10-20-2011 12:00 AM
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  1. ottscay's Avatar
    Dear Verizon,

    I first joined your network out of a lack of choice. At the time I lived in a small, sparsely populated state, and your network was quite literally the only game in town. A couple years ago I started paying you even more money when I got my first smartphone, a Blackberry Storm. The Storm wasn't everything I'd hoped; with poor browsing and app support your data plan seemed like a silly expense, but I stuck with you through it. When the Droid X came out, I finally got a phone that actually made use of all that bandwidth I'd been paying for. I've watched with excitement as you rolled out your shiny new 4G network, and I'm excited about moving up to a 4G smartphone. Yet despite your huge lead with your network, I'm closer to leaving than ever before.

    You see, your absence last night was noticed. Maybe it was understandable - I've heard there is some strain between you and the Nexus team over marketing, and this was after all an international event, so maybe an announcement would have been out of place. But I've also heard more ominous rumors. Leaks that you don't like parts of the Nexus. Perhaps how open or unbloated the OS is. Or that it gives consumers a choice between ecosystems you don't like (e.g. Google Wallet). So let me give you some friendly advice:

    Don't meddle with this phone.

    Really, just don't. Don't try to force them to lock it down so developers can't use it. Don't try to limit my choice as a consumer about who's market I buy my apps from, how I SMS, or what sort of digital wallet I use. This isn't an idle threat - I'm close enough to the end of my contract that the price isn't prohibitive to buy myself out of it. If you insist on deciding "for me" who's services I select, then I will simply select another carrier's services.

    Don't get me wrong, I know you are insecure. Numerous times your CEO has talked about how you don't want to be just a "dumb pipe" company. Like any company you want to pad your margins by layering in other services you can charge for. And I fully encourage you to do so. But you need to do it by creating compelling services that I chose to use over what's available, not by locking out competing services. The former is pro-consumer, and shows you believe you can compete head-on in a healthy market of competition. The latter suggests you feel you cannot compete, but that you will leverage your position as the gate-holder to a network to force your customers to use your services.

    The choice really is up to you. I want nothing more than an open Nexus phone on your 4G network. By retaining me you would have the chance to demonstrate that Verizon's service offerings are worth using and/or paying for. If you decide that I should only be allowed to access your services, then there will be zero chance I will ever use them, because I will be on another carrier.

    So please, stop whatever "negotiations" are going on with this phone. Announce it and offer it in its original and intended state as soon as possible. And look at it as a chance to win people over, not as a way that you could lose people to other ecosystems. Because if you insist upon looking at it that way, you WILL lose people to other ecosystems.

    Sincerely,

    -Scott
    10-19-2011 12:31 PM
  2. digitalslacker's Avatar
    The phones in the demo videos had VZW branding on them, what you see in those videos IS the VZW version and we're way to late in the game for them to change that.

    It's not a Nexus device is it's anything but a Pure Google Experience...
    Nexus devices are unlocked and bloatware free. I don't see this one being any different just because of VZW.
    MetalPhoenix79 likes this.
    10-19-2011 12:49 PM
  3. Zorachus's Avatar
    The phones in the demo videos had VZW branding on them, what you see in those videos IS the VZW version and we're way to late in the game for them to change that.

    It's not a Nexus device is it's anything but a Pure Google Experience...
    Nexus devices are unlocked and bloatware free. I don't see this one being any different just because of VZW.
    Really ? All the demo videos I watched did not show any Verizon carrier logo or anything like that, and from what I have read, yes the Galaxy-Nexus is indeed a "pure" vanilla device, with no carrier apps/bloatware.
    10-19-2011 12:57 PM
  4. digitalslacker's Avatar
    yeah, saw this earlier but these guys just picked up the article..

    Galaxy Nexus with Verizon 4G LTE spotted in the wild | Android Community

    EDIT: Another, second photo http://www.androidguys.com/2011/10/1...=Google+Reader
    10-19-2011 12:59 PM
  5. ottscay's Avatar
    The phones in the demo videos had VZW branding on them, what you see in those videos IS the VZW version and we're way to late in the game for them to change that.
    Alas, but adding bloatware or removing an app doesn't take weeks or months the way other changes do. Several reliable community people have indicated that there are some shenanigans going on behind the scenes right now, and I just think consumers ought to remind Verizon that it does matter to us.

