07-14-2014 07:46 AM
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  1. llamabreath's Avatar
    Either way, I am through with this thread. I should have known better to get involved to begin with. Enjoy the conversation, guys
    Feel like you just stepped out of a shark tank?

    07-15-2013 02:42 PM
  2. DS1331's Avatar
    What we have is a young man who used drugs and was a trouble maker. He was sent to his father and was unknown in the neighborhood. We have a watch in this community due to thefts. The young man was hiding in the shadows and instead of going into his home he chose to circle around and attack Zimmerman. After breaking his nose and pounding his head against the concrete saw the gun and informed Zimmerman that he was going to die and that's when Trayvon was shot. This should not have gone to trial and would not have without outside pressure. Numerous mock grand juries chose not to bring to trial which is why they went without one. We should ask ourselves why Trayvon chose to attack a stranger? Why not go home or inform Zimmerman that his father lived there. People also forget Zimmerman is about 5 foot 8 and Trayvon over 6 foot.

    Sent from my EVO using AC Forums mobile app
    Wtf planet are you on

    Sent from my HTC One using AC Forums mobile app
    07-15-2013 03:13 PM
  3. mhenne4's Avatar
    Wtf planet are you on

    Sent from my HTC One using AC Forums mobile app
    Im confused about what you dont understand.
    07-15-2013 03:33 PM
  4. pappy53's Avatar
    Not according to wikipedia. Shooting of Trayvon Martin - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Martin was 5 ft 11 in and 158 pounds.
    Zimmerman is 5 ft 7 in and 185 pounds
    Zimmerman also outweighed Martin by 27 pounds.
    And Martin was trained in MMA, so weight difference doesn't matter much. Being high on pot probably had a lot to do with Martin's decision-making. Sober, and he might have walked away. Or maybe not, as it seems that he was somewhat of a thug.
    07-15-2013 03:59 PM
  5. GadgetGator's Avatar
    This case has nothing to do with drinking or voting rights either.
    Let me know when those issues are being debated in a closed thread..or any thread at all for that matter. No one has a horse in a drinking or voting rights race here. It just isn't an issue that anyone is debating. Which is why I specifically used it in my example. There's passion for the other subject on your part. There's no passion on my part on the other things. Big difference.

    Direct order from who? Large sad news people, the 911 operator isnt a cop nor an officer of the law. He/she is nothing more than someone that connects people to the police or rescue. They have ZERO authority to compell a person to do anything.
    Perhaps, however he was told that they didn't need him to follow him. But more importantly, it's against the neighborhood watch rules as well. That point keeps getting lost in all of this. If Zimmerman had FOLLOWED PROPER PROCEDURES, there wouldn't have been anyone killed that night.

    It sucks that this 17 yr old is dead, I feel terrible for his family but when you look at his history (he was expelled from school for fighting and sent to an alternative school) its not a stretch to think he started another fight, a fight that he lost badly.

    TM wasnt the angel he has been shown as by the media.
    Have you looked into GZ's history? It's not exactly a picture postcard either. GZ isn't the angel that some people out there (and here) want to portray him as either.

    Yes, he was high on marijuana.
    Which makes people mellow....not fight.

    What we have is a young man who used drugs and was a trouble maker. He was sent to his father and was unknown in the neighborhood. We have a watch in this community due to thefts. The young man was hiding in the shadows and instead of going into his home he chose to circle around and attack Zimmerman. After breaking his nose and pounding his head against the concrete saw the gun and informed Zimmerman that he was going to die and that's when Trayvon was shot. This should not have gone to trial and would not have without outside pressure. Numerous mock grand juries chose not to bring to trial which is why they went without one. We should ask ourselves why Trayvon chose to attack a stranger? Why not go home or inform Zimmerman that his father lived there.
    Have you not read any of the post in this thread? I clearly explained why he might not have gone home...cause his 12 year old brother was home alone there. Would you lead someone stalking you straight to your house and your little brother????

    Now the question I have, is why do you believe all that other stuff to be true? One person already declined to answer that question in this thread, instead treating this situation more like a religious crusade then a legal matter. I'm still looking for an answer of why the only man living is automatically assumed to be giving a correct account of the events as they happened (when he has lied on other things). And I am also wondering why no one STILL...8 pages in now, has been able to answer ANY of those lies and inconsistencies that I listed and pointed out way back on page 2.

