Issue with odd Halo or flaring with photos

[dsignori]

So it seems that I have an issue with the camera on my Pixel XL. On certain shots I have an odd halo effect (different from a lens flare) that shows up when there is a bright light source in the frame or even out of the frame sometimes. It's quite annoying and has ruined a few of my shots so far.

I have seen others on Reddit and other places talk about this, and there is even a video here video here from a user showing the issue. Does anyone else have this issue? It happens frequently when pointing at a bright light source (and sometimes even a dimmer one). It manifest differently in different situations, but I know it's an issue. I haven't had this with other cameras yet ..

I am getting a bit frustrated today, and even tried the new Google Help chat in the settings (to little avail so far).





I'll add one I took below with an iPod touch to show is not just the lighting..



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Update:

So .. some good news of sorts. It turns out Google is aware of this issue, and will issue a software fix . Isaac Reynolds, a member of Google's camera team, posted the following in the Pixel user community forum:

"Hi, all!

First, for some background -- flare is a property of ALL camera lenses. It comes in a ton of different shapes and sizes and can even be used for creative effect -- good and bad . The shape, color, amount, etc. of flare is related to dozens of different parameters of the lens structure and inclement light.

However, we have noticed Pixel has a little too much of the "halo/arc" type flare. This is the specific kind of flare that appears as a bright/low-contrast arc in the corners of the frame.
You can expect a software update in the next few weeks that will improve the effects of this issue. We're working on some algorithms that recognize the halo/arc flare, characterize it mathematically, and then subtract it from the image. You will need to use HDR+ to see the benefits of this software.
Also, there is no point getting your device replaced thanks to this issue. The Pixel camera's lens structure is very highly controlled -- this means that all Pixels take high-quality images, but it also means all Pixels have the same flare characteristics.
I wrote a post a while ago about how by doing things in software, we are able to make Pixel's camera even better over time. This is one of those ways.

Isaac"
https://productforums.google.com/for...g/V8Ue-0gvCAAJ


So yes. This is an actual, real problem. And there will be some attempted software fix. Yay!!!!

 

[Rukbat]

Halos and lens flares are caused by the same thing - a very bright light (in comparison to the average light level of the scene) in or near the scene. (Check photography sites for information - it's a photography problem, not a cellphone problem.) Since you can't mount a lens shade to a phone, you'll have to use your hand or a piece of dense black paper or card to block the light (except that last picture - that's completely normal, and you can't block the light you're taking a picture of).

 

[dsignori]

Halos and lens flares are caused by the same thing - a very bright light (in comparison to the average light level of the scene) in or near the scene. (Check photography sites for information - it's a photography problem, not a cellphone problem.) Since you can't mount a lens shade to a phone, you'll have to use your hand or a piece of dense black paper or card to block the light (except that last picture - that's completely normal, and you can't block the light you're taking a picture of).

Not here. This is a problem with THIS camera. I can take 5 of the same pics with 5 different cell phones I have lying around, this is the only one that outputs what you see. Watch that video. It's the phone. It may not be all Pixels, but it is mine, and it is not due to photography issues.

I updated the OP with a shot from an iPod touch just to show that it's not the framing, its the camera. If I use any other phone in the home, it doesn't display these issues ..

 

[Brandon Harhi]

Odd that Jeff Springer said it doesn't happen in his other two Pixels. Seems like if you have this issue you have to be mindful in setting up your shots. I wonder if this has anything to do with the rather large piece of Gorilla Glass on the back. Or if it's just a fluke.

 

[Go0gle]

I'm surprised that people still think this is a Pixel specific problem. This is a photography related problem that you are seeing with the pixel due to A) an extreme scenario and B) the lens construction. If you still do not believe that, you should spend some time reading up on detailed lens properties and how they interact with light. Tiny variances in angle can be the difference between flare and no flare as well. Your iPod photo is not the exact same angle, distance, focal length, aperture, or even orientation - it is unfortunately irrelevant as a comparison.

Lens flare happens with any lens, and the type and shape of flare will depend on the lens construction (flare is typically reflection between lens elements) and the scene (exactly how the bright light source is hitting the lens). I have used $3,000 landscape lenses that do similar things, and there is nothing wrong with them. In the above examples where you have an extremely bright light source pointed right at the lens or just barely outside it's field of view, it's not unusual. Remember at the end of the day this is a smartphone camera, not a high end multi-coated optic designed for a DSLR (and even those would often produce flare in the scenarios you show above).

