07-14-2014 07:46 AM
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  1. Aquila's Avatar
    From FB

    "BOSTON, 4/19 - National guard units seeking to confiscate a cache of recently banned assault weapons were ambushed on April 19th by elements of a para-military extremist faction. Military and law enforcement sources estimate that 72 were killed and more than 200 injured before government forces were compelled to withdraw.

    Speaking after the clash Massachusetts Governor Thomas Gage declared that the extremist faction, which was made up of local citizens, has links to the radical right-wing tax protest movement.

    Gage also blamed the extremists for recent incidents of vandalism directed against internal revenue offices. The governor, who described the group's organizers as "criminals," issued an executive order authorizing the summary arrest of any individual who has interfered with the government's efforts to secure law and order. The military raid on the extremist arsenal followed wide-spread refusal by the local citizenry to turn over recently outlawed assault weapons.

    Gage issued a ban on military-style assault weapons and ammunition earlier in the week. This decision followed a meeting in early this month between government and military leaders at which the governor authorized the forcible confiscation of illegal arms.

    One government official, speaking on condition of anonymity, pointed out that "none of these people would have been killed had the extremists obeyed the law and turned over their weapons voluntarily." Government troops initially succeeded in confiscating a large supply of outlawed weapons and ammunition. However, troops attempting to seize arms and ammunition in Lexington met with resistance from heavily-armed extremists who had been tipped off regarding the government's plans.

    During a tense standoff in Lexington's town park, National Guard Colonel Francis Smith, commander of the government operation, ordered the armed group to surrender and return to their homes. The impasse was broken by a single shot, which was reportedly fired by one of the right-wing extremists.

    Eight civilians were killed in the ensuing exchange. Ironically, the local citizenry blamed government forces rather than the extremists for the civilian deaths. Before order could be restored, armed citizens from surrounding areas had descended upon the guard units.

    Colonel Smith, finding his forces overmatched by the armed mob, ordered a retreat. Governor Gage has called upon citizens to support the state/national joint task force in its effort to restore law and order. The governor also demanded the surrender of those responsible for planning and leading the attack against the government troops.

    Samuel Adams, Paul Revere, and John Hancock, who have been identified as "ringleaders" of the extremist faction, remain at large."

    All of this transpired on April the 19th and 20th, in the year 1775.
    You can tell it takes about the entire article to tell that it is just a recount of what happened.
    Hopefully you'll see now that these Libertarians/Extremists aren't so extreme after all.
    They're actually pretty logical.
    Lots of poetic license taken, but all in all, it's well done. If and when a confiscation mission begins, unless the nation has revoked the 2nd amendment (not sure that's possible, given the following point), then fighting back against the illegal seizure is warranted; especially when you are in rebellion against what you believe to be an unlawful government.

    Going back to our human rights discussion, obviously they didn't have a 2nd amendment back then; it'd be 15 more years before they would get one ratified by the new Congress... but they fought for that Right anyways.
    05-09-2013 10:32 PM
  2. Aquila's Avatar
    I guess here is my main question about the gun control protest. Why are they protesting at a federal level? The federal government just had an opportunity to debate gun control legislation and they agree they're not going to do a damn thing. Some state legislatures are passing regulations, why not protest at that level? It seems weird to say, "hey, I know you guys already backed off any potential of restricting firearms, but just so you know, we're pissed anyways." I get being vigilant, but the fight was already won, at least for now. Is the protest a celebration of victory? Or just a year or two head start on the next time it will be blocked in the senate?
    05-10-2013 12:59 AM
  3. stunx120fshwf's Avatar
    Australia has strict gun control, a tiny fraction of the gun deaths, 1/10 the imprisonment, but I understand your afraid, like any warzone, so many of your neighbours have guns. Chicken and egg, as many people in the US die from guns as car crashes, cars have killed more US citizens than War, since WWII. Most gun deaths are a man killing his wife and or children, since the advent of Reaganomics the average citizen there has gained 1 cent in the dollar. Even the rich have only doubled their money in 30 years, in China in that time they've gone from famine to 800 million middle income. Chinese poor are 10 times as wealthy, middle class 50X, rich 400X. In the midst of exponential technological progress, 4 years more education per person, access to 10X the capital, the US managed to have a fourty year great stagnation. They've paid for their poverty by going into private and government debt, what happened, you land on the Moon and then instead of entering an episode of the Jetsons, you went into an episode of the Flintstones. Now the emerging economies are worth more than the developed ones, government of the executives, by the corporate lawyers and for the speculators. It's brought down government of the consumer, by the shareholder, for the employees, all you had to do was produce aluminium, 4 cylinder cars, 4 decades ago and you'd have been as rich as Cresus.

