06-30-2015 01:52 PM
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  1. LinuxWeather's Avatar
    So I'm guessing that trusted places, trusted devices and encryption, just overall better security just doesn't interest you. Yea me either, give me wallpaper with my 5 month old Lollipop.

    Posted via the Android Central App
    I couldn't have said it better myself, thanks!

    Posted via the Android Central App
    05-11-2015 02:51 PM
  2. paintdrinkingpete's Avatar
    Anybody ever wonder if it has to do with Verizon's request vs payment? They'd pay twice to go from 5.0 to 5.1. My assumption is that they're balancing the maturity of Android's OS release with how much they want to pay Motorola for those software updates.

    Motorola shouldn't provide updates until they receive payment for services. At least that's my presumption. If the droid turbo was a big seller I'd think Verizon is more likely to invest in it.

    Posted via the Android Central App
    Keep in mind I don't have any insight or knowledge as to how Verizon's deals with manufacturers work, but I doubt that this is the issue.

    I would assume that their contract would be to include all necessary software updates, and not an a la carte sort of deal where the carrier is able to pick an choose updates to save a few bucks.

    In terms of money, however, I'd be a lot more likely to believe that Verizon would withhold certain updates if they felt that the risk for increased customer service calls and device replacements outweighed any of the proposed features and benefits. For example, if someone at R&D said, "We've tested the update, and it looks OK, but one in ten phones the phone dialer stops working and a factory reset is needed...and one in twenty phones went into a bootloop and never recovered". Then Verizon is probably NOT gonna release that update, because it would cost them more to deal with the potential problems.
    vzwuser76 likes this.
    05-11-2015 03:06 PM
  3. Ry's Avatar
    I was originally going off memory.
    The best I can do right now is this:
    A New DROID Experience Arrives in 48 Hours

    It states "Upgradable to Android 5.0 Lollipop"

    The argument that this just means that hardware is capable of handling lollipop is false. . To be upgradable, the user has to be given the ability to upgrade it.
    By that argument, My Lenovo laptop could advertise "upgradable to OSX Yosemite". I don't think that'd fly.
    How so?

    IMO, that statement reads that the DROID Turbo can be upgraded to Android 5.0 Lollipop. It doesn't say it will. It doesn't say when.
    1Coopgt likes this.
    05-11-2015 03:35 PM
  4. Rob_B's Avatar
    Unless Verizon provides Droid Turbo owners with the proverbial keys to unlock & upgrade to lollipop themselves, I read that as verizon has to upgrade it to lollipop for them
    05-11-2015 04:31 PM
  5. vzwuser76's Avatar
    I was originally going off memory.
    The best I can do right now is this:
    A New DROID Experience Arrives in 48 Hours

    It states "Upgradable to Android 5.0 Lollipop"

    The argument that this just means that hardware is capable of handling lollipop is false. . To be upgradable, the user has to be given the ability to upgrade it.
    By that argument, My Lenovo laptop could advertise "upgradable to OSX Yosemite". I don't think that'd fly.
    It is false? What does upgradeable mean? Able to upgrade. There are plenty of times when new phones are released and they say upgradeable to incoming OS version. It just means that the hardware is compatible and there are plans to upgrade to the upcoming OS, when the update is made available by the OEM and the carrier approves it. As far as the customer being able to upgrade it, for the most part, the customer doesn't upgrade, an over the air (OTA) update is pushed to the customer's device. The only instances where a customer initiates the update is rooting or doing an RUU update or through something like Kies with Samsung.

    We're not talking about updating the Turbo to iOS, we're talking about upgrading the device to the newest OS version for Android. Have you ever seen a Lenovo or any other Windows OEM say their Windows 7 PC was upgradeable to Windows 8? Or a Windows 8 machine that will be upgeadeable to Windows 10? They do that all the time, the only difference is on home computers, many times the customer does initiate the update (unless they have automatic updates enabled).
    KPMcClave and philly like this.
    05-11-2015 05:22 PM
  6. vzwuser76's Avatar
    To be clear, I think it'd be a huge waste of time going to court over the update. I'm not asking if we can take them to court. In past similar cases I don't think iv'e ever seen more than $10 awarded to users, and it took years.
    I'm asking for something of real value. I'm asking if anyone has attempted to get an early upgrade to another phone due to the lack of updates. That's what I meant when I said 'breach of contract'.
    And like I said, they're not going to that. The only reason they would even allow you to go to another device after having three bad devices of the same model is because of lemon laws. Do you think Verizon's just going to start handing out $600 phones? You can try all you want, but of all of the carriers, I'd say you'd have the least luck with Verizon.
    05-11-2015 05:29 PM
  7. Eclipse2K's Avatar
    And like I said, they're not going to that. The only reason they would even allow you to go to another device after having three bad devices of the same model is because of lemon laws. Do you think Verizon's just going to start handing out $600 phones? You can try all you want, but of all of the carriers, I'd say you'd have the least luck with Verizon.
    All of this.

