Rooting Noob Needs help and has lots of questions - video include

[AlexOnVinyl]

Alright, this whole process has me a little anxious so I decided in order for me to sum up what I'd like to know I wanted to make a video - and ask the questions and hopefully this is easier for everyone to answer all the questions without multiple mass amounts of posts. Video isn't too long, any help is appreciated greatly.

unfortunately the forum isnt letting me post the video, but its on youtube

[YT]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dAZl7qQ6RpI[/YT]

 

[droidmyme]

Hey buddy,

Didn't want to upload a video response, but have you heard of md5sums? Idk the technical terms, but basically and md5sum is a mathematically generated string value based upon a file's exact bytes. A person who creates a ROM for good purposes can generate these md5sums and post them, then a user can use what's called an md5 checker to verify that the two md5 values match. That shows you that a ROM is exactly as it was made by the developer and has not been tampered with. That's how you can and should protect yourself from any malware. But the truth is, that's mainly alot of internet hearsay, don't worry about it too much.

Your main concern is, DON'T BRICK YOUR PHONE. If you are not 100% sure of something, just ask. There's alot of friendly people on here who want to help. So read carefully, ask questions, and you'll be fine.



Sent from my VM670 using Tapatalk 2

 

[AlexOnVinyl]

Re: Rooting Noob Needs help and has lots of questions - video inc

But that doesn't answer all my questions.. I'm just curious about rooting it. Is it possible to root it without needing to flash a new rom? and I heard its possible to unroot your phone so that your phone company cant tell that its rooted?

ALSO -- thats why I made the video, because I wanted to know the chances of bricking my phone I need like a serious explanation.

 

[matt0715]

There's always a chance of bricking your phone but its small as long as you read and follow directions exactly. And you can have root on a stock rom. Look at the stickys to find the best way to root your phone.

 

[droidmyme]

These questions can get very model specific, so you'll need to do more reading about the Thunderbolt. Depending on what version of Android your device is running, there is a root exploit that is basically like a script wrapped in an APK. The chances of bricking a phone by running a community supported, root exploit APK such as Gingerbreak (using Android 2.3 as my example here) are zero.

AFTER you perform a root exploit, that changes. There are things you cannot do. If you perform a Data/Factory reset from the Settings menu, specifically, then yes you are asking for a brick. If you use a file manager with root access and delete your /system folder, these things can brick a phone. So after rooting a certain level of common sense and prudence becomes necessary. It's funny how many people mess there phones up and say, "I know I wasn't supposed to do this, but OOPS."

More specifically, it is 100% possible to root an Android phone without needing to flash a ROM. Alk a ROM is is basically a custom version of Android that you can load on your device.

Can Verizon tell if you have a rooted phone? Sure they CAN, just like Verizon can tell what is in your texts and e-mails, if they wanted to. The question is WILL they see if you have a rooted phone, and the answer is no, and even if they did so what, you own the phone. The worst it does is remove your phone's warranty.

Verizon's movements are very automated. The stuff they are mostly concerned about is how you access their networks, and a rootef phone does not change this at all. Rooting simply means to gain root access.
Sent from my VM670 using Tapatalk 2

 

[droidmyme]

If you are worried about rooting, don't. Rooting with a proper exploit is very easy and takes 5 minutes. You can unroot with one touch of a button, too. And there is a chance that you could bork your phone a little if, say, you flash an outdated or incompatible ROM, or use the wrong methods. That's why you take some time to read everything properly, ask questions, and follow instructions. You'll be just fine, trust me!

Sent from my VM670 using Tapatalk 2

 

[paintdrinkingpete]

Re: Rooting Noob Needs help and has lots of questions - video inc

Alright...you're pretty much in the same boat many of us were in when we first got our Android phones. There is an FAQ I wrote up (see my signature) that addresses a few of your concerns, it is a bit dated, but none the less, you may want to check that out.

FWIW, XDA is a great resource, I go there all the time (as well as Rootzwiki and the BAMF forums, natch), but I feel you will find Android Central a "friendlier" environment for asking noob-ish questions. That's not a knock on XDA (or Android Central for that matter), but that site is almost expects that you already have a certain amount of knowledge before interacting on there, whereas AC is more of general help and support forum.

Obviously, bricking your phone is a HUGE concern to anyone...new phones are expensive. My honest advice is that if this *really* concerns you, the only way to avoid the risk is to just not do it, it's that simple. Having said that, you can take some comfort in the fact that all the methods published here for rooting the TB are tried and tested -- as others have mentioned, *if* you follow the instructions, your risk is VERY low.

