08-21-2015 02:00 PM
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  1. Brent Starnes's Avatar
    Samsung's latest financial reporting session showed disappointing sales of the S6, and they admitted they underestimated the demand for the S6 Edge. By the time they figured out the mistake and increased Edge shipments, it was too late...the buzz had worn off. I see more of the same for the Note/S6 Edge +, as it seems Samsung is not doing a good job of understanding what their consumers want.

    I believe the root cause is a dramatic shift in Samsung's approach to phones and tablets. They want to be Apple 2.0, but have missed the bulk of the premium phone market already as most people who can afford the top of the line phones are seeing fewer reasons to upgrade every year for incremental feature enhancements. They have shifted the design of their top tier tablets to the same diminsions of iPads, but waited to do this until iPad sales had already started a large decline....again, too late to the premium game.

    There used to be complaints about Samsung's cheap hardware design (plastic backs, etc), but the phones still sold well. I believe they did need to improve in the hardware design area, and this year's models are indeed beautiful. However, they dropped many of the features that were differentiators between them and Apple, like removeable batteries, SD cards, IR blasters, water proofing (for the S5 anyway), etc. So now they have fewer feature advantages, little to no price advantage, have alienated a significant portion of their core users, and are facing a rapidly increasing set of Android competitors that offer good or better quality phones often at much lower prices.

    I hope I'm wrong. My last 3 phones have been the Note 4, Note 3, and S3. But as nice as the new phones look, things that matter to me are no longer available in the Samsung top tier. I'm gonna start looking at other vendors, and I'm guessing many others will as well.

    What do you think?
    08-15-2015 12:54 AM
  2. russel5150's Avatar
    You could be right...

    I wonder if the consumers they listen to are the Asian market, which may be vastly different than what other consumers want.

    I also agree that phones last longer, and there is no reason to upgrade every year unless you just have to have the newest phone.

    If I decide on a new phone in the next while, i need to force myself to be content with it.. So far this year ive had the droid turbo which is an awesome phone, the note4, which is about perfect. And back to the droid turbo since my daughter wanted the note4 to replace her motox.

    I think samsung is trying something different w the new line, like when a car company revamps its cars every few years.. Where they missed is they make so many phones, and if they would settle on just a couple they would save money and could have one for each target market.. (Yes like apple).

    Just my opinion but samsung is trying to do better, they are just missing the mark by letting style replace function, instead of style complimenting function.

    Posted via the Android Central App
    ccpopham and Brent Starnes like this.
    08-15-2015 01:25 AM
  3. Laura Knotek's Avatar
    I believe that Samsung needs to streamline its product lines. Rather than releasing the Galaxy S, Galaxy S Edge and Galaxy Note lines just release one flagship device in a product that offers combined features of all 3 of these lines and make that product its flagship line.
    08-15-2015 01:35 AM
  4. johnmcd348's Avatar
    You may be right. I'm one of those people, maybe even to an extreme. I'm upgrading now to the Note 5 from my Note 2 that I bought about 1 month after they came out. I buy and use until it simply just doesn't work for me anymore. I don't need the latest and greatest and rarely ever see the need to buy a new unit, just because it has "This Great New Feature." Prior to my Note 2, my first Smartphone was an HTC Arrive. Prior to that, I still had my cell phone and a Dell Axim x51v PDA that I carried with me everywhere. I did the Cell phone/PDA shuffle for years because there simply wasn't a Smartphone out there that could compete with what my Dell could do.

    Once the Arrive came out, it was about as close to both devices as I could ask for and I made the change. I used it for a few years and went through a lot of refurbs until MS made the change over from Windows Phone 6.5 to Windows Phone7 and left me behind with no stylus to take notes with. I learned about the Note 2 phone, and the fact that Windows just wasn't being supported by the world like iOS and Android were, made me change over to Android and I haven't looked back since. As long as it works for me, I never really see a need to change.
    Brent Starnes and bigglyguy like this.
    08-15-2015 07:18 AM
  5. Crashdamage's Avatar
    IMHO Samsung has gone nuts. They make about a thousand different phones that have about a thousand problems. That was part of Nokia's problem, partly what brought them down. But Samsung fails to see the same thing could easily happen to them. Samsung needs to cut the number of models they make by at least by 2/3 and concentrate their efforts on getting what's left right. Trash friggin' Touchwizz.

