06-02-2012 04:46 AM
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  1. Kevin OQuinn's Avatar
    I disagree. Where is this 'clean break' HTC have made? Most of Sense is unchanged. I've given specific examples. Can you give some examples that make back up your opinion, since you've used the new Sense a lot more. The only oem skin I'd call remotely close to stock is the new Motorola ICS one they just revealed.

    btw, just because Google says so doesn't make it right. If all phones were barebones AOSP, Android wouldn't sell. Are you seriously trying to say removable storage is bad?
    I'm trying to say that Google said they don't want removable storage anymore, or a menu button. So yes, it's bad. Put enough internal storage in the phone to appease people. Samsung did that. So why the SD card slot? Just to check a box on the list of things they could use in marketing? If so, that's fine. They are in business to make money, and I that helps then they'll do it. Doesn't make it right.

    Clean break, the new dock takes its cue straight from ICS and behaves the same exact way. The camera interface is also brand new.

    In the interest of fairness I'll point out something that took a step backwards...the lock screen shortcuts can't be customized on their own. Whatever is in your dock is what's on your lockscreen.

    Sent from my HTC One X using Android Central Forums
    05-28-2012 08:02 AM
  2. v1rtu4l's Avatar
    I didn't really get that. What they tried to do (and didn't do all that well) was say that the S3 actually has pretty stiff competition, which the S2 didn't. And since the One X is beastly in its own right, the S3 cannot get some of the free passes that the S2 got. Myriam tends to be as fair as you can get, so any claims of bias ring a little hollow.
    Myriam being as fair as you can get ? you mean the same myriam that told samsung they should not differentiate, but actually put their features (like smart stay) into the android branch, so android as whole (and in turn the other manufacturers) can benefit from that. if you are in a clear set of mind you realize how ridiculous it is telling a manufacturer to hire and pay software engineers to create something just to give it to your opponent/competition.

    the review of sharif was one of the worst in regards of showing open bias against or for custom skins, i read and i nearly read them all.

    even vlad (of the verge) showed his bias against the design "designed for humans who like fake brushed metal" but sharif did top it.


    Read Phil's thoughts on the new Touchwiz. While Sense 4 complements and adds to ICS, the new touchwiz sits on top of it, doing its own thing while sticking vaguely to ICS paradigms. With the new Sense, its very apparent that ICS is a part of it. The same cannot be said of touchwiz. (More than a few hands ons said the experience was not different than the old version)
    this argument "touchwiz on galaxy s3 is looking exactly like the touchwiz on gingerbread" is only done by people who actually did not use a samsung galaxy s2 touchwiz (ICS) device for an extended period of time. obviously myriam is one of em.


    all i here is "this is a rippoff of apples feature xyz" from htc fans, while if htc had actually something to counter than they would say "but htc feature xyz is better". it's clearly the argumentation method of htc guys to say "samsungs feature is irrelevant because noone needs this" or that it is a ripp-off. funny example "samsung does more pictures per second in burst mode ? pah, no one needs this". i agree that it does not make a huge difference if the cam shoots 4 pics or 6 in a second but if you would have to give a rating to those values you would clearly rate the 6pics/second higher.

    samsung bad at updating ? this can clearly only come from someone that either never visited xda-forums or has not even used the latest samsung phones. my galaxy s2 has already got an update that includes features that where part of the new ICS build exclusively used in the galaxy s3.

    the new touchwiz launcher of the galaxy s3 is AMAZING ! now you will ask how i can tell ... it was extracted and i am running it on my galaxy s2 and believe it or not it is even more fluid than the stock launcher on the galaxy s2 and more fluid than any other launcher. great piece of software there by samsung.

    the argument about build quality can be put quickly aside... just have a look at the htc one x forums and see how many threads exists with bad screens, bending, creaking parts, dead pixels, colour problems, returns because of bad quality. if you think about the low percentage of people that are actually on xda (compared to the number of people that got the htc one x) you can extrapolate how many flawed devices find their way back to the shop where they were bought

    I'm trying to say that Google said they don't want removable storage anymore, or a menu button. So yes, it's bad. Put enough internal storage in the phone to appease people. Samsung did that. So why the SD card slot? Just to check a box on the list of things they could use in marketing? If so, that's fine. They are in business to make money, and I that helps then they'll do it. Doesn't make it right.
    google may want this and that, but simply because google wants something it's not going to happen (see google wallet for example). there are too many parties involved in this and the statement "no external media" is clearly something only targeted to stop piracy and leakage of internal system files (like apks- which then can get pirated). if you have only the filtered access via MTP google can much easier restrict what parts of the phones files and stuff you can access. if course they want that (going into the direction of ios and wp7) but that is not in the favour of actual customers.

    phones with high internal storage are way more expensive, than buying a variant with lower internal storage and upgrading it later by the means of a sd-card. another point against "no sd-card" is that even though samsung announced other variants with 32gb and 64gb, they either get released a good part later or not at all depending on your region. advertised high internal storage does not calculate into the ability for john doe to simply buy the phone with the larger capacity.


