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  1. A895's Avatar
    A lot of people like the US. We have people literally risking their lives to cross the border for the dream of living in the US as American citizens. Why would people do that if they didn't like the US?
    There is a large anti American sentiment from Middle Eastern countries. You know, the area where ISIS is? My Aunt served in the war in Iraq, she said herself not many people liked the U.S. over there.

    To be fair, if people were truly unhappy, I suggested a mass protest to hold our government accountable. I didn't get any takers. Go figure.
    Luckily enough for the government it is a Republican controlled congress who are all for boots on the ground there. And, as of now we are only doing ineffective drone strikes just enough middle eastern involvement to avoid mass protests for another war. Though if we DO get boots on the ground I can see a lot of unhappy people and protests.
    11-05-2014 11:26 AM
  2. Scott7217's Avatar
    There is a large anti American sentiment from Middle Eastern countries. You know, the area where ISIS is? My Aunt served in the war in Iraq, she said herself not many people liked the U.S. over there.

    Luckily enough for the government it is a Republican controlled congress who are all for boots on the ground there. And, as of now we are only doing ineffective drone strikes just enough middle eastern involvement to avoid mass protests for another war. Though if we DO get boots on the ground I can see a lot of unhappy people and protests.
    The US has coalition partners... you know, Saudi Arabia, the United Arab Emirates, Jordan, Egypt, Qatar, and Bahrain. We do have allies in the Middle East.

    If your aunt served in Iraq, she might have encountered Sunnis who were loyal to Saddam Hussain. If she met Shia or Kurds, she might have had a more positive reception.

    In any case, all military actions must be approved by the commander-in-chief. I do not believe that he has joined the Republican party yet.
    11-05-2014 11:48 AM
  3. A895's Avatar
    The US has coalition partners... you know, Saudi Arabia, the United Arab Emirates, Jordan, Egypt, Qatar, and Bahrain. We do have allies in the Middle East.

    If your aunt served in Iraq, she might have encountered Sunnis who were loyal to Saddam Hussain. If she met Shia or Kurds, she might have had a more positive reception.

    In any case, all military actions must be approved by the commander-in-chief. I do not believe that he has joined the Republican party yet.
    "Allies"

    Yes, military actions do have to approved by the President the guy who backtracked and said "The United States will take any action against those who threaten the United States".

    So he will go with it, despite people being against it. And anyways, whether we do go full metal against ISIS or not, we do need to not forget what we have to take care of what is at home. During the Iraq/Afghanistan/Iran/Someplace War, we completely forgot the issues going on domestically, leading to the Recession.

    I hope a proposed war in the Middle East isn't a distraction for what is going on domestically.
    11-05-2014 11:57 AM
  4. anon8126715's Avatar
    I keep reading stories of ISIS torturing and killing innocent people. Perhaps it is just too difficult for the US to turn a blind eye, so we feel we must intervene.
    I hear those stories coming from Africa all the time as well but we're ok with a blind eye there for some reason.
    A895, palandri and Scott7217 like this.
    11-05-2014 05:40 PM
  5. A895's Avatar
    I hear more horror stories about cartels killing a lot of Americans and torturing them in Mexico and slaughtering anyone else, but we aren't sending drone strikes and talking about sending boots there either.
    palandri and Scott7217 like this.
    11-05-2014 05:57 PM
  6. Scott7217's Avatar
    "Allies"
    So, you don't believe Obama when he says that Saudi Arabia and the other coalition countries are US allies? Why would Obama do that?
    11-05-2014 07:34 PM
  7. anon8126715's Avatar
    So, you don't believe Obama when he says that Saudi Arabia and the other coalition countries are US allies? Why would Obama do that?
    Because we're handcuffed to oil.
    palandri and A895 like this.
    11-05-2014 08:34 PM
  8. Scott7217's Avatar
    Yes, military actions do have to approved by the President the guy who backtracked and said "The United States will take any action against those who threaten the United States".