So far I have not seen flare in any of my images, but I haven't been giving the camera/lens a torture test with extreme brightness scenarios. You should expect it if you're shooting directly into an extremely bright light source with what amounts to a very basic camera/lens (but outstanding for a smartphone of course) at the end of the day. Manufacturers like Nikon and Canon do all kinds of things to try and reduce flare on very expensive lenses, and even with a lens hood you will not be immune to it.

Honestly I do not think this is a problem at all, I just think people do not like the specific type of flare the lens produces when giving the camera an extremely difficult scene to deal with. This also did not show up in any of the professional reviews I read on the phone with numerous photo examples. Under normal shooting scenarios it's very unlikely you would see any flare at all.

 

[dsignori]

I appreciate the folks explaining lens flare and such. I would reiterate that I have other cameras around that do not show any of the results that I am seeing with the Pixel. I updated one in the OP with just a iPod Touch, but it is replicated with any other camera phone I use (except for the Pixel, which has issues).

It's natural to jump to the conclusion that it's the framing, or such, if you don't have the issue on your Pixel, or if you don't have the phone. I might too. But trust me, I have taken lots of pics over the years with many different phones and cameras, and my Pixel has some problem.


There's also at least one reddit thread about it . Several folks there have the issue, some don't.

 

[Go0gle]

I appreciate the folks explaining lens flare and such. I would reiterate that I have other cameras around that do not show any of the results that I am seeing with the Pixel. I updated one in the OP with just a iPod Touch, but it is replicated with any other camera phone I use (except for the Pixel, which has issues).

It's natural to jump to the conclusion that it's the framing, or such, if you don't have the issue on your Pixel, or if you don't have the phone. I might too. But trust me, I have taken lots of pics over the years with many different phones and cameras, and my Pixel has some problem.

The thing is though that nobody is jumping to a conclusion. It is physics in this case. You cannot post two completely different images taken at different distances, focal lengths, orientations, and apertures and call it a comparison. It is anything but. Especially in the world of photography, things have to be *extremely* controlled if you want any sort of accurate comparison.

Is it possible that in certain extreme scenarios, the pixel exhibits halo-like flare? Sure. The disconnect is that some people think it's an issue or a problem. I can get a $3000+ camera lens to do the exact same thing, and there are other lenses that may not produce flare in that specific scenario, but would in others.

 

[hectorbribiesca]

Did some test right now .... And I can confirm I have this issues as well here are some pics

 

[hectorbribiesca]

Another shot

 

[hectorbribiesca]

Third shot

 

[hectorbribiesca]

Fourth shot

 

[hectorbribiesca]

Last shot

 

[NeilMex]

Is your lense clean? I've had this happen before when I had a fingerprint on it.

 

[Go0gle]

A bunch of shots directly into the sun - yup that's going to flare at certain angles. These tests don't show anything other than that the phone doesn't defy the laws of physics.

This is like driving your car into a wall, being surprised that it destroys your bumper and then saying "yup, I have the bumper issue too" haha. Seriously guys don't worry about it. When you create a worst-case scenario that no lens on the planet is immune to, and experience the predictable result, it isn't an "issue".

If I took my SLR outside and took that same shot with far more expensive multi-coated optics designed specifically to reduce flare, I would get something similar.

Take a moment and have a look at this review. Scroll down about 3/4 the way to the "flare" section. Look familiar? Exact same halo-like flare (it's actually even worse) - that is a $2,000 lens, one of the best landscape lenses you can buy, with special features and optical coatings specifically to reduce flare:

http://www.photozone.de/nikon_ff/447-nikkor_afs_1424_28_ff?start=1

Now, you're taking your smartphone with MUCH cheaper optics, giving it an even more extreme scenario, and you are getting the predictable result.

 

[anon(596177)]

A bunch of shots directly into the sun - yup that's going to flare at certain angles. These tests don't show anything other than that the phone doesn't defy the laws of physics.

This is like driving your car into a wall, being surprised that it destroys your bumper and then saying "yup, I have the bumper issue too" haha. Seriously guys don't worry about it. When you create a worst-case scenario that no lens on the planet is immune to, and experience the predictable result, it isn't an "issue".

If I took my SLR outside and took that same shot with far more expensive multi-coated optics designed specifically to reduce flare, I would get something similar.