    Clean break, the new dock takes its cue straight from ICS and behaves the same exact way. The camera interface is also brand new.
    i am not too familiar with the htc sense cam application but what baffled me is, how can any camera interface be superior to a camera interface of touchwiz which you can easily customize (because you have 4 or 5 shortcuts on the cam interface you can freely change).
    s14tat likes this.
    05-28-2012 01:23 PM
  3. Kevin OQuinn's Avatar
    Myriam being as fair as you can get ? you mean the same myriam that told samsung they should not differentiate, but actually put their features (like smart stay) into the android branch, so android as whole (and in turn the other manufacturers) can benefit from that. if you are in a clear set of mind you realize how ridiculous it is telling a manufacturer to hire and pay software engineers to create something just to give it to your opponent/competition.

    the review of sharif was one of the worst in regards of showing open bias against or for custom skins, i read and i nearly read them all.

    even vlad (of the verge) showed his bias against the design "designed for humans who like fake brushed metal" but sharif did top it.



    this argument "touchwiz on galaxy s3 is looking exactly like the touchwiz on gingerbread" is only done by people who actually did not use a samsung galaxy s2 touchwiz (ICS) device for an extended period of time. obviously myriam is one of em.


    all i here is "this is a rippoff of apples feature xyz" from htc fans, while if htc had actually something to counter than they would say "but htc feature xyz is better". it's clearly the argumentation method of htc guys to say "samsungs feature is irrelevant because noone needs this" or that it is a ripp-off. funny example "samsung does more pictures per second in burst mode ? pah, no one needs this". i agree that it does not make a huge difference if the cam shoots 4 pics or 6 in a second but if you would have to give a rating to those values you would clearly rate the 6pics/second higher.

    samsung bad at updating ? this can clearly only come from someone that either never visited xda-forums or has not even used the latest samsung phones. my galaxy s2 has already got an update that includes features that where part of the new ICS build exclusively used in the galaxy s3.

    the new touchwiz launcher of the galaxy s3 is AMAZING ! now you will ask how i can tell ... it was extracted and i am running it on my galaxy s2 and believe it or not it is even more fluid than the stock launcher on the galaxy s2 and more fluid than any other launcher. great piece of software there by samsung.

    the argument about build quality can be put quickly aside... just have a look at the htc one x forums and see how many threads exists with bad screens, bending, creaking parts, dead pixels, colour problems, returns because of bad quality. if you think about the low percentage of people that are actually on xda (compared to the number of people that got the htc one x) you can extrapolate how many flawed devices find their way back to the shop where they were bought


    google may want this and that, but simply because google wants something it's not going to happen (see google wallet for example). there are too many parties involved in this and the statement "no external media" is clearly something only targeted to stop piracy and leakage of internal system files (like apks- which then can get pirated). if you have only the filtered access via MTP google can much easier restrict what parts of the phones files and stuff you can access. if course they want that (going into the direction of ios and wp7) but that is not in the favour of actual customers.

    phones with high internal storage are way more expensive, than buying a variant with lower internal storage and upgrading it later by the means of a sd-card. another point against "no sd-card" is that even though samsung announced other variants with 32gb and 64gb, they either get released a good part later or not at all depending on your region. advertised high internal storage does not calculate into the ability for john doe to simply buy the phone with the larger capacity.



    i am not too familiar with the htc sense cam application but what baffled me is, how can any camera interface be superior to a camera interface of touchwiz which you can easily customize (because you have 4 or 5 shortcuts on the cam interface you can freely change).
    Said like a true fanboy that hasn't actually used sense. And yes, I owned an sgsii and ran all the leaks.

    Guess what, saying "root your phone and screw official updates" isn't the answer.

    I would rather not have something than have something that works halfway.

    Nope, nobody has to listen to Google, but that doesn't mean they shouldn't. I fail to see how having more internal storage isn't beneficial to the consumer.

    Sent from my HTC One X using Android Central Forums
    _JKK_ likes this.
    05-28-2012 02:46 PM
  4. v1rtu4l's Avatar
    Said like a true fanboy that hasn't actually used sense. And yes, I owned an sgsii and ran all the leaks.
    so we got something in common i guess... i did not post much in the AC forums as of yet, so i do not know how the official stance is about moderators here, but for a moderator you absolutely sound very pro-htc/sense from the very first post in here

    Guess what, saying "root your phone and screw official updates" isn't the answer.
    where did i mention "root" or "screw official updates" ? i got no problems with official updates since i got an international open galaxy s2. i get the updates. if you are in the US or somewhere with a provider sitting between you and the updates that is hardly samsungs fault. the hint to xda was only to say that even if you are a US citizen you could check there and see that samsung is not bad in updating (since there are many updates released). the fact that some don't get those is by (unknowingly) choosing to. noone needs to buy a branded phone if since there are gsm-networks all over the world. if you are on cdma it's another story, but that is the minority


    I would rather not have something than have something that works halfway.
    that is again a very fanboy'ish answer. if i was to argue like that i could actually flame the htc one x to ashes with that argument "better nothing than half":

    - htc one x hd videos do only have 60% of the bitrate of the GS3... "better not have hd video at all, than only half baked low quality video recording compared to the GS3"

    - htc one x does not leave as many apps open in the background as the GS3, hence the one x has to reload them when choosing them from the recent apps menu ... better not have multitasking at all, if i only have a few selected apps that can stay running in background

    i could call out more, but i guess you get the point ... or not depending on how hard your htc-illness already has got the better of you


    Nope, nobody has to listen to Google, but that doesn't mean they shouldn't. I fail to see how having more internal storage isn't beneficial to the consumer.
    that is NOT what i said. i said that just having more variants of the hardware with different internal storage capacity will not lead to the wanted effect of a customer being able to choose the variant which fits his needs best. as of right now, there are only 16 GB variants for sale.
    so customers who need more can not get their way.

    furthermore the other variants will NOT be available everywhere.

    third point is, that the 32 GB version will still be more expensive than the 16 GB version with an additional 16 GB microSDHC card

    as long as those three points are all true and valid, it is very sensible to offer microSD slots for this device.

    do you think anyone would even bother to buy the iPhone with 64GB if the 16 GB variant had an sd-slot ? it's actually only apple who can pull that off, because they do supply all regions with all capacity-versions of the phone.
    s14tat, Tkbredx and Kevin OQuinn like this.
    05-28-2012 03:41 PM
  5. s14tat's Avatar
    wow, v1rtu4l is someone who might be as smart as kevin but is actually on samsung's ( our ) side.


