04-23-2015 05:51 PM
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  1. Scott7217's Avatar
    You have to realize that the speed at which news traveled back then is different than how fast it travels now.
    I would say that if we had rapid access to news back in World War II, we would have intervened with military force sooner. It's too bad we didn't have things like the internet back then.
    09-05-2014 03:41 AM
  2. Scott7217's Avatar
    And then you have to also understand that it wasn't that long ago before the 1st World War was fought. You don't just jump right back into a war like it's some sort of weekend bar brawl.
    How long should we wait between armed conflicts?
    09-05-2014 03:46 AM
  3. Scott7217's Avatar
    The right wing need to understand that they lost in 2012. The American people flat out rejected their idea of dismantling the ACA, of their war mongering, of their "corporations are people" ideology. Thus, I have no problems with a President doing what he was voted into office for.
    The left also lost in 2000 and 2004 when George W. Bush got elected, but that didn't stop their efforts during his presidency. I wouldn't expect anything different from the right in 2014 during the Obama administration.

    I often wonder what would happen if Hillary Clinton were president instead. I think she would implement a more aggressive policy. There's no way she would let Putin get away with causing trouble under her watch.
    09-05-2014 04:06 AM
  4. anon8126715's Avatar
    How long should we wait between armed conflicts?
    It's not so much a matter of how long we "should" wait, it's a matter of how public opinion affects politicians' actions. I'm sure there was quite a lengthy recovery after WWI. You also have to consider how many lives we lost and how many more soldiers were hurt. Without having lived in that period, I can't say whether or not the U.S. was right in how long it took to get involved.

    If you think that the U.S. acted immoral in not entering WWII as fast as it did, what's your opinion of our inaction in Africa and Darfur?
    09-05-2014 05:24 AM
  5. anon8126715's Avatar
    Ooo, I want to see his response to this one.
    If he wasn't old enough to remember what it REALLY was like under Reagan then I doubt he'll have an answer. I was actually old enough to see what was going around during his administration. Reagan had no problem going against the working class. He threatened to fire Air Traffic controllers when they went on strike. I remember UAW was constantly on strike. Reagan's presidency marked the beginning of the rich getting richer while the working class was left holding the bag. But then why would you expect anymore from someone that made a career out of portraying someone in an alternate reality?
    A895, GadgetGator and msndrstood like this.
    09-05-2014 05:32 AM
  6. SteveISU's Avatar
    Ummm, yeah the rest of the world calls them "Facts", not "crackpot thesis'"....


    From an article on the Huffington Post. Who is More Conservative: Ronald Reagan or Barack Obama?*|*Cenk Uygur Sure you'll say it's a liberal bastion, but from their quote, let me know what you see that isn't right......
    IRCA gave legal status to those who applied and met specific criteria. Of the 4 million who applied only have qualified. It also created laws that put heavy fines on employers for hiring illegals from that point forward, but like most of our immigration laws, no one follows half of them.

    Overall Reagan was a tax cutter. To say he hiked taxes left and right is a willful obfuscation of the facts. There is a difference between a cigarette tax and a hike to someones income tax. Ending certain deductions is not a tax hike. Most conservatives today have no issues closing loopholes. He did agree to $1 tax increase to $3 spending cut with Tip O'Neil but we all know he reneged on that one. He got Cap Gains down to 20% then raised it to 28% but offset that by lowering the top marginal rate from 50% to 28%. He simplified the tax code and indexed it for inflation which was huge because people were being pushed into higher tax brackets at the time. Overall Reagan was a tax cutter.

    Negotiating with the evil empire? Many view Reagan as the driving force that ended the cold war.

