1. Almeuit's Avatar
    EFF says T-Mobile One seems to violate net neutrality - TmoNews

    I'd have to agree. BingeOn at first walked a fine line but since it was free and could be turned off.. Sure. The T-Mobile One plan does basically throttle 100 percent and charges you to not do so.

    Hopefully the FCC steps in.
    Tom Westrick likes this.
    08-20-2016 05:25 PM
  2. Aquila's Avatar
    IMO there was no line on BO. It was bad. This is MUCH worse. Caveat: Obviously TMO has lawyers and they're probably saying there's a way to make this sound compatible. But the intent matters and every active action that TMO takes based on customer usage, whether it's paid for or not, is a violation of NN. Sprint followed through with a similar plan the day after TMO too. It is just as bad. People need to tell these guys to bugger off and to treat all data like data. No throttling, no discounts, no extra fees, nothing. Data = data. There are no partners, there are no plans or buckets, the whole thing is nonsense. They ought not be making ANY active decisions based on the type of content. And other than to protect themselves from liability, such as abating, they should never take any steps to sabotage connectivity or performance of the network or content.
    Almeuit, Laura Knotek and raino like this.
    08-20-2016 05:29 PM
  3. Almeuit's Avatar
    Just noticed this...

    Sievert said that one percent of T-Mobile customers have turned off Binge On, and so if those customers want high-def video, then can pay $70 for T-Mobile One and $25 for high-def video and they’ll be at the same $95 price of the current Simple Choice unlimited plan.
    I almost want to bet only 1% turned it off because a lot don't even realize it was turned on by default.
    raino likes this.
    08-20-2016 05:30 PM
  4. Kevin OQuinn's Avatar
    Just noticed this...



    I almost want to bet only 1% turned it off because a lot don't even realize it was turned on by default.
    The reason doesn't matter though, as much as I agree with you.
    08-20-2016 05:33 PM
  5. Aquila's Avatar
    These the impact and acceptance of these actions, whether or not they benefit either TMO or the customer or both, is irrelevant to the NN issue, whether it is beneficial financially or from a performance standpoint. In order to embrace NN, they cannot ever, make any active decision, based on the type of content - whether that decision be based in billing or how they handle the delivery of content. Every byte of data needs to be treated exactly the same as every other byte. To a large extent, they shouldn't be actively aware of the type of data. They obviously have to monitor traffic with some degree of specificity in order to keep the network as optimized as possible, but other than troubleshooting issues, there's no real valid reason to ever distinguish between data being an app download or a speed test or a photo upload or streaming music or video or whatever. All of it has to be viewed exactly the same from an active decisioning standpoint.
    08-20-2016 05:42 PM
  6. Laura Knotek's Avatar
    Content is content. Video should not be treated differently based upon how much money the customer pays.

    This appears to be a clear violation of net neutrality.
    08-20-2016 05:44 PM
  7. Aquila's Avatar
    The nightmarish part of this isn't that companies want to do it, their reasons are obvious. It's that people are like, "it's cool; guess it'll save me 5 bucks so do whatever you want".
    08-20-2016 05:47 PM
  8. Aquila's Avatar
    Content is content. Video should not be treated differently based upon how much money the customer pays.

    This appears to be a clear violation of net neutrality.

    Example 1: "Net Neutrality is the principle that Internet service providers and governments should treat all data on the Internet the same, not discriminating or charging differently by user, content, site, platform, application, type of attached equipment, or mode of communication."


    Example 2: "Adopted on February 26, 2015, the Federal Communication Commission's Open Internet rules are designed to protect free expression and innovation on the Internet and promote investment in the nation's broadband networks. The Open Internet rules are grounded in the strongest possible legal foundation by relying on multiple sources of authority, including: Title II of the Communications Act and Section 706 of the Telecommunications Act of 1996. The new rules apply to both fixed and mobile broadband service.

    Bright Line Rules:


    • No Blocking: broadband providers may not block access to legal content, applications, services, or non-harmful devices.
    • No Throttling: broadband providers may not impair or degrade lawful Internet traffic on the basis of content, applications, services, or non-harmful devices.
    • No Paid Prioritization: broadband providers may not favor some lawful Internet traffic over other lawful traffic in exchange for consideration of any kind—in other words, no "fast lanes." This rule also bans ISPs from prioritizing content and services of their affiliates."


    TMO is clearly violating example 1 by differentiating between types of content, type of equipment and the user and violating all three of those bullets of example 2.
    Laura Knotek likes this.
    08-20-2016 05:54 PM
  9. Kevin OQuinn's Avatar
    The nightmarish part of this isn't that companies want to do it, their reasons are obvious. It's that people are like, "it's cool; guess it'll save me 5 bucks so do whatever you want".
    Wasn't that the reasoning behind the FCC being ok with Binge On? Giving the customer the ability to turn it off and on?

