07-14-2014 07:46 AM
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  1. Serial Fordicator's Avatar
    First is a discussion thread,if there was only 1 view there would be no thread. The reason I respond is to hopefully one day to get alteast one to realise society can operate fine without out guns. There is no tyranny, I would love to see how guns keep the government in check... Egypt is a good example -_- the media is not what causes people to lash out, they don't always do it for attention. Weaponry, Luke semi's, allows those who can to lash out affect large quantities of people.

    - Android Central App. Remember courage is contagious.
    There may not be tyranny now, but there may be later. And trust me, if your government ever becomes tyrannical, you will want someone with a gun to help.

    As far as seeing how guns keep govt. in check? Simple, everyone answers to those above them. Take for example, our goverment outlaws all guns and looks to law enforcement to confiscate. After seeing 3+ officers shot per every gun you try to take, you won't want to be a law enforcement officer anymore.
    cdmjlt369 and qxr like this.
    09-19-2013 02:10 AM
  2. cdmjlt369's Avatar
    Actually when you buy the chemicals your put on a watch list and have the Feds coming to your house. E.g. if your buy the chemicals for thermite your flagged.

    - Android Central App. Remember courage is contagious.
    Your theory about being liscensed for a car vs a gun is flawed. People find their way behind the wheel of a car without a liscense often. So again, lets get rid of cars since we cant properly regulate them. There are ways around being flagged for chemicals. They flag people who buy guns legally. There is so much disinformation in your last post its not even worth going through and picking apart. But if you want real world evidence and you think tyranny is a far fetched idea, watch this video and try to explain it to these several different groups of people. They all had one thing in common. Before they were destroyed, guns were banned, then millions of people died. A common theme after gun control throughout history. This is historical documentation.




    Sent from my SCH-I535 using AC Forums mobile app
    09-19-2013 02:26 AM
  3. festinator's Avatar
    Your theory about being liscensed for a car vs a gun is flawed. People find their way behind the wheel of a car without a liscense often. So again, lets get rid of cars since we cant properly regulate them. There are ways around being flagged for chemicals. They flag people who buy guns legally. There is so much disinformation in your last post its not even worth going through and picking apart. But if you want real world evidence and you think tyranny is a far fetched idea, watch this video and try to explain it to these several different groups of people. They all had one thing in common. Before they were destroyed, guns were banned, then millions of people died. A common theme after gun control throughout history. This is historical documentation.




    Sent from my SCH-I535 using AC Forums mobile app
    The difference between cars and guns though, is that guns have no other use but to kill. This cars argument is not a good one so stop using it. Deaths by vehicles are vastly accidental. Can you say the same for guns?

    Sent from my Nexus 4 using AC Forums mobile app
    Fairclough likes this.
    09-19-2013 06:26 AM
  4. anon(430792)'s Avatar
    My post was sarcastic I don't want a bomb. With guns innocent lives are lost shoot! You give a blind man a gun how the hell is he meant to shoot? Theoretically a nuke can reverse the extreme weather conditions from gw. Just an odd fact.


    We do try and reduce road deaths, but funny when it comes to doing any measure to reduce gun deaths a big... That's my right comes up.

    - Android Central App. Remember courage is contagious.
    I agree, innocent people die from gun crimes. I would also say removing guns from a country has a good chance of reducing gun crimes. But the question I have to wonder is: will removing guns from a country reduce the overall mortality rate? I don't think anyone knows (for the U.S. at least).
    I see a lot of arguments for gun control citing gun related deaths as a reason. However, I haven't seen any list the overall mortality, or even crime related mortality rate, as a reason for gun control.

    On the nuclear weapon reversing global warming: I should have looked into that more carefully. But the nuclear winter is actually bad for crops. I wish it wasn't just so someone could tell people "I save the environment by blowing stuff up." It would be similar to fixing a computer by hitting it.
    Fairclough likes this.
    09-19-2013 07:38 AM
  5. cdmjlt369's Avatar
    The difference between cars and guns though, is that guns have no other use but to kill. This cars argument is not a good one so stop using it. Deaths by vehicles are vastly accidental. Can you say the same for guns?

