with it's own dedicated bus, controls the OS. Power management is split off to a separate subsystem, which communicates with the kernel on it's own time through some manner of I/O controller.

    This is exactly how real-time automated parts sorters work, with dedicated subsystems running in parallel to control cameras and load cells. There are not enough clock cycles to run the shell, the routines to interact with the user, collect information from other sensors, and communicate with motor controllers unless you use separate systems in parallel. It's not a new concept by any means, but seeing it done in a product the size of a cell phone has piqued my interest. It would also be an excellent way to monitor battery use and needs in real-time, to make minute adjustments to the power management service which could add up to make a visible difference to the end user.
    08-02-2013 09:07 PM
  25. robertopod1968's Avatar
    That's exactly how my toaster works!
    Chiplg likes this.
    08-02-2013 11:26 PM
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