01-23-2016 03:21 PM
32 12
tools
  1. Blues Fan's Avatar


    apparently they redesigned a couple things internally on it so if you put it in backwards it wont break the sensors.

    Sucks for us on here who bought it when it first came out. Luckily I have not inserted mine backwards.
    calicocat2010 likes this.
    01-19-2016 12:25 AM
  2. Wussupi83's Avatar
    I purchased a note 5 last week, not sure if it's the new revision. However none of the materials included stated a warning about pen direction when placing into the device (although the manual noted in the article appears to be of digital delivery only). I will say the pen has fallen loose under impact several times. Not sure if this reflects a change in design or previous revisions did this as well. That's the only input I can provide given I'm not going to attempt.

    Posted via the Android Central App
    01-19-2016 05:59 AM
  3. Trees's Avatar
    Good to know if true. Hard to tell from the video showing the internal components exactly what was changed or fixed.
    01-19-2016 06:48 AM
  4. anon(394005)'s Avatar
    It's been confirmed: Confirmed: Samsung changes Galaxy Note 5 internals to fix upside-down S Pen issue | Android Central

    Below is a screen grab from the video above (47 sec mark) comparing the new version (on the left) and the old version (on the right). What they did was replace the electronic switch that had the lever sticking straight out of it with a push button switch that has a large hook type lever across it to prevent the S-Pen from snagging on it.

    Samsung fixes Spen backwards issue on newer Note 5s-spenredesign.png
    Trees likes this.
    01-19-2016 07:20 AM
  5. naturalguy's Avatar
    I do not understand how someone could put the pen in backwards, it's just common sense and easy to put it in the right way.
    01-19-2016 08:42 AM
  6. Blues Fan's Avatar
    I purchased a note 5 last week, not sure if it's the new revision. However none of the materials included stated a warning about pen direction when placing into the device (although the manual noted in the article appears to be of digital delivery only). I will say the pen has fallen loose under impact several times. Not sure if this reflects a change in design or previous revisions did this as well. That's the only input I can provide given I'm not going to attempt.

    Posted via the Android Central App
    That's normal. I bought mine back in late aug and dropped it on the carpet by accident a couple times of course it has a case on it and the spen came loose a couple times.
    01-19-2016 09:03 AM
  7. TabGuy's Avatar
    I do not understand how someone could put the pen in backwards, it's just common sense and easy to put it in the right way.
    I agree with you but this is such a simple flaw to fix I'm surprised the engineers allowed it to happen.
    01-19-2016 10:23 AM
  8. bassplayrguy's Avatar
    I am sorry that this has to be said but this is not a design flaw. It is carelessness on the part of the phone owner. Just because someone doesn't pay attention and damages their phone, does not make it the manufacturers' responsibility to save them from themselves by spending the money to fix a "flaw" that doesn't exist. Pay attention.
    jmy7213, stang281472 and crester like this.
    01-19-2016 01:57 PM
  9. naturalguy's Avatar
    I am sorry that this has to be said but this is not a design flaw. It is carelessness on the part of the phone owner. Just because someone doesn't pay attention and damages their phone, does not make it the manufacturers' responsibility to save them from themselves by spending the money to fix a "flaw" that doesn't exist. Pay attention.
    Seriously, it's just common sense
    jmy7213 likes this.
    01-19-2016 02:34 PM
  10. serpent2005's Avatar
    I feel the same way about those guardrails on mountain roads. There are probably hundreds of miles of those things installed near where I live -- a total waste of taxpayer money. People should know not to drive over cliffs -- duh!

