Serious Gingerbread question...

[EdwardsNH]

Ok, now that the devs have their hands on the CDMA Fascinate ROM for Froyo, I'm just curious as to what holds them back from building a Gingerbread ROM.

I mean, doesn't that contain all the radio information needed? Clearly not, since they've had their mitts on Eclair for a long time, with the same radio info.

So I'm just wondering... Once they have their hands on any version of Gingerbread, and the information for the radios, what holds them back from quickly creating a ROM for a device?

 

[afbar1114]

Ok, now that the devs have their hands on the CDMA Fascinate ROM for Froyo, I'm just curious as to what holds them back from building a Gingerbread ROM.

I mean, doesn't that contain all the radio information needed? Clearly not, since they've had their mitts on Eclair for a long time, with the same radio info.

So I'm just wondering... Once they have their hands on any version of Gingerbread, and the information for the radios, what holds them back from quickly creating a ROM for a device?

COME ON MAN!!!! there was already a thre3ad started.... all the os are diffrent thats why you can build off of one that we have already

 

[jisley10]

From my understanding there are a number of factors that hold them back from just porting over the Gingerbread ROM from one device to the next. For one, every device is different. . . this means the coding that is on each device must be unique to coincide with it's hardware/software. Digging through this coding to make it work on different devices is the hard part. It's not like these guys are working with a couple strings of coding here, it's a tall task for anyone to re engineer the coding on one device to bring it to another.

 

[EdwardsNH]

From my understanding there are a number of factors that hold them back from just porting over the Gingerbread ROM from one device to the next. For one, every device is different. . . this means the coding that is on each device must be unique to coincide with it's hardware/software. Digging through this coding to make it work on different devices is the hard part. It's not like these guys are working with a couple strings of coding here, it's a tall task for anyone to re engineer the coding on one device to bring it to another.

As a coder myself, this answer doesn't explain the difficulty. Like I said, the ROM/Kernal/Radio version for the Eclair/Froyo versions should have all the pertinent information. Re-coding the Gingerbread from the Nexus S should not be difficult with this information. Tedious yes, but not difficult.

Clearly, it is though. Since these guys are quite clever, and it is still an issue for them. So I was just wondering if anyone knew specifically what it was.

ps - As to this being brought up before... Not in any kind of serious manner, but thanks for your helpful response.

 

[jisley10]

As a coder myself, this answer doesn't explain the difficulty. Like I said, the ROM/Kernal/Radio version for the Eclair/Froyo versions should have all the pertinent information. Re-coding the Gingerbread from the Nexus S should not be difficult with this information. Tedious yes, but not difficult.

Clearly, it is though. Since these guys are quite clever, and it is still an issue for them. So I was just wondering if anyone knew specifically what it was.

ps - As to this being brought up before... Not in any kind of serious manner, but thanks for your helpful response.

Honestly I don't have a clue as to what specifically it is that makes it so difficult to port over the coding. Funny thing is after the last Podcast the guys were taking questions and I asked "what makes it so difficult to port ROMs from one Galaxy S to the next?" and I got a very similar answer as the one I gave you; Hardware/Software/Radio differences. Hopefully someone like a developer can shed some light on the issue.

 

[gunnermike53]

im sorry, no serious thread on this subject are allowed.

bad llama

 

[afbar1114]

im sorry, no serious thread on this subject are allowed.

bad llama

well you did start the first one....

 

[gunnermike53]

well you did start the first one....

lol. mine wanst serious. i was over taken by the uncontrolable urge to do something annoying.

i honestly couldnt care less about 2.3. the one thing i want the phone to do that it doesnt is the audio out on the car dock. well there is the HDMI out and the flash 10.1, but thats only because the droid x has all that and that is just plain unaccectable.

 

[Kevin Gossett]

It all comes down to the kernel. Birdman was building a GB ROM from the AOSP 2.6.35 kernel, adapting everything from scratch. The devs were also creating the 2.2 ROMs based off the 2.1 kernel, because technically FroYo can run off it. The same goes for GB; it can run off the 2.2 kernel, which the devs now have. So a GB ROM should be much easier to code now than it was prior to getting that kernel

 

[EdwardsNH]

Thanks Kevin. That's the direction I was going in.

@jisley10 Do you see the difference now? To take a ROM from one phone to the other... yes, there are the issues you mentioned.

But what I'm wondering, and Kevin touched on, is taking the information from a previous release, which includes hardware I/O, driver, software for your specific model, and using it to adapt the current OS version to your phone.

I can see if you were jumping up a whole version release (2.* to 3.*), you might have vastly different methods of interfacing with the hardware. But a +0.1 release should not.