    I've had device exchanges because the device didn't work properly. But to think Verizon would change you from a Turbo to a new phone because Lollipop hasn't come yet is just not reasonable. Its an update that is not going to make or break your phone. You'll get Lollipop as promised but no date was ever promised.
    KPMcClave and ckelly33 like this.
    05-11-2015 06:06 PM
  8. ctenc001's Avatar
    It is false? What does upgradeable mean? Able to upgrade. There are plenty of times when new phones are released and they say upgradeable to incoming OS version. It just means that the hardware is compatible and there are plans to upgrade to the upcoming OS, when the update is made available by the OEM and the carrier approves it. As far as the customer being able to upgrade it, for the most part, the customer doesn't upgrade, an over the air (OTA) update is pushed to the customer's device. The only instances where a customer initiates the update is rooting or doing an RUU update or through something like Kies with Samsung.

    We're not talking about updating the Turbo to iOS, we're talking about upgrading the device to the newest OS version for Android. Have you ever seen a Lenovo or any other Windows OEM say their Windows 7 PC was upgradeable to Windows 8? Or a Windows 8 machine that will be upgeadeable to Windows 10? They do that all the time, the only difference is on home computers, many times the customer does initiate the update (unless they have automatic updates enabled).
    If it is 'able to upgrade' then go do it..
    You can't? Then the phone is not 'able to upgrade' then, is it? its locked down, purposely made unable to upgrade at this time and for the foreseeable future.

    Lets look at a more extreme case..
    You buy an Xbox 4, which is marketed as 'games are playable' or 'able to play games'.. you get home you power it up, pop in a game, and you get a popup that says 'unable to play games until we upgrade the system'. You wait 6 months, and still no upgrade.. Do you consider this console 'able to play games' or do you consider the original statement false?


    The phone is not upgradable to Lollipop until verizon/motorolla releases an upgrade to lollipop. At this time it is Unupgradable.

    ANY android phone's hardware is technically compatible with Lollipop with enough tweeks and disregard for performance. If I post a HTC G1 on Ebay and list 'upgradable to 5.0 lollipop' do you consider that correct information?
    philly likes this.
    05-11-2015 06:35 PM
  9. doogald's Avatar
    IYou buy an Xbox 4, which is marketed as 'games are playable' or 'able to play games'.. you get home you power it up, pop in a game, and you get a popup that says 'unable to play games until we upgrade the system'. You wait 6 months, and still no upgrade.. Do you consider this console 'able to play games' or do you consider the original statement false?
    Which Android apps are you unable to use because the phone is not upgraded to Lollipop?

    ANY android phone's hardware is technically compatible with Lollipop with enough tweeks and disregard for performance. If I post a HTC G1 on Ebay and list 'upgradable to 5.0 lollipop' do you consider that correct information?
    That's a bad analogy. Lollipop requires an ARMv8 processor and a minimum of 340 MB RAM (though it's really 512 MB RAM minimum to do anything). An HTC G1 does not have close to these minimum hardware requirements to run Lollipop, so that statement would, in fact, be false.
    KPMcClave and Namrobo like this.
    05-11-2015 07:51 PM
  10. vzwuser76's Avatar
    If it is 'able to upgrade' then go do it..
    You can't? Then the phone is not 'able to upgrade' then, is it? its locked down, purposely made unable to upgrade at this time and for the foreseeable future.

    Lets look at a more extreme case..
    You buy an Xbox 4, which is marketed as 'games are playable' or 'able to play games'.. you get home you power it up, pop in a game, and you get a popup that says 'unable to play games until we upgrade the system'. You wait 6 months, and still no upgrade.. Do you consider this console 'able to play games' or do you consider the original statement false?


    The phone is not upgradable to Lollipop until verizon/motorolla releases an upgrade to lollipop. At this time it is Unupgradable.