    05-28-2012 05:06 PM
  6. Tkbredx's Avatar
    As for the menu button on the phone vs softkeys on the screen... I say neither! Give me a sexy gesture bar like on the palm pre. Less bezel needed, sexier look, less fuss, more functionality, more unique, more potential.
    05-28-2012 05:37 PM
  7. maverick96's Avatar
    Said like a true fanboy that hasn't actually used sense. And yes, I owned an sgsii and ran all the leaks.

    Guess what, saying "root your phone and screw official updates" isn't the answer.

    I would rather not have something than have something that works halfway.

    Nope, nobody has to listen to Google, but that doesn't mean they shouldn't. I fail to see how having more internal storage isn't beneficial to the consumer.

    Sent from my HTC One X using Android Central Forums
    Have to admit this does sound fanboy-ish. And being a forum moderator. That's a bad thing.
    05-28-2012 06:04 PM
  8. Kevin OQuinn's Avatar
    wow, v1rtu4l is someone who might be as smart as kevin but is actually on samsung's ( our ) side.


    Click to view quoted image
    Umm....thanks?

    Have to admit this does sound fanboy-ish. And being a forum moderator. That's a bad thing.
    I'm entitled to an opinion...and I'm not an HTC fanboy. I've owned HTC and Samsung Android phones. You could say I'm anti-Motorola, but that's not relevant here.

    so we got something in common i guess... i did not post much in the AC forums as of yet, so i do not know how the official stance is about moderators here, but for a moderator you absolutely sound very pro-htc/sense from the very first post in here


    where did i mention "root" or "screw official updates" ? i got no problems with official updates since i got an international open galaxy s2. i get the updates. if you are in the US or somewhere with a provider sitting between you and the updates that is hardly samsungs fault. the hint to xda was only to say that even if you are a US citizen you could check there and see that samsung is not bad in updating (since there are many updates released). the fact that some don't get those is by (unknowingly) choosing to. noone needs to buy a branded phone if since there are gsm-networks all over the world. if you are on cdma it's another story, but that is the minority

    If that's what you were implying then why point to XDA? We post about international phones getting updates all the time. Obviously it hasn't happened yet, but HTC has said that the Desire HD will be getting official ICS, but the Galaxy S (competitor to the Desire HD) won't be. That's what I'm talking about. Also, how long did it take for the SGS to get any updates? And, unfortunately, getting updates in the States is what we're talking about, regardless of whose fault it is. The majority of people buy a carrier branded phone here, and the people that don't, or that root and flash roms and such, is by far the minority of users. Also wondering how CDMA is the minority here in the States, since more people are on it than GSM. And claiming people don't get updates because of ignorance is in and of itself ignorant. People buy a phone because it does what they want when they leave the store. If it doesn't then they return it, but 99% of people don't go "hmmm....this is not what I expected, let's see what I can do to change it." That's just not realistic to think that it's anything other than that.

    that is again a very fanboy'ish answer. if i was to argue like that i could actually flame the htc one x to ashes with that argument "better nothing than half":

    - htc one x hd videos do only have 60% of the bitrate of the GS3... "better not have hd video at all, than only half baked low quality video recording compared to the GS3"

    - htc one x does not leave as many apps open in the background as the GS3, hence the one x has to reload them when choosing them from the recent apps menu ... better not have multitasking at all, if i only have a few selected apps that can stay running in background

    i could call out more, but i guess you get the point ... or not depending on how hard your htc-illness already has got the better of you


    I definitely get the point. But MY point is this; Samsung introduced a lot of new features, some of which don't function very well, some of which do. But I'm sure they intended for all of them to be perfect. They just aren't.

    HTC built the app killing nature into Sense. Therefor it's not something that's half done, but something that actually functions exactly the way it was intended. Whether or not it sucks isn't the point here (I'm on the side of "it sucks"), but rather that it functions the way HTC designed it to.

    I also never said that HTC was perfect, or that the One X was perfect. There are things that can be improved. Those can all be changed through software updates. Or, since I'm in the minority that will root and such, through ROM's/hacks/tweaks.


    that is NOT what i said. i said that just having more variants of the hardware with different internal storage capacity will not lead to the wanted effect of a customer being able to choose the variant which fits his needs best. as of right now, there are only 16 GB variants for sale.
    so customers who need more can not get their way.

    furthermore the other variants will NOT be available everywhere.

    I guess this nullifies your point above that people should just buy the unlocked phone of their choosing. Once they are all released by Samsung they should be available EVERYWHERE.

    third point is, that the 32 GB version will still be more expensive than the 16 GB version with an additional 16 GB microSDHC card

    The price difference is pretty significant, according to the importers. I would like to see what carriers charge for the different capacities. Reasonable or not, though, Google still doesn't want expandable storage.

    as long as those three points are all true and valid, it is very sensible to offer microSD slots for this device.

    do you think anyone would even bother to buy the iPhone with 64GB if the 16 GB variant had an sd-slot ? it's actually only apple who can pull that off, because they do supply all regions with all capacity-versions of the phone.

    And look at the percentage of capacities that are sold. 90% are the 16gb. For a reason.
    See above in bold and italics. <---- FAIL on my part. Didn't notice that some of what I replied to was already bold and italics. I will now underline my response.


