06-30-2014 01:17 AM
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  1. Serial Fordicator's Avatar
    I personally don't think it's a matter of right/wrong. Considering it happens in nature, I don't see how anyone can label it right or wrong. To me it would be as if someone told me that I'm not allowed to like women with blonde hair less or more than women with brown or black hair. Again, I think it goes back to religion. We were taught a few decades ago that interracial marriages were a sin as well. We look back at that and other societal mores now and wonder what the hell we were thinking. Some of the elderly generations will tell you that they remember when having black and white water fountains was no big deal to them. I don't know how one can quantify thinking homosexuality is a sin and being ok with interracial marriages as it was really looked down upon back in the day. I have an uncle who told me that when he was a young kid that it wasn't uncommon for black men to get lynched because they would consort with white women, and they thought nothing of it because they felt it was their moral obligation.


    I also don't know if I agree with him not being fired. Considering he is somewhat a representation of the A&E brand, they have to take care of what's in their best financial interest. When you represent the face of the company you're working for by enough recognition, most companies will cut their losses when they weigh what you bring to the table vs how much financial damage they think you've cost them.
    How the hell can you even compare the 2? The bible speaks nothing of interracial marriage but talks about homosexuality.
    Everytime I get into a discussion with a liberal, they don't stick to the point and throw 30 other things into a discussion.

    ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    Live2ride883 likes this.
    12-23-2013 12:26 PM
  2. anon8126715's Avatar
    It seems that many are forgetting where these Duck Dynasty people are from. Religion once again rears it's head. Their lifestyle, their background, their whole religious belief system pats them on the back for thinking how they think. We should not be surprised that there are people in the U.S. that are completely homophobic and racist yet think that what they say should be considered "free speech" or "my right to an opinion". It has nothing to do with free speech or anyones right to an opinion. These hillbillies just don't know any better. They have grown up in a racist, homophobic world (religion) that makes them think THEY are being quite liberal about it all by saying they have no problem working amongst black people. It's like the old, "some of my best friends are black" line that was supposed to prove you weren't a racist. It is uninformed, uneducated, insensitiveness that permeates a huge part of the U.S. All you have to do is travel the country, and especially the south, to see that racism and homophobia are alive and kicking in the U.S. Anyone that claims that racism and homophobia are "almost non-existent" must be living in a bubble.
    I read that Suffolk (New York town) is having their police department go under federal oversight because they wouldn't investigate hate crimes committed against Hispanics in their jurisdiction. It was pretty typical for teens to go out looking for hispanics that they thought were illegal and beat them. While I concede that there tends to be more racism in the south, it's definitely isn't a monopoly. The word "ignorant" is pretty spot on though. While I think it can have negative connotations for those that are being discriminated against, it also doesn't do any favors for the person doing the discriminating. I know if I had a closed mind regarding race, sex, religion or sexual orientation, I wouldn't have been blessed with some of the people I consider friends in my life.
    12-23-2013 12:37 PM
  3. anon8126715's Avatar
    How the hell can you even compare the 2? The bible speaks nothing of interracial marriage but talks about homosexuality.
    Everytime I get into a discussion with a liberal, they don't stick to the point and throw 30 other things into a discussion.

    ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    Because back in the day people used religion (the bible) to justify their stance. And, to wit, the reason I have difficulty when I talk to conservatives on the issue, they cherry pick what they want to out of the bible. Do you work on the Sabbath?

    Exodus 35:2
    Six days work shall be done, but on the seventh day you shall have a Sabbath of solemn rest, holy to the Lord. Whoever does any work on it shall be put to death.
    Oofa likes this.
    12-23-2013 12:42 PM
  4. Serial Fordicator's Avatar
    Because back in the day people used religion (the bible) to justify their stance. And, to wit, the reason I have difficulty when I talk to conservatives on the issue, they cherry pick what they want to out of the bible. Do you work on the Sabbath?
    Oh here we go. Where did I say I was perfect? Where did i say i do no wrong? Way to prove my last point with liberal discussions. And back to the point in hand why does anyone care what anyone believes just because someone believe something different than you. What does it matter?

