09-10-2012 12:03 AM
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  1. Ry's Avatar
    It was the other way around.

    Sent from my Nexus 7 using Android Central Forums
    Really now?



    Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Android Central Forums
    pauldroidr2d2 likes this.
    09-06-2012 10:09 PM
  2. JHBThree's Avatar
    It was the other way around.

    Sent from my Nexus 7 using Android Central Forums
    No, it wasn't. Apple warned Samsung on multiple occasions about what they were doing, and offered them a settlement very early on because of their business relationship. Samsung refused.
    pauldroidr2d2 likes this.
    09-06-2012 11:02 PM
  3. Ry's Avatar
    No, it wasn't. Apple warned Samsung on multiple occasions about what they were doing, and offered them a settlement very early on because of their business relationship. Samsung refused.
    Yup.

    And those $30/$40 figures were from Apple, not offers from Samsung.

    Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Android Central Forums
    09-07-2012 11:19 AM
  4. cbc0201's Avatar
    iPhone - No
    GS3 - NO
    HTC One X - Yes

    Sent from my HTC One X using Tapatalk 2
    09-07-2012 11:45 AM
  5. 534n's Avatar
    apple made a ridiculous settlement offer to Samsung because they knew that Samsung would turn it down if they did so and that they could still squeeze the same amount out (and get added publicity! You will hear about this again and again in future apple press releases) in money. Just shady tactics.
    09-07-2012 01:07 PM
  6. JHBThree's Avatar
    apple made a ridiculous settlement offer to Samsung because they knew that Samsung would turn it down if they did so and that they could still squeeze the same amount out (and get added publicity! You will hear about this again and again in future apple press releases) in money. Just shady tactics.
    Apple asked for LESS from Samsung when they first approached them compared to the trial damages. The payments, after discounts, were less than what android OEMs pay Microsoft. The only people that seem to think it was shady are android fanboys.

    Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2
    09-07-2012 01:23 PM
  7. 534n's Avatar
    Apple asked for LESS from Samsung when they first approached them compared to the trial damages. The payments, after discounts, were less than what android OEMs pay Microsoft. The only people that seem to think it was shady are android fanboys.

    Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2
    That view is either horrendously nave or blatantly ignorant.

    EDIT: Forgive me for jumping out like that. There is a lot more to the issue that just the "settlement" and apple has had shady tactics for a long time before this. It has nothing to do with "being a fanboy."
    09-07-2012 01:31 PM
  8. JHBThree's Avatar
    That view is either horrendously nave or blatantly ignorant.

    EDIT: Forgive me for jumping out like that. There is a lot more to the issue that just the "settlement" and apple has had shady tactics for a long time before this. It has nothing to do with "being a fanboy."
    Yes it does. Samsung was presented a reasonable settlement multiple times, was warned by both Apple AND Google about what they were doing, and chose to ignore all of it. There is absolutely no legitimate defense of their behavior that can be offered.
    09-07-2012 02:19 PM
  9. 534n's Avatar
    Yes it does. Samsung was presented a reasonable settlement multiple times, was warned by both Apple AND Google about what they were doing, and chose to ignore all of it. There is absolutely no legitimate defense of their behavior that can be offered.
    How about "furthering the mobile device industry in the interests of the people and not of some morons who think every aluminum can with an apple logo on it is golden and improving on mediocre implementations of stolen ideas that can be turned into useful innovative devices loved by millions and furthered daily?" Sounds legitimate enough to me. apple sucks. If you want to support them, do it elsewhere because there is nothing good about them. Saying that what they do is not shady is being an apple fanboy, and I hope I get to see when Google stops playing Switzerland because apple is treading on their territory too and the new cases attempting to be brought against the N7 and other ASUS devices as well as Acer is just showing that apple has become power hungry and is just going to keep pushing until either someone stops them or the only electronics are apple.
    09-07-2012 02:23 PM
  10. Ry's Avatar
    How about "furthering the mobile device industry in the interests of the people and not of some morons who think every aluminum can with an apple logo on it is golden and improving on mediocre implementations of stolen ideas that can be turned into useful innovative devices loved by millions and furthered daily?" Sounds legitimate enough to me. apple sucks. If you want to support them, do it elsewhere because there is nothing good about them. Saying that what they do is not shady is being an apple fanboy, and I hope I get to see when Google stops playing Switzerland because apple is treading on their territory too and the new cases attempting to be brought against the N7 and other ASUS devices as well as Acer is just showing that apple has become power hungry and is just going to keep pushing until either someone stops them or the only electronics are apple.
    Being warned by Apple is one thing, but apparently Google themselves - you know the, the people behind Android - also told Samsung they were going a bit too far with the copying. Samsung ignoring those warnings reeks of arrogance. Samsung let it get to the courts. And based on the evidence, Samsung was found to infringe on most of Apple's claims.