    So, based on the argument of "all data is the same" the FCC seems to disagree. They seem to be more interested in competition and making sure the mobile market is not stagnant while not letting the customer "get screwed".
    08-20-2016 06:06 PM
  10. jdfry15's Avatar
    Just noticed this...



    I almost want to bet only 1% turned it off because a lot don't even realize it was turned on by default.
    I agree. I doubt the average person would even know it is on or could tell the difference.

    Posted via the Android Central App
    08-20-2016 08:32 PM
  11. dpham00's Avatar
    It certainly violates net neutrality. Whether or not it is legal depends on who you ask.
    08-20-2016 10:42 PM
  12. metllicamilitia's Avatar
    Well, I'd say BingeOn is a fine line, and more toward not violating Net Neutrality simply because it does offer video at 480p, which is DVD quality, and therefore there is no degradation of video. However I understand the side of wanting full HD video as well. And an argument could be make that video shot in 1080p and played back at 480p is a degradation of video. That's why it's a fine line.

    However, the T-Mobile One plan definitely violates Net Neutrality by asking user to pay $25/mo for full HD and $15/mo to use data for tethering and limiting it at 5GB/mo.

    Whereas T-Mobile also violates Net Neutrality on any unlimited plan by throttling and prioritizing data when a user uses more than 26GB/mo. This is also a violation that all four major cell providers in the US incur.
    08-21-2016 12:48 AM
  13. dpham00's Avatar
    Well, I'd say BingeOn is a fine line, and more toward not violating Net Neutrality simply because it does offer video at 480p, which is DVD quality, and therefore there is no degradation of video. However I understand the side of wanting full HD video as well. And an argument could be make that video shot in 1080p and played back at 480p is a degradation of video. That's why it's a fine line.

    However, the T-Mobile One plan definitely violates Net Neutrality by asking user to pay $25/mo for full HD and $15/mo to use data for tethering and limiting it at 5GB/mo.

    Whereas T-Mobile also violates Net Neutrality on any unlimited plan by throttling and prioritizing data when a user uses more than 26GB/mo. This is also a violation that all four major cell providers in the US incur.
    Verizon did at one time de prioritize 3g only for unlimited data plan ,but not any more. 4glte is never de prioritized on any plan.

    Verizon does offer safety net which is throttling once you reach your high speed allotment but this is an add on feature, you can use data with absolutely no limit on the current plan , so long as you have a very big checkbook.
    08-21-2016 01:27 AM
  14. raino's Avatar
    Here's what John Legere has to say about this:

    “Listen, we have made it painfully clear from the beginning, we are pro net neutrality. This is all about customer choice. So if a customer buys this program, we will, based upon the offer itself, deliver them video at standard definition. If they want Ultra HD and they upgrade and pay the $25, we will give them that, too. That’s choice."

    That choice is a Net Neutrality violation to a T.
    Aquila and dpham00 like this.
    08-21-2016 10:52 AM
  15. Aquila's Avatar
    Here's what John Legere has to say about this:

    “Listen, we have made it painfully clear from the beginning, we are pro net neutrality. This is all about customer choice. So if a customer buys this program, we will, based upon the offer itself, deliver them video at standard definition. If they want Ultra HD and they upgrade and pay the $25, we will give them that, too. That’s choice."

    That choice is a Net Neutrality violation to a T.
    Terribad.
    08-21-2016 11:06 AM
  16. dpham00's Avatar
    Here's what John Legere has to say about this:

    “Listen, we have made it painfully clear from the beginning, we are pro net neutrality. This is all about customer choice. So if a customer buys this program, we will, based upon the offer itself, deliver them video at standard definition. If they want Ultra HD and they upgrade and pay the $25, we will give them that, too. That’s choice."

    That choice is a Net Neutrality violation to a T.
    It is, but it doesn't really matter if the enforcer of the law is on Tmobile's side.
    08-21-2016 12:17 PM
  17. raino's Avatar
    It is, but it doesn't really matter if the enforcer of the law is on Tmobile's side.
    And that's the unfortunate truth. This time though, I don't see it going TMO's way, but then I didn't think BO was going to fly either...

    Ironically, TMO is advertising this plan on their home page with a video titled 'Break the Rules.'
    08-21-2016 02:33 PM
  18. dpham00's Avatar
    Especially since Wheeler is only in office for a few more months... I don't think that he is going to ruffle feathers in the time remaining
    08-21-2016 02:36 PM
  19. Channan's Avatar
    I almost want to bet only 1% turned it off because a lot don't even realize it was turned on by default.
    That would be a very safe bet. Only 1% turned it off because the majority don't know what it is, have never heard of it, don't care, and/or don't know how to turn it off.
    08-22-2016 09:14 AM

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