07-15-2014 12:26 PM
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  1. Timelessblur's Avatar
    Yep, I am prejudiced in favor of Republicans. IMO, this is the worst administration since Jimmy Carter. He promised transparency? LOL!
    That was clear when you said you believe the GOP really cares about the truth on Benghazi. That alone speaks volumes and why I stated it was pointless to do any debating with you as you just keep spitting off Fake (Fox) news talking points.
    A895 likes this.
    05-27-2014 10:53 AM
  2. SteveISU's Avatar
    You do know that Obamacare is just a website for a healthcare market right now right? The only thing that's being "run" by the government is the website AND some subsidies for some of the healthcare plans.
    Really? There are no set standards outlined by the federal government, it's just a website? (ie...ACA standards? Hence why private individuals were losing their insurance?).
    05-27-2014 12:32 PM
  3. SteveISU's Avatar
    Look at other countries that have tried it. It doesn't work. The delays in treatments and doctor appointments are terrible. Look at Medicare and Medicaid, and tell me that those government-run plans are working out well. It is getting harder and harder to find a doctor that will even see a Medicaid patient, because they get paid next to nothing, and that is what will happen with single payer. The government needs to stay out of healthcare, and that includes Obamacare. The latest stats show that other than Medicaid enrollments, that the majority of enrollments were from people that already had good plans that were cancelled. I think that I read that only about 1 million of the enrollments were previously un-insured people.

    You have to define "work". Are there wait times, doctor shortages (especially specialists), caps on salaries of providers, ect. Sure there are, but you have to find out if the country is willing to adopt a "VA" style healthcare system and take the good with the bad. We currently live in a country and a culture where patients want an easy fix and they want it now. Knee pain, you get an MRI ASAP. In other countries, you take aleve for 6 weeks and wait for a scanner to open up. Americans don't want to wait and everyone feels their healthcare problem is the most significant one. Look at the VA system and that is what single payer would look like in this country. I honestly think the vast majority of people who argue for single payer don't have a clue what they will find themselves immersed in. I have more patients who even when I recommend they go to the VA since they have the benefits, they don't want to go. The wait is too long, it's an all day affair, they'd rather pay something out of pocket than be dragged through the VA system slowly.
    05-27-2014 12:44 PM
  4. A895's Avatar
    You have to define "work". Are there wait times, doctor shortages (especially specialists), caps on salaries of providers, ect. Sure there are, but you have to find out if the country is willing to adopt a "VA" style healthcare system and take the good with the bad. We currently live in a country and a culture where patients want an easy fix and they want it now. Knee pain, you get an MRI ASAP. In other countries, you take aleve for 6 weeks and wait for a scanner to open up. Americans don't want to wait and everyone feels their healthcare problem is the most significant one. Look at the VA system and that is what single payer would look like in this country. I honestly think the vast majority of people who argue for single payer don't have a clue what they will find themselves immersed in. I have more patients who even when I recommend they go to the VA since they have the benefits, they don't want to go. The wait is too long, it's an all day affair, they'd rather pay something out of pocket than be dragged through the VA system slowly.
    I don't think single payer is what we are arguing for, we are arguing for a better more centralized system that is better than the one we have now.

    Sent from my XT907 using Mobile Nations mobile app
    05-27-2014 12:50 PM
  5. SteveISU's Avatar
    I don't think single payer is what we are arguing for, we are arguing for a better more centralized system that is better than the one we have now.

    Sent from my XT907 using Mobile Nations mobile app
    Yes, that's single payer or UHC if you want the federal government to run the thing. So look at the VA system and that's what you'd get for 330 million people.
    05-27-2014 12:58 PM
  6. A895's Avatar
    Yes, that's single payer or UHC if you want the federal government to run the thing. So look at the VA system and that's what you'd get for 330 million people.
    No, more regulation in terms of how it is, because the previous system was a mess. Not the federal government run the whole thing.

    Sent from my XT907 using Mobile Nations mobile app
    05-27-2014 01:27 PM
  7. SteveISU's Avatar
    No, more regulation in terms of how it is, because the previous system was a mess. Not the federal government run the whole thing.

    Sent from my XT907 using Mobile Nations mobile app
    What kind of regulation?
    05-27-2014 01:29 PM
  8. SteveISU's Avatar
    This isn't the group I work with, but the general idea is similar...



    One of the few ideas in the US that has ACTUAL Bipartisan support.
    Does anyone else find this a bit odd coming from a man who worked for a President that had money pouring in from foreign countries in 1996.
    05-27-2014 01:40 PM
  9. Aquila's Avatar
    Who has time to Google things like this?

    Sent from my SCH-I535 using AC Forums mobile app
    I'd assume Googling takes less time than creating a post to continue to spread it on, lol. I like Mooncatt's strategy. Ignore, maybe chuckle, but mostly ignore.
    A895 and nolittdroid like this.
    05-27-2014 02:15 PM
  10. A895's Avatar
    What kind of regulation?
    Who does or does not get accepted. A lot of people are not able to get health insurance because of preexisting conditions, and income. Requiring everyone to have health insurance is a step into his direction but something has to be done to make it more affordable for those with lower income especially.