    The copying Samsung did seems to be part of a mentality of Korea-based companies, Samsung was even called out by the press in their own country to become a leader, not a follower. With the earlier Galaxy S devices, again - Samsung went too far in copying Apple's designs. Google warned them.

    Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Android Central Forums
    09-07-2012 02:35 PM
  11. 534n's Avatar
    Google is not the only thing behind Android. It was a separate entity before Google acquired it and took open source contributions from many sources, as well as a foundation from Dalvik. I know that you are intelligent Ry, but that sarcastic comment lacks a little background.

    While your finger may remain pointed at Samsung (and interestingly you brought other "Korea-based companies" into it), apple has (I feel like a broken record) copied things too and no one points at them. If someone patents starting a set of stairs with your left foot and says no one else can do it, are you always going to start with your right? apple's patents are - for lack of a better word - fantastically absurd. Look deeper into the web of issues surrounding apple's design industry and the legal protective barrier they have put up around it. At least Samsung makes a lot of its own hardware. Just because they got "caught" with some information regarding copying something from apple (or one of the BS patents) does not mean they did not make an original and innovative product. I REALLY don't know what you think, but none of my Samsung devices look, feel, or function like apple devices.

    Samsung had a great idea, and hell, the stuff they dug up may have just been research on how to go about making the idea a reality just like apple did when they started, or it could have been trying to skirt boundaries, but who cares?

    Anyway, I am confident that Samsung will prevail in the end and I hope that ASUS does not crumble to the tyranny of apple.
    09-07-2012 03:13 PM
  12. JHBThree's Avatar
    How about "furthering the mobile device industry in the interests of the people and not of some morons who think every aluminum can with an apple logo on it is golden and improving on mediocre implementations of stolen ideas that can be turned into useful innovative devices loved by millions and furthered daily?" Sounds legitimate enough to me. apple sucks. If you want to support them, do it elsewhere because there is nothing good about them. Saying that what they do is not shady is being an apple fanboy, and I hope I get to see when Google stops playing Switzerland because apple is treading on their territory too and the new cases attempting to be brought against the N7 and other ASUS devices as well as Acer is just showing that apple has become power hungry and is just going to keep pushing until either someone stops them or the only electronics are apple.
    Thanks for proving beyond a reasonable doubt that you are a fanboy. Now I know to ignore anything you have to say.
    09-07-2012 03:38 PM
  13. Ry's Avatar
    Google is not the only thing behind Android. It was a separate entity before Google acquired it and took open source contributions from many sources, as well as a foundation from Dalvik. I know that you are intelligent Ry, but that sarcastic comment lacks a little background.

    While your finger may remain pointed at Samsung (and interestingly you brought other "Korea-based companies" into it), apple has (I feel like a broken record) copied things too and no one points at them. If someone patents starting a set of stairs with your left foot and says no one else can do it, are you always going to start with your right? apple's patents are - for lack of a better word - fantastically absurd. Look deeper into the web of issues surrounding apple's design industry and the legal protective barrier they have put up around it. At least Samsung makes a lot of its own hardware. Just because they got "caught" with some information regarding copying something from apple (or one of the BS patents) does not mean they did not make an original and innovative product. I REALLY don't know what you think, but none of my Samsung devices look, feel, or function like apple devices.

    Samsung had a great idea, and hell, the stuff they dug up may have just been research on how to go about making the idea a reality just like apple did when they started, or it could have been trying to skirt boundaries, but who cares?

    Anyway, I am confident that Samsung will prevail in the end and I hope that ASUS does not crumble to the tyranny of apple.
    Google runs the Android show now. And again, the story goes that Google also warned Samsung that they were copying Apple's design a little too closely. Samsung continued. Quite the show of arrogance.