    I wrote a post about my feelings towards Samsung a while back:

    http://androidforums.com/threads/cac.../#post-7001530
    08-15-2015 07:51 AM
  6. Gator352's Avatar
    You may be right. I'm one of those people, maybe even to an extreme. I'm upgrading now to the Note 5 from my Note 2 that I bought about 1 month after they came out. I buy and use until it simply just doesn't work for me anymore. I don't need the latest and greatest and rarely ever see the need to buy a new unit, just because it has "This Great New Feature." Prior to my Note 2, my first Smartphone was an HTC Arrive. Prior to that, I still had my cell phone and a Dell Axim x51v PDA that I carried with me everywhere. I did the Cell phone/PDA shuffle for years because there simply wasn't a Smartphone out there that could compete with what my Dell could do.

    Once the Arrive came out, it was about as close to both devices as I could ask for and I made the change. I used it for a few years and went through a lot of refurbs until MS made the change over from Windows Phone 6.5 to Windows Phone7 and left me behind with no stylus to take notes with. I learned about the Note 2 phone, and the fact that Windows just wasn't being supported by the world like iOS and Android were, made me change over to Android and I haven't looked back since. As long as it works for me, I never really see a need to change.
    Windows mobile 6.5 made me leave the windows mobile camp. Forever. I had the htc touch pro and diamond and both were atrocious. That and the lack of udates to fix numerous problems made me switch to android and I've never looked back.

    Posted via the Android Central App
    08-15-2015 07:51 AM
  7. dpham00's Avatar
    Samsung profit margins have been on the slide well before the s6/note 5 came out.

    You might have liked the note 4,but Samsung profits from the note 4 didn't help the downward trend.

    Really the issue is Samsung being squeezed at the top by Apple and at the bottom/mid by the lower specd devices from Huawei, xiaomi, lenovo.

    Are some people not going to buy the s6/note 5 due to the lack of microSD slot and removable battery? Sure. Is the number anywhere as big as forums make it to be? Perhaps amongst vocal forum members, Sure. But in the general public, I don't think the percentage I'd very large. Samsung isn't stupid. They did market studies before making their choice.





    I think Samsung is in trouble-uploadfromtaptalk1439646105647.png
    08-15-2015 08:41 AM
  8. syspry's Avatar
    Samsung profit margins have been on the slide well before the s6/note 5 came out.

    You might have liked the note 4,but Samsung profits from the note 4 didn't help the downward trend.

    Really the issue is Samsung being squeezed at the top by Apple and at the bottom/mid by the lower specd devices from Huawei, xiaomi, lenovo.

    Are some people not going to buy the s6/note 5 due to the lack of microSD slot and removable battery? Sure. Is the number anywhere as big as forums make it to be? Perhaps amongst vocal forum members, Sure. But in the general public, I don't think the percentage I'd very large. Samsung isn't stupid. They did market studies before making their choice.





    Click image for larger version. 

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    Bang on.
    08-15-2015 09:05 AM
  9. Adawg1203's Avatar
    Samsung profit margins have been on the slide well before the s6/note 5 came out.

    You might have liked the note 4,but Samsung profits from the note 4 didn't help the downward trend.

    Really the issue is Samsung being squeezed at the top by Apple and at the bottom/mid by the lower specd devices from Huawei, xiaomi, lenovo.

    Are some people not going to buy the s6/note 5 due to the lack of microSD slot and removable battery? Sure. Is the number anywhere as big as forums make it to be? Perhaps amongst vocal forum members, Sure. But in the general public, I don't think the percentage I'd very large. Samsung isn't stupid. They did market studies before making their choice.





    Click image for larger version. 

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    BOOM!
    08-15-2015 09:39 AM
  10. russel5150's Avatar
    Touchwiz was improved a lot since the note2.

    I realize pure android is great, i do not deny that, but touchwiz has come a long way, and on a phone like the note you dont want to have search for spen apps to do basic functions.

    If i get the new note5, i wont be buying it with android M in mind, ill be buying it for what it has on it. Ill be buying it because of the features it has, including touchwiz..