    If no one wanted to hear what this guy was going to say they shouldn't have asked him.

    ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    12-23-2013 01:09 PM
  5. anon8126715's Avatar
    Oh here we go. Where did I say I was perfect? Where did i say i do no wrong? Way to prove my last point with liberal discussions.

    ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    So judging others ok, but others judging you, not ok. Got it.....

    Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk 2
    rexxman likes this.
    12-23-2013 01:13 PM
  6. Serial Fordicator's Avatar
    So judging others ok, but others judging you, not ok. Got it.....

    Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk 2
    I NEVER SAID I DO NO WRONG EITHER. EVERYONE DOES! But I'm not going to say that something is right when its wrong.

    why don't you just start deflecting with subjects about guns, healthcare, taxes, etc.?

    ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    The Hustleman likes this.
    12-23-2013 01:21 PM
  7. JW4VZW's Avatar
    How the hell can you even compare the 2? The bible speaks nothing of interracial marriage but talks about homosexuality.
    Everytime I get into a discussion with a liberal, they don't stick to the point and throw 30 other things into a discussion.

    ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    True story, Serial Fordicator
    Posted on my Samsung Galaxy Note 3 on Verizon Wireless, America's largest 4G LTE Network. Please excuse any errors.
    12-23-2013 01:26 PM
  8. JW4VZW's Avatar
    I feel that he's right on the gay issue, and you missed the quote about him loving everyone and not mistreating anyone. But gay rights people as one of my lesbian friends says "often mistake disagreement with hate" and it's true, it also happened to the guy from chick fil a.


    Problem is people love to act like if you're not completely homo happy or you disagree with one of their issues, they want to blacklist and criticize you, call you out your name for disagreeing, and IRONICALLY tell you that you're closed-minded, when in truth it's THEM.
    Well said, The Hustleman.
    Posted on my Samsung Galaxy Note 3 on Verizon Wireless, America's largest 4G LTE Network. Please excuse any errors.
    12-23-2013 01:36 PM
  9. anon8126715's Avatar
    I NEVER SAID I DO NO WRONG EITHER. EVERYONE DOES! But I'm not going to say that something is right when its wrong.

    why don't you just start deflecting with subjects about guns, healthcare, taxes, etc.?

    ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    Then why are we so quick to try to address the sin in others? I don't see conservatives trying to address the issue with working on the Sabbath, the issue with the poor, the hungry you know all the things Jesus championed. Far be it for me to try to tell you how you should live, but I think that courtesy should be extended to everyone. And before you try the straw man argument about pedophilia or some other act, those acts do involve someone being hurt, and I am 100% for intervention.
    12-23-2013 02:20 PM
  10. NoYankees44's Avatar
    This thread took a while to pop up.

    First and foremost, this is nothing other than the media profiteering on controversy like always.

    Beyond that, I like how the quotes are just quotes. There is no context given by the magazine at all. Just "hey he said this while we were in the woods". That annoys me. Context is everything, but no one really cares.

    Secondly, I support his opinion and right to express it just as I support A&E's right to put or not put whatever they want on their network. However both have consequences.

    Finally, disagreeing with a practice does not equal hate or bigotry or racism or any of the other liberal slander terms. It merely means disagreeing with a practice. As Phil himself stated, treating people with love and respect is a must regardless of how you feel about their habits. This is just another way that the lgbt community can force their cause into the spotlight again. Just like chik-fi-la last time.
    12-23-2013 02:30 PM
  11. Oofa's Avatar
    This is the ignorant s7it that really pisses me of. Someone is labeled a homophobe because they don't agree with a lifestyle. Then you blast any southern/religious person for being that way. Way to show where the intolerance really is.

    I don't agree with it, BUT I DONT CARE WHAT PEOPLE DO! IF SOMEONE IS GAY I DONT CARE AS MOST RELIGIOUS SOUTHERNER'S DO NOT.

    BTW, if you think that racism and intolerance are coming from one side, you are blind.

    ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    So you are going to tell us that the south is just as open to homosexuality as California or New York and that religious southerners don't care if someone is gay? You can't be that naive about the south and the subject in general. It sounds like you just have a problem with anyone YOU consider "liberal" on any subject. This Duck guy didn't just "disagree with a lifestyle". It's fine to disagree with any lifestyle. He claims that you "start with being homosexual and you morph from there", compares it to bestiality, swindling....... BTW, do you also believe that? He's totally out of his naive and uneducated mind. He's clueless about facts and is driven only by his religious beliefs. If you don't see that as homophobia and thinking he's very open minded because he worked alongside blacks and they never complained to him about white people as racism.... there is no use in my trying to make a point.
    12-23-2013 02:50 PM
  12. anon8126715's Avatar
    So you are going to tell us that the south is just as open to homosexuality as California or New York and that religious southerners don't care if someone is gay? You can't be that naive about the south and the subject in general. It sounds like you just have a problem with anyone YOU consider "liberal" on any subject. This Duck guy didn't just "disagree with a lifestyle". It's fine to disagree with any lifestyle. He claims that you "start with being homosexual and you morph from there", compares it to bestiality, swindling....... BTW, do you also believe that? He's totally out of his naive and uneducated mind. He's clueless about facts and is driven only by his religious beliefs. If you don't see that as homophobia and thinking he's very open minded because he worked alongside blacks and they never complained to him about white people as racism.... there is no use in my trying to make a point.
    I think what happens with some people is they lack empathy unless it's someone close to them. **** Cheney is a good example. One might wonder if he'd have the views he has if his daughter wasn't lesbian. Hence the reason I can't see labeling it as right or wrong. To me it would be like someone trying to tell me that what I find attractive on a woman is completely wrong. No one should have the authority over someone else to define for them what they think is attractive.
    12-23-2013 03:09 PM
  13. palandri's Avatar
    ...Finally, disagreeing with a practice does not equal hate or bigotry or racism....
    I think you're missing the point. I agree, simply disagreeing with a practice doesn't equal hate, but your approach and presentation is critical.

    Look at the way the Pope approached it, "If a person is gay and seeks God and has good will, who am I to judge?"

    Now look at the way Phil Robertson approached it with scripture and sin.

    Now when I look at Phil Robertson, all I see is a bigoted hick. Now do I see the Pope are a bigoted hick? Absolutely not, and it all has to do with presentation and approach. Phil Robertson showed his true colors.
    jdbii and msndrstood like this.
    12-23-2013 03:14 PM
  14. Serial Fordicator's Avatar
    I am not quick to point out. I just despise hypocrisy. Everyone is for free speech unless they don't agree with it and I fail to see how him not agreeing with it makes everyone think he is preaching hate. He said, and it was conveniently left out, that he hates no man, and that everyone sins.

    ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    12-23-2013 03:24 PM
  15. NoYankees44's Avatar
    I think you're missing the point. I agree, simply disagreeing with a practice doesn't equal hate, but your approach and presentation is critical.

    Look at the way the Pope approached it, "If a person is gay and seeks God and has good will, who am I to judge?"

    Now look at the way Phil Robertson approached it with scripture and sin.

    Now when I look at Phil Robertson, all I see is a bigoted hick. Now do I see the Pope are a bigoted hick? Absolutely not, and it all has to do with presentation and approach. Phil Robertson showed his true colors.
    O I agree that his choice in wording was not great. This is also why I pointed out the extreme lack of context surrounding the quotes. The questions could have been very pointed or the conversation could have lead to a more extreme example. We will never know and it does not change what he said, but it could put things into a more favorable light.

