Unresponsive screen when not grounded (car dock, certain surfaces, not holding it)

[igl007]

Basically, the phone screen is unresponsive when your not holding it or any time it's not grounded. If I put it in the car holder and then touch the screen, its very sporadic. I have compared it with the droid eris and the Moto Droid under the same conditions at the same time, and it performs flawlessly. I have tried the incredible with the screen protector and without. If I take it out of the dock and hold the phone in my hand, it works great again. It's not just the car dock either. If I set it on certain surfaces and just touch it with one finger it does the same thing.
The car dock itself has nothing to do with it. I've narrowed it down to a grounding issue. I've also tested 3 Incredibles and ALL of them do it. I am going to post another video showing it on top of a piece of styrofoam which also creates the problem. It's definitely more widespread then just a few phones. Basically, If the phone has very little ground it is unresponsive. If you ground it, either by holding it or placing it on a surface that is grounded then it solves the problem. If you plug anything into it that is grounded it solves the problem.

Here is a new video on different surfaces. It's not a car dock issue. If it is some static issue as some are saying, it works great on a eris, or a moto droid so it's not capacitive screen in general.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vL6sLW7Ll0E

Here is the car dock video
YouTube - Verizon HTC Incredible - Unresponsive Screen Test 2

My goal for this thread, (now that I see it is happening to a lot of phones) is too get enough info out there so that other people can effectively recreate this problem on their phones. With enough people, I am hoping HTC or Verizon can offer a fix not just a work around.

UPDATE 5-17-10
I received 2 replacement Incredibles from Verizon. Both phones respond in the same way as the original. I called verizon, and they said "they are compiling a list of problems to send to HTC and they will add this one to the list". Hopefully the rep that I spoke with wasn't just trying to shut me up. I don't know... Anyway, Here is the last video I am going to do on the topic. In this I wanted to clearly show the following:
- It is not a "Capacitive" screen issue in general (MOTO Droid, and Eris are fine)
- It is a MASS DEFECT of this phone. (I am not saying ALL phones)
I am going to forward this message and the video to HTC. I will post the response. Here is the link to the new video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQRgT3gtmsI

 

[Cyder]

I could see the styrofoam maybe causing an issue as the static electricity could mess with the internal components. As far as the car dock, I'm scratching my head...0.o

You could try bringing it up to a Verizon rep at the store but without being able to show them at the desk, i doubt they will do much.

 

[brandonx1000]

no problems here...i leave mine on my desk and use it without holding it...never ran into this

 

[chloeymatthews]

I have that problem with mine now that I have seen your video. I don't use a car dock. I had it setting on the couch beside me and didn't pick it up but tried to unlock it and it wouldn't work well at all. I'm not sure what's wrong with it, but it's not your phone... you aren't alone in this matter, I promise you that much. I do hope it is some type of software glitch that might get resolved with a pushed update... :-/ but who knows right now. It might be made that way for some reason that hasn't been said yet. :-/

 

[GivenToFly]

I don't have this problem. While I'm at work, I'll leave my phone on my toolbox, or desk, or even just a shelf, and I don't pick it up when I get an alert, I just use my finger and the phone workes just fine. Just tried setting it down on my couch beside me like above post, and it works fine there too. For reference, my toolbox top is stainless steel, desk is wood, and shelves are composite. so it's not the surface. I know that my old storm was like that though. I had to be holding it for it to work.

 

[rosariorose9]

That's really strange. I've tried mine on a number of surfaces (wood, rubber, plastic, metal and formica) and it works fine. Awaiting a car dock that I ordered, so we'll see how that works...

 

[nightfishing#AC]

This was an issue with the Storm as well. I chased it for months but could never 100% nail it down. It is related to grounding, but I could completely resolve or reproduce it.

My Inc is the same way in my car cradle.

Thumb on the side=solution.

 

[herbologist]

I have never had this problem. Sounds like you should exchange it?

 

[igl007]

Here is a new video on different surfaces. It's not a car dock issue. If it is some static issue as some are saying, it works great on a eris, or a moto droid so it's not capacitive screen in general.

YouTube - Verizon HTC Incredible - Unresponsive Screen Test 3

Thanks for all the feedback. Please test your phone using the materials in the new video. Thanks!

 

[Qazme]

As far as the thing not working, I've been playing around with my phone all day, from my desk, to the couch arm one handed, and I even tried the top of a Styrofoam cooler on top of a table like you did in the video and the phone worked just fine. Maybe you got the HTC prototype that can detect when it's in your hand or not so that buttons aren't pushed in your pocket! j/k I would just take the phone back, they are probably going to look at you crazy though.

 

[Roy Aguilera]

I have tried this and can't duplicate the issue.

 

[crosserb]

Mine is like that, when its on the couch. Haven't tried the other ways.