    Posted via the Android Central App
    08-15-2015 09:44 AM
  11. D13H4RD2L1V3's Avatar
    IMHO, I think one big reason why Samsung's profits are heading towards the red is because of all the new wave of smartphones that pack in a lot of punch for not much money at all.

    Phones like the ASUS Zenfone 2 ZE551ML 64GB, the "phone-that-we-love" 2015 Moto X Pure, and even the OnePlus Two are good examples of phone that pack in flagship-grade hardware with a much more affordable MSRP. Let's not forget phones like the Xiaomi Mi4, Huawei P8 and other phones from Chinese OEMs that look great, feel great, pack in nice hardware while keeping an affordable MSRP.

    Given that these phones offer a similar experience to the S6, it's harder to justify paying $700 for an S6 now.

    IMO, Samsung's only way of staying relevant is to reduce the prices on their devices. They've been in decline before the Note 4 came out, so I highly doubt that the downward trend has anything to do with the removal of an SD card slot.
    Brent Starnes and recDNA like this.
    08-15-2015 09:47 AM
  12. linzgeneral's Avatar
    Samsung's latest financial reporting session showed disappointing sales of the S6, and they admitted they underestimated the demand for the S6 Edge. By the time they figured out the mistake and increased Edge shipments, it was too late...the buzz had worn off. I see more of the same for the Note/S6 Edge +, as it seems Samsung is not doing a good job of understanding what their consumers want.

    I believe the root cause is a dramatic shift in Samsung's approach to phones and tablets. They want to be Apple 2.0, but have missed the bulk of the premium phone market already as most people who can afford the top of the line phones are seeing fewer reasons to upgrade every year for incremental feature enhancements. They have shifted the design of their top tier tablets to the same diminsions of iPads, but waited to do this until iPad sales had already started a large decline....again, too late to the premium game.

    There used to be complaints about Samsung's cheap hardware design (plastic backs, etc), but the phones still sold well. I believe they did need to improve in the hardware design area, and this year's models are indeed beautiful. However, they dropped many of the features that were differentiators between them and Apple, like removeable batteries, SD cards, IR blasters, water proofing (for the S5 anyway), etc. So now they have fewer feature advantages, little to no price advantage, have alienated a significant portion of their core users, and are facing a rapidly increasing set of Android competitors that offer good or better quality phones often at much lower prices.

    I hope I'm wrong. My last 3 phones have been the Note 4, Note 3, and S3. But as nice as the new phones look, things that matter to me are no longer available in the Samsung top tier. I'm gonna start looking at other vendors, and I'm guessing many others will as well.

    What do you think?
    Spot on!
    Brent Starnes and dallas90733 like this.
    08-15-2015 09:47 AM
  13. BOSSY TEXAS CHICK's Avatar
    I've said it a million times before, so what's a million and one?!... "plastic builds & Touchwiz" CANNOT be "that bad" if it brought Samsung to the "top of the smartphone game" for a consecutive 3-4 years in a row. Changing to a metal design needed to happen, but why oh why could they have NOT designed a removable "metal back" with access to sd & battery? Even if it were made of a high quality "reinforced tin", I can ALMOST guarantee it would have easily been received better than their "glass sandwichs of yesteryear....." I for one do NOT need either, my life could fit on a 1MB cloud (that's right, I said MEGABYTE- don't judge me...lol), i'm barely away from an outlet for more than 5 minutes at any given time, and my tv remote does a fine job without needing ANY help....BUT still, always better to have MORE hardware features than the public may need, rather than less!

    And Sammy, another question... with all your R&D you couldn't figure out that a Galaxy S6 Edge Plus needed an S Pen to make it appeal to more than just, "the 5 ppl out there who wanted an S6 Edge w/ a bigger screen?" RIP Sammy, we'll miss ya! maybe....