With rooting this phone, there are essentially 3 main pieces:
1. unlock bootloader
2. install custom recovery
3. root the OS

The bootloader (aka HBOOT) is bit like the BIOS of your computer -- it is a very basic UI with limited functionality, but it is VERY important because as long as the bootloader is locked (as it is by default) you cannot flash a custom recovery (or so is my understanding)...and if you can't install a custom recovery, you can't install ROMs. In most cases, when people refer to "rooting" a phone, this includes unlocking the bootloader as well, even though that's really a separate thing from gaining root access to the OS. Since you state you're familiar with Linux, then you should understand what root is...it's like the "administrator" account in windows -- it has full access to the system. The "recovery" partition I compare to the pre-install environment of a Windows OS (like when you boot from a Windows CD, or a linux distro like Ubunto for that matter). Once booted into recovery, you can make changes to the system files, format drives, and install new OS to the phone. All of the procedures found in the stickies on this forum will complete all 3 of these steps...once finished, your TBolt will have an unlocked bootloader, a custom recovery installed (i.e. ClockworkMod), and root access gained to your OS (controlled by SuperUser app).

You should let us know your specific software version, so that you can be directed to the right place. I believe that there are methods to root almost ANY software version WITHOUT wiping data (although the procedure may differ), but I'm not 100% about that.

EDIT: Oh, and to answer your question about "upkeep and maintenance", the only thing you really gotta realize is that you will NOT want to accept any "official" updates that VZW pushes out. That can have bad consequences, and is why many suggest NOT running stock OS after rooting (because custom ROMs won't be offered updates, but stock OS will). If you root, you do naturally accept the responsibility to maintain your device. If you're not cool with that, you may want to reconsider. (See #7 in my FAQ).

 

[AlexOnVinyl]

Re: Rooting Noob Needs help and has lots of questions - video inc

These questions can get very model specific, so you'll need to do more reading about the Thunderbolt. Depending on what version of Android your device is running, there is a root exploit that is basically like a script wrapped in an APK. The chances of bricking a phone by running a community supported, root exploit APK such as Gingerbreak (using Android 2.3 as my example here) are zero.

AFTER you perform a root exploit, that changes. There are things you cannot do. If you perform a Data/Factory reset from the Settings menu, specifically, then yes you are asking for a brick. If you use a file manager with root access and delete your /system folder, these things can brick a phone. So after rooting a certain level of common sense and prudence becomes necessary. It's funny how many people mess there phones up and say, "I know I wasn't supposed to do this, but OOPS."

More specifically, it is 100% possible to root an Android phone without needing to flash a ROM. Alk a ROM is is basically a custom version of Android that you can load on your device.

Can Verizon tell if you have a rooted phone? Sure they CAN, just like Verizon can tell what is in your texts and e-mails, if they wanted to. The question is WILL they see if you have a rooted phone, and the answer is no, and even if they did so what, you own the phone. The worst it does is remove your phone's warranty.

Verizon's movements are very automated. The stuff they are mostly concerned about is how you access their networks, and a rootef phone does not change this at all. Rooting simply means to gain root access.
Sent from my VM670 using Tapatalk 2

Thank you for this, I feel a little bit better about rooting my phone what I'm thinking about doing is getting the SDK setup and running an emulator through the ADB - and testing a few rooting mechanisms that way.

If you are worried about rooting, don't.

what I'm worried about is not understanding enough and blindly rooting - if that makes sense. that's why I made the video to learn and get help.

Rooting with a proper exploit is very easy and takes 5 minutes. You can unroot with one touch of a button, too. And there is a chance that you could bork your phone a little if, say, you flash an outdated or incompatible ROM, or use the wrong methods. That's why you take some time to read everything properly, ask questions, and follow instructions. You'll be just fine, trust me!

Sent from my VM670 using Tapatalk 2

I want to learn as much as I can and do some simulations on devices so I can be ultimately prepared, my main thing is I don't want to just hit a single click button and have it done, I want to understand what and how things are being maintained. Yes - I will use a 1 click root, but I want to understand what all I'm doing to the phone to root it and how to go about going back to unrooting.

Alright...you're pretty much in the same boat many of us were in when we first got our Android phones. There is an FAQ I wrote up (see my signature) that addresses a few of your concerns, it is a bit dated, but none the less, you may want to check that out.

FWIW, XDA is a great resource, I go there all the time (as well as Rootzwiki and the BAMF forums, natch), but I feel you will find Android Central a "friendlier" environment for asking noob-ish questions. That's not a knock on XDA (or Android Central for that matter), but that site is almost expects that you already have a certain amount of knowledge before interacting on there, whereas AC is more of general help and support forum.

Obviously, bricking your phone is a HUGE concern to anyone...new phones are expensive. My honest advice is that if this *really* concerns you, the only way to avoid the risk is to just not do it, it's that simple. Having said that, you can take some comfort in the fact that all the methods published here for rooting the TB are tried and tested -- as others have mentioned, *if* you follow the instructions, your risk is VERY low.