    So he will go with it, despite people being against it.
    I suppose Obama has to use his best judgment when making the ultimate decision to deploy military forces, even if that makes people upset.
    11-05-2014 09:59 PM
  9. Scott7217's Avatar
    Because we're handcuffed to oil.
    Would you say that Obama is a puppet of the oil companies? Will he do whatever they want?
    11-05-2014 10:03 PM
  10. A895's Avatar
    I suppose Obama has to use his best judgment when making the ultimate decision to deploy military forces, even if that makes people upset.
    His ultimate decision should be nonintervention.
    11-05-2014 10:12 PM
  11. anon8126715's Avatar
    Would you say that Obama is a puppet of the oil companies? Will he do whatever they want?
    I would say most politicians are a puppet of their biggest contributors, which isn't how our political process should work, but you have big business that has no problem with policy being set by the highest bidder via proxy.
    A895 and Scott7217 like this.
    11-05-2014 10:13 PM
  12. Scott7217's Avatar
    And anyways, whether we do go full metal against ISIS or not, we do need to not forget what we have to take care of what is at home. During the Iraq/Afghanistan/Iran/Someplace War, we completely forgot the issues going on domestically, leading to the Recession.
    Presidents have to know how to multitask and delegate. They must be able to handle foreign and domestic issues simultaneously. If the American people don't think Obama was up to the task, they shouldn't have elected him to 2 terms.
    11-05-2014 10:22 PM
  13. A895's Avatar
    Presidents have to know how to multitask and delegate. They must be able to handle foreign and domestic issues simultaneously. If the American people don't think Obama was up to the task, they shouldn't have elected him to 2 terms.
    Not the president specifically, government as a whole. I wasn't even referring to the president in that post. I am saying government and the American people get distracted whenever there is any big foreign event such as a war we are involved in.

    Media talks about it, people talk about, government talks about it. It is a distraction. That is why it should be avoided right now.
    11-05-2014 10:25 PM
  14. Scott7217's Avatar
    I hope a proposed war in the Middle East isn't a distraction for what is going on domestically.
    I think that's something we couldn't prove, even though we might suspect it. Using a war just as a distraction seems very extreme. Do you think Obama would go through with such a plan?
    11-05-2014 10:30 PM
  15. A895's Avatar
    I think that's something we couldn't prove, even though we might suspect it. Using a war just as a distraction seems very extreme. Do you think Obama would go through with such a plan?
    You are still misunderstanding, I am saying when things like wars happen they tend to heavily distract away from domestic issues.
    11-05-2014 10:32 PM
  16. Scott7217's Avatar
    I hear those stories coming from Africa all the time as well but we're ok with a blind eye there for some reason.
    I think we sent military personnel to Africa to fight the spread of Ebola because that seems to be the greatest threat at the moment. However, if you think we need to do more, we can organize a petition to send help to Africa. Where should we direct our forces?
    11-05-2014 10:44 PM
  17. Scott7217's Avatar
    His ultimate decision should be nonintervention.
    CNN - Obama sends 1,500 troops to Iraq (article link here)

    Excerpt:

    President Barack Obama is sending up to 1,500 more soldiers to Iraq to train Iraqi and Kurdish forces to fight ISIS, in a deployment that would almost double the total number of American troops there to 2,900.

    The White House said in a statement that it will also ask Congress for another $5.6 billion to fund the fight against ISIS. The troops will not have a combat role, and will operate from bases outside Baghdad and Erbil.
    11-12-2014 04:52 PM
  18. A895's Avatar
    CNN - Obama sends 1,500 troops to Iraq (article link here)

    Excerpt:

    President Barack Obama is sending up to 1,500 more soldiers to Iraq to train Iraqi and Kurdish forces to fight ISIS, in a deployment that would almost double the total number of American troops there to 2,900.

    The White House said in a statement that it will also ask Congress for another $5.6 billion to fund the fight against ISIS. The troops will not have a combat role, and will operate from bases outside Baghdad and Erbil.
    I know about this. Non combat roles supposedly. We will see about that.
    11-12-2014 04:53 PM
  19. anon8126715's Avatar
    CNN - Obama sends 1,500 troops to Iraq (article link here)

    Excerpt:

    President Barack Obama is sending up to 1,500 more soldiers to Iraq to train Iraqi and Kurdish forces to fight ISIS, in a deployment that would almost double the total number of American troops there to 2,900.

    The White House said in a statement that it will also ask Congress for another $5.6 billion to fund the fight against ISIS. The troops will not have a combat role, and will operate from bases outside Baghdad and Erbil.
    If anything this tells me that regardless of who we elect, we're not being represented in our political system. That then begs the question, who is calling the shots? If you ask me, companies and large special interest groups like the Koch brothers don't spend millions of dollars out of pure altruism. If we can get more politicians to push SINCERE campaign finance reform that takes money OUT of our political campaign system then we will have politicians that are working for the people, not for big business and big special interest groups.
    A895 likes this.
    11-15-2014 12:53 PM
  20. Scott7217's Avatar
    If anything this tells me that regardless of who we elect, we're not being represented in our political system. That then begs the question, who is calling the shots? If you ask me, companies and large special interest groups like the Koch brothers don't spend millions of dollars out of pure altruism.
    Would you say that President Obama is acting on the behalf of special interest groups?