    To reiterate, though, open source is a double edge sword. Companies can make any changes they want. Some are good, some are bad, and a lot of what's what is a matter of opinion.

    My opinion is this, compared to last year's flagship phones, HTC hit a homerun (last year's dual-core HTC phones were OK at best), but Samsung only hit a triple (the SGSII was THAT good). A triple isn't bad, and neither is the SGSIII. Working up to Apple levels of hype has its consequences, though, and that is generally that you won't live up to it.

    Is it a solid phone? Yes. Will it be immensely successful and sell millions of devices? Yes. Take the argument about whether or not what Samsung or HTC has chosen to do is good for the Android platform as a whole, and making money is what you're left with. It's a good bet that Samsung will make more money off of the SGSIII than HTC does from the One X (not counting the S or V), and if that does indeed become a fact then Samsung wins.


    Also, since the phone hasn't been released yet (and the blue one is actually DELAYED) we have no idea how many bugs/issues/problems people will have with it. Build quality and quality control aren't the same thing. Having quality control problems is nothing new for HTC. Just look at the Thunderbolt. It was a disaster.
    05-28-2012 06:41 PM
  9. droidmyme's Avatar
    I'll add my two cents. I read the review, and while I don't think it was biased against Samsung, it certainly was not dripping with praises, and perhaps that is why some Samsung fans are mad: it simply doesn't receive the same level of adulation as the iPhone. Samsung and Apple are much different. Samsung will never be an Apple replacement, but it need not be.

    If anything, in my eyes the reviewer displayed a level of healthy skepticism. And I appreciate that.

    Sent from my VM670 using Tapatalk 2
    Kevin OQuinn likes this.
    05-28-2012 07:54 PM
  10. s14tat's Avatar
    Kevin can you please explain to me how build quality is different from quality control? Are you telling me the ones that are actually built nice would have great build quality but the ones that slipped through the cracks in the final check out should not be considered to have poor build quality because the quality control sucks? I'm confused because that does not make any sense to me at all.
    05-28-2012 08:02 PM
  11. Kevin OQuinn's Avatar
    Kevin can you please explain to me how build quality is different from quality control? Are you telling me the ones that are actually built nice would have great build quality but the ones that slipped through the cracks in the final check out should not be considered to have poor build quality because the quality control sucks? I'm confused because that does not make any sense to me at all.
    Build quality would be the way things fit together, tightness of gaps, fit and finish, quality of materials, etc.

    Quality control would be things like parts not assembled correctly, loose panels, defective components from the factory, loose volume rockers (One X specifically), etc.

    Overall build quality can be great, but if a high percentage of devices come with defects from the factory than that's a knock against quality control.


    That would be like a car maker building a $1,000,000 car, but then having multiple recalls after it ships to customers. Build quality would be assumed to be amazing at that price point, but quality control would be considered poor because of the recalls.
    05-28-2012 08:09 PM
  12. Kevin OQuinn's Avatar
    Just to add...some of these things can overlap. Using a cheap material that appears to be high-quality could fail prematurely, which would then be a knock against both build quality and quality control.
    05-28-2012 08:12 PM
  13. Robes1NC's Avatar
    Engadget did a full on review. I normally love their reviews but this one just felt plain, basic, something we've already seen. Not only that but it also seemed pretty biased.

    Samsung Galaxy S III review -- Engadget

    Of course they made it seem like the One X is better. Lots of personal opinions on the UI, build of device, and screen. Apple makes another iPhone with 0 changes and the phone is praised on the build. Samsung takes well liked previous designs and enhances it and everyone criticisizes it. HTC moves away from stock Android and generally people like it. Samsung does the same thing with fancy new features and people say its like older versions of Android (which is irrelevant thanks to custom roms and launchers). I just dont get it. Everyones so hard on the S3 and Samsung
    I must say that I agree with you 100000%. The One X is being called beautiful but when you look at the back it has a huge ugly hump! To me that is a design failure! It has been since the first phone with the hump was made. It's ugly. I like the smooth lines and the entire look of the GS3. I don't think there is anything that the One X could do to compete. Especially when you look at Sense! The same icons that I had on my Incredible! The first Incredible! Sense is old and heavy. The camera has been proven to be better on the GS3. The browser is miles ahead. So where exactly does the One X win? And against what? That was an extremely biased review. The writer might as well have stated that he hated Samsung at the beginning. I would have had more respect.
    Tkbredx likes this.
    05-28-2012 09:14 PM
  14. s14tat's Avatar
    So what if got a phone that was flawless when new but stuff stops working over time like the power button or the track ball becomes too loose like one the nexus one? Would that be a build quality or quality control issue?
    05-28-2012 09:15 PM
  15. Robes1NC's Avatar
    So what if got a phone that was flawless when new but stuff stops working over time like the power button or the track ball becomes too loose like one the nexus one? Would that be a build quality or quality control issue?
    LOL! Both! Quality control should have stopped them from building that crap!
    05-28-2012 09:31 PM
  16. Crispy's Avatar
    Every single claimed advantage of the One X besides the screen is totally subjective and not justifiable. Vague statements like 'it's closer to what Google wants'. Major faults like inability to multitask are explained away as being a feature, as if that makes it ok. Sense users on the htc boards have said how it's stil a heavy bloated skin.

    In contrast the GS3 has many new features which may not matter to some people, but the vast majority like them, like removable storage, keeping the menu button, faster and smoother. These are things anyone using their phone will like more.

    The sales figures will bear this out. The GS3 looks like a much better phone.
    05-28-2012 11:54 PM
  17. JHBThree's Avatar
    Every single claimed advantage of the One X besides the screen is totally subjective and not justifiable. Vague statements like 'it's closer to what Google wants'. Major faults like inability to multitask are explained away as being a feature, as if that makes it ok. Sense users on the htc boards have said how it's stil a heavy bloated skin.