    It's not a Nexus device is it's anything but a Pure Google Experience...
    Nexus devices are unlocked and bloatware free. I don't see this one being any different just because of VZW.
    That sounds nice, but the word "Nexus" doesn't appear in any law book. It's just a brand - and that brand can be slapped on anything if Google and Verizon agree to it. It shouldn't be different (that's my point, in fact), but again it sounds like Verizon has been reconsidering, and I think it behooves us to let them know they shouldn't.
    10-19-2011 01:01 PM
  6. kilofoxtrot's Avatar
    OP

    So are you insinuating that VZW will be the first carrier to load bloatware on a Nexus device? First carrier to lockdown a Nexus device?

    I really think you are making a much to do over nothing. Kinda "Chicken Little" if you ask me.
    10-19-2011 01:05 PM
  7. Zorachus's Avatar
    yeah, saw this earlier but these guys just picked up the article..


    Need Proof of Verizon’s Galaxy Nexus? | AndroidGuys
    I don't mind the 4G logo on the rear of the phone, I will never see that, and would have a case over it anyways, but the front is the most important, and if it does say "Verizon Wireless" in the notification bar, that's pretty crappy
    10-19-2011 01:07 PM
  8. ottscay's Avatar
    So are you insinuating that VZW will be the first carrier to load bloatware on a Nexus device? First carrier to lockdown a Nexus device?

    I really think you are making a much to do over nothing. Kinda "Chicken Little" if you ask me.
    I hope you're right.

    Outside of P3Droid indicating something was up (but not yet panic-worthy) on Twitter and the admittedly sketchy rumor over at NFC Rumors, a Verizon insider that leaked stuff to Phandroid also said things were very tense between Verizon and Google/Samsung over this phone right now. So it's not like I'm making it up - and if it turns out everything is alright, then I'll be delighted to be wrong about my concern.
    10-19-2011 01:10 PM
  9. kilofoxtrot's Avatar
    I hope you're right.

    Twitter
    Your 7 paragraph post suggests otherwise.
    10-19-2011 01:14 PM
  10. revickulous2001's Avatar
    OP

    So are you insinuating that VZW will be the first carrier to load bloatware on a Nexus device? First carrier to lockdown a Nexus device?

    I really think you are making a much to do over nothing. Kinda "Chicken Little" if you ask me.
    The photo that shows "Verizon Wireless" in the notification bar already shows that the "pure Google experience" has been tampered with. Clearly, VZW has at least splashed their logo around the place.

    Hopefully, that's the extent of the damage (or that was just there for the marketing during the event). But nothing with VZW surprises me. If any carrier out there would pollute Nexus, it's Verizon.
    Wiggy0211 likes this.
    10-19-2011 01:16 PM
  11. ottscay's Avatar
    Your 7 paragraph post suggests otherwise.
    It suggests that I'm concerned your confidence is misplaced. I still hope you're right.
    10-19-2011 01:23 PM
  12. kilofoxtrot's Avatar
    Could the "Verizon Wireless" in the notification bar be a carrier indicator and not "branding" per se?
    10-19-2011 01:23 PM
  13. Zorachus's Avatar
    Could the "Verizon Wireless" in the notification bar be a carrier indicator and not "branding" per se?
    Good point, my Nexus-S 4G does show the name "Sprint" in the pull down notification bar, and I am rooted with AdFree. Never really noticed it before.
    10-19-2011 01:25 PM
  14. ottscay's Avatar
    Hopefully, that's the extent of the damage (or that was just there for the marketing during the event). But nothing with VZW surprises me. If any carrier out there would pollute Nexus, it's Verizon.
    That's how I feel too (obviously). I don't personally really care about the branding on the back, but it just reinforces my larger concern that Verizon may be trying to strong-arm this. After all, Samsung and Google have a lot to lose if Verizon decides not to carry it.
    10-19-2011 01:25 PM
  15. revickulous2001's Avatar
    Could the "Verizon Wireless" in the notification bar be a carrier indicator and not "branding" per se?
    That is a good point. Very possible.
    10-19-2011 01:26 PM
  16. Blitzdroid's Avatar
    I think verizin haven't announce galaxy nexus yet because they just announce razr. Go to verizon website and razr is promoted and advertised. Verizon has always been big on advertising the motorola droid series.