 

[ultrav23]

OK OK OK... Here is the deal. Capacitive touch phones work on potential energy. The potential energy of the object which is holding the device must be less than the energy of the object which is touching the screen. In many cases (i.e. styrofoam, wool blanket, plastic bag, carpet, etc...) a static charge is present. When you attempt to use the phone while it is on/cradled by such potential energy it negates your touch. All phones of this type have this and it is one of the draw backs to capacitive. Resistive touch screens have similar drawbacks when being touched by items with little to no resistance, but are not effected by static. I suggest getting a car mount more like this. Or ground out the static charge to lower the potential energy.

 

[Qazme]

OK OK OK... Here is the deal. Capacitive touch phones work on potential energy. The potential energy of the object which is holding the device must be less than the energy of the object which is touching the screen. In many cases (i.e. styrofoam, wool blanket, plastic bag, carpet, etc...) a static charge is present. When you attempt to use the phone while it is on/cradled by such potential energy it negates your touch. All phones of this type have this and it is one of the draw backs to capacitive. Resistive touch screens have similar drawbacks when being touched by items with little to no resistance, but are not effected by static. I suggest getting a car mount more like this. Or ground out the static charge to lower the potential energy.

Yeah, it appears after some research this is totally possible, and within bounds of the phone. Its not a design defect because you have too much static lol. Here is some info on the screen.

A capacitive touchscreen panel consists of an insulator such as glass, coated with a transparent conductor such as indium tin oxide (ITO). As the human body is also a conductor, touching the surface of the screen results in a distortion of the body's electrostatic field, measurable as a change in capacitance. Different technologies may be used to determine the location of the touch. The location is then sent to the controller for processing.

In this basic technology, only one side of the insulator is coated with a conductive layer. A small voltage is applied to the layer, resulting in a uniform electrostatic field. When a conductor, such as a human finger, touches the uncoated surface, a capacitor is dynamically formed. The sensor's controller can determine the location of the touch indirectly from the change in the capacitance as measured from the four corners of the panel. As it has no moving parts, it is moderately durable but has limited resolution, is prone to false signals from parasitic capacitive coupling, and needs calibration during manufacture. It is therefore most often used in simple applications such as industrial controls and kiosks.

 

[igl007]

Yeah, it appears after some research this is totally possible, and within bounds of the phone. Its not a design defect because you have too much static lol. Here is some info on the screen.

A capacitive touchscreen panel consists of an insulator such as glass, coated with a transparent conductor such as indium tin oxide (ITO). As the human body is also a conductor, touching the surface of the screen results in a distortion of the body's electrostatic field, measurable as a change in capacitance. Different technologies may be used to determine the location of the touch. The location is then sent to the controller for processing.

In this basic technology, only one side of the insulator is coated with a conductive layer. A small voltage is applied to the layer, resulting in a uniform electrostatic field. When a conductor, such as a human finger, touches the uncoated surface, a capacitor is dynamically formed. The sensor's controller can determine the location of the touch indirectly from the change in the capacitance as measured from the four corners of the panel. As it has no moving parts, it is moderately durable but has limited resolution, is prone to false signals from parasitic capacitive coupling, and needs calibration during manufacture. It is therefore most often used in simple applications such as industrial controls and kiosks.

Guys,
Yes your both absolutely right on how capacitive screens work. I am very familiar with both Capacitive and Resistive screens. However, the simple fact remains, these same test do not effect the moto Droid or Eris which both have capacitive screens. You can take any of those phones and plop them on all the Styrofoam you want and it's NOT going to respond like many Incredibles are. Your certainly not going to have trouble with those phone in a car dock. I'm not saying all Incredibles are bad by any means, but I am saying some have clear cut defective screens and grounding problems. It's NOT a generic capacitive screen capability issue.

 

[04redgto]

ok....umm.........Get a replacement...............

 

[Qazme]

ok....umm.........Get a replacement...............

Kind of the point I was making.....I have tried these tests and my phone behaves like normal.

 

[fiveojeb]

Maybe each person generates differant levels of static from their body.

 

[Qazme]

Well don't forget too, going back to the A+ Cert. days, remember a humid environment causes more static electricity in the air versus a dry environment. So basically South Carolina will have more static in the air than California.

This is the reason why most data centers are humidity controlled with rubber floors

 

[Execute]

I have noticed that when you are not holding your phone, and you use the touch screen, it is pretty easy to "miss" the "sweet spot". The touchscreen looks to be designed, and rightfully so, to preform best when you are holding it. If you lay the phone on another surface and tap on a widget, look real close to where you finger makes contact. It may be that you're not touching where it feels like you are. If that makes sense? Idk I've kinda noticed it anyway. Worth taking a look at anyway. Might help ya out.