    Even Reagan stated the Iran Contra was a mistake and he regrets what went down (some without his knowledge).
    09-05-2014 10:39 AM
  7. Scott7217's Avatar
    It's not so much a matter of how long we "should" wait, it's a matter of how public opinion affects politicians' actions.
    How would public opinion affect Obama, especially given the fact that he can't run for office again due to term limits?
    09-05-2014 01:53 PM
  8. Scott7217's Avatar
    I'm sure there was quite a lengthy recovery after WWI.
    Basically, you would give our potential adversaries time to dig in and fortify their defenses. That will just make it much harder for our troops to deal with them.
    09-05-2014 02:02 PM
  9. Scott7217's Avatar
    You also have to consider how many lives we lost and how many more soldiers were hurt.
    You also have to consider how many civilian deaths and injuries that could have been prevented with prompt military action.
    09-05-2014 02:14 PM
  10. Scott7217's Avatar
    Without having lived in that period, I can't say whether or not the U.S. was right in how long it took to get involved.
    What additional information do you need?
    09-05-2014 02:19 PM
  11. Scott7217's Avatar
    If you think that the U.S. acted immoral in not entering WWII as fast as it did, what's your opinion of our inaction in Africa and Darfur?
    I think we should have done more in both Rwanda and Darfur, Sudan. I believe both Bill Clinton and George W. Bush regret the decisions they made in their administrations with respect to these tragedies.

    In fact, the only people who appreciated our inactions may be the ones that did all the killing.
    09-05-2014 02:30 PM
  12. anon8126715's Avatar
    Overall Reagan was a tax cutter. To say he hiked taxes left and right is a willful obfuscation of the facts. There is a difference between a cigarette tax and a hike to someones income tax. Ending certain deductions is not a tax hike. Most conservatives today have no issues closing loopholes. He did agree to $1 tax increase to $3 spending cut with Tip O'Neil but we all know he reneged on that one. He got Cap Gains down to 20% then raised it to 28% but offset that by lowering the top marginal rate from 50% to 28%. He simplified the tax code and indexed it for inflation which was huge because people were being pushed into higher tax brackets at the time. Overall Reagan was a tax cutter.
    Saying it twice in the same paragraph is not going to make it a fact. Taxes: What people forget about Reagan - Sep. 8, 2010
    09-05-2014 06:22 PM
  13. anon8126715's Avatar
    How would public opinion affect Obama, especially given the fact that he can't run for office again due to term limits?
    So you think Obama doesn't care about public opinion just because he can't run for office anymore and should do whatever he wants?

    Basically, you would give our potential adversaries time to dig in and fortify their defenses. That will just make it much harder for our troops to deal with them.
    I'm sure they were also rebuilding after the war, unless you're referring to other adversaries that weren't in the first WW. I think you're comparing our current warfare to the type of warfare fought in both world wars. We weren't as technologically advanced as we are now. It wasn't just a matter of repairing hardware, there was more skin in the game.

    You also have to consider how many civilian deaths and injuries that could have been prevented with prompt military action.
    Or, consider that if we were the first to go in, we would've exhausted our resources faster than other countries. Who knows, we might not be the powerhouse we are now if we dove into the war sooner than later. It's all speculation at this point and rather moot to the current discussion. The discussion was someone insisting Obama should act, "the way we did in WWII". My assertion was that we DID NOT act with haste in WWII, thus I'm not even sure why we're going in this direction.

    What additional information do you need?
    We can't just pretend to know what the environment was like leading up to WWII. The fact is that we joined WWII after there had been many atrocities committed. Were we right or wrong in doing so? I couldn't say. Any loss of life in this magnitude needs to be a big concern for all sovereign countries, the fact that not much is being discussed about what's been taking place in Africa by any major country with any serious tone has me concerned as well.

    I think we should have done more in both Rwanda and Darfur, Sudan. I believe both Bill Clinton and George W. Bush regret the decisions they made in their administrations with respect to these tragedies.

    In fact, the only people who appreciated our inactions may be the ones that did all the killing.

    I honestly don't believe so. I think we have been conditioned to value life by skin color, religion, gender, etc. It's our lack of empathy towards our fellow human beings that will ultimately be our undoing as a species IMO.


    Oh and finally, you know you can highlight selected text from a post and "quote" it right?
    09-05-2014 06:37 PM
  14. msndrstood's Avatar
    So you think Obama doesn't care about public opinion just because he can't run for office anymore and should do whatever he wants?



    I'm sure they were also rebuilding after the war, unless you're referring to other adversaries that weren't in the first WW. I think you're comparing our current warfare to the type of warfare fought in both world wars. We weren't as technologically advanced as we are now. It wasn't just a matter of repairing hardware, there was more skin in the game.