    Trade dress and physical design has always been my main point every time I get suckered into a thread about the Apple vs. Samsung trial. What previous phone could a regular consumer confuse an iPhone for? The whole prior art thing is irrelevant to me as again, Motorola and HTC were cranking out Android smartphones at the time that didn't physically look anything like the iPhone. It seems Samsung stretched their phone a bit and changed the shade of the edges to a darker tone.

    People bring up the design exercises Apple was doing prior to the iPhone. Take their "what if Sony made a smartphone" example. What Sony smartphone did Apple rip off there? None. They did an exercise to try to think like Sony. What did the evidence show Samsung doing? Direct comparisons to the iPhone and how they could make their phones more like the iPhone.

    When this lawsuit was first brought up, Nilay Patel over at the Verge did a great comparison of the icons Samsung was using in their TouchWiz interface. The yellow flower for the gallery and the CD for the music player really stood out to me. Rather blatant of Samsung to try and mimic the icons used on the iPhone.

    We even have users here on this very forum saying things like "I took a look at my Epic and I can clearly see Samsung copied Apple with some of these icons and how they were placed on the screen".

    I agree on the software patents. Apple probably shouldn't have been granted patents on certain things. But they were. And following the letter of the law, again Samsung was found to have infringe on those patents. And for some of those patents, workarounds have been developed so that you don't have to infringe. That's a form of innovation in my eyes.

    I understand that other phones can have rounded corners. Apple doesn't have a patent on that. The way I see it, Samsung got called out for blatantly copying aspects of the iPhone, were warned by both Apple and Google, were arrogant about the copying and either didn't want to stop or take any settlement offers, took their chances with a trial in the US - in Northern California, and got burned when key evidence of blatant copying was presented.




    Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Android Central Forums
    09-07-2012 03:41 PM
  14. 534n's Avatar
    Google runs the Android show now. And again, the story goes that Google also warned Samsung that they were copying Apple's design a little too closely. Samsung continued. Quite the show of arrogance.

    Trade dress and physical design has always been my main point every time I get suckered into a thread about the Apple vs. Samsung trial. What previous phone could a regular consumer confuse an iPhone for? The whole prior art thing is irrelevant to me as again, Motorola and HTC were cranking out Android smartphones at the time that didn't physically look anything like the iPhone. It seems Samsung stretched their phone a bit and changed the shade of the edges to a darker tone.

    People bring up the design exercises Apple was doing prior to the iPhone. Take their "what if Sony made a smartphone" example. What Sony smartphone did Apple rip off there? None. They did an exercise to try to think like Sony. What did the evidence show Samsung doing? Direct comparisons to the iPhone and how they could make their phones more like the iPhone.

    When this lawsuit was first brought up, Nilay Patel over at the Verge did a great comparison of the icons Samsung was using in their TouchWiz interface. The yellow flower for the gallery and the CD for the music player really stood out to me. Rather blatant of Samsung to try and mimic the icons used on the iPhone.

    We even have users here on this very forum saying things like "I took a look at my Epic and I can clearly see Samsung copied Apple with some of these icons and how they were placed on the screen".

    I agree on the software patents. Apple probably shouldn't have been granted patents on certain things. But they were. And following the letter of the law, again Samsung was found to have infringe on those patents. And for some of those patents, workarounds have been developed so that you don't have to infringe. That's a form of innovation in my eyes.

    I understand that other phones can have rounded corners. Apple doesn't have a patent on that. The way I see it, Samsung got called out for blatantly copying aspects of the iPhone, were warned by both Apple and Google, were arrogant about the copying and either didn't want to stop or take any settlement offers, took their chances with a trial in the US - in Northern California, and got burned when key evidence of blatant copying was presented.

    Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Android Central Forums
    I respect your opinion, but who do you follow when the law is corrupted? They should have never been awarded those patents, nor should a judge have upheld them. As for people saying that the phones or icons look similar, that is true for ALL of them. Anyone who is looking for a similarity will find one or manufacture one that comes close.

    As for the crap about that juror with his "aha moment" in his contemplation at home, where he suddenly got the brilliant idea that "hey, if this was my patent, I could defend it here!" Well no, really genius? Of course you would defend it if you had a financial interest.

    Also, while Google runs Android's framework, regulation, and their own OS for their own devices, designers/manufacturers make their OS for the device they make and then it gets approved by Google (usually).

