What is the "perfect" megapixel count?

[Matty]

Hey guys, hope you all doing well.

So I was thinking today. Ever since smartphones started being made, there has been a constant pursuit to pack in more and more megapixels. Until the Galaxy S7 came around and we dropped from 16mp to 12mp.

Do you think we will stay around the 12/13mp mark like many many flagships have today or continue to go higher as the years go by?

 

[Aquila]

Yes, 12/13 is the sweet spot for the sensor sizes that we're currently using.

 

[LeoRex]

I agree, 12/13mp is the ideal size, based on the dimensions that these sensors must fit in. It gives them the best compromise between resolving ability (pixel count) and light capturing efficiency (pixel size).

 

[Tsepz_GP]

Yep, 12MP is the sweetspot, we really do not need more Megapixels, but rather larger and smarter sensors and lenses that can capture more light.

In actual fact I'd argue that after 8MP, the Megapixel race should have ended.

What I would love to see making a comeback in smartphone cameras is the Xenon Flash and Camera covers.

I miss this:

 

[Golfdriver97]

I think the idea of higher MP has become too much of a focusing point. I was in the market for a new digital camera (still am technically, just put it aside for a little while), but people also need to look at the sensor size. If the camera can't capture light well, the photo will turn out bad.

 

[Matty]

I think the idea of higher MP has become too much of a focusing point. I was in the market for a new digital camera (still am technically, just put it aside for a little while), but people also need to look at the sensor size. If the camera can't capture light well, the photo will turn out bad.

I'm not sure how wide spread it still is but when ever I say to people my Priv has a 18mp. The first thing they say is, wow that better than my iPhone. I guess many years of marketing more is better is the culprit.

I don't know hey, I would be happy to bump it to 16mp. Being able to zoom in, is always a positive for me. That being said, being able to take really nice night shots is also a big draw.

Maybe we can have 1 (16mp) day camera and 1 (8mp) night camera with like a F1.4 aperture or something!

 

[belodion]

Developments in thin lenses using new technologies may make larger sensors possible with no overall increase in device thickness, and therefore higher pixel counts. Then again, they may not, but there are interesting developments in folded-path lenses, and things like this: https://www.google.co.uk/amp/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/36438686

 

[Almeuit]

I agree, 12/13mp is the ideal size, based on the dimensions that these sensors must fit in. It gives them the best compromise between resolving ability (pixel count) and light capturing efficiency (pixel size).

This.

 

[Sedp23]

Yep, 12MP is the sweetspot, we really do not need more Megapixels, but rather larger and smarter sensors and lenses that can capture more light.

In actual fact I'd argue that after 8MP, the Megapixel race should have ended.

What I would love to see making a comeback in smartphone cameras is the Xenon Flash and Camera covers.

I miss this:
//uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170701/31ca8e6a67d094c6d4657443b0b5dd11.jpg

Man I miss the xenon flash I wonder why they stopped using them

 

[Guytronic]

@Matty
Great subject and question.

I'm not sure about megapixels and whats smartphone perfect.
Could be lens quality along with pixel size over pixel count.

I've had phone cameras @ 5MP that I thought had great processed output.
My personal best experience was with 16MP and a f1.8 lens on an Android phone.

 

[Matty]

@Matty
Great subject and question.

I'm not sure about megapixels and whats smartphone perfect.
Could be lens quality along with pixel size over pixel count.

I've had phone cameras @ 5MP that I thought had great processed output.
My personal best experience was with 16MP and a f1.8 lens on an Android phone.

I just remember a couple years ago HTC has the "One M7" which had a 4MP camera with better low light photography with larger Pixel sizes. Then we also had that 41MP camera from Nokia with their Lumia 1020.

So that's why I suggested, maybe we could have a 5 or 8MP camera for low light and a 16mp camera for day light photos. Will be interesting to see what happens going forward.

Maybe the focus will all be about aperture and Pixel size going forward as you said I want to see F1.5! Haha.

 

[Guytronic]

I want to see F1.5! Haha.

Lol...
Might as well try to hit 1.4 or 1.2

 

[LeoRex]

So that's why I suggested, maybe we could have a 5 or 8MP camera for low light and a 16mp camera for day light photos. Will be interesting to see what happens going forward.

Maybe the focus will all be about aperture and Pixel size going forward as you said ������ I want to see F1.5! Haha.

First... I think Huawei's approach gets us there. Pair a monochrome sensor with a color sensor... the mono does the detail, the color fills in the rest. Why? A monochrome sensor utilizes every pixel, it's looking at light levels without caring about color... whereas a color sensor is dividing up that those pixels among three colors. So a monochrome sensor has vastly superior resolving capability than a color sensor of the same specs. Make a monochrome version of the Pixel's IMX378 to sit next to a standard color version... send that all through HDR+.... you'd have a camera that would be head and shoulders above anything else in every condition and have low-light performance never seen in mobile photography.

Oh, and you really don't want a fixed F1.5 lens on a phone, the beauty of phone cameras is their flexibility.. and having a F1.5 would leave you with a hellaciously narrow field of view and you'd end up with odd pics where someone's nose would be in focus but everything else blurry.

 

[Tsepz_GP]

Man I miss the xenon flash I wonder why they stopped using them

Phones got thinner quicker than they could make the xenon flash equipment smaller.

Every phone with a xenon flash is thick, just think of the Sony Ericsson K850, Nokia N82, Sony Ericsson Satio, Nokia 808 PureView, Lumia 1020 etc...

There are also other factors like the capacitor and flashtube circuit that are pretty big and pricy. Xenon flash also needs a ton of power, so it costs the battery.

Feature Phones such as Sony Ericsson K800, K850, C905, Samsung G800 etc... Ran on very light Java Platforms, focused on sipping battery, so they could afford to have a Xenon, allow you to snap most of the day and still have battery left.

Smartphones with Xenon have famously had poor battery once you start using that flash.

 

[birgami]

I think for phones enough 8mp

 

[wenso smith]

12/13 MP is good..

 

[Mooncatt]

Oh, and you really don't want a fixed F1.5 lens on a phone, the beauty of phone cameras is their flexibility.. and having a F1.5 would leave you with a hellaciously narrow field of view and you'd end up with odd pics where someone's nose would be in focus but everything else blurry.

That wouldn't be a huge deal. If you're familiar with calculating focal length crop factors on DSLR cameras, it's similar. My DSLR is a 2X crop (micro 4/3 sensor) relative to a full frame, meaning my 45mm lens has an equivalent focal length and field of view as a 90mm lens on a full frame. The same crop factor applies to the depth of field as well, making my f3.5 equivalent to f7 on a full frame.

I don't know what crop factors are on the various phones out there, but having an f1.4 isn't as extreme as it sounds when talking about DoF. With such a small sensor, the DoF is still going to be pretty wide, and of course it grows as you move father away from the subject.

Personally, I love the 16MP shooter on my V20. I think I'd rather keep that resolution and move to a larger sensor size for better low light performance than reducing the resolution for larger pixel sizes.