    Or, consider that if we were the first to go in, we would've exhausted our resources faster than other countries. Who knows, we might not be the powerhouse we are now if we dove into the war sooner than later. It's all speculation at this point and rather moot to the current discussion. The discussion was someone insisting Obama should act, "the way we did in WWII". My assertion was that we DID NOT act with haste in WWII, thus I'm not even sure why we're going in this direction.



    We can't just pretend to know what the environment was like leading up to WWII. The fact is that we joined WWII after there had been many atrocities committed. Were we right or wrong in doing so? I couldn't say. Any loss of life in this magnitude needs to be a big concern for all sovereign countries, the fact that not much is being discussed about what's been taking place in Africa by any major country with any serious tone has me concerned as well.




    I honestly don't believe so. I think we have been conditioned to value life by skin color, religion, gender, etc. It's our lack of empathy towards our fellow human beings that will ultimately be our undoing as a species IMO.


    Oh and finally, you know you can highlight selected text from a post and "quote" it right?
    Not on Tapatalk, sadly.

    Sent from my SM-N900P using Tapatalk
    Scott7217 likes this.
    09-06-2014 09:05 AM
  15. anon8126715's Avatar
    Not on Tapatalk, sadly.

    Sent from my SM-N900P using Tapatalk
    Obama doesn't care about public opinion on Taptalk?
    09-06-2014 01:53 PM
  16. Scott7217's Avatar
    So you think Obama doesn't care about public opinion just because he can't run for office anymore and should do whatever he wants?
    I haven't made a statement regarding Obama's view on public opinion. I merely asked a question in response to your previous statement:

    "It's not so much a matter of how long we 'should' wait, it's a matter of how public opinion affects politicians' actions."

    So, how would public opinion affect Obama?
    09-08-2014 03:38 PM
  17. anon8126715's Avatar
    I haven't made a statement regarding Obama's view on public opinion. I merely asked a question in response to your previous statement:

    "It's not so much a matter of how long we 'should' wait, it's a matter of how public opinion affects politicians' actions."

    So, how would public opinion affect Obama?
    I heard him say that he's not going to do anything on the immigration issue until AFTER the elections. To me that plays in the GOP's favor come November. So at this point, he seems hellbent on more GOP obstructionism. Maybe you're right about not caring about public opinion and just being in it for his own interests at this point.
    09-09-2014 05:30 AM
  18. Scott7217's Avatar
    I honestly don't believe so. I think we have been conditioned to value life by skin color, religion, gender, etc. It's our lack of empathy towards our fellow human beings that will ultimately be our undoing as a species IMO.
    So, I think we can agree that increasing our empathy towards others will also elevate us as a species. Given that, I would like to think we would have the courage to intervene when innocent civilian lives are in jeopardy. Evil wins when the good do nothing.
    09-11-2014 03:50 AM
  19. anon8126715's Avatar
    So, I think we can agree that increasing our empathy towards others will also elevate us as a species. Given that, I would like to think we would have the courage to intervene when innocent civilian lives are in jeopardy. Evil wins when the good do nothing.
    True, but we can't just say, "Lets raise our empathy for this group of people, exclusively". It needs to be done across the board, not just to appease one incident in one location.
    09-11-2014 02:23 PM
  20. Scott7217's Avatar
    True, but we can't just say, "Lets raise our empathy for this group of people, exclusively". It needs to be done across the board, not just to appease one incident in one location.
    I would have no problem with exercising more empathy for people everywhere.

    Isn't it nice when we agree?
    09-11-2014 04:44 PM
  21. GadgetGator's Avatar
    I heard him say that he's not going to do anything on the immigration issue until AFTER the elections. To me that plays in the GOP's favor come November. So at this point, he seems hellbent on more GOP obstructionism. Maybe you're right about not caring about public opinion and just being in it for his own interests at this point.
    No. He delayed it because some Dems are in very tight races and they asked him not to. Both parties really don't want to do anything right now. They are too afraid of the midterms

    Posted via Android Central App
    09-11-2014 05:44 PM
  22. anon8126715's Avatar
    I would have no problem with exercising more empathy for people everywhere.

    Isn't it nice when we agree?
    I'm going to say "No", just so we don't start developing a pattern of agreeing....