    In contrast the GS3 has many new features which may not matter to some people, but the vast majority like them, like removable storage, keeping the menu button, faster and smoother. These are things anyone using their phone will like more.

    The sales figures will bear this out. The GS3 looks like a much better phone.
    ...in your subjective opinion.

    Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2
    05-29-2012 03:40 AM
  18. v1rtu4l's Avatar
    If that's what you were implying then why point to XDA? We post about international phones getting updates all the time. Obviously it hasn't happened yet, but HTC has said that the Desire HD will be getting official ICS, but the Galaxy S (competitor to the Desire HD) won't be.
    so you are saying a manufacturer "claiming to update a phone" and not yet having done so is more worth than a manufacturer sensibly telling it's customers that the phone wont have ICS, but get the key features the people want from it anyways ?

    i will not let pass by, that you said the desire HD was the competitor of the galaxy s (i9000) while the desire HD was announced half a year later than the galaxy s and came with 256 MB more RAM and a bigger screen (4.3 inch) a newer android version (2.2 vs. the galaxy s which came out with 2.1)
    why didn't you claim the same with the original HTC Desire which was only announced one month before the galaxy s ... oh i see, because it would not have supported your point. The HTC Desire came out with Android 2.1 and is officially only upgradeable to Android 2.2.. great job HTC

    so to sum it up: you could have compared the galaxy S i9000 with a device which was only announced a month earlier by htc, which has the same amount of RAM, the same clockspeed of processor and came out with the same version of android (v2.1 eclair) but since this did not support your point you fastforward 6 month or so to find a device with better specs which came out with a later version of android anyways (v.2.2) and a bigger amount of RAM just to make your point.

    i think it's up to the reader to evaluate how far or close to the "truth" you are by bending the facts like this. if i was to argue like this i could say "hey, the galaxy s2 has not the same probability of getting android 5.0 jelly bean as the galaxy nexus" (omitting the fact that the galaxy nexus came out with a later version of the os in the first place).

    That's what I'm talking about. Also, how long did it take for the SGS to get any updates? And, unfortunately, getting updates in the States is what we're talking about, regardless of whose fault it is.
    ...
    Also wondering how CDMA is the minority here in the States, since more people are on it than GSM.
    again you are being very US-centric. even though you would not want to hear it, but the US is hardly the centre of the universe, let alone the earth. globally announced phones come out earlier most other regions of the world and that should tell you that it's not all about the US and the systematic flaws of the U.S. providers do apply to all phones bar the iPhone.

    now after setting this right, i guess it is easy to once again state that cdma users are a minority, because worldwide GSM is the more wide-spread standard. this is an international forum, so arguing as if it was an U.S. only forum will not lead you anywhere apart from being seen as ignorant american who thinks the world revolves around him.

    The majority of people buy a carrier branded phone here, and the people that don't, or that root and flash roms and such, is by far the minority of users.
    you are right and it's all those people who don't really care what their phone is capable of in the long run. don't want to call those people cheapskates, but the saying "beggards can't be choosers" does apply here. if you artificially restrict the choice of your phones to what your carrier gives you for free or nearly free, than you just don't deserve better.

    if i only eat what other persons give me for free i can't blame the manufacturer of the food others give me for free, that the food does not fit my diet.

    if someone really wants something he will pay for it, if he does not, then the whish to have this feature or that feature was not strong enough.

    And claiming people don't get updates because of ignorance is in and of itself ignorant. People buy a phone because it does what they want when they leave the store. If it doesn't then they return it, but 99% of people don't go "hmmm....this is not what I expected, let's see what I can do to change it." That's just not realistic to think that it's anything other than that.
    yeah, when people buy the phone because they like what it does RIGHT NOW and not what the phone could possibly do in the future after modifying or updating, then your first point about samsungs alleged bad update policy is invalid or at least not relevant to the case

    they bought it "as is" so why should the customers by unhappy


    I definitely get the point. But MY point is this; Samsung introduced a lot of new features, some of which don't function very well, some of which do. But I'm sure they intended for all of them to be perfect. They just aren't.
    you could argue like that to downplay any feature hence this is not a good way of arguing. i will agree that s-voice is probably just as gimicky and flawed like siri.

    the rest i will not agree.

    "they are intended to be perfect" what the heck ? let's turn the thing around and apply that to your beloved htc phone

    the 100% crop of an htc one x image is pixelated or blurred ? oh, i guess you can not call the camera a feature, since i am pretty sure htc intended it to perfect and not pixelated !

    it would be very easy to apply this to htc one x's multitasking, but i will not do that now, because we read enough to know that you "ate the foul fish" that was served by HTCs official announcement regarding "it's not a bug, it's a feature". just like taking less pictures per second than the gs3 is probably a intended feature

    feel free to call out the feature, that you think could have been implemented better or nearer to "perfect".

    HTC built the app killing nature into Sense. Therefor it's not something that's half done, but something that actually functions exactly the way it was intended. Whether or not it sucks isn't the point here (I'm on the side of "it sucks"), but rather that it functions the way HTC designed it to.
    again, we all pretty much know why the background killing is set the way it is. to prove you are HTC wrong just set the involved settings (minfree and so on) to the value of other phones like the GS3 or even the galaxy nexus and see how the one x stumbles from one stutter to the other if it does multitask like the other manufacturers think of multitasking.