    Sent from my Nexus 4 using AC Forums mobile app
    Total nonsense. My firearms are used for recreational target shooting. None of my firearms have been used to shoot anyone or in commission of a crime. Anti gun people like to throw that a guns only purpose junk around. Just because you don't like it doesn't make the car point invalid. People still die by car and at a much higher rate. Most of it boils down to neglect. Texting while driving, dui, not paying attention, speeding. A 2, 000 lb bullet.

    Sent from my SCH-I535 using AC Forums mobile app
    qxr and Live2ride883 like this.
    09-19-2013 07:49 AM
  6. qxr's Avatar
    "COMMON ANTI-GUN DEBATES YOU GUYS USE
    1. Gun control doesnt work.

    Anyone who knows how to use Google can disprove this argument. Its common knowledge that the states with the most stringent gun control policies hold lower rates of gun violence than states with the least control. Look at Australia: In the aftermath of a mass shooting in 1996, Australia enacted sweeping gun control, including an assault weapons ban and increased background checks. How many mass shootings have occurred since then? You got it. 0."

    Chicago - toughest gun laws in our country... yet one of the highest murder rates in last two years. Think those guns are legally registered and owned?
    Congrats on the 0 mass murders.
    Sandy Hook, Arizona, Colorado & Virginia Tech. - failure of the mental health system to protect the citizens. In fact in Conn. you can blame the ACLU for blocking the assisted care act to allow for families to commit those who have become a danger or at least have them confined & evaluated. The mother who was killed was trying to have her son committed but was killed before she could make that happen. The other 3 have clear indications of being schizophrenic, which manifests,generally, in males in their 20s. We have an issue with this we need to address but obamacare is going to kill mental health care even more.

    "2. Gun control wont prevent another Sandy Hook.
    This argument makes absolutely no sense. The point of gun control laws is to threaten would-be criminals with penalties if they so choose to break the law. If we dont enact laws simply because they wont prevent heinous acts from continuing, why do we have laws against murder? Rape? Theft? The law is used to create a disincentive for potential criminals who would otherwise commit the acts laws seek to prohibit and punish."

    You cannot reason with a schizophrenic, esp. when they are off their medications.

    I am a woman with concealed carry permit. Most of my friends both men & women are as well. We take our responsibilities seriously and we will walk away to avoid confrontation. Further drawing a weapon is not my idea of conflict resolution. You will find most gun owners do that as well, because of the awesome power of our weapons. I grew up going to the range with my parents and learned gun safety first.

    Statistics can be manipulated to show just about anything.
    09-19-2013 09:27 AM
  7. Scott7217's Avatar
    Water boiling on the stove to make pasta can be a "deadly weapon".
    So, is boiling water the deadliest civilian weapon you can think of?
    09-19-2013 12:34 PM
  8. llamabreath's Avatar
    So, is boiling water the deadliest civilian weapon you can think of?
    I never said it is.
    I thought my point was obvious.

    09-19-2013 12:40 PM
  9. Scott7217's Avatar
    I never said it is.
    I thought my point was obvious.
    I understand your point that anything can be a weapon. That is an excellent point, and I do appreciate the comment.

    Let me rephrase my question. Can you think of anything else that would be deadlier than boiling water?
    09-19-2013 01:00 PM
  10. llamabreath's Avatar
    I understand your point that anything can be a weapon. That is an excellent point, and I do appreciate the comment.

    Let me rephrase my question. Can you think of anything else that would be deadlier than boiling water?
    Of course.

    Gas station sushi.

    09-19-2013 01:04 PM
  11. Scott7217's Avatar
    Of course.

    Gas station sushi.
    I honestly haven't seen gas station sushi before in person, but I could see this being a possibility.