    It's it still does not change the fact that he said the act was sinful. He did not judge the people, just the act. The Pope avoided saying the act was sinful and just said that loving God was more important. Something that most denominations did long ago, but catholics are late to the game on. I am sure that the catholic church's stand on the subject is still the same "it is wrong". They are just now trying harder to draw in and teach instead of leading by denouncing(and avoid the wrath of the ever louder lgbt community of course).
    jdbii likes this.
    12-23-2013 03:29 PM
  16. Serial Fordicator's Avatar
    So you are going to tell us that the south is just as open to homosexuality as California or New York and that religious southerners don't care if someone is gay? You can't be that naive about the south and the subject in general. It sounds like you just have a problem with anyone YOU consider "liberal" on any subject. This Duck guy didn't just "disagree with a lifestyle". It's fine to disagree with any lifestyle. He claims that you "start with being homosexual and you morph from there", compares it to bestiality, swindling....... BTW, do you also believe that? He's totally out of his naive and uneducated mind. He's clueless about facts and is driven only by his religious beliefs. If you don't see that as homophobia and thinking he's very open minded because he worked alongside blacks and they never complained to him about white people as racism.... there is no use in my trying to make a point.
    From the interview:

    What, in your mind, is sinful?

    Start with homosexual behavior and just morph out from there. Bestiality, sleeping around with this woman and that woman and that woman and those men, he says.*

    He was asked what's sinful. He did not say that gay people morph from being homosexual to beastiality. I mean, do you think he is also saying that being gay is what causes adultery? No. You just took a quip from an article and ran with it. My goodness, all he was talking about is how sinful behavior has became the norm with no repentance.

    So, what now? Am I going to be called a racist? Are you going to start trying to say that I must agree with Hitler?



    ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    12-23-2013 03:36 PM
  17. anon8126715's Avatar
    I am not quick to point out. I just despise hypocrisy. Everyone is for free speech unless they don't agree with it and I fail to see how him not agreeing with it makes everyone think he is preaching hate. He said, and it was conveniently left out, that he hates no man, and that everyone sins.

    ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    His free speech wasn't violated. Freedom of speech means he can say whatever he wants and not worry about the government punishing him. The last time I looked, it was USA, not A&E.
    12-23-2013 03:36 PM
  18. Serial Fordicator's Avatar
    His free speech wasn't violated. Freedom of speech means he can say whatever he wants and not worry about the government punishing him. The last time I looked, it was USA, not A&E.
    Are you kidding me? SMH. You know exactly what I'm saying. Persecuted by the media and public

    ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    12-23-2013 03:41 PM
  19. NoYankees44's Avatar
    So you are going to tell us that the south is just as open to homosexuality as California or New York and that religious southerners don't care if someone is gay? You can't be that naive about the south and the subject in general. It sounds like you just have a problem with anyone YOU consider "liberal" on any subject. This Duck guy didn't just "disagree with a lifestyle". It's fine to disagree with any lifestyle. He claims that you "start with being homosexual and you morph from there", compares it to bestiality, swindling....... BTW, do you also believe that? He's totally out of his naive and uneducated mind. He's clueless about facts and is driven only by his religious beliefs. If you don't see that as homophobia and thinking he's very open minded because he worked alongside blacks and they never complained to him about white people as racism.... there is no use in my trying to make a point.
    He equated all sexual immorality. In the Bible, all sin is more or less equal and is connected to further sin.

    And if you ought to try living in the South before having such an ignorant and bigoted attitude. I have lived in the south my entire life and never seen discrimination on any measure able level for any reason. Race, sexual orientation, or otherwise. And I have lived down the road from one of the main KKK hubs of the world before and have also lived just outside of Birmingham with all of its supposed civil rights "issues". Racism and hatred may still exists here, but you would have to look hard to find it. Just as I am sure you can find it in California and New York.
    12-23-2013 03:42 PM
  20. dancing-bass's Avatar
    I feel that he's right on the gay issue, and you missed the quote about him loving everyone and not mistreating anyone. But gay rights people as one of my lesbian friends says "often mistake disagreement with hate" and it's true, it also happened to the guy from chick fil a.


    Problem is people love to act like if you're not completely homo happy or you disagree with one of their issues, they want to blacklist and criticize you, call you out your name for disagreeing, and IRONICALLY tell you that you're closed-minded, when in truth it's THEM.

    On the civil rights issue, he's full of tihs...