 

[gunnermike53]

Thanks Kevin. That's the direction I was going in.

@jisley10 Do you see the difference now? To take a ROM from one phone to the other... yes, there are the issues you mentioned.

But what I'm wondering, and Kevin touched on, is taking the information from a previous release, which includes hardware I/O, driver, software for your specific model, and using it to adapt the current OS version to your phone.

I can see if you were jumping up a whole version release (2.* to 3.*), you might have vastly different methods of interfacing with the hardware. But a +0.1 release should not.

one of the biggest reasons for the upgrade is hardware. so the old kernel and hardware info wont cut it. there are a lot of hard ware features that 2
.1 isnt capable of.

 

[gunnermike53]

ah,now look what you made me do!!! i gave a serious answer!

 

[Chris3D]

I can see if you were jumping up a whole version release (2.* to 3.*), you might have vastly different methods of interfacing with the hardware. But a +0.1 release should not.

Version numbering can be pretty arbitrary. Just consider the versions so far:

1.0
1.1
1.5 (Cupcake)
1.6 (Donut)
2.0/2.1 (Eclair)
2.2 (Froyo)
2.3 (Gingerbread)
3.0 (Honeycomb)

You'd think with all the new features of Gingerbread that it would be more than a .1 update, but it is. It's hard to pin down what makes an upgrade worthy of more than a +.1 designation.

 

[sjenkins1009]

One thing i seemed to notice about google is features determine the .1+ designation, while design and view are the #.0 number. What i am referring to is if you look at the pre 2.0 devices the UI is drastically differnt than post eclair. The AOSP launcher is different and essentially a different exp. Meanwhile, stock 2.0 and 2.2 are visually the same interaction. i haven't played with 2.3 at all so i can't comment on that, but eclair and froyo the only major difference is the feaures each brings to the table beyond the design and visual aspect of the os. Just my .02 on the differences tween a 1+ and a.1+

 

[EdwardsNH]

one of the biggest reasons for the upgrade is hardware. so the old kernel and hardware info wont cut it. there are a lot of hard ware features that 2
.1 isnt capable of.

Sorry, but you are still not quite groking this. You're argument only rings true if the new OS is calling for something the old hardware CAN'T do, or does it so crappy, it's just not realistic.

The Nexus S and the Fascinate are two very similar phones. Now yes, there are hardware differences, which is why you can't just drop one ROM on either phone, but no significant performance differences. The issue is, getting the OS to communicate with hardware... the kernal.

What's going on here, as Kevin dug into a bit, is the devs have the input/output information (I/O) from the Froyo kernal now, and the Froyo kernal works on Gingerbread.

My point about the 1.* vs. the *.1 version was just that this is not a huge leap forward, that required a very different I/O structure. Don't get caught up in the whole .1 vs 1. semantics. The point is, it's not a huge leap.

And with what Kevin stated, the point is... if the devs decide to stick with it, we should eventually see Gingerbread on the Fascinate.


FYI:
Difference Between Nexus S vs. Samsung Galaxy S (Fascinate vs. Vibrant)

 

[gunnermike53]

Sorry, but you are still not quite groking this. You're argument only rings true if the new OS is calling for something the old hardware CAN'T do, or does it so crappy, it's just not realistic.

The Nexus S and the Fascinate are two very similar phones. Now yes, there are hardware differences, which is why you can't just drop one ROM on either phone, but no significant performance differences. The issue is, getting the OS to communicate with hardware... the kernal.

What's going on here, as Kevin dug into a bit, is the devs have the input/output information (I/O) from the Froyo kernal now, and the Froyo kernal works on Gingerbread.

My point about the 1.* vs. the *.1 version was just that this is not a huge leap forward, that required a very different I/O structure. Don't get caught up in the whole .1 vs 1. semantics. The point is, it's not a huge leap.

And with what Kevin stated, the point is... if the devs decide to stick with it, we should eventually see Gingerbread on the Fascinate.


FYI:
Difference Between Nexus S vs. Samsung Galaxy S (Fascinate vs. Vibrant)

i get what you are saying, and to some point i agree, especialy between 2.2 nad 2.3. however there are several hardware features the phone is capable of that 2.1 simply does not have the I/O for. thats why you can run 2.3 on a 2.2 kernel but you cant run 2.2 on a 2.1 kernel. 2.2 to 2.3 is mostly a software upgrade where as 2.1 to 2.2 is hardware. i do believe the devs will get us 2.3 wether vzw and sammy wants us to or not, because of the reasons just stated.

i also agree about not getting hung up on .1 vs 1. they can name it what ever they want.