    ANY android phone's hardware is technically compatible with Lollipop with enough tweeks and disregard for performance. If I post a HTC G1 on Ebay and list 'upgradable to 5.0 lollipop' do you consider that correct information?
    You really are taking an extreme view of this situation. Going by what you're saying, no phone is upgradeable to the next OS update. I've seen Samsung, HTC, LG, devices all say they're upgradeable to the upcoming update. But the thing is, again outside of rooting, RUU, or Kies, the customer doesn't upgrade, the OEM/ carrier pushes the update. Apple states when they come out with a new version of iOS which models will be upgradeable to it, but it's not ready to upgrade at that moment. It will be upgradeable when the OS is available, but that doesn't mean it's not upgradeable, it just means it's upgradeable when the update is available.

    That's a pretty broad example. What would you think of a gaming console that said "games are playable"? Now if they said Halo games are playable, that would be closer. But if the newest game isn't available yet, it's not playable until you insert the game into the console or it's available online.

    Exactly. But does it say on Verizon's website that the Turbo is upgradeable to Lollipop right now? By that I mean does it say that you can do the upgrade right this second? No, it just says it is able to be upgraded. And if you want to technical about it, it says it's upgradable to Android Lollipop 5.0, which is false since the Turbo is set to skip 5.0 and go straight to 5.1.

    Not necessarily, but beyond that when they say it's upgradeable to Lollipop or whatever other OS version they're talking about, they mean OFFICIALLY upgradable to that version. They don't discuss non official ways to update, because that voids the warranty.

    Nothing they have said is false. The phone is officially going to be upgraded to Lollipop, pending partner support. Using semantics to make your case, saying that upgradable means able to upgrade right this second rather than upgradable when the update is available or that the hardware allows for the upgrade to happen, is nit picking. But if you think your case is so solid, why keep stating your case to us? We can't do anything about it. Call Verizon and tell them what you've told us and see what happens. I'm no psychic, but I see disappointment in your future.
    05-11-2015 07:52 PM
  11. Hgouck's Avatar
    Ya'll realize there are over 1000 posts on something no one on this forum can control, influence, are make happen faster?
    Wow, people get worked up over some really insignificant things.

    Posted via the Android Central App
    tvouge, 1Coopgt, doogald and 1 others like this.
    05-11-2015 10:12 PM
  12. maxman1's Avatar
    Ya'll realize there are over 1000 posts on something no one on this forum can control, influence, are make happen faster?
    And about one that even more people don't even know about and are thrilled with the phone as it was the day it was bought.
    05-11-2015 10:29 PM
  13. KPMcClave's Avatar
    If it is 'able to upgrade' then go do it..
    You can't? Then the phone is not 'able to upgrade' then, is it? its locked down, purposely made unable to upgrade at this time and for the foreseeable future.

    Lets look at a more extreme case..
    You buy an Xbox 4, which is marketed as 'games are playable' or 'able to play games'.. you get home you power it up, pop in a game, and you get a popup that says 'unable to play games until we upgrade the system'. You wait 6 months, and still no upgrade.. Do you consider this console 'able to play games' or do you consider the original statement false?


    The phone is not upgradable to Lollipop until verizon/motorolla releases an upgrade to lollipop. At this time it is Unupgradable.

    ANY android phone's hardware is technically compatible with Lollipop with enough tweeks and disregard for performance. If I post a HTC G1 on Ebay and list 'upgradable to 5.0 lollipop' do you consider that correct information?
    You're playing at semantics.

    If Verizon pushes a Lollipop update to your Turbo, Its chosen way to upgrade phones of all sorts, it will upgrade to Lollipop. Because it is upgrade able. It's right there in the word.

    Beyond that, you're grasping at stuff that isn't there. If you're upset it's taking so long for the Lollipop upgrade to roll out, you obviously aren't alone in that, but words mean stuff and upgradeable fits the Turbo and Lollipop.
    05-11-2015 11:57 PM
  14. KPMcClave's Avatar
    Ya'll realize there are over 1000 posts on something no one on this forum can control, influence, are make happen faster?
    Wow, people get worked up over some really insignificant things.

    Posted via the Android Central App
    I always love it when people add to threads to complain about the uselessness of the rest of the thread.

    This thread was created 6 months ago this Wednesday. That the dioscussion has reached more than 1,000 posts sort of speaks to the issue at hand.

    I for one am not "worked up." Plenty of others aren't either. Some are. So, just like everything else on the forums, opinions vary.
    Emperor, JFH8 and bizzyqu like this.
    05-12-2015 12:02 AM
  15. JJ Jones's Avatar
    I for one still don't see what all the Lollipop fuss is about. What's it do to make the Turbo better?