    Either way, he shouldn't have been fired for speaking his mind!
    THIS... Yes, this pretty much summarizes my thoughts. I think the worst part of it is that if you have watched the show more then once, you realize Phil and family are devout conservative Christians, and adhere to those beliefs strongly. It doesn't matter what YOU think about those beliefs, the fact is it shouldn't surprise anyone what Phil's answers were. Could he have been more tactful? Perhaps more politically correct? Probably -- but that wouldn't have been Phil being Phil. It would have been... staged. People read interviews like this to get the "real deal". So really, yeah he could have been tactful or more politically correct, but he wouldn't have been true to himself then (and isn't that what everyone pushes? Being true to yourself and your beliefs?)

    Now, as for A&E, they could have and should have been prepared for a situation like this. They should have a pretty clear idea of where Phil and the Robertson's stand on the issue, and really shouldn't have been caught too off guard. Maybe they weren't but I think the fact that the rest of the family is standing firm behind Phil is somewhat of a shock. Maybe the fact that other networks are waiting and eager to pick up Duck Dynasty if A&E drops them is a factor here. I guess that remains to be seen.

    I also find it funny how rapidly things have changed. Christians haven't had the best track record when it comes to minorities, especially of the LBGQ community, but they're coming around -- yet I find the LBGQ community appears to be just as intolerant of Christians (if not worse!) -- isn't that calling the kettle black? Calling "INTOLERANCE!!! BIGOTS!!" when they are very often embodying those very things?

    Now in full disclosure, I guess I would fall under the label "Christian" (although reluctantly -- that word means something quite different to me then what is portrayed in the media). I also have a couple gay friends. Not many, but a couple.

    I just wonder what would have happened if Phil was a devout Muslim and similar questions had been asked. I'm fairly certain that devout Muslims are more "extreme" in their views then most Christians. Can you imagine what would have happened if they had interviewed a Muslim and he had defended his point of view from the Koran? Have you guys looked into what they think about homosexuality? or theft? or infidels (unbelievers - meaning pretty much anyone who ISN'T Muslim)?
    plumbrich likes this.
    12-23-2013 03:44 PM
  21. anon8126715's Avatar
    THIS... Yes, this pretty much summarizes my thoughts. I think the worst part of it is that if you have watched the show more then once, you realize Phil and family are devout conservative Christians, and adhere to those beliefs strongly. It doesn't matter what YOU think about those beliefs, the fact is it shouldn't surprise anyone what Phil's answers were. Could he have been more tactful? Perhaps more politically correct? Probably -- but that wouldn't have been Phil being Phil. It would have been... staged. People read interviews like this to get the "real deal". So really, yeah he could have been tactful or more politically correct, but he wouldn't have been true to himself then (and isn't that what everyone pushes? Being true to yourself and your beliefs?)

    Now, as for A&E, they could have and should have been prepared for a situation like this. They should have a pretty clear idea of where Phil and the Robertson's stand on the issue, and really shouldn't have been caught too off guard. Maybe they weren't but I think the fact that the rest of the family is standing firm behind Phil is somewhat of a shock. Maybe the fact that other networks are waiting and eager to pick up Duck Dynasty if A&E drops them is a factor here. I guess that remains to be seen.

    I also find it funny how rapidly things have changed. Christians haven't had the best track record when it comes to minorities, especially of the LBGQ community, but they're coming around -- yet I find the LBGQ community appears to be just as intolerant of Christians (if not worse!) -- isn't that calling the kettle black? Calling "INTOLERANCE!!! BIGOTS!!" when they are very often embodying those very things?

    Now in full disclosure, I guess I would fall under the label "Christian" (although reluctantly -- that word means something quite different to me then what is portrayed in the media). I also have a couple gay friends. Not many, but a couple.

    I just wonder what would have happened if Phil was a devout Muslim and similar questions had been asked. I'm fairly certain that devout Muslims are more "extreme" in their views then most Christians. Can you imagine what would have happened if they had interviewed a Muslim and he had defended his point of view from the Koran? Have you guys looked into what they think about homosexuality? or theft? or infidels (unbelievers - meaning pretty much anyone who ISN'T Muslim)?