    And look at the percentage of capacities that are sold [of iphones]. 90% are the 16gb. For a reason.
    yeah, the reason being people being cheapskates that don't really care about specs. they get the "name" iphone for the lowest price on their provider and that is all that counts for them. huge masses of sheep will only get you people who are not really into tech buy that stuff for the name and don't care for the specs.

    it's like the turkish bazar, where you get fake designer cloth. all the cheapskates buy there, wear it because of the name and don't care about the actuall quality of the cloth. it's just the name and this is hardly something you can bring into a debate about cloth or fabric-quality, because those people do not even care about this.

    over and out
    05-29-2012 06:17 AM
  19. Robes1NC's Avatar
    so you are saying a manufacturer "claiming to update a phone" and not yet having done so is more worth than a manufacturer sensibly telling it's customers that the phone wont have ICS, but get the key features the people want from it anyways ?

    i will not let pass by, that you said the desire HD was the competitor of the galaxy s (i9000) while the desire HD was announced half a year later than the galaxy s and came with 256 MB more RAM and a bigger screen (4.3 inch) a newer android version (2.2 vs. the galaxy s which came out with 2.1)
    why didn't you claim the same with the original HTC Desire which was only announced one month before the galaxy s ... oh i see, because it would not have supported your point. The HTC Desire came out with Android 2.1 and is officially only upgradeable to Android 2.2.. great job HTC

    so to sum it up: you could have compared the galaxy S i9000 with a device which was only announced a month earlier by htc, which has the same amount of RAM, the same clockspeed of processor and came out with the same version of android (v2.1 eclair) but since this did not support your point you fastforward 6 month or so to find a device with better specs which came out with a later version of android anyways (v.2.2) and a bigger amount of RAM just to make your point.

    i think it's up to the reader to evaluate how far or close to the "truth" you are by bending the facts like this. if i was to argue like this i could say "hey, the galaxy s2 has not the same probability of getting android 5.0 jelly bean as the galaxy nexus" (omitting the fact that the galaxy nexus came out with a later version of the os in the first place).


    again you are being very US-centric. even though you would not want to hear it, but the US is hardly the centre of the universe, let alone the earth. globally announced phones come out earlier most other regions of the world and that should tell you that it's not all about the US and the systematic flaws of the U.S. providers do apply to all phones bar the iPhone.

    now after setting this right, i guess it is easy to once again state that cdma users are a minority, because worldwide GSM is the more wide-spread standard. this is an international forum, so arguing as if it was an U.S. only forum will not lead you anywhere apart from being seen as ignorant american who thinks the world revolves around him.


    you are right and it's all those people who don't really care what their phone is capable of in the long run. don't want to call those people cheapskates, but the saying "beggards can't be choosers" does apply here. if you artificially restrict the choice of your phones to what your carrier gives you for free or nearly free, than you just don't deserve better.

    if i only eat what other persons give me for free i can't blame the manufacturer of the food others give me for free, that the food does not fit my diet.

    if someone really wants something he will pay for it, if he does not, then the whish to have this feature or that feature was not strong enough.


    yeah, when people buy the phone because they like what it does RIGHT NOW and not what the phone could possibly do in the future after modifying or updating, then your first point about samsungs alleged bad update policy is invalid or at least not relevant to the case

    they bought it "as is" so why should the customers by unhappy



    you could argue like that to downplay any feature hence this is not a good way of arguing. i will agree that s-voice is probably just as gimicky and flawed like siri.

    the rest i will not agree.

    "they are intended to be perfect" what the heck ? let's turn the thing around and apply that to your beloved htc phone

    the 100% crop of an htc one x image is pixelated or blurred ? oh, i guess you can not call the camera a feature, since i am pretty sure htc intended it to perfect and not pixelated !

    it would be very easy to apply this to htc one x's multitasking, but i will not do that now, because we read enough to know that you "ate the foul fish" that was served by HTCs official announcement regarding "it's not a bug, it's a feature". just like taking less pictures per second than the gs3 is probably a intended feature

    feel free to call out the feature, that you think could have been implemented better or nearer to "perfect".


    again, we all pretty much know why the background killing is set the way it is. to prove you are HTC wrong just set the involved settings (minfree and so on) to the value of other phones like the GS3 or even the galaxy nexus and see how the one x stumbles from one stutter to the other if it does multitask like the other manufacturers think of multitasking.



    yeah, the reason being people being cheapskates that don't really care about specs. they get the "name" iphone for the lowest price on their provider and that is all that counts for them. huge masses of sheep will only get you people who are not really into tech buy that stuff for the name and don't care for the specs.

    it's like the turkish bazar, where you get fake designer cloth. all the cheapskates buy there, wear it because of the name and don't care about the actuall quality of the cloth. it's just the name and this is hardly something you can bring into a debate about cloth or fabric-quality, because those people do not even care about this.

    over and out
    First, I agree with everything that you said about HTC phones and the One X. I believe that their phones suck. The humps on the back are ugly and Sense is just a waist of memory and processing power.

    Unfortunately I have to wonder why after making such solid points you would add such a ridiculous statement at the end about why people buy iPhones or why the 16gb model is the most popular. Do you not think that the awesome camera, smooth, lag free interface, superior app, and ease of use that would make a 4 year old seem to be highly intelligent would have a little something to do with why so many people buy iPhones? Not to mention the fact that the cameras are simply amazing! Every new phone that comes out eventually has its camera compared to the iPhone. A lot of you would simply like to believe that people wake up and say, "how can I be more like everyone else?!", but that is a ridiculous way of viewing anything and it makes anyone using that thinking look totally stupid to me. I am not an iSheep or a Fandroid. I have owned every iPhone since the first as well as 7-8 Android phones since the OG Droid which I proudly display on a trophy case. Just because people prefer a rival platform that doesn't make them any kind of animal and it doesn't mean that they deserve to be insulted or labeled. What of the "cool" new thing to say was that all Android lovers sucked their mothers boobs till they were 16? Stupid right?! Let them love what they love. You love what you love. This just really has gone too far with the ridiculous labeling and insults.