    The nexus might only get a pr statement a week before release and that's it.
    10-19-2011 01:32 PM
  17. qnet's Avatar
    I agree that the Verizon in the notification just may mean that's the carrier it's on. If that's all there is, along with the 4G LTE symbol on the back, that's not a big deal to me.

    The Motorola Xoom is pure Google so, I don't see why they wouldn't allow the GN to be. They have plenty of other phones with their branding on it.
    10-19-2011 02:06 PM
  18. SuperTongue's Avatar
    It wouldn't make much sense for Verizon to not want this phone on their network either. Verizon has just as much to lose as Google and Samsung would if the deal were to fall through.

    This phone is huge for everyone. I'd be thoroughly surprised to not see it hit Verizon in November considering the whole "Verizon Wireless" branding on the promo video and such.

    I think we all need to take a chill pill and relax. Verizon won't decimate the Nexus brand with bloatware either. This thing will literally print money for all three companies, so it makes no sense for one to back out. At all.
    MetalPhoenix79 likes this.
    10-19-2011 02:22 PM
  19. racedog's Avatar
    I believe that everyone has the right to make their ideas known on these forums. While I read quite a few I choose to respond to only a few and to be OP on even fewer.

    The OP has the right to his opinion as stated in the opener here but the logic is such a total outlier that it seems to be approaching paranoia. I've read his comments in other threads and in each one he keeps putting out the idea that VZW is actively scheming and plotting to thwart this phone and even the very idea of a "Nexus" device and will possibly not even carry the phone, but if they do, they may be adding their bloatware to it or at least some of it.

    I think a number of things about VZW based on the time I've been with them (only two years) and some of it isn't pretty. But what is being put out in here is just weird - and not in a good way!
    10-19-2011 02:31 PM
  20. ottscay's Avatar
    I've read his comments in other threads and in each one he keeps putting out the idea that VZW is actively scheming and plotting to thwart this phone and even the very idea of a "Nexus" device and will possibly not even carry the phone, but if they do, they may be adding their bloatware to it or at least some of it.
    I'm sorry, but you clearly have not read my comments in other threads very closely. I have never once suggested that Verizon won't carry the phone. I've actively supported the idea that the phone is coming to Verizon since the news was leaked here on AC months ago (Phil has an excellent trackrecord). In September I noted several times that Verizon actually seemed to want to position the Galaxy Nexus against the iPhone 4S, and was even anticipating perhaps a bigger marketing push by them (although their presence at the RAZR launch might suggest that phone is their bigger priority).

    All I was doing here was noting that several people with good track records (and a couple of sites with less than good track records) have indicated that Verizon isn't thrilled with how things have gone down, and may be negotiating to try and Verizon-ize the phone a bit more. I've always said they were rumors, but some of them are from people with good track records. If it is true, by the time we find out it really would be too late, so I thought it would be worth a discussion now so people could share their support for a true Nexus/Google experience on the Verizon version.

    I'm not sure why you think it's bizarre - it's not like any of it is new; Verizon has been doing this sort of thing for years, on pretty much every smartphone they've shipped outside of the iPhone. It's not some sort of crazy conspiracy theory, it's just a way of life at Verizon. Nor am I trying to rain on the ICS parade - I think this is the largest and best overhaul of their operating system (maybe any mobile OS) yet. I'm just not confident that Verizon can leave well enough alone.