    Trusted devices? We've got that.

    Lockscreen notifications? We've got that.

    Encryption? Got that too.

    ART runtime? Already an option.

    Someone please tell me, in all seriousness, what is so great about Lollipop that has so many up in arms?

    If it's just wanting updates, go get an Apple device and be guaranteed at least 1 update a year for about 4 years. Otherwise, enjoy what is already a perfectly performing Droid Turbo.

    Sent from my Ballistic Turbo
    Ricky Gray1, tvouge and 1Coopgt like this.
    05-12-2015 12:47 AM
  16. KSDroid01's Avatar
    From an AC story on the Lollipop upgrade for the Moto X 2013 (released a year before the Turbo), in a statement from a Moto rep:

    "I can see the frustration and in some cases the anger about how long it has taken to get the upgrade deployed. It has been a struggle due to the lack of support from some of our partners..."

    Firstly, I think the "anger and frustration" over a slow upgrade to a phone that's almost two years old is a little ironic in light of the Turbo's situation, secondly this is a pretty glaring indictment of the role wireless co's are playing in the delay. It would appear that Moto is feeling the heat a bit from frustrated consumers, and is trying to deflect some of it.

    I personally am not waiting impatiently for the improvements L will bring (except maybe the kill switch feature in 5.1, which I think is inexcusably overdue in Android - really, someone had to pass a law first?) but find it galling on principle that Verizon is letting the supposed flagship Turbo sit in the wings while THREE generations-old phones like the S4 are upgraded.

    Posted via the Turbo
    05-12-2015 01:38 AM
  17. doogald's Avatar
    Firstly, I think the "anger and frustration" over a slow upgrade to a phone that's almost two years old is a little ironic in light of the Turbo's situation, secondly this is a pretty glaring indictment of the role wireless co's are playing in the delay.
    This has nothing to do with the turbo, but it's interesting that people jump right to carriers. I don't think that David Schuster was talking about carriers in this case. There were reports that Motorola was having trouble getting Lollipop working on the custom system on a chip X8 they used in the 2013 Moto X, and, of course, there are documented issues with the early Lollipop builds by Google.

    Motorola doesn't have an update for the unlocked, non-carrier 2013 Moto X yet, so obviously carriers aren't blocking the update to unlocked phones. So I think that's what David Schuster meant by partners - drivers for the custom hardware they used - and not the carriers, at least in this case.

    The Droids are different in that they are carrier branded devices made under contract by Motorola, but the X isn't that way. It's a subtle difference, but for the Droids, that's when Verizon becomes a critical decision maker about upgrade timing. But, there are no other high end phones that are carrier branded like the Droids. Any other carrier brand is either low end or medium end, designed to make sales to people who are extremely cost conscious at purchase, and are unlikely to be too worked up over upgrades to their phone.
    05-12-2015 06:15 AM
  18. KPMcClave's Avatar
    I for one still don't see what all the Lollipop fuss is about. What's it do to make the Turbo better?

    Trusted devices? We've got that.

    Lockscreen notifications? We've got that.

    Encryption? Got that too.

    ART runtime? Already an option.

    Someone please tell me, in all seriousness, what is so great about Lollipop that has so many up in arms?

    If it's just wanting updates, go get an Apple device and be guaranteed at least 1 update a year for about 4 years. Otherwise, enjoy what is already a perfectly performing Droid Turbo.

    Sent from my Ballistic Turbo
    ART isn't a fully functioning option in the Turbo. There are dozens of apps that don't actually optimize if you switch to ART. I find it odd, since I ran ART on my Droid Maxx without issues.

    For the people having issues with Advanced Calling 1.0, it is at least possible the OS update fixes them (in cases where coverage isn't the issue). The same thing can be said for the camera being improved (slow shutter and lowrer light motion).

    Since the original promise was that Lollipop would save battery, I also hold out some hope that the Turbo winds up with a bump there after the update settles in. I know some have had battery issues on other handsets after updating to earlier versions of Lollipop (though my wifer's Galaxy S5 on Verixzon has had no issues at all since getting 5.0). Obviously with the Turbo that isn't something that is sorely lacking for us right now, but I also seem to get not much more battery than I did with my Maxx. If nothing else, a more obvious improvement would make me feel better about my upgrade to the Turbo.

    Beyond that, there's an unknown for those of us who haven't used Lollipop as yet. It may add things I like (and things I don't), it may make some things work better (or worse), but we won't know until the upgrade rolls out.