    BTC
    08-15-2015 10:36 AM
  14. Gator352's Avatar
    I've said it a million times before, so what's a million and one?!... "plastic builds & Touchwiz" CANNOT be "that bad" if it brought Samsung to the "top of the smartphone game" for a consecutive 3-4 years in a row. Changing to a metal design needed to happen, but why oh why could they have NOT designed a removable "metal back" with access to sd & battery? Even if it were made of a high quality "reinforced tin", I can ALMOST guarantee it would have easily been received better than their "glass sandwichs of yesteryear....." I for one do NOT need either, my life could fit on a 1MB cloud (that's right, I said MEGABYTE- don't judge me...lol), i'm barely away from an outlet for more than 5 minutes at any given time, and my tv remote does a fine job without needing ANY help....BUT still, always better to have MORE hardware features than the public may need, rather than less!

    And Sammy, another question... with all your R&D you couldn't figure out that a Galaxy S6 Edge Plus needed an S Pen to make it appeal to more than just, "the 5 ppl out there who wanted an S6 Edge w/ a bigger screen?" RIP Sammy, we'll miss ya! maybe....


    BTC
    Rotflmaoiwyci!

    Posted via the Android Central App
    Brent Starnes likes this.
    08-15-2015 05:35 PM
  15. Ry's Avatar
    How much money does Samsung have?

    Posted via Android Central App (Moto X)
    08-15-2015 06:24 PM
  16. dsignori's Avatar
    Ahh the hyperbole. Samsung is "only" gonna make around $6 Billion profit this QUARTER. The trend is down, but jeez guys, I think they can keep the lights on here.

    When profits were higher, it wasn't because of SD cards or removable batteries, when profits are declining, it's not because of no SD cards or removable batteries. Their latest phones are nicer now, there's just much better competition at all levels, and many choices on Android. There's only a few iOS choices, and Apples gets the revenue from all of them.

    Raise your hand if you thought Samsung would continue making $50 billion profit per quarter for he next 20 years... No? More good and great competition , at both high and low price points leads to declining profits - but still $6 billion in profits in 1 quarter

    While it's cool to moan about missing features, Samsung is making some of the nicest phones they have ever made now, and this all seems overly dramatic. They're a public company making a LOT of money still, facing increased competition. Sounds like a lot of other businesses to me.

    Cue the hyperbole ...
    08-15-2015 06:45 PM
  17. L0n3N1nja's Avatar
    Well I've had the s3, Note 2, 3, and currently using the Note 4. Also have a note 10.1 and this is the first time since I got my S3 that I have considered another phone manufacturer, I personally don't like the new phones or tablets very much. If I wanted an iphone/iPad I would have bought one instead.

    I also think lollipop is the worst version of android and I've used it since Gingerbread.

    Posted via the Android Central App
    08-15-2015 07:14 PM
  18. BOSSY TEXAS CHICK's Avatar
    ....

    i'm really outta the loop...wuts the tail end of ur reply mean?! "Rotflmaoiwyci!"

    Also, after reading here Best Buy had Note 5 & S6 Edge+ in store already, i had to go visit, hoping against hope they were MUCH better in person....

    Two words: oy vay!

    This is only one gal's opinion, and i am a diehard Sammy fan, (if Sammy makes it, i buy it, and ask questions LATER) but man o man, this time Sammy, ol' pal, ol' bud, you missed the mark (by about a country mile : (

    BTC
    08-15-2015 07:43 PM
  19. ThrottleJohnny's Avatar
    I have to say, both phones impressed me quite a bit, even more so than the Note 4.
    MuchoAloha likes this.
    08-15-2015 08:06 PM
  20. robertopod1968's Avatar
    IMHO, I think one big reason why Samsung's profits are heading towards the red is because of all the new wave of smartphones that pack in a lot of punch for not much money at all.

    Phones like the ASUS Zenfone 2 ZE551ML 64GB, the "phone-that-we-love" 2015 Moto X Pure, and even the OnePlus Two are good examples of phone that pack in flagship-grade hardware with a much more affordable MSRP. Let's not forget phones like the Xiaomi Mi4, Huawei P8 and other phones from Chinese OEMs that look great, feel great, pack in nice hardware while keeping an affordable MSRP.

    Given that these phones offer a similar experience to the S6, it's harder to justify paying $700 for an S6 now.

    IMO, Samsung's only way of staying relevant is to reduce the prices on their devices. They've been in decline before the Note 4 came out, so I highly doubt that the downward trend has anything to do with the removal of an SD card slot.
    I subscribe to this theory. And I think Samsung doesn't want to get into the low price war so they figured they better make a premium device. They might be down a lot more if they released another plastic phone.