    Logically things just don't add up in the story.
    DS1331 likes this.
    07-15-2013 04:05 PM
  6. pappy53's Avatar
    Which makes people mellow....not fight
    Not always.
    Live2ride883 likes this.
    07-15-2013 04:08 PM
  7. jdbii's Avatar
    And Martin was trained in MMA, so weight difference doesn't matter much. Being high on pot probably had a lot to do with Martin's decision-making. Sober, and he might have walked away. Or maybe not, as it seems that he was somewhat of a thug.
    I never knew pot to make somebody violent as opposed to crank, meth, or cocaine. Stoners seem mellow and easygoing. Anyways, it doesn't matter. If you want to bring in Trayvon's past and propensity for thuggish behavior and other things that discredit him then the argument cuts both ways and Zimmerman has a number of his own skeletons in the closet that paint a sad picture against women and (allegedly) children. Domestic Violence and George Zimmerman.
    GadgetGator likes this.
    07-15-2013 04:09 PM
  8. pappy53's Avatar
    The racial angle is kind of hard to throw away, when Zimmerman specifically racially profiled and targeted a young man, and then confronted him after specifically being told not to by a 911 emergency dispatcher.
    No indication of racial profiling.
    911 dispatcher is not an authority, so no need to follow their orders. With recent break-ins in the neighborhood, Zimmerman had a right to follow him.
    Live2ride883 likes this.
    07-15-2013 04:14 PM
  9. HalizDad's Avatar
    Not replying to anyone in particular, but the JURY said not guilty... Trayvon could have run off, but he stopped, hid somewhere, then attacked Zimmerman according to Zimmerman. If I lived in a neighborhood that needed a neighborhood watch, I would have followed Trayvon, also, albeit a little more discreetly. Fortunately, I live on 15 acres... If you get past the dogs, I've got you sighted in already.

    Sent from my HTCONE using AC Forums mobile app
    Live2ride883 likes this.
    07-15-2013 04:16 PM
  10. jdbii's Avatar
    No indication of racial profiling.
    911 dispatcher is not an authority, so no need to follow their orders. With recent break-ins in the neighborhood, Zimmerman had a right to follow him.
    There are counter-points to all of these points. Ask any police officer if Zimmerman should have gotten out of his car. Zimmerman may have had a right to follow, but Trayvon equally had a right to walk on the street. I hold Zimmerman to a higher standard since he was the adult and he was armed and he had be advised by 911 not to engage.
    GadgetGator likes this.
    07-15-2013 04:19 PM
  11. HalizDad's Avatar
    I wish they had an actual recording between Trayvon and that "Black English" speaker before it happened... I think she instigated the confrontation through peer pressure... Can't be proved, but that's what the gut tells me.

    Sent from my HTCONE using AC Forums mobile app
    07-15-2013 04:20 PM
  12. pappy53's Avatar
    There are counter-points to all of these points. Ask any police officer if Zimmerman should have gotten out of his car. Zimmerman may have had a right to follow, but Trayvon equally had a right to walk on the street. I hold Zimmerman to a higher standard since he was the adult and he was armed and he had be advised by 911 not to engage.
    But Martin had no right to attack him.
    07-15-2013 04:32 PM
  13. cdmjlt369's Avatar
    The bottom line is Zimmerman broke no laws. Also, I can tell you this much. if I'm leaving my driveway and I see someone standing between my house and my neighbors house and I have never seen them before, I'm going to be nosey and go find out what's going on . I hardly think that would call for somebody attacking me.

    Sent from my SCH-I535 using AC Forums mobile app
    moosc likes this.
    07-15-2013 04:37 PM
  14. jdbii's Avatar
    But Martin had no right to attack him.
    We don't know that that's what happened. We never will. That is why he was acquitted, but I am sort of perplexed why people are so willing to assume Zimmerman's side of the story.
    GadgetGator and Aquila like this.
    07-15-2013 04:37 PM
  15. jdbii's Avatar
    Why does everybody say over and over again that Trayvon attacked him? Is that indisputably factually correct?
    07-15-2013 04:39 PM
  16. llamabreath's Avatar
    We don't know that that's what happened. We never will. That is why he was acquitted, but I am sort of perplexed why people are so willing to assume Zimmerman's side of the story.
    People aren't necessarily believing Zimmerman 100%

    All he needed was reasonable doubt to be acquitted. And in this case, there's alot.

    jdbii likes this.
    07-15-2013 04:40 PM
  17. jdbii's Avatar
    People aren't necessarily believing Zimmerman 100%

    All he needed was reasonable doubt to be acquitted. And in this case, there's alot.