    Lastly why are you guys on a GS3 thread arguing with an obvious TROLL. If he wanted to express his undying love for the One X there HAS GOT TO BE A PLACE FOR THAT! Maybe the ONE X thread?! Hmmm?! Maybe?! If you feel that the One X is sooooo awesome why not go to the threads where they love it? You could all touch each other in a circle! LOL! This is crazy!
    Moxer likes this.
    05-29-2012 09:18 AM
  20. Kevin OQuinn's Avatar
    again you are being very US-centric. even though you would not want to hear it, but the US is hardly the centre of the universe, let alone the earth. globally announced phones come out earlier most other regions of the world and that should tell you that it's not all about the US and the systematic flaws of the U.S. providers do apply to all phones bar the iPhone.

    now after setting this right, i guess it is easy to once again state that cdma users are a minority, because worldwide GSM is the more wide-spread standard. this is an international forum, so arguing as if it was an U.S. only forum will not lead you anywhere apart from being seen as ignorant american who thinks the world revolves around him.


    you are right and it's all those people who don't really care what their phone is capable of in the long run. don't want to call those people cheapskates, but the saying "beggards can't be choosers" does apply here. if you artificially restrict the choice of your phones to what your carrier gives you for free or nearly free, than you just don't deserve better.

    if i only eat what other persons give me for free i can't blame the manufacturer of the food others give me for free, that the food does not fit my diet.

    if someone really wants something he will pay for it, if he does not, then the whish to have this feature or that feature was not strong enough.



    yeah, the reason being people being cheapskates that don't really care about specs. they get the "name" iphone for the lowest price on their provider and that is all that counts for them. huge masses of sheep will only get you people who are not really into tech buy that stuff for the name and don't care for the specs.

    it's like the turkish bazar, where you get fake designer cloth. all the cheapskates buy there, wear it because of the name and don't care about the actuall quality of the cloth. it's just the name and this is hardly something you can bring into a debate about cloth or fabric-quality, because those people do not even care about this.

    over and out
    I think you just insulted a LOT of people by implying that people that don't buy phones for full retail price are cheapskates.

    Do you know why people buy phones on subsidy? I do, or at least why I need to. I can't shell out hundreds of dollars every 6 months or so for the latest and greatest. So implying that people that can't afford that are cheapskates severely dents the credibility of the rest of your argument.

    And guess what? The majority of people don't care about specs. Anywhere in the world.


    You did bring up a valid point as to what phones I chose to compare. Also, I did state that the desire HD update hasn't happened yet. But if/when I does that'll put it on the same version of the galaxy s ii. How long after the desire HD came out was that launched?

    Sent from my HTC One X using Android Central Forums
    05-29-2012 09:20 AM
  21. Kevin OQuinn's Avatar
    First, I agree with everything that you said about HTC phones and the One X. I believe that their phones suck. The humps on the back are ugly and Sense is just a waist of memory and processing power.

    Unfortunately I have to wonder why after making such solid points you would add such a ridiculous statement at the end about why people buy iPhones or why the 16gb model is the most popular. Do you not think that the awesome camera, smooth, lag free interface, superior app, and ease of use that would make a 4 year old seem to be highly intelligent would have a little something to do with why so many people buy iPhones? Not to mention the fact that the cameras are simply amazing! Every new phone that comes out eventually has its camera compared to the iPhone. A lot of you would simply like to believe that people wake up and say, "how can I be more like everyone else?!", but that is a ridiculous way of viewing anything and it makes anyone using that thinking look totally stupid to me. I am not an iSheep or a Fandroid. I have owned every iPhone since the first as well as 7-8 Android phones since the OG Droid which I proudly display on a trophy case. Just because people prefer a rival platform that doesn't make them any kind of animal and it doesn't mean that they deserve to be insulted or labeled. What of the "cool" new thing to say was that all Android lovers sucked their mothers boobs till they were 16? Stupid right?! Let them love what they love. You love what you love. This just really has gone too far with the ridiculous labeling and insults.

    Lastly why are you guys on a GS3 thread arguing with an obvious TROLL. If he wanted to express his undying love for the One X there HAS GOT TO BE A PLACE FOR THAT! Maybe the ONE X thread?! Hmmm?! Maybe?! If you feel that the One X is sooooo awesome why not go to the threads where they love it? You could all touch each other in a circle! LOL! This is crazy!
    Are you calling me a troll? If so, not cool.

    As for the direction this thread has taken, it hasn't gotten just a bit off topic. But I'm not against a thread going that way if the discussion is good, productive, and best of all, makes people think. Up until that last reply that was half insulting, half great, I was all about continuing it. I, for one, will not resort to insulting people's intelligence, aptitude, income level, or geographic location to prove my point. (which of course is based at least half way on opinion, but isn't everybody's here?) Isn't that part of what's great about the forums? We can have different opinions and voice them and have a discussion about it.


    As much as the United States isn't the center of the planet, neither is anywhere else. People in the US do have different concerns than other areas. That doesn't mean they get ignored because you think they don't matter. They are just as valid, and while I don't have numbers, I would bet that a majority of people on this site are from the US.