    The flower icon for the galleries don't look anything alike. And are you going to say you are okay with apple patenting a music note?! What else should they use, and the backgrounds for that icon also do not look alike. This is just part of looking for similarities. I am holding the two devices (S3 and 4s) right now and they really are NOT that similar, but I could see how someone with a predisposition and bias looking for similarities could come up with some. Even if they did blatantly copy something, it is still vastly different from the iphone, inside, out, and software-wise.

    And anyone who confuses a Samsung phone for an iphone shouldn't be considered mentally stable enough to testify or purchase a phone. There are drastic, measurable differences.
    09-07-2012 03:53 PM
  15. Ry's Avatar
    I respect your opinion, but who do you follow when the law is corrupted? They should have never been awarded those patents, nor should a judge have upheld them. As for people saying that the phones or icons look similar, that is true for ALL of them. Anyone who is looking for a similarity will find one or manufacture one that comes close.

    As for the crap about that juror with his "aha moment" in his contemplation at home, where he suddenly got the brilliant idea that "hey, if this was my patent, I could defend it here!" Well no, really genius? Of course you would defend it if you had a financial interest.

    Also, while Google runs Android's framework, regulation, and their own OS for their own devices, designers/manufacturers make their OS for the device they make and then it gets approved by Google (usually).

    The flower icon for the galleries don't look anything alike. And are you going to say you are okay with apple patenting a music note?! What else should they use, and the backgrounds for that icon also do not look alike. This is just part of looking for similarities. I am holding the two devices (S3 and 4s) right now and they really are NOT that similar, but I could see how someone with a predisposition and bias looking for similarities could come up with some. Even if they did blatantly copy something, it is still vastly different from the iphone, inside, out, and software-wise.
    Last I checked, the Galaxy S III wasn't involved in any trade-dress lawsuits. You know which devices were involved in the last ruling.

    Because Apple was granted those patents, the law is suddenly corrupt? It's really more like the patent system hasn't caught up with the times.

    Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Android Central Forums
    09-07-2012 03:59 PM
  16. 534n's Avatar
    Last I checked, the Galaxy S3 wasn't involved in any trade-dress lawsuits. You know which devices were involved in the last ruling.
    They just happen to be the two I have on hand immediately. My fiancee has the S2 and it doesn't look like an iphone either. In fact, a Google image search of "Samsung phones" brought back zero winners as well.

    Because Apple was granted those patents, the law is suddenly corrupt? It's really more like the patent system hasn't caught up with the times.
    No, because they were upheld and not thrown out. The patent office may be initially at fault, but they can be ruled out in court, and the fact that "the law" decided to make an example out of Samsung based on what was provided as was stated in the findings is also a reason.
    09-07-2012 04:02 PM
  17. pauldroidr2d2's Avatar
    It was the other way around.

    Sent from my Nexus 7 using Android Central Forums
    This is the first I've heard of this. What is your source?

    - - - Updated - - -

    apple made a ridiculous settlement offer to Samsung because they knew that Samsung would turn it down if they did so and that they could still squeeze the same amount out (and get added publicity! You will hear about this again and again in future apple press releases) in money. Just shady tactics.
    I don't think it would've mattered how much Apple asked for. Samsung was arrogant enough to think they would be successful once they went before a jury.
    JHBThree likes this.
    09-09-2012 11:52 PM
  18. pauldroidr2d2's Avatar
    How about "furthering the mobile device industry in the interests of the people and not of some morons who think every aluminum can with an apple logo on it is golden and improving on mediocre implementations of stolen ideas that can be turned into useful innovative devices loved by millions and furthered daily?" Sounds legitimate enough to me. apple sucks. If you want to support them, do it elsewhere because there is nothing good about them. Saying that what they do is not shady is being an apple fanboy, and I hope I get to see when Google stops playing Switzerland because apple is treading on their territory too and the new cases attempting to be brought against the N7 and other ASUS devices as well as Acer is just showing that apple has become power hungry and is just going to keep pushing until either someone stops them or the only electronics are apple.
    No matter what ideals you may hold, like it or not, Apple and Samsung for that matter are a business. They are not a charity. Samsung chose to use things that were patented by another company. They also chose not to take a settlement offer. Now they are paying the price for their poor choices.
    Ry likes this.
    09-10-2012 12:03 AM
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