    But hopefully they will. Some sort of consumer awareness would help.
    10-19-2011 02:50 PM
  21. Averix's Avatar
    Not sure if anyone has posted this yet, but looks like Samsung is confirming Verizon out of the gate.
    https://www.facebook.com/SamsungMobi...50317622831786
    10-19-2011 02:58 PM
  22. ottscay's Avatar
    I think it's been pretty well confirmed that Verizon would get it first in the U.S. - glad to see Samsung confirming it today.
    10-19-2011 03:01 PM
  23. kilofoxtrot's Avatar
    IVerizon has been doing this sort of thing for years, on pretty much every smartphone they've shipped outside of the iPhone. It's not some sort of crazy conspiracy theory, it's just a way of life at Verizon.
    Its not a crazy conspiracy... its a conspiracy theory.

    If Apple can do it, why cant Samsung/Google? Apple has broke the mold, there is no reason Samsung/Google cant either.

    There is too much at stake for Google to ****-off the developer community by allowing Verizon to brand/bloat a Nexus device IMO.... and it would **** them off. You dont think Google realizes this?

    If Verizon has any aspirations of opening their own app store (ala Amazon), I would think they would let the dev community keep their Nexus unbranded just as other carriers have done in the past.

    Who is the bigger dog here? Google or Verizon?

    "You see, your absence last night was noticed." ... I noticed it too.... and I think Verizon wasn't there because they cant brand the phone. Between the Nexus, RAZR and HTC Rezound, the Nexus will get the least "love" of the 3... for the that very reason... a lack of VZW branding on the Nexus.

    I guess we'll find out soon enough... I hope I am right... and what you fear is not the case.

    Cheers.
    10-19-2011 03:21 PM
  24. ottscay's Avatar
    If Apple can do it, why cant Samsung/Google? Apple has broke the mold, there is no reason Samsung/Google cant either.
    Absolutely. The question is whether Verizon would try to shove the geni back in the bottle, rather than allow more openness.

    There is too much at stake for Google to ****-off the developer community by allowing Verizon to brand/bloat a Nexus device IMO.... and it would **** them off. You dont think Google realizes this?
    Here we may differ a little - given the marketing we've seen so far, I think the Galaxy Nexus is the first serious attempt by Google to push the Nexus brand into the mainstream. The best way to reduce fragmentation would be for consumers to want to own a Nexus. That's not to say that I disagree with you - I'm sure Google very much wants a VZW Nexus to be as untouched as every other Nexus. But given Verizon's history, P3Droids comments about Verizon's absence "meaning something", and a Verizon insider on Phandroid explicitly mentioning tension between them and Google/Samsung, I was concerned that Verizon might try to play hardball to win the right to massage a bit of VZW into the Nexus.

    If Verizon has any aspirations of opening their own app store (ala Amazon), I would think they would let the dev community keep their Nexus unbranded just as other carriers have done in the past.
    Verizon already has its own app store. It's installed on my Droid X this very moment - it was installed "for me" when I got the Gingerbread update. As I said in my letter, if Verizon wants to do these things they should concentrate on making them attractive on their own (much as Amazon has succeeded in doing), but much of Verizon's history shows their preference for using their leverage to control what you can and cannot get to. That's a fact of the history of their smartphones, not a conspiracy.

    Who is the bigger dog here? Google or Verizon?
    That's a good question. The carriers certainly were bigger dogs back when they blocked the Nexus One from being sold the way Google wanted them to. But the market has changed since then, so it's not clear (to me at least) now. How much pressure Verizon feels depends directly on how many of GNs they think will sell, and what sort of contractual obligations are written in stone.


    I guess we'll find out soon enough... I hope I am right... and what you fear is not the case.
    Cheers.
    Indeed. And I really hope you are right.
    10-19-2011 03:39 PM
  25. greydarrah's Avatar
    If Apple can do it, why cant Samsung/Google? Apple has broke the mold, there is no reason Samsung/Google cant either.
    The reason Apple could do it is because they only have ONE phone. If verizon wanted to carry it, they had to bow to Job's ways. That's not the case with Android. There are a bunch of different Android phones that verizon can market. The truth is that there are only a tiny percentage of users (I'd guess less than 1%) that actually care about having a "pure vanilla" experience. I still don't think verizon is going to drop its bloat practices for those very few people. I'm guessing that we'll see a different version of this phone (loaded with bloat and not called a nexus) some time later. But I could be wrong.
    ottscay likes this.
    10-19-2011 04:00 PM
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