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N920A using Tapatalk
    t11rmh likes this.
    08-15-2015 08:08 PM
  21. ThrottleJohnny's Avatar
    I subscribe to this theory. And I think Samsung doesn't want to get into the low price war so they figured they better make a premium device. They might be down a lot more if they released another plastic phone.

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N920A using Tapatalk
    Agreed. The S5 waves and says hi.
    08-15-2015 08:12 PM
  22. D13H4RD2L1V3's Avatar
    I subscribe to this theory. And I think Samsung doesn't want to get into the low price war so they figured they better make a premium device. They might be down a lot more if they released another plastic phone.

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N920A using Tapatalk
    Well, from what I've been seeing, the Moto X and even the OnePlus Two has similar build quality.

    IMHO, a price drop to something a bit more reasonable would help them.

    I still stand by my belief that Samsung's decline has to do with cheaper phones that are similarly-specced. I don't think it has anything to do with their decision to remove an SD card slot and sealing up a battery.

    Remember, they've been in decline before the Note 4 even got revealed
    Laura Knotek likes this.
    08-15-2015 09:27 PM
  23. Crashdamage's Avatar
    I subscribe to this theory. And I think Samsung doesn't want to get into the low price war so they figured they better make a premium device. They might be down a lot more if they released another plastic phone.
    You're forgetting that Samsung makes literally dozens of different models of plastic phones aimed at the mid to low end. They are putting a massive effort into competing in those markets. They already are in a low price war. It will be a difficult battle to win.

    Like I said earlier, look at what happened to Nokia. They had piled of cash. They were a market monster. Three years later they had become a market mouse. It only takes a few mistakes. The same thing could easily happen to Samsung.


    Android since v1.0. Linux since 2001.
    08-15-2015 09:34 PM
  24. brancross's Avatar
    But Samsung is still the best company in Android world, if not LG g4 had already taken Samsung's place, but it didn't happen. But I don't think I will buy Samsung's phones next year, I preordered note5 and I didn't feel excited.

    Posted via the Android Central App
    johnmcd348 likes this.
    08-15-2015 09:44 PM
  25. BlackZeppelin's Avatar
    Samsung's latest financial reporting session showed disappointing sales of the S6, and they admitted they underestimated the demand for the S6 Edge. By the time they figured out the mistake and increased Edge shipments, it was too late...the buzz had worn off. I see more of the same for the Note/S6 Edge +, as it seems Samsung is not doing a good job of understanding what their consumers want.

    I believe the root cause is a dramatic shift in Samsung's approach to phones and tablets. They want to be Apple 2.0, but have missed the bulk of the premium phone market already as most people who can afford the top of the line phones are seeing fewer reasons to upgrade every year for incremental feature enhancements. They have shifted the design of their top tier tablets to the same diminsions of iPads, but waited to do this until iPad sales had already started a large decline....again, too late to the premium game.

    There used to be complaints about Samsung's cheap hardware design (plastic backs, etc), but the phones still sold well. I believe they did need to improve in the hardware design area, and this year's models are indeed beautiful. However, they dropped many of the features that were differentiators between them and Apple, like removeable batteries, SD cards, IR blasters, water proofing (for the S5 anyway), etc. So now they have fewer feature advantages, little to no price advantage, have alienated a significant portion of their core users, and are facing a rapidly increasing set of Android competitors that offer good or better quality phones often at much lower prices.

    I hope I'm wrong. My last 3 phones have been the Note 4, Note 3, and S3. But as nice as the new phones look, things that matter to me are no longer available in the Samsung top tier. I'm gonna start looking at other vendors, and I'm guessing many others will as well.

    What do you think?
    Spot on I couldn't agree with you more. Make no mistake if Samsung continues its present course they will go down like Nokia. I swear there are Apple moles working for Samsung. What I believe is really tragic is that the S6 came very close to being a phenomenal sales winner. If it had simply a removable back plus a bigger battery than the S5 + micro SD card + generous hard drive storage as standard, it would have sold much better .
    KJ78 and dallas90733 like this.
    08-15-2015 09:50 PM
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