    Posted via Android Central App
    rexxman and GadgetGator like this.
    05-10-2013 02:16 PM
  4. Live2ride883's Avatar
    Also, IF this armed protest actually happens just think of the possibilities that a "false flag" operation would open up at an event like this....
    05-10-2013 09:46 PM
  5. Aquila's Avatar
    Also, IF this armed protest actually happens just think of the possibilities that a "false flag" operation would open up at an event like this....
    Right, the possibility of someone wanting it to go wrong is high on both sides of the issue. If that were to happen, maybe the truth would come out... but really, short of video of whoever started it and proof they were paid, threatened, coerced or employed to start things, how would we ever know? Would it ever even matter? The backlash could be devastating. Regardless of what ignites it, there is just no upside to this if something were to go wrong.
    05-10-2013 09:49 PM
  6. Live2ride883's Avatar
    Most gun deaths are a man killing his wife and or children,
    Please back this information up...
    Serial Fordicator likes this.
    05-10-2013 09:50 PM
  7. msndrstood's Avatar
    Also, IF this armed protest actually happens just think of the possibilities that a "false flag" operation would open up at an event like this....
    Wait... Are you agreeing that this is a bad idea?!

    What?! ...I'm msndrstood.
    via Gnex
    05-11-2013 10:34 AM
  8. Live2ride883's Avatar
    Wait... Are you agreeing that this is a bad idea?!

    What?! ...I'm msndrstood.
    via Gnex
    Try reading it, not reading into it.
    05-11-2013 06:18 PM
  9. dchawk81's Avatar
    Since the article states that sexual assault is the term that Aus. uses to describe rape then it becomes clear that they are stating that rape (sexual assault) increased 29.9%. If this included arse touching or grabbing the article would had stated this.

    Even IF under some extreme circumstance you could get the criminals to give up their guns, every last one of them I would not turn mine in. Simply because then the government would be the only ones to have them. Our founding fathers understood what it was like to live under tyrannical rule. So while our right to bear arms is and extension of our natural right to self defense, it is also to defend our way of life from a tyrannical government.

    Here is a link to our Constitution for reference.

    Constitution of the United States - Official
    The US Government could easily take you out with a drone.
    05-11-2013 06:54 PM
  10. Aquila's Avatar
    The US Government could easily take you out with a drone.
    It would be incredibly rude for them to do so.
    rexxman likes this.
    05-11-2013 06:56 PM
  11. dchawk81's Avatar
    It would be incredibly rude for them to do so.
    That, and it would ruin your suit.
    05-11-2013 06:58 PM
  12. dchawk81's Avatar
    But seriously, the whole notion of standing up against a tyrannical government that has nuclear weapons with your trusty 12 gauge is just absurd.

    The masses are too well fed with social programs or a general satisfaction with their lifestyle to stand up, organize, and revolt whether armed or not. People can't even give up their cell phones...forget asking them to sacrifice everything for the common good of new government.

    The small groups with both balls and means end up cornered in Waco and taken out.
    GadgetGator likes this.
    05-11-2013 06:59 PM
  13. Live2ride883's Avatar
    But seriously, the whole notion of standing up against a tyrannical government that has nuclear weapons with your trusty 12 gauge is just absurd.