    On a related note, a UN panel has determined that ISIS has committed war crimes.

    CNN - U.N. panel details ISIS abuses in Syria, says they amount to war crimes (article link here)

    Excerpt:

    With images of violence and torture coming out of Syria daily, a U.N. panel on Friday stated what many people consider obvious: ISIS has committed war crimes and crimes against humanity, and leaders of the militant group should be held accountable by organizations such as the International Criminal Court.

    The U.N. Independent International Commission of Inquiry on Syria based its conclusions on more than 300 firsthand accounts and included photos and videos of violence and victims, a statement said.
    11-15-2014 04:22 PM
  21. anon8126715's Avatar
    Would you say that President Obama is acting on the behalf of special interest groups?

    On a related note, a UN panel has determined that ISIS has committed war crimes.

    CNN - U.N. panel details ISIS abuses in Syria, says they amount to war crimes (article link here)

    Excerpt:

    With images of violence and torture coming out of Syria daily, a U.N. panel on Friday stated what many people consider obvious: ISIS has committed war crimes and crimes against humanity, and leaders of the militant group should be held accountable by organizations such as the International Criminal Court.

    The U.N. Independent International Commission of Inquiry on Syria based its conclusions on more than 300 firsthand accounts and included photos and videos of violence and victims, a statement said.
    Well a lot of people would argue that the ACA was a big "thank you" to the insurance companies. But it's hard to say whether that was his doing or it was the GOP that forced him to give a big present to the insurance companies. I will say this, if you donated millions to his campaign, you're going to get a seat at the table that average citizens won't necessarily get (unless it's a big enough issue and you belong to one of those that the policy would affect).

    As far as the whole War Crimes thing, I'm not sure why it matters that the UN panel came to that conclusion since their resolutions don't really have that much clout and the UN probably wouldn't bother acting without a large coalition, which we would undoubtedly have to be the majority to invest. You might as well have a local U.S. city give ISIS a parking ticket.
    A895 likes this.
    11-15-2014 07:38 PM
  22. Scott7217's Avatar
    As far as the whole War Crimes thing, I'm not sure why it matters that the UN panel came to that conclusion since their resolutions don't really have that much clout and the UN probably wouldn't bother acting without a large coalition, which we would undoubtedly have to be the majority to invest.
    The reason the U.S. needs to go into this as a coalition instead of trying to go it mostly alone like we did in Iraq is twofold. One, it lets these types of terrorist organizations know that their ideology is being flat out rejected by many states, not just U.S. interests. Two, it takes some of the focus off the U.S.
    If a UN panel says that ISIS has committed war crimes, that helps address the two points you brought up before. One, it lets terrorists groups like ISIS know that their ideology is being flat out rejected by many states, not just US interests. Two, it takes some of the focus off the US.
    11-18-2014 05:00 PM
  23. anon8126715's Avatar
    If a UN panel says that ISIS has committed war crimes, that helps address the two points you brought up before. One, it lets terrorists groups like ISIS know that their ideology is being flat out rejected by many states, not just US interests. Two, it takes some of the focus off the US.
    I think ACTION by the UN would speak louder than just WORDS. IIRC, the international community also condemned the Bush administration for its torture practices, but I don't think anything ever came out of that.
    11-18-2014 07:48 PM
  24. palandri's Avatar
    I think ACTION by the UN would speak louder than just WORDS. IIRC, the international community also condemned the Bush administration for its torture practices, but I don't think anything ever came out of that.
    I saw this, but I don't think anything happened from it:

    A Complaint has been filed with the Prosecutor for the International Criminal Court (I.C.C.) in The Hague against U.S. citizens George W. Bush, Richard Cheney, Donald Rumsfeld, George Tenet, Condoleezza Rice, and Alberto Gonzales (the “Accused”) for their criminal policy and practice of “extraordinary rendition” perpetrated upon about 100 human beings.

    http://extremeprejudiceusa.wordpress...ng-war-crimes/
    11-18-2014 08:13 PM
  25. Scott7217's Avatar
    I think ACTION by the UN would speak louder than just WORDS. IIRC, the international community also condemned the Bush administration for its torture practices, but I don't think anything ever came out of that.
    I prefer actions combined with words. Not only has the UN panel condemned ISIS for war crimes, it has not called for any sanctions against the US and its allies for their ongoing military actions. That's pretty much a green light from the UN for coalition military strikes.

    As for the international community's response to the Bush administration, we probably don't see much going on because there are countries that treat their prisoners more severely than the US does. It would be hypocritical to condemn the Bush administration if the other countries are even worse.
    11-20-2014 06:42 PM
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