    Can you explain how gas station sushi would be deadlier than boiling water?
    09-19-2013 01:17 PM
  12. llamabreath's Avatar
    I honestly haven't seen gas station sushi before in person, but I could see this being a possibility.

    Can you explain how gas station sushi would be deadlier than boiling water?
    No, not really.

    09-19-2013 01:22 PM
  13. Scott7217's Avatar
    No, not really.
    That's too bad. If you change your mind, I would be glad to hear your explanation on the comparative lethal properties of gas station sushi and boiling water.

    If you were in a situation where a criminal was about to kill you, which would you rather have to defend yourself? Boiling water or gas station sushi?
    09-19-2013 01:28 PM
  14. Scott7217's Avatar
    Yeah, and to think some states won't let you deer hunt with a .223 round because its not deadly enough.
    Was this also an issue with military rounds? I heard that the US military was thinking of moving to 6.8 mm because the 5.56 mm NATO round needed multiple hits to bring down an enemy combatant.
    09-19-2013 01:32 PM
  15. Serial Fordicator's Avatar
    09-19-2013 05:34 PM
  16. Live2ride883's Avatar
    You know these won't count, will be ignored, or dismissed as isolated incidents.....
    qxr and Serial Fordicator like this.
    09-19-2013 06:48 PM
  17. Serial Fordicator's Avatar
    Was this also an issue with military rounds? I heard that the US military was thinking of moving to 6.8 mm because the 5.56 mm NATO round needed multiple hits to bring down an enemy combatant.
    Yes. The 5.56 round tumbles and there is not alot of recoil. It is also accurate. That is why the military used it. It just doesn't have alot of knockdown power.
    09-19-2013 10:24 PM
  18. festinator's Avatar
    You know these won't count, will be ignored, or dismissed as isolated incidents.....
    http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/3941889

    And we know you guys will also disregard this too and make excuses for them won't you?

    Sent from my Nexus 4 using AC Forums mobile app
    09-19-2013 11:48 PM
  19. Jennifer Stough's Avatar
    Just stopping by to remind you guys to keep it civil. It hasn't gotten too out of hand yet, but let's remember to keep our information and discussion in a manner that doesn't disrespect or belittle another's beliefs or intellect. Some posts as of late have started to become borderline.

    Sent from my Nexus 7 using AC Forums mobile app
    Aquila likes this.
    09-20-2013 01:09 AM
  20. Live2ride883's Avatar
    There Have Been More Mass Shootings Since Newtown Than You've Heard About (INFOGRAPHIC)

    And we know you guys will also disregard this too and make excuses for them won't you?

    Sent from my Nexus 4 using AC Forums mobile app
    “Lets break down the numbers from the CDC

    There are roughly 32,000 deaths a year is the US and declining from Gun Violence

    60% Are suicides thats 19,200
    3% are accidentals that's 960
    4% are justified that's 1,280
    33% are homicides that's 10,560
    80% of homicides are gang related. That's 8,448

    That leaves 1,712 in a society of 312 million people.

    That leaves a 0.00010256410256 chance of death by gun.
    0.000008564102564 if you don't hang out in the hood, are not planning on committing suicide, and not planning a crime.

    Let's do what we can, but let's not be unreasonable.”

    Nov5th: Lets break down the numbers from the CDC There are
    qxr likes this.
    09-20-2013 01:24 AM
  21. festinator's Avatar
    Lets break down the numbers from the CDC

    There are roughly 32,000 deaths a year is the US and declining from Gun Violence

    60% Are suicides thats 19,200
    3% are accidentals that's 960
    4% are justified that's 1,280
    33% are homicides that's 10,560
    80% of homicides are gang related. That's 8,448

    That leaves 1,712 in a society of 312 million people.

    That leaves a 0.00010256410256 chance of death by gun.
    0.000008564102564 if you don't hang out in the hood, are not planning on committing suicide, and not planning a crime.

    Let's do what we can, but let's not be unreasonable.