    Sent from my XT907 using Mobile Nations mobile app
    05-27-2014 02:26 PM
  11. anon8126715's Avatar
    Really? There are no set standards outlined by the federal government, it's just a website? (ie...ACA standards? Hence why private individuals were losing their insurance?).
    Yes, the federal government is telling insurance companies that they have to actually cover people when people become sick, yes they're telling insurance companies that they must allow college students to remain on their parents' policies through college, yes insurance companies have to cover pre-existing conditions. So somehow those things are proof that it's "government run"?
    05-27-2014 02:36 PM
  12. anon8126715's Avatar
    Does anyone else find this a bit odd coming from a man who worked for a President that had money pouring in from foreign countries in 1996.
    No more odd than you pointing out the oddity of someone having a unique perspective on campaign finance, seeing how it affects our democracy, and wanting to bring public awareness of it, but you alluding to their past political ties as if you just found out it was Professor Plum, in the study, with the pipe....
    05-27-2014 02:48 PM
  13. SteveISU's Avatar
    Yes, the federal government is telling insurance companies that they have to actually cover people when people become sick, yes they're telling insurance companies that they must allow college students to remain on their parents' policies through college, yes insurance companies have to cover pre-existing conditions. So somehow those things are proof that it's "government run"?
    No, it's proof your original statement was BS that Obamacare is "just a website".
    05-27-2014 03:18 PM
  14. A895's Avatar
    No, it's proof your original statement was BS that Obamacare is "just a website".
    We were saying before the healthcare website is just a portal, you are taking it out of context.

    Sent from my XT907 using Mobile Nations mobile app
    05-27-2014 03:19 PM
  15. SteveISU's Avatar
    You do know that Obamacare is just a website for a healthcare market right now right? The only thing that's being "run" by the government is the website AND some subsidies for some of the healthcare plans.
    The website is a portal, healthcare is not actually run by the government.

    Posted via Android Central App
    We were saying before the healthcare website is just a portal, you are taking it out of context.

    Sent from my XT907 using Mobile Nations mobile app

    How so? What was taken out of context? Are there regulations put on the entire healthcare industry (not just insurance companies) outlined in the ACA?
    05-27-2014 03:26 PM
  16. anon8126715's Avatar
    How so? What was taken out of context? Are there regulations put on the entire healthcare industry (not just insurance companies) outlined in the ACA?
    Regulations put in place by the government >< Government run healthcare. I guess by your logic we have government run meat packing plants, government run airlines, government run private industry?

    And what exactly is your point, that "government regulated ANYTHING must be garbage because it's 'government regulated'"? Yes because private industry has proven time and time again that if left to their own devices, they'll do what's in the best interest of the public over what's best for their shareholders......
    msndrstood likes this.
    05-27-2014 04:15 PM
  17. SteveISU's Avatar
    Regulations put in place by the government >< Government run healthcare. I guess by your logic we have government run meat packing plants, government run airlines, government run private industry?

    And what exactly is your point, that "government regulated ANYTHING must be garbage because it's 'government regulated'"? Yes because private industry has proven time and time again that if left to their own devices, they'll do what's in the best interest of the public over what's best for their shareholders......
    Now which of your thoughtful examples is regulated to mandate me that I purchase anything? The USDA or the FAA?

    Again, I'm not the one who eluded to Obamacare being just a website.
    05-27-2014 05:07 PM
  18. A895's Avatar
    Now which of your thoughtful examples is regulated to mandate me that I purchase anything? The USDA or the FAA?

    Again, I'm not the one who eluded to Obamacare being just a website.
    I didn't say that another poster did. The healthcare website is a portal, my words. The ACA (hate Obamacare as a name) is a set of regulations, not the federal government running the healthcare industry.

    Sent from my XT907 using Mobile Nations mobile app
    05-27-2014 05:44 PM
  19. SteveISU's Avatar
    I didn't say that another poster did. The healthcare website is a portal, my words. The ACA (hate Obamacare as a name) is a set of regulations, not the federal government running the healthcare industry.

    Sent from my XT907 using Mobile Nations mobile app

    Which is why I quoted and bolded his words!?!


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    05-27-2014 05:46 PM
  20. A895's Avatar
    Which is why I quoted and bolded his words!?!


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    And? Did you read the rest of my post?

    Sent from my XT907 using Mobile Nations mobile app
    05-27-2014 06:07 PM
  21. jdbii's Avatar
    Kind of interesting how this played out but at least the OP posted it here where opinions differ. Most of us are so stuck in our own echo chamber that complete BS is repeated unchecked so many times that after awhile it gets internalized as truth.
    05-27-2014 06:30 PM
  22. msndrstood's Avatar
    LOL, I remember during Vietnam, the right use to take the peace symbol, turn it sideways and walk it across a leaflet and called it the track of the Amerrican Chicken.
    My brother used to say that when he came into my room and saw a poster on the wall. That was 45 years ago! 😨

    Sent via The Big, Bad, Beautiful Note 3
    palandri and rexxman like this.
    05-27-2014 09:00 PM
  23. pappy53's Avatar
    Why would you post something like this without googling it first? Snopes, Truth or Fiction, Urban Legends and a host of other sites will give you the answer.
    Lighten up, Frances.
    05-27-2014 10:03 PM
  24. anon8126715's Avatar
    Now which of your thoughtful examples is regulated to mandate me that I purchase anything? The USDA or the FAA?

    Again, I'm not the one who eluded to Obamacare being just a website.

    I'm not being forced to buy anything. I'll be taxed if I don't purchase insurance, but I'm not being forced to buy it. And when one purchases insurance, most of the population can be diagnosed with some condition that the insurance company used to be able to cancel policies over. And then there are the other insurance companies that would cancel you if you were costing them more than they were making off of you. Now those 2 practices are not allowed. I'd hardly consider that "Government run healthcare".

    Is this the thesis of your argument? "It's not just a website so it must be government run healthcare and everyone knows that government run anything is inefficient"? If so, that's one poor excuse of an argument.
    A895 and rexxman like this.
    05-27-2014 10:11 PM
  25. Timelessblur's Avatar
    One sure fired way to know it is completely false is Fake News is not having a field day with it.

    To me I put this under the standard for right wing echo chamber and anything like this I toss under the stupid people fall for it category.

    Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk
    Scott7217 likes this.
    05-28-2014 04:37 AM
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