    My personal opinion is that there was not a lot of reasonable doubt, but I feel very strongly that the state's prosecutors did not prove their case at trial.
    07-15-2013 04:51 PM
  18. jdpj2008's Avatar
    Not replying to anyone in particular, but the JURY said not guilty... Trayvon could have run off, but he stopped, hid somewhere, then attacked Zimmerman according to Zimmerman. If I lived in a neighborhood that needed a neighborhood watch, I would have followed Trayvon, also, albeit a little more discreetly. Fortunately, I live on 15 acres... If you get past the dogs, I've got you sighted in already.

    Sent from my HTCONE using AC Forums mobile app
    Not disagreeing with the entirety of your posts. But we don't really know if travon actually hid and jumped him. As you said it boils down to what Zimmeran says. The start of the confrontation is unknown. But he gets the benefit of not having a dead 17 year old give his side of the story. I don't like the law because it can't be applied equally to everyone.

    sent from my soon to be replaced HTC Rezound
    07-15-2013 04:52 PM
  19. Live2ride883's Avatar
    Let me know when those issues are being debated in a closed thread..or any thread at all for that matter. No one has a horse in a drinking or voting rights race here. It just isn't an issue that anyone is debating. Which is why I specifically used it in my example. There's passion for the other subject on your part. There's no passion on my part on the other things. Big difference.
    I am not being argumentative here, but honestly I didn't really have a horse in that other thread either.

    While you might not see drinking ages as a passionate issue you should go talk to my brother who has 2 sons and a son in law in Afghanistan, and cannot even legally buy or drink a beer, but yet they can risk their lives for our country.

    But you have to see the hypocrisy in what you stated, and then arguing against what I said.
    07-15-2013 04:53 PM
  20. cdmjlt369's Avatar
    Even the prosecution had reasonable doubt. They ran 3 mock grand jury to see what the outcome would be and didn't even get close. That's why the prosecution went ahead and filed the case and bypassed the grand jury. They had over a year to search through this evidence and couldn't find anything that would help the prosecution. On top of that ,the prosecution withheld evidence from the defense. So I think there was plenty of reasonable doubt.

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    07-15-2013 05:06 PM
  21. Live2ride883's Avatar
    I've made several comments about the DOJ investigating/reinvestigating this for civil rights violations. Today I found this:

    Justice Department Investigating Federal Charges Against George Zimmerman - The Free Patriot
    07-15-2013 05:10 PM
  22. Kevin OQuinn's Avatar
    Can THIS be the end of the discussion?



    EVERYTHING IS SPECULATION.

    Be sure to click the link.....
    jdbii, Aquila, GadgetGator and 1 others like this.
    07-15-2013 05:11 PM
  23. Aquila's Avatar
    Can THIS be the end of the discussion?



    EVERYTHING IS SPECULATION.

    Be sure to click the link.....
    In the immortal words of the recent president, "I think we all agree, the past is behind us".

    Transmitted through spacetime.
    Kevin OQuinn likes this.
    07-15-2013 05:36 PM
  24. jdbii's Avatar
    Kevin, excellent link. If you don't mind I'd like to paste the three best points I thought were made in it.

    Not knowing exactly what happened requires a not guilty verdict, no matter how angry or outraged you are. The jury didn't free Zimmerman because they thought he was a good guy or because they weren't sad that a young boy was killed (jurors were rumored to be crying during the state's rebuttal), they found him not guilty because the facts and the law required them to do so.

    The state had a crappy case, they knew they had a crappy case. This is why they assigned 3 career prosecutors with a combined stat of probably over 500 trials. Their first problem was no witnesses to the event. You would agree, wouldn't you, that witnesses help prove cases? Their second problem was a tape that no one could agree on. You know whose voice was on that tape? I don't. The state never laid out, point by point, what happened. If I'm being asked to convict someone of a crime, and I know the state has the burden of proof, the state is required to tell me what happened, not just ask questions and tell me "you decide" over and over again.

    Juries don't make decisions because they are mad, sad, angry, or feel bad for someone's parents.
    Kevin OQuinn likes this.
    07-15-2013 05:39 PM
  25. Kevin OQuinn's Avatar
    Shame on you guys for not reading THIS and clicking the link there. LOL

    #seewhatididthere?
    jdbii likes this.
    07-15-2013 05:52 PM
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