    I'm not sure if I agree that you can claim the gay and lesbian community's "intolerance" is as bad as the intolerance they're getting from other groups. Their intolerance is more reactionary, I mean c'mon their lifestyle has been compared to Bestiality on more than one occasion.

    As far as another network picking up the show, I'm willing to bet that somewhere deep in the contract signed, there's a no compete clause. And I'm even more certain that there's a clause in that contract that states A&E can terminate employment if they deem their actions are harmful to A&E's brand.
    12-23-2013 03:52 PM
  22. anon8126715's Avatar
    Are you kidding me? SMH. You know exactly what I'm saying. Persecuted by the media and public

    ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    The media and public aren't bound by the Bill of Rights. Since you did want me to deflect to gun rights.... That would be like insisting that your 2nd amendment rights are being violated because your employer will not allow you to carry your gun to work.

    Amendment I

    Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
    He is free to speak his mind, but he is also bound by the contract he signed with A&E, which I'm pretty sure covers this sort of scenario.
    12-23-2013 03:58 PM
  23. dancing-bass's Avatar
    As far as another network picking up the show, I'm willing to bet that somewhere deep in the contract signed, there's a no compete clause. And I'm even more certain that there's a clause in that contract that states A&E can terminate employment if they deem their actions are harmful to A&E's brand.
    Both A&E and Duck Commander I'm sure have lawyers working around the clock to nail this thing down. I'm curious to see how the legalities play out. Yes, he has the right to freedom of speech, but as I understand it, that is in reference to the Government of the United States interfering with an individual's speech. I am not American so I'm sure I'm missing out on some of the finer points of how Freedom of Speech and Freedom of Religion ties in with the rights of an employer to fire/suspend/lay off an employee when it comes to words or actions that may be damaging to the parent company.

    Side note: I'd also be curious to see how this all plays out on another front. I'm fairly sure the LGBQ community wants him fired, and the Christians (and perhaps other religions) would like to see him brought back. At this point I'm not sure which group will be more upset -- and therefore present more of a "loss" to A&E.
    12-23-2013 04:13 PM
  24. plumbrich's Avatar
    During a G/L show they make a comment towards backward hillbilly rednecks. The Redneck community would respond "Who cares what the G/L community thinks." Now the Redneck show makes a comment towards the G/L community and its some kind of big deal people get fired and the media gets all upset.

    Having grown up on a farm in the South but traveled around the U.S. I find it some offensive when others speak bad of southerners or accuse everyone here as slave owners and racist. As a descendant of slaves I have no tolerance for people that believe in having slaves. However living here all my life I never met anyone from the south that wanted to bring back slavery so I wish people would quit bringing that up.

    If I see a guy dressed as a woman in public I see him no differently than someone with swastikas tattooed on their shaved head in public. They are both wanting a reaction and hoping it is negative so they can pounce.

    I think A&E knew all along Phil would say this knowing his beliefs so they could cash in on it.
    Serial Fordicator likes this.
    12-23-2013 04:25 PM
  25. Live2ride883's Avatar
    In response to:

    Exodus 35:2
    Six days work shall be done, but on the seventh day you shall have a Sabbath of solemn rest, holy to the Lord. Whoever does any work on it shall be put to death.

    I am not going to type the entire chapter, but start after Jesus tells the man to pick up his mat and walk. This took place on the sabbath.

    John chapter 5: and so the Jews said to the man who had been healed, "It is the sabbath, the law forbids you to carry your mat."

    So they asked him "who is this fellow who told you to pick it up and walk?"

    (Skipping ahead)

    The man went away and told the Jews it was Jesus who had made him well.

    So because was doing these things on the sabbath the Jews persecuted him.

    Jesus said to them "My father is always at his work to this very day, and I, too, am working"

    For this reason the Jews tried all the harder to kill him; not only was he breaking the sabbath, but he was calling God his own father, making himself equal with god.

    Jesus gave them this answer: "I tell you the truth, the Son can do nothing by himself; he can do only what he sees his father doing, because whatever the Father does the Son also
    does.

    For the Father loves the Son and shows him all he does. Yes, to your amazement he will show him even greater things than these.
    12-23-2013 04:52 PM
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