    No. He delayed it because some Dems are in very tight races and they asked him not to. Both parties really don't want to do anything right now. They are too afraid of the midterms

    Posted via Android Central App
    I sure hope those key states aren't lost because of it. I'd like to see another blow to the GOPs if only to see another fox news meltdown from the 2012 elections. I got a kick out of Karl Rove trying to call Ohio for Romney.
    09-12-2014 02:01 AM
  23. anon8126715's Avatar
    I was going to make a new thread for ISIS (no not ISIS wallet) but figured I'll just lump it in here since it is a foreign policy thread as well. ISIS being the growing threat that it is, even ostracizing itself from Al Qaeda, I still can't help think that this is the exact result of GWB's policies in Iraq. If you look at what's been taking place in Syria, it tends to mirror what took place in Iraq. You have an oppressive dictator that has killed scores of his own people, you have us trying to unseat him, and you have rebels that are being funded by a dark entity (mostly us). I'm not making a case for Assad to remain in power, but when you consider how destabilized Iraq is right now, is that really a good idea?

    What also bothers me about everything taking place in ISIS and the middle east in general is how the media gives airtime to some of the former administration that had everything to do with the current chaos taking place in Iraq. **** Cheney has made the rounds and likes to point at Obama's handling of the situation. Should he be allowed to criticize anyone about anything? As far as I'm concerned, you might as well ask him about his opinion on the 9 year old being given an UZI and how it reflects on gun safety. Another guy that needs to remove himself from any type of critique is John McCain. Not only did he get WMDs wrong, he also visited with one of the Syrian rebels that was video taped later eating his enemy's raw heart. Not exactly a good judge of character if you ask me. Then again, I guess when all you know is war mongering, that's what you expect.

    I hope this doesn't turn into some sort of holy war, although you hear boneheads like Phil Robertson insisting that we should either "Convert them or kill them" in regards to ISIS followers, and you can't help but wonder if the Christian right is trying to bring about what they believe to be the end of days.
    GadgetGator and msndrstood like this.
    09-13-2014 06:00 PM
  24. GadgetGator's Avatar
    I was going to make a new thread for ISIS (no not ISIS wallet) but figured I'll just lump it in here since it is a foreign policy thread as well. ISIS being the growing threat that it is, even ostracizing itself from Al Qaeda, I still can't help think that this is the exact result of GWB's policies in Iraq. If you look at what's been taking place in Syria, it tends to mirror what took place in Iraq. You have an oppressive dictator that has killed scores of his own people, you have us trying to unseat him, and you have rebels that are being funded by a dark entity (mostly us). I'm not making a case for Assad to remain in power, but when you consider how destabilized Iraq is right now, is that really a good idea?

    What also bothers me about everything taking place in ISIS and the middle east in general is how the media gives airtime to some of the former administration that had everything to do with the current chaos taking place in Iraq. **** Cheney has made the rounds and likes to point at Obama's handling of the situation. Should he be allowed to criticize anyone about anything? As far as I'm concerned, you might as well ask him about his opinion on the 9 year old being given an UZI and how it reflects on gun safety. Another guy that needs to remove himself from any type of critique is John McCain. Not only did he get WMDs wrong, he also visited with one of the Syrian rebels that was video taped later eating his enemy's raw heart. Not exactly a good judge of character if you ask me. Then again, I guess when all you know is war mongering, that's what you expect.

    I hope this doesn't turn into some sort of holy war, although you hear boneheads like Phil Robertson insisting that we should either "Convert them or kill them" in regards to ISIS followers, and you can't help but wonder if the Christian right is trying to bring about what they believe to be the end of days.
    Exactly. Both sides moving towards a holy war and their version of "paradise". This is what religion ultimately leads to......extremism. A " believe in my religion else you burn in hell" mentality. The flip side of that being if you do believe you are rewarded in some way...beautiful eternal life, 40 virgins....or whatever. A lot of people buy into that stuff. Hence we are where we are.

    No one ever stops to consider the question of why a higher power would want their creation to kill and injure others all in their name. It makes no sense.

    Posted via Android Central App
    09-14-2014 03:24 PM
  25. Scott7217's Avatar
    We can't just pretend to know what the environment was like leading up to WWII. The fact is that we joined WWII after there had been many atrocities committed. Were we right or wrong in doing so? I couldn't say.
    I don't think we need to pretend to know. We simply need to look at recorded history. That helps us determine whether we were right or wrong in a particular course of action.
    09-15-2014 09:46 PM
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