    The masses are too well fed with social programs or a general satisfaction with their lifestyle to stand up, organize, and revolt whether armed or not. People can't even give up their cell phones...forget asking them to sacrifice everything for the common good of new government.

    The small groups with both balls and means end up cornered in Waco and taken out.
    I may not be able to stand up to the government by myself, even if you add others into the equation that feel the way I do when or if that time ever comes when we literally have to defend ourselves against tyranny. But honestly I would rather at least have a fighting chance.

    It may not mean much, but during the revolutionary war only about 3% of the population fought the British at any given time.
    jdbii likes this.
    05-11-2013 07:40 PM
  14. llamabreath's Avatar
    It would be incredibly rude for them to do so.
    LOL

    Come one, come all, hop on the Lllllllama Bandwagon! FREE POPCORN!!! You'll need it! (bring your own butter)
    05-11-2013 08:01 PM
  15. llamabreath's Avatar
    But seriously, the whole notion of standing up against a tyrannical government that has nuclear weapons with your trusty 12 gauge is just absurd.
    :thumbup: GREAT point. I don't think many of the 2nd Amendment trailblazers have thought about that.

    Come one, come all, hop on the Lllllllama Bandwagon! FREE POPCORN!!! You'll need it! (bring your own butter)
    05-11-2013 08:04 PM
  16. jdbii's Avatar
    Tyranny doesn't happen out of the blue all at once -- it is a slow, methodical, and systematic stripping away at rights. For instance, the Holocaust was a series of events that started slow. As the Nazis grew in power they stripped the Jews of more rights. The point of no return, and really that which sent millions of them to their death, was when the Nazis were able to force relocate them to Jewish ghettos. At that point the Jews were utterly defenseless.

    What small arms do for a civilian population is make it very hard and nearly impossible for any state actor to roll into your town or neighborhood and force you out of your homes. As far fetched as implausible as it may seem in the US, Canada, Mexico, or any other nation that a government might turn on its people, it is still likely to happen at least once every 100 generations. In truth it is an inevitability unless somehow humans as a race have evolved past tyranny. For those who support the 2nd Amendment in the US, (and I grudgingly count myself among them though I support more regulation), the right to bear arms is the ultimate guarantor of a free society.
    Aquila and Serial Fordicator like this.
    05-11-2013 08:19 PM
  17. llamabreath's Avatar
    Tyranny doesn't happen out of the blue all at once -- it is a slow, methodical, and systematic stripping away at rights. For instance, the Holocaust was a series of events that started slow. As the Nazis grew in power they stripped the Jews of more rights. The point of no return, and really that which sent millions of them to their death, was when the Nazis were able to force relocate them to Jewish ghettos. At that point the Jews were utterly defenseless.

    What small arms do for a civilian population is make it very hard and nearly impossible for any state actor to roll into your town or neighborhood and force you out of your homes. As far fetched as implausible as it may seem in the US, Canada, Mexico, or any other nation that a government might turn on its people, it is still likely to happen at least once every 100 generations. In truth it is an inevitability unless somehow humans as a race have evolved past tyranny. For those who support the 2nd Amendment in the US, (and I grudgingly count myself among them though I support more regulation), the right to bear arms is the ultimate guarantor of a free society.
    Disagree.
    No matter how many arms the citizens possess, they wouldn't be able to stop a Sherman tank from flattening them AND their house.
    The 2nd Amendment was written in different times. It's outdated compared to what the government has available to itself nowadays and I'm sure we can all agree that the government has things it can use that we don't even know about.

    Come one, come all, hop on the Lllllllama Bandwagon! FREE POPCORN!!! You'll need it! (bring your own butter)
    GadgetGator likes this.
    05-11-2013 08:32 PM
  18. jdbii's Avatar
    Disagree.
    No matter how many arms the citizens possess, they wouldn't be able to stop a Sherman tank from flattening them AND their house.
    The 2nd Amendment was written in different times. It's outdated compared to what the government has available to itself nowadays and I'm sure we can all agree that the government has things it can use that we don't even know about.