Take a moment and have a look at this review. Scroll down about 3/4 the way to the "flare" section. Look familiar? Exact same halo-like flare (it's actually even worse) - that is a $2,000 lens, one of the best landscape lenses you can buy, with special features and optical coatings specifically to reduce flare:

http://www.photozone.de/nikon_ff/447-nikkor_afs_1424_28_ff?start=1

Now, you're taking your smartphone with MUCH cheaper optics, giving it an even more extreme scenario, and you are getting the predictable result.

Go0gle, I appreciate your Zeal with trying to describe this phenomenon to us all. However, I don't think you are understanding that yes, while this is something that is completely normal and will happen with any camera with any lense it is happening far more often and far easier with the pixel. A normal phenomenon maybe, but this is not a phenomenon that should occur in very low-light situations with an indoor light while not even having said light lined up in the shot.

I I posted these on a separate thread already, but since we're already here I will repost these photos. I took these photos last night, the first set with the Nexus 6p and the second set with the pixel. You will see that both photos are as close to being lined up together as possible using the same light sources shot only seconds apart from each other. As a side note, I moved the 6p around a little bit to attempt to get the same flare to occur as seen in the pixels photos and was unsuccessful.



6p

Pixel

The first photo in each set is more of a control, showing that yes if you point the camera directly at the light source it's going to flare and cause an artifact. However, the purple arc you see in the pixel second photo is definitely not something that you should be seeing off such a weak light source while not being directed at the light source itself. This is an incredibly Bad Case of lense flare even for a smartphone camera. If you look at the 6 P's second photo, you will see that there is indeed a flare on it ( under the dogs water bowl )however it's very subtle.

I don't think anybody is trying to argue that lense flare is going to happen, under certain circumstances. What we are saying, at least what I'm saying, is that the circumstances are a lot less forgiving on the pixel then they are with any other phone. If I have to hold my hand over the camera lens in order to take a photo without lense flare, I can probably deal with that. I like taking photos but I'm nowhere near as hard core of a user that that would bug me. But I really don't think anyone can sit and look at these photos and tell me that lense flare isn't more of an issue with this phone than it is with other smartphones. it is. Whether it is an isolated bath of phones or not.

Edit: on another note, I stopped by my local Verizon store today and checked out the two pixels that they had on display. I was able to recreate intense lense flare on both of those pixels, even after wiping the lense off first, using only the overhead lighting in the store.

 

[hectorbribiesca]

Night shot

 

[anon(596177)]

Here's another interesting shot for you. I just took a nice shot outside to respond to the previous above post. The top of my porch was visible in the shop and my flash went off. Take a look at what happened.

Take a look at that flare! This would have been caused by the light from my phone's flash reflecting off from the top of my porch. Tell me that's normal.

I corrected the shot and took another one for the above poster. This is what my night shots look like.

Corrected shot:

And for comparison's sake, a shot with my 6p with the porch roof to try to imitate what happened on the pixel.

 

[mwboost]

I'm one of the lucky ones.(32gb Black pixel, bought outright from jb hifi, aus) Good too. As I've already exchanged my first pixel for an uneven screen tone.
I tried to get the flare but I only got flare when I aim pretty close to the sun. Tried alot of angles. All good.

 

[Wiley_11]

Here's another interesting shot for you. I just took a nice shot outside to respond to the previous above post. The top of my porch was visible in the shop and my flash went off. Take a look at what happened.

//uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161025/d08af8af246fb77d0b46410c94d5e9dd.jpg



Take a look at that flare! This would have been caused by the light from my phone's flash reflecting off from the top of my porch. Tell me that's normal.

I corrected the shot and took another one for the above poster. This is what my night shots look like.

Corrected shot:

//uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161025/65883976915661c70b11736f413ff6aa.jpg


And for comparison's sake, a shot with my 6p with the porch roof to try to imitate what happened on the pixel.

//uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161025/a12ec51e0a1e1f73bb622629494618d0.jpg

This phone is magical. resistance is futile, you will be assimilated!...........

#flaregate

 

[SteelGator]

It is clear to me that there is something up with the lens structure or positioning that makes the camera more susceptible to flare than it ought to be.

Folks should shoot as many pictures as they can when they first get the camera in lighting they typically use to be sure it will not be a limiter for them. This is not an issue I see being fixed with software.

I will say, the flare shows in the viewer for me, so I have been able to limit/eliminate by reframing so far. I really need to test more though.