    Just kidding. Changing the design to prevent this type of mishap is good customer service by Samsung!
    01-19-2016 06:14 PM
  11. calicocat2010's Avatar
    I guess, the manufacturers' never thought that people would be careless at putting their pen in backwards. I have never done it, *knocks on wood*, but when I do use my pen, I make sure to LOOK and see if it's pointing in the right direction, AND have it where the inscription is facing upwards. I don't know if That would mess up the pen , but at any point, I DO watch what I'm doing. People do stupid stuff, and so the manufacturers' really should come up with "stupid" ideas and then make the improvements based on those "stupid" ideas IN the drawing room, before EVER releasing the device for BETA testing.
    01-19-2016 11:07 PM
  12. anon(394005)'s Avatar
    I am sorry that this has to be said but this is not a design flaw. It is carelessness on the part of the phone owner. Just because someone doesn't pay attention and damages their phone, does not make it the manufacturers' responsibility to save them from themselves by spending the money to fix a "flaw" that doesn't exist. Pay attention.
    It's a design flaw in the fact that inserting the S-Pen backwards (and then having to forcefully pull it back out) actually damages internals of the phone. Good design wouldn't allow this to happen in the first place nor would it put the onus on the end user to prevent. What we have here instead is a poor design decision made by Samsung, thus the responsibility rests with them and why they have subsequently corrected it.
    serpent2005 and debdroid1a like this.
    01-20-2016 06:48 AM
  13. bassplayrguy's Avatar
    It's a design flaw in the fact that inserting the S-Pen backwards (and then having to forcefully pull it back out) actually damages internals of the phone. Good design wouldn't allow this to happen in the first place nor would it put the onus on the end user to prevent. What we have here instead is a poor design decision made by Samsung, thus the responsibility rests with them and why they have subsequently corrected it.
    Agree to disagree.
    01-20-2016 07:39 AM
  14. anon(9228075)'s Avatar
    I still find it hard to believe how someone could put it in backwards by accident. I just don't get it lol

    Posted via the Android Central App
    01-20-2016 01:08 PM
  15. Mage Studio's Avatar
    How easy does it fit in backwards?
    01-20-2016 01:49 PM
  16. LeoRex's Avatar
    OK... this was something spoken about, in length, back when the story broke. Yes, putting the S-Pen in backwards is a mistake on the part of the user and most people wouldn't have that problem. But.... one of the most critical component of product testing and quality assurance is what's called 'negative path' testing. This involves purposefully using the product incorrectly. Whether the product is a toaster or a piece of software, the concept is the same; if it can be done wrong, it will be done wrong. And the manufacturer really has to do their due diligence in these cases. If the design can be changed to eliminate or reduce the chances of it happening, change the design.

    So back to the enclosure for the S-Pen. If someone inserts the pen the wrong way (and there really isn't anything mechanically to stop that), if the narrowed portion of the S-Pen, the 'cap', passes that black switch, the switch will snag on it when removed, and there is a high likelihood that the switch will break if the S-Pen is removed at that point.

    That is most certainly a design flaw. Sure, it is a design flaw that only occurs due to an error on the part of the user, it is still a flaw. It's why manual gearboxes have lockouts to keep someone from going from 5th gear to reverse and why electrical codes require GFI outlets in bathrooms.
    debdroid1a likes this.
    01-20-2016 02:36 PM
  17. bassplayrguy's Avatar
    OK... this was something spoken about, in length, back when the story broke. Yes, putting the S-Pen in backwards is a mistake on the part of the user and most people wouldn't have that problem. But.... one of the most critical component of product testing and quality assurance is what's called 'negative path' testing. This involves purposefully using the product incorrectly. Whether the product is a toaster or a piece of software, the concept is the same; if it can be done wrong, it will be done wrong. And the manufacturer really has to do their due diligence in these cases. If the design can be changed to eliminate or reduce the chances of it happening, change the design.

    So back to the enclosure for the S-Pen. If someone inserts the pen the wrong way (and there really isn't anything mechanically to stop that), if the narrowed portion of the S-Pen, the 'cap', passes that black switch, the switch will snag on it when removed, and there is a high likelihood that the switch will break if the S-Pen is removed at that point.

    That is most certainly a design flaw. Sure, it is a design flaw that only occurs due to an error on the part of the user, it is still a flaw. It's why manual gearboxes have lockouts to keep someone from going from 5th gear to reverse and why electrical codes require GFI outlets in bathrooms.
    I'm sorry but I Just don't agree. It isn't samsung's responsibility to save you from yourself. You are grown and you take responsibility for your own actions. You break it by being careless, you pay to fix it. That's how the real world works.

    Posted via the Android Central App
    NotAnAppleGuy likes this.
    01-20-2016 05:07 PM
  18. anon(394005)'s Avatar
    How easy does it fit in backwards?
    The video below shows how easily the Note 5 S-Pen goes into the silo backwards and slides all the way in with just gravity. In comparison I can't do that with my Note 4, it only goes in about a quarter of an inch before it hits a hard stop and won't go in further unless I apply excessive force. Even then, there are no moving parts inside the Note 4 silo that could break (unlike the Note 5). It has an entirely different S-Pen detection mechanism (IMHO a superior one) with a sensor built into the outer top edge of the silo that detects a magnet on the top end of the S-Pen.