    Come one, come all, hop on the Lllllllama Bandwagon! FREE POPCORN!!! You'll need it! (bring your own butter)
    Point taken. It is not the same as a Sherman Tank flattening your house, but when I make the analogy to the Jews in Germany someone normally says to me something along the lines, "A single Jewish tailor with a pistol wouldn't have stopped the Holocaust." True, but it misses the point. It is a hundred Jews armed in a single apartment complex. Men armed who are protecting their families. And then times that by ten apartment buildings, so you have a thousand families armed in a neighborhood. So if you go back to 1933 the Nazis would not have been able to terrorize the Jews at will, and if they had, the Jews would have been able to defend themselves. At that point the Germans might have flattened a couple of apartment complexes and there would have been some kind of bloodbath, but in 1934 something like that would have alerted the world to how barbaric the Nazis were and the course of history would have been different.
    05-11-2013 08:49 PM
  19. jdbii's Avatar
    @llamabreath, I guess I didn't really directly answer your post now that I reread it. Yes, the full force of the US Government could flatten us all and then some, but it is not really about stopping Sherman Tanks.
    05-11-2013 09:01 PM
  20. llamabreath's Avatar
    .... something like that would have alerted the world to how barbaric the Nazis were and the course of history would have been different.
    By numerous accounts, the world WAS aware, yet chose to sit back and do nothing until the damage was done.
    Same thing (kinda ) as a dangerous intersection in a neighborhood. People can complain day & night that there's gonna be an accident one day, it needs a traffic light installed.
    Guess when it gets installed.
    AFTER someone gets killed.

    Come one, come all, hop on the Lllllllama Bandwagon! FREE POPCORN!!! You'll need it! (bring your own butter)
    05-11-2013 09:03 PM
  21. Aquila's Avatar
    By numerous accounts, the world WAS aware, yet chose to sit back and do nothing until the damage was done.
    Same thing (kinda ) as a dangerous intersection in a neighborhood. People can complain day & night that there's gonna be an accident one day, it needs a traffic light installed.
    Guess when it gets installed.
    AFTER someone gets killed.

    Come one, come all, hop on the Lllllllama Bandwagon! FREE POPCORN!!! You'll need it! (bring your own butter)
    good point.
    05-11-2013 09:05 PM
  22. llamabreath's Avatar
    @llamabreath, I guess I didn't really directly answer your post now that I reread it. Yes, the full force of the US Government could flatten us all and then some, but it is not really about stopping Sherman Tanks.
    But it may be one day.

    Come one, come all, hop on the Lllllllama Bandwagon! FREE POPCORN!!! You'll need it! (bring your own butter)
    05-11-2013 09:06 PM
  23. llamabreath's Avatar
    Disagree.
    No matter how many arms the citizens possess, they wouldn't be able to stop a Sherman tank from flattening them AND their house.
    The 2nd Amendment was written in different times.
    But then again, THIS guy was able to get it done. Who could forget this guy's bravery?

    (But then again, sad to say, he hasn't been seen since this day.)



    Come one, come all, hop on the Lllllllama Bandwagon! FREE POPCORN!!! You'll need it! (bring your own butter)
    jdbii likes this.
    05-11-2013 09:11 PM
  24. jdbii's Avatar
    But it may be one day.
    Then I hope Live2Ride is my neighbor. You think he'd defend a liberal like me?
    Aquila likes this.
    05-11-2013 09:12 PM
  25. jdbii's Avatar
    By numerous accounts, the world WAS aware, yet chose to sit back and do nothing until the damage was done.
    Same thing (kinda ) as a dangerous intersection in a neighborhood. People can complain day & night that there's gonna be an accident one day, it needs a traffic light installed.
    Guess when it gets installed.
    AFTER someone gets killed.

    Come one, come all, hop on the Lllllllama Bandwagon! FREE POPCORN!!! You'll need it! (bring your own butter)
    And that my friend (or conversation partner) is why the Jews would have been better off had Germany had some sort of 2nd Amendment, or tradition thereof, of their own. IMHO.
    05-11-2013 09:14 PM
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