    At any rate, the implication that there's simply nothing new or to be gained from Loillipop 5.1 is mistaken. We all prioritize things differently, so the potential benefits will differ in their level of importance to us.
    05-12-2015 07:34 AM
  19. travaz's Avatar
    I think that David Schuster's comments points directly at Verizon. Granted there may be some problems with the drivers required for the processor I see no reason for Qualcom to stiff Moto.
    1Coopgt likes this.
    05-12-2015 09:42 AM
  20. MA2GA28's Avatar
    Actually advertisements are legally binding. Not only would you likely be able to get out of your contract, but you could also receive monetary damages if you bought a phone based on an advertisement and it was found to be false advertising.
    The issue here is there was no date given as to when the Turbo will get lollipop, so as long as it is still on track to get it, there is no false advertisement in this case.

    Posted from my Droid Turbo, Kelly and Ozone
    Yes and no...depends on the definition of legally binding.

    What I meant is that a single customer (or even a group) has no footing to file suit based on advertising. However, the FTC can be petitioned and made aware of the alleged advertising claim, and if they rule in your favor then they would impose punishment on the company and some sort of settlement for the customers of said company.
    05-12-2015 10:15 AM
  21. KPMcClave's Avatar
    I think that David Schuster's comments points directly at Verizon. Granted there may be some problems with the drivers required for the processor I see no reason for Qualcom to stiff Moto.
    How do you reconcile that with doogald's point that "Motorola doesn't have an update for the unlocked, non-carrier 2013 Moto X yet, so obviously carriers aren't blocking the update to unlocked phones?" That seems to make sense to me and let Verizon off the hook.
    05-12-2015 10:36 AM
  22. sharkita's Avatar
    At any rate, the implication that there's simply nothing new or to be gained from Loillipop 5.1 is mistaken. We all prioritize things differently, so the potential benefits will differ in their level of importance to us.
    I would add that when folks have a top-of-the-line, premium phone like the Turbo, it is not unreasonable to want to have the latest software - just because. I know I don't need any other compelling reason to upgrade; I just want the option of having the newest version of whatever's out there to try it out for myself.
    05-12-2015 10:58 AM
  23. dusoccer10's Avatar
    I think that David Schuster's comments points directly at Verizon. Granted there may be some problems with the drivers required for the processor I see no reason for Qualcom to stiff Moto.
    Strongly disagree otherwise the unlocked Moto X 2013 would already have been upgraded. Motorola chose to use a custom S4 Pro in the original X. That is a generation behind the 800 and two generations behind the 810. It will be three generations behind the 820 scheduled for release at the end of of 2015/early 2016. Going back to a S4 to update its drivers for Lollipop takes resources and money that Qualcomm would probably prefer to spend in other places.
    05-12-2015 02:08 PM
  24. Ry's Avatar
    I would add that when folks have a top-of-the-line, premium phone like the Turbo, it is not unreasonable to want to have the latest software - just because. I know I don't need any other compelling reason to upgrade; I just want the option of having the newest version of whatever's out there to try it out for myself.
    But this premium, top of the line phone is just a carrier exclusive.
    05-12-2015 03:11 PM
  25. Ry's Avatar
    This has nothing to do with the turbo, but it's interesting that people jump right to carriers. I don't think that David Schuster was talking about carriers in this case. There were reports that Motorola was having trouble getting Lollipop working on the custom system on a chip X8 they used in the 2013 Moto X, and, of course, there are documented issues with the early Lollipop builds by Google.

    Motorola doesn't have an update for the unlocked, non-carrier 2013 Moto X yet, so obviously carriers aren't blocking the update to unlocked phones. So I think that's what David Schuster meant by partners - drivers for the custom hardware they used - and not the carriers, at least in this case.

    The Droids are different in that they are carrier branded devices made under contract by Motorola, but the X isn't that way. It's a subtle difference, but for the Droids, that's when Verizon becomes a critical decision maker about upgrade timing. But, there are no other high end phones that are carrier branded like the Droids. Any other carrier brand is either low end or medium end, designed to make sales to people who are extremely cost conscious at purchase, and are unlikely to be too worked up over upgrades to their phone.
    It's always easy to blame the carriers.

    Yet nothing happens unless the OEM is working on the update.

    The Verizon Moto X was one of the first to get an OTA update to Kit Kat. Seems like maybe Verizon and Motorola set the bar really high.
    05-12-2015 03:15 PM
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