With rooting this phone, there are essentially 3 main pieces:
1. unlock bootloader
2. install custom recovery
3. root the OS

This part right here is almost exactly like how it is to root most gaming consoles so I understand that, and I know what a Nandbackup is.

The bootloader (aka HBOOT) is bit like the BIOS of your computer -- it is a very basic UI with limited functionality, but it is VERY important because as long as the bootloader is locked (as it is by default) you cannot flash a custom recovery (or so is my understanding)...and if you can't install a custom recovery, you can't install ROMs. In most cases, when people refer to "rooting" a phone, this includes unlocking the bootloader as well, even though that's really a separate thing from gaining root access to the OS. Since you state you're familiar with Linux, then you should understand what root is...it's like the "administrator" account in windows -- it has full access to the system. The "recovery" partition I compare to the pre-install environment of a Windows OS (like when you boot from a Windows CD, or a linux distro like Ubunto for that matter). Once booted into recovery, you can make changes to the system files, format drives, and install new OS to the phone. All of the procedures found in the stickies on this forum will complete all 3 of these steps...once finished, your TBolt will have an unlocked bootloader, a custom recovery installed (i.e. ClockworkMod), and root access gained to your OS (controlled by SuperUser app).

You should let us know your specific software version, so that you can be directed to the right place. I believe that there are methods to root almost ANY software version WITHOUT wiping data (although the procedure may differ), but I'm not 100% about that.

EDIT: Oh, and to answer your question about "upkeep and maintenance", the only thing you really gotta realize is that you will NOT want to accept any "official" updates that VZW pushes out. That can have bad consequences, and is why many suggest NOT running stock OS after rooting (because custom ROMs won't be offered updates, but stock OS will). If you root, you do naturally accept the responsibility to maintain your device. If you're not cool with that, you may want to reconsider. (See #7 in my FAQ).

Thanks for that information, good to know - here's a few things I wanted to have answered as well, I understand that when you root - just like on any linux based distro - you are given full access to the system - which in the case of malware, the only way it can severely harm your system is if it has full root access, which brings me to ask - does rooting your phone open it up to more malware out there for Android devices as opposed to being unrooted.

Lastly! Say HTC puts out a new Android ROM - an official one but doesn't push it OTA - can it still be installed without root permissions?

 

[paintdrinkingpete]

Re: Rooting Noob Needs help and has lots of questions - video inc

Thanks for that information, good to know - here's a few things I wanted to have answered as well, I understand that when you root - just like on any linux based distro - you are given full access to the system - which in the case of malware, the only way it can severely harm your system is if it has full root access, which brings me to ask - does rooting your phone open it up to more malware out there for Android devices as opposed to being unrooted.

Lastly! Say HTC puts out a new Android ROM - an official one but doesn't push it OTA - can it still be installed without root permissions?

Well, once you root, the access will be controller by an app called "superuser". Part of the rooting process is flashing this app, plus pretty all custom ROMs will come with Superuser included. What this app does is ensures that root access is given ONLY to those apps that specifically allow. When a certain app needs root access, a popup will appear asking if you want to authorize. In other words, you're not just running on the root account and any process can take advantage of that, it's selective access only.

To answer your second question, the non-OTA updates are called RUU's. ("Rom Upgrade Utility" I believe?). An "official" RUU differs from a custom ROM in that they are flashed in HBOOT as opposed to CWM recovery. You *can* install official RUUs on a non-rooted phone (or rather a phone with a locked bootloader) because they have been signed. You need to UNlock the bootloader to installed UNsigned packages, but official upgrades will install just fine. Many folks will download and install updates this way. One large caveat to this is that installing an RUU will ALWAYS wipe data, whereas the OTA updates do not.

 

[trter10-imore]

Re: Rooting Noob Needs help and has lots of questions - video inc

I can explain how my tool works.

You used to have to downgrade to an old software version to root, but my tool "bypasses" that need.

It pushes an exploit (fre3vo, made by TeamWin/Agrabren) to the phone's /data/local, marks it executable (chmod 777), and runs it. What fre3vo does is exploit the system to gain a root shell (Sort of like admin privileges). From there, my program starts revolutionary. Revolutionary's "root shell" method was broke with the new update, so that's why fre3vo is ran first. Revolutionary finds the root shell and does what it needs to do to gain S-OFF, which is "Unlocking" the hboot and removing write protection on quite a few partitions. From there, you flash a custom recovery image over the now S-OFF hboot and then boot to that image. From there you flash a zip file that installs superuser and the required binary. The superuser binary (su) is pretty much a privilege escalator that is put in place so that you do not have to re-exploit every time you want to do something that requires root. The superuser app controls what gets root privileges and lets you say whether you want them to be allowed or not. This is because just allowing everything root privileges can be very dangerous. And yes, it is very easy to unroot, there is a tool in my signature that does that also.

Sorry if this is redundant, as I did not read the second page.