    European carriers also do subsidies, and I bet a vast majority of people take advantage of those, too. The big difference is that you don't have to stick to just one carrier with one device to guarantee you're going to have coverage. I'm actually really envious of that. Just like I've heard some people that live in Europe say they're jealous of us for having LTE.
    Tkbredx and _JKK_ like this.
    05-29-2012 10:10 AM
  22. v1rtu4l's Avatar
    F
    Unfortunately I have to wonder why after making such solid points you would add such a ridiculous statement at the end about why people buy iPhones or why the 16gb model is the most popular. Do you not think that the awesome camera, smooth, lag free interface, superior app, and ease of use that would make a 4 year old seem to be highly intelligent would have a little something to do with why so many people buy iPhones?
    ok, i see it was read not the way i intended it to be (... i'm not HTC, so i wont say "it's written how it is intended to be, but you guys just read wrong!").

    let me rephrase what i meant by the iphone users cheapskates paragraph.

    of course you can not call every iphone user a cheakskate. that was not the point i was trying to make, but the fact that people will try to get what they need as cheap as possible, disregarding other variants that might have slightly higher numbers in some specs (like the internal storage). so of course someone who buys an iphone is not a cheapskate since he will pay handsomely for the device, but he is a cheapskate compared to us nerds who do try to find out every detail of the device we want to buy and we will very carefully evaluate if we would be better off, if we bought the device with the larger internal capacity.

    perhaps a car analogy would be more appropriate, where 90% of the iphone users are like people who always wanted to drive a mercedes. they will buy it to have the name and of course the stock luxury (like the iphone features). they will not buy it brand new, but rather used, because they do not need to have the ability to choose extras (which you could choose if you bought it new). then there are the people that are kind of luxus car connoisseurs who know very much about luxury cars and only drive those kind of cars. they wont buy it cheap or used, because they want to have the choice to put in any extra they deem needed.

    still there are more of the first kind of people buying used mercedes', compared to the rich ones who only buy new mercedes with all the extras... and if you compare those too, you could call the first ones "cheapskates". perhaps it has a too negative notion, but i am sorry, english is not my native tonge/language.

    Not to mention the fact that the cameras are simply amazing! Every new phone that comes out eventually has its camera compared to the iPhone. A lot of you would simply like to believe that people wake up and say, "how can I be more like everyone else?!", but that is a ridiculous way of viewing anything and it makes anyone using that thinking look totally stupid to me. I am not an iSheep or a Fandroid. I have owned every iPhone since the first as well as 7-8 Android phones since the OG Droid which I proudly display on a trophy case. Just because people prefer a rival platform that doesn't make them any kind of animal and it doesn't mean that they deserve to be insulted or labeled. What of the "cool" new thing to say was that all Android lovers sucked their mothers boobs till they were 16? Stupid right?! Let them love what they love. You love what you love. This just really has gone too far with the ridiculous labeling and insults.
    i hope i have addressed most of your problems with my last paragraphs in the first reply.
    thank you for your valuable input and i have to add, that i am not per se against apple.
    i am writing this to you on a macbook pro (although i only use windows on it) and i was very close to buying the iphone 4, when jobs presented it (damn, he was a good salesman).

    Lastly why are you guys on a GS3 thread arguing with an obvious TROLL. If he wanted to express his undying love for the One X there HAS GOT TO BE A PLACE FOR THAT! Maybe the ONE X thread?! Hmmm?! Maybe?! If you feel that the One X is sooooo awesome why not go to the threads where they love it? You could all touch each other in a circle! LOL! This is crazy!
    you are right about that and there is only "so much" you can argue about something.
    i think a reply to a reply is totally ok, even if it is a troll, but if it becomes a challenge to persuade each other it will only go round and round and bring nothing new to the table.
    in the end it's ok to have different opinions and an reply should only be to clarify things or to rephrase if you think the other one did not get what you was trying to say (which does not have to say that he is agreeing after understanding what you tried to say)
    ...
    Kevin OQuinn and Tkbredx like this.
    05-29-2012 11:05 AM
  23. Tkbredx's Avatar
    I liked the fact that it kind of went off topic. Not only was it interesting but I felt enlightened. They both made valid points.

    At the end of the day I've come to the realization that phone choice is all a matter of opinion. Theres fanboys for every device and theres regular people that just want what they think is the best device. Although I truly believe that the GS3 is a better phone, if some disagree then oh well. It may not be the better phone for them.

    As for the cheapskate comment... Ehh, I dont really take offense. I think its the smarter thing to do. Why pay $600 when you can pay $200? And now internal storage barely matters because of online storage. The only thing you really need internal storage for is apps. Other than that there are services that allow you to access everything else (photos, music, videos, etc.)
    dmmarck likes this.
    05-30-2012 01:26 PM
  24. Crispy's Avatar
    The only thing you really need internal storage for is apps. Other than that there are services that allow you to access everything else (photos, music, videos, etc.)
    This part is not true at all. No connection or slow speeds, data charges, bandwidth caps - there are so many issues that make this not an option for most people.

    Its the same thing on pc's, people have been saying for decades that no one needs local storage and it hasn't happened. Would you use a pc with no content, only the apps and OS?
    05-30-2012 02:14 PM
  25. Tkbredx's Avatar
    This part is not true at all. No connection or slow speeds, data charges, bandwidth caps - there are so many issues that make this not an option for most people.

    Its the same thing on pc's, people have been saying for decades that no one needs local storage and it hasn't happened. Would you use a pc with no content, only the apps and OS?
    I am actually looking into the new Chromebook by Samsung, so yes, thanks for asking.

    Im just saying that it really isnt necessary to have all that internal storage. Prioritize, keep the most important things you need on your phone and put everything else in the cloud
    05-30-2012 02:28 PM
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