    01-20-2016 06:38 PM
  19. LeoRex's Avatar
    I'm sorry but I Just don't agree. It isn't samsung's responsibility to save you from yourself. You are grown and you take responsibility for your own actions. You break it by being careless, you pay to fix it. That's how the real world works.
    Actually... it is how the real world works. Every product you touch, use, consume, etc... all has several design elements whose sole purpose is to avoid a similar situation and protect you from yourself. I've been in software QA for a long long time and in near every situation where the developer is saying "I'm not going to change it, the user shouldn't do that" and the QA says "Doesn't matter, we can address it so it can't happen", the QA argument wins. And in the few instances where they didn't win, it was usually because it was caught too late in the cycle, in which the issue gets addressed post-release. In instances where the product breaks, it gets addressed, every time.

    Now, sometimes these potential problems should have been caught before release.. which I think the S-Pen issue most certainly should have. I can only guess that that switch was the result of a design change late in the development cycle and not properly tested... or they discovered it too late to change it. That happens more than people think. But other issues, well, they just can't be caught.

    A perfect example of this, albeit a much more extreme example, is the huge ignition recall that GM had to do back in 2014... the one where the ignition mechanism was getting worn out by people who had everything but the kitchen sink on their keychains. GM caught a lot of flak for that, but from a testing standpoint, who would have thought to ask that question during the R&D phase? Now, the simple answer would be "Stop doing that!", but 6 people died as a result of the airbags not going off due to the ignition failure. GM recalled 1.6 million+ cars.
    01-21-2016 08:37 AM
  20. bassplayrguy's Avatar
    Actually... it is how the real world works. Every product you touch, use, consume, etc... all has several design elements whose sole purpose is to avoid a similar situation and protect you from yourself. I've been in software QA for a long long time and in near every situation where the developer is saying "I'm not going to change it, the user shouldn't do that" and the QA says "Doesn't matter, we can address it so it can't happen", the QA argument wins. And in the few instances where they didn't win, it was usually because it was caught too late in the cycle, in which the issue gets addressed post-release. In instances where the product breaks, it gets addressed, every time.

    Now, sometimes these potential problems should have been caught before release.. which I think the S-Pen issue most certainly should have. I can only guess that that switch was the result of a design change late in the development cycle and not properly tested... or they discovered it too late to change it. That happens more than people think. But other issues, well, they just can't be caught.

    A perfect example of this, albeit a much more extreme example, is the huge ignition recall that GM had to do back in 2014... the one where the ignition mechanism was getting worn out by people who had everything but the kitchen sink on their keychains. GM caught a lot of flak for that, but from a testing standpoint, who would have thought to ask that question during the R&D phase? Now, the simple answer would be "Stop doing that!", but 6 people died as a result of the airbags not going off due to the ignition failure. GM recalled 1.6 million+ cars.
    And this is partly why phones are 800 plus dollars. I see where you are coming from and I agree that a lot of companies do it. I just don't agree with it. I am in transportation and have been a mechanic for years so I see a lot of stupid and if the manufacturers had to go back and redesign antistupid devices everytime I saw someone put gas in a diesel truck or any number of similar stupid attacks, they would all be bankrupt. The public opinion would be there is a design flaw in this truck because you are physical able to put the wrong fuel in it, there by blowing your engine. We can respectfully agree to disagree.
    01-21-2016 09:22 AM
  21. LeoRex's Avatar
    And this is partly why phones are 800 plus dollars. I see where you are coming from and I agree that a lot of companies do it. I just don't agree with it.
    Well that's a different topic for a different day. In some cases, we end up with better, more reliable products... in other cases we end up with 'Caution : Contents may be hot" warnings on the side of coffee cups. Samsung obviously had enough complaints, warranty claims, bad press to go in and make a tweak to the switch (and kind of without making a big deal over it too)

    In the end, sometimes a simple design element is the right choice, even though the user should really know better.

    Samsung fixes Spen backwards issue on newer Note 5s-claymore.jpg
    bassplayrguy likes this.
    01-21-2016 03:50 PM
  22. NotAnAppleGuy's Avatar
    OK... this was something spoken about, in length, back when the story broke. Yes, putting the S-Pen in backwards is a mistake on the part of the user and most people wouldn't have that problem. But.... one of the most critical component of product testing and quality assurance is what's called 'negative path' testing. This involves purposefully using the product incorrectly. Whether the product is a toaster or a piece of software, the concept is the same; if it can be done wrong, it will be done wrong. And the manufacturer really has to do their due diligence in these cases. If the design can be changed to eliminate or reduce the chances of it happening, change the design.

