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  1. anon8126715's Avatar
    We've had problems with spending long before that. I don't care who's in charge, spending more than you take in is a big problem.
    What would you cut? I remember the right offering cuts to programs that would undercut Obamacare but not offering up cuts in defense spending. Considering how much more we spend on defense than the next few countries, I'd say we can safely cut into defense spending and take a big chunk out of the deficit. The one area I don't think should be cut is Social Security, especially since the program was self sustaining until our greedy leaders decided to raid social security without putting that money back in. We had a HUGE surplus at one point, but some politicians decided to embezzle money from us. Why they haven't been prosecuted as criminals is beyond me.
    04-06-2014 10:14 PM
  2. palandri's Avatar
    We've had problems with spending long before that. I don't care who's in charge, spending more than you take in is a big problem.
    Clinton left with the economy in the black. More money coming in than the government was spending.
    04-06-2014 10:15 PM
  3. anon8126715's Avatar
    Clinton left with the economy in the black. More money coming in than the government was spending.
    Let me play this one out...."Yeah but that's because he benefited from Reagan and George Bush 1 policies"....."Does that mean that Obama's economy is a result of GWB policies?" "I wish you hippies would stop bringing up GWB"....."the end..."
    palandri, A895, Evilguppy and 1 others like this.
    04-06-2014 10:23 PM
  4. toober's Avatar
    Let me play this one out...."Yeah but that's because he benefited from Reagan and George Bush 1 policies"....."Does that mean that Obama's economy is a result of GWB policies?" "I wish you hippies would stop bringing up GWB"....."the end..."
    I thought Clinton's success was due to Al Gore's inventing the internet.
    04-06-2014 10:35 PM
  5. Mooncatt's Avatar
    What would you cut? I remember the right offering cuts to programs that would undercut Obamacare but not offering up cuts in defense spending. Considering how much more we spend on defense than the next few countries, I'd say we can safely cut into defense spending and take a big chunk out of the deficit. The one area I don't think should be cut is Social Security, especially since the program was self sustaining until our greedy leaders decided to raid social security without putting that money back in. We had a HUGE surplus at one point, but some politicians decided to embezzle money from us. Why they haven't been prosecuted as criminals is beyond me.
    I think a good place to start is the annual government waste report (one of the highlights is the destruction of military equipment rather than to bring home and re-use them in other areas). There's quite a bit of blatent waste there that can be cut before you even start to touch entitlements and such. I also saw a report a while back about all the vacant properties and buildings government at different levels is holding and not doing anything with that could be sold off. That money could go towards paying down the debt too. Once they reign in some of that stuff, then we can have a discussion on what is reasonable in the "silver bullet" areas. Everyone wants to make one or two big cuts in something, but they never address the low hanging fruit that, when combined, will make some big changes.

    You'll get no arguement from me on your SS point about the funding being raided. But that program was set up as a big ponzy scheme anyway that wasn't even originally meant to be a general retirement plan. Even if the money wasn't raided, the program was never ran as if you got back what you put in. They funded seniors up front with the money spread out among many workers. I don't remember the original ratios, but the ratio of workers paying in to workers receiving has been shrinking as life expectancy goes up. I wish we could fully opt out, but right now you can only do that if you're a priest or something like that religiously. I'd love to take what I'm currently putting in to SS and have my own, private retirement fund to control with it. That would free up more money for other things. But darned if I try to do something better than what the government thinks is best.

    Clinton left with the economy in the black. More money coming in than the government was spending.
    USGovernmentSpending.com Past Debt Briefing
    Again, it's a long problem that extends beyond any recent President. Cherry picking one that you like doesn't suddenly mean the problem didn't exist before him or that it was only a one sided issue.

    That aside, lets not forget Clinton also afforded China Most Favored Nation status, making it even easier for them to compete with the U.S. products and helping send more jobs over there as their products were so much cheaper to sell here. Had that not happened, you could argue that U.S. manufacturing would be in better shape than it is now, and the enviromental impacts would have been much less.
    04-06-2014 10:59 PM
  6. Serial Fordicator's Avatar
    The first thing they need to do is veto every bill that has any earmarks. If a bill is written for public school 34 million dollars shouldn't be alocated to study the mating habits of the guatemalen water lizard. Bush and obama are absolutely no different when it comes to enlarging the government and spending money.

    ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    04-06-2014 11:01 PM
  7. Serial Fordicator's Avatar
    Clinton left with the economy in the black. More money coming in than the government was spending.
    Clinton was successful because him and Congress, not only worked together, but tried to shink government. They all made sure we didn't spend more than we took in. I also forgot to add, Clinton didn't believe in taxing the ever live hell out of the rich or businesses. He gave them breathing room. Arguements can be made about nafta, and im inclined to agree with a lot of them, but all in all, they all worked together.
    ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    04-06-2014 11:04 PM
  8. palandri's Avatar

    USGovernmentSpending.com Past Debt Briefing
    Again, it's a long problem that extends beyond any recent President. Cherry picking one that you like doesn't suddenly mean the problem didn't exist before him or that it was only a one sided issue.

    That aside, lets not forget Clinton also afforded China Most Favored Nation status, making it even easier for them to compete with the U.S. products and helping send more jobs over there as their products were so much cheaper to sell here. Had that not happened, you could argue that U.S. manufacturing would be in better shape than it is now, and the enviromental impacts would have been much less.
    Lets look at factcheck: The Budget and Deficit Under Clinton

    I am pretty sure that Clinton proposed, "renewing" most-favored-nation, so that sounds to me like someone else started it, but maybe I am wrong and we should blame it all on Clinton like you're proposing.
    04-06-2014 11:16 PM
  9. Serial Fordicator's Avatar
    Oh, hear is a tidbit of news. My wife works with doctors who know Clinton personally. He absolutely despises Obama.

    ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    04-06-2014 11:19 PM
  10. anon8126715's Avatar
    Oh, hear is a tidbit of news. My wife works with doctors who know Clinton personally. He absolutely despises Obama.

    ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    Lol, oh well that changes evrrything...../sarcasm


    I am sure most guys would hate the guy that beat their wife in a presidential election.




    Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk
    A895 and msndrstood like this.
    04-06-2014 11:47 PM
  11. Mooncatt's Avatar
    I am pretty sure that Clinton proposed, "renewing" most-favored-nation, so that sounds to me like someone else started it, but maybe I am wrong and we should blame it all on Clinton like you're proposing.
    I did a little looking and Clinton had renewed it. Seems it was revoked back in the 50's, restored in the 80's, then became a point of contintion after the Tiananmen Square incident. It may be splitting hairs here, but MFN status has been replaced with the "normal trade relations" designation, and Clinton did sign in to law granting permanent NTR and is not something that can be as easily revoked.

    - - - Updated - - -

    My mom went to school with his brother, one grade behind him. Small world, huh. :P
    04-07-2014 12:03 AM
  12. Tall Mike 2145's Avatar
    I don't know when the last time was that we were actually in the black in this country, but I'd be willing to bet it might have been in the post-war 40s. We were still in debt in the 90s. Clinton may have been better than either GWB or Obama in various respects, but I would never go so far as to claim he was a good president.

    There hasn't been a president since before FDR that wasn't guilty of serious government overreach. And thanks to FDR we have the Federal Reserve, thanks to FDR, Truman, and Eisenhower we have the NSA, the CIA, and a host of other agencies that destroy our civil liberties, waste our money, spy on us, practice overreach, intrude in and disregard the sovereignty of other countries, etc.

    This short-term memory blame game bs has gone on long enough, folks.
    04-07-2014 02:27 AM
  13. Aquila's Avatar
    I don't know when the last time was that we were actually in the black in this country, but I'd be willing to bet it might have been in the post-war 40s. We were still in debt in the 90s. Clinton may have been better than either GWB or Obama in various respects, but I would never go so far as to claim he was a good president.

    There hasn't been a president since before FDR that wasn't guilty of serious government overreach. And thanks to FDR we have the Federal Reserve, thanks to FDR, Truman, and Eisenhower we have the NSA, the CIA, and a host of other agencies that destroy our civil liberties, waste our money, spy on us, practice overreach, intrude in and disregard the sovereignty of other countries, etc.

    This short-term memory blame game bs has gone on long enough, folks.
    Clinton's economic reputation is based on the Congress shrinking and eventually eliminating the deficit, leaving the newcomer in the 2000 election a SUBSTANTIAL budgetary surplus. It's fun (or maybe interesting) to watch the presidential debates between Bush and Gore and how they choose to handle that surplus (about 300 billion per year). Gore basically wanted to enhance education and some other small programs and start paying off the debt while Bush wanted to lower taxes for the wealthy. In hindsight, paying off the debt and/or investing in anything may have been a better call than just random tax cuts. 8 years later, we handed off a crashed economy and over a trillion dollars in annual deficit. The only thing I like about the Congress and Executive team over the past 6 years is that the deficit is coming down. Granted, it's coming down because they are cowards, and not because of any sense of responsibility or foresight or wisdom, but it is coming down and fast.
    palandri and nolittdroid like this.
    04-07-2014 02:58 AM
  14. palandri's Avatar
    Clinton's economic reputation is based on the Congress shrinking and eventually eliminating the deficit, leaving the newcomer in the 2000 election a SUBSTANTIAL budgetary surplus. It's fun (or maybe interesting) to watch the presidential debates between Bush and Gore and how they choose to handle that surplus (about 300 billion per year). Gore basically wanted to enhance education and some other small programs and start paying off the debt while Bush wanted to lower taxes for the wealthy. In hindsight, paying off the debt and/or investing in anything may have been a better call than just random tax cuts. 8 years later, we handed off a crashed economy and over a trillion dollars in annual deficit. The only thing I like about the Congress and Executive team over the past 6 years is that the deficit is coming down. Granted, it's coming down because they are cowards, and not because of any sense of responsibility or foresight or wisdom, but it is coming down and fast.
    Spot on!
    04-07-2014 07:59 AM
  15. Serial Fordicator's Avatar
    Lol, oh well that changes evrrything...../sarcasm