    Nov5th: Lets break down the numbers from the CDC There are
    I see my previous post was completely disregarded.. I just don't see why you're so against something that is trying to save lives, just so you can do some recreational shooting at targets. But I'm just an 18 year old Canadian boy so what do I know? I shouldn't even be in this conversation I suppose.

    Sent from my Nexus 4 using AC Forums mobile app
    09-20-2013 01:52 AM
  22. Live2ride883's Avatar
    I see my previous post was completely disregarded.. I just don't see why you're so against something that is trying to save lives, just so you can do some recreational shooting at targets. But I'm just an 18 year old Canadian boy so what do I know? I shouldn't even be in this conversation I suppose.

    Sent from my Nexus 4 using AC Forums mobile app
    I am not against saving lives, and no one stated that you or anyone else could not take part in this discussion.

    Let's look at what causes gun violence suicides, homicides, reduce crime. Instead of creating more laws and outlawing firearms which will do nothing to address the underlying crime problem.
    qxr likes this.
    09-20-2013 02:47 AM
  23. Aquila's Avatar
    My .02

    I believe that discovering and acting upon root causes are incredibly relevant and highly important. For the play on words based analogy, if you think of crime, poverty and violence as a systemic system of nodes similar to a lawn that's infiltrated by weeds. Maybe we think of the leaves of each weed as a tragedy. If you do nothing, the weeds take over, the whole lawn grows nothing but tragedies. You can pass laws against weeds, nothing happens. You can mow the lawn (short term, tactical reform), the leaves are dead... but the roots are still there, and the weeds come back, more leaves appear in short order. Strategic improvement requires finding and destroying the roots. That being said, if you're one of the 8.6E-06 innocent people who's life is devastated by one of those leaves falling upon your spouse, or child or friend...

    Festinator, your opinions are valued here. Hearing only one side of an issue all day long creates nothing but an echo chamber, and so we want a broad spectrum of opinions and sources of information. In forums, especially in a political context, we're not always going to agree. I'd still encourage you to voice your ideas and be open minded when hearing those of people who look at it differently. As Jennifer indicated, if we can talk about these things civilly and keep the conversations focused on issues, sometimes we learn something and sometimes we teach. We're not going to solve very many political issues in these threads, but maybe we can all come away with a broader understanding of the topics at hand.
    msndrstood and qxr like this.
    09-20-2013 03:13 AM
  24. Fairclough's Avatar
    I did read these. Using nothingistrue example. Why did the students have guns, why did they have automatic weapons. Yo take the root out (shooters) you remove their tool the gun. If they didn't have the gun they couldn't shoot. As for the quoting of me, out shooters had mental issues too but since their guns were removed there hasn't been any. To simple just shoot shooters down is like spraying pesticide, it occasionally works but sometimes when it fails it trains the whole lawn.

    - Android Central App. Remember courage is contagious.
    msndrstood likes this.
    09-20-2013 03:31 AM
  25. Fairclough's Avatar
    I agree, innocent people die from gun crimes. I would also say removing guns from a country has a good chance of reducing gun crimes. But the question I have to wonder is: will removing guns from a country reduce the overall mortality rate? I don't think anyone knows (for the U.S. at least).
    I see a lot of arguments for gun control citing gun related deaths as a reason. However, I haven't seen any list the overall mortality, or even crime related mortality rate, as a reason for gun control.

    On the nuclear weapon reversing global warming: I should have looked into that more carefully. But the nuclear winter is actually bad for crops. I wish it wasn't just so someone could tell people "I save the environment by blowing stuff up." It would be similar to fixing a computer by hitting it.
    The nuclear clearing of storms is silly but possible.

    In Australia it dropped suicide rates by 60% as it was determined it is often a spur in the moment event, if you remove the gun they have more time to think it over and talk themselves out of it.

    Our large scale murder rates by guns dived. If you watch the daily show gun debate, it shows our prime minister who implemented it and factual in an funny way.

    - Android Central App. Remember courage is contagious.
    msndrstood likes this.
    09-20-2013 03:39 AM
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