    So back to the enclosure for the S-Pen. If someone inserts the pen the wrong way (and there really isn't anything mechanically to stop that), if the narrowed portion of the S-Pen, the 'cap', passes that black switch, the switch will snag on it when removed, and there is a high likelihood that the switch will break if the S-Pen is removed at that point.

    That is most certainly a design flaw. Sure, it is a design flaw that only occurs due to an error on the part of the user, it is still a flaw. It's why manual gearboxes have lockouts to keep someone from going from 5th gear to reverse and why electrical codes require GFI outlets in bathrooms.
    Disagree. Gasoline engines run on gasoline, not DIESEL. The manual for the car specifically states not to put diesel in your gasoline engine. The manual says NOT to insert the pen in backwards or damage may occur. So it's the manufacturers fault of the engine if someone puts diesel in the engine that runs on gasoline and it damages the engine?

    Lol it's pure carelessness nothing else. Like the one guy whose S-Pen magically broke in half while "INSIDE" the silo. WTF are you doing to the phone or the pen to get it to break whether inside or outside the silo?! But then that was blamed on the design of the pen also. You can only ***** proof these electronic devices so much. What's next? "I dropped it in the pool, it doesn't work, so it's a design flaw?" Even though it tells you not to get the device wet. C'mon now...

    Posted Via Galaxy Note Edge. Yea, the phone is perfect...
    sweetypie31 likes this.
    01-22-2016 05:11 AM
  23. bassplayrguy's Avatar
    Disagree. Gasoline engines run on gasoline, not DIESEL. The manual for the car specifically states not to put diesel in your gasoline engine. The manual says NOT to insert the pen in backwards or damage may occur. So it's the manufacturers fault of the engine if someone puts diesel in the engine that runs on gasoline and it damages the engine?

    Lol it's pure carelessness nothing else. Like the one guy whose S-Pen magically broke in half while "INSIDE" the silo. WTF are you doing to the phone or the pen to get it to break whether inside or outside the silo?! But then that was blamed on the design of the pen also. You can only ***** proof these electronic devices so much. What's next? "I dropped it in the pool, it doesn't work, so it's a design flaw?" Even though it tells you not to get the device wet. C'mon now...

    Posted Via Galaxy Note Edge. Yea, the phone is perfect...
    Exactly what I have been saying.
    01-22-2016 06:39 AM
  24. NotAnAppleGuy's Avatar
    Exactly what I have been saying.
    People want to blame the manufacturer for their failures. I fail to see how it is a design flaw. A diesel nozzle goes in the same exact way as a gasoline nozzle. How do you save those from themselves that don't pay attention? It's really not a hard concept and an instruction manual explicitly tells you what and what NOT to do.

    My impression is alot of these people shouldn't own these phones in the first place. Stick with a BlackBerry phone. It's a plastic box with an antennae and a battery. Very rugged. Hard to break and no external moving parts. Again, the issue is not Samsung. The issue is a large population of people that utilize their expensive device in a careless manner and then when they break it, it's someone elses fault.

    Posted Via Galaxy Note Edge. Yea, the phone is perfect...
    bassplayrguy likes this.
    01-22-2016 10:31 AM
  25. debdroid1a's Avatar
    Disagree. Gasoline engines run on gasoline, not DIESEL. The manual for the car specifically states not to put diesel in your gasoline engine. The manual says NOT to insert the pen in backwards or damage may occur. So it's the manufacturers fault of the engine if someone puts diesel in the engine that runs on gasoline and it damages the engine?

    Posted Via Galaxy Note Edge. Yea, the phone is perfect...
    Not all manuals are that specific. There was some vehicle that the front of the manual was written for the diesel version of the vehicle and the back version written for the gas version. If someone just quickly checked the manual (and some young girl did), you would think to put diesel in it. Plus the top of the most gas tanks are wide enough to fit a diesel gas pump in, the lower part fits the gas pump perfectly. My gas tank is like that. Those who are young or have worked on farms with diesel vehicles, may not know any better.

    I've never done any of this, but have calls on this at my day job (in vehicle fleet).

    About the Note 5 manual regarding the Spen insertion. Mine never said that. Here's a picture I took of the manual. I got it on launch day at t-mobile.
    01-22-2016 04:45 PM
32 12

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