    I am sure most guys would hate the guy that beat their wife in a presidential election.




    Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk
    I posted it to show how stupid and absolutely ridiculous believing everything that a political party tells you. He doesn't despise him because he beat his wife in an election either.

    ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    04-07-2014 10:21 AM
  16. palandri's Avatar
    I posted it to show how stupid and absolutely ridiculous believing everything that a political party tells you. He doesn't despise him because he beat his wife in an election either.
    Then why does he despise him?
    04-07-2014 10:52 AM
  17. Serial Fordicator's Avatar
    Then why does he despise him?
    I heard that he doesn't like him because he's "hardheaded".

    I guess that makes Bill racist.
    ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    04-07-2014 12:15 PM
  18. A895's Avatar
    I heard that he doesn't like him because he's "hardheaded".

    I guess that makes Bill racist.
    ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    I could never accuse of Bill Clinton of being racist.

    Sent from my XT907 using Mobile Nations mobile app
    04-07-2014 01:10 PM
  19. Serial Fordicator's Avatar
    I could never accuse of Bill Clinton of being racist.

    Sent from my XT907 using Mobile Nations mobile app
    Why not? Anyone who doesn't like obama is labeled a racist.

    I've been accused of being racist for not liking him. It's amazing though, no one called me racist for not liking Bush.
    ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    04-07-2014 01:15 PM
  20. A895's Avatar
    Why not? Anyone who doesn't like obama is labeled a racist.

    I've been accused of being racist for not liking him. It's amazing though, no one called me racist for not liking Bush.
    ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    I couldn't generalize about who disagrees with Obama because, a lot of people disagree with him for various reasons.

    Sent from my XT907 using Mobile Nations mobile app
    Serial Fordicator likes this.
    04-07-2014 07:52 PM
  21. anon8126715's Avatar
    I posted it to show how stupid and absolutely ridiculous believing everything that a political party tells you. He doesn't despise him because he beat his wife in an election either.

    ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    Stating that a politician hates another politician is like stating that a car salesman hates another car salesman. They're both slimy professions and just because one of their types hates another of their types doesn't really provide much insight. I guess you're attempting to claim there's a wedge within the democratic party, which I wouldn't doubt it, but I bet it's nothing like the wedge between the tea bag GOP and the regular GOP.
    04-07-2014 10:39 PM
  22. Serial Fordicator's Avatar
    Stating that a politician hates another politician is like stating that a car salesman hates another car salesman. They're both slimy professions and just because one of their types hates another of their types doesn't really provide much insight. I guess you're attempting to claim there's a wedge within the democratic party, which I wouldn't doubt it, but I bet it's nothing like the wedge between the tea bag GOP and the regular GOP.
    Why do you find slimy behavior acceptable? Why isn't any other profession held to such a low standard? If I took money for accepting something on my job I could end up in jail and I would lose my certifications as rightly so. Thats one of the biggest reasons I'm tired of people being blinded by their political parties.
    ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    04-08-2014 08:44 AM
  23. palandri's Avatar
    Why do you find slimy behavior acceptable? Why isn't any other profession held to such a low standard? If I took money for accepting something on my job I could end up in jail and I would lose my certifications as rightly so. Thats one of the biggest reasons I'm tired of people being blinded by their political parties.
    ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ

    ....and what do you do again?
    04-08-2014 10:19 AM
  24. Serial Fordicator's Avatar
    ....and what do you do again?
    I'm in quality assurance

    ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    palandri likes this.
    04-08-2014 10:28 AM
  25. palandri's Avatar
    I'm in quality assurance

    ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
    I guess I am missing something here, since you said, "...If I took money for accepting something on my job I could end up in jail...". So it's a government job? I just don't understand how you could end up in jail.
    msndrstood likes this.
    04-08-2014 10:38 AM
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