Can Verizon legally cancel and restart an Edge agreement after an original agreement?

[Moo Cow]

Long story short, because even my brain hurts as I try to figure out the math...

-- I "Edge up" from the Maxx to the Turbo in December. With a bill print date of December 15th due on January 10th (and from hereon out, I'm referring to the due date for ease), I would pay the taxes and first Edge payment.
-- February 10 and March 10 I make Edge payments.
-- April 10 there was no Edge payment. Odd. I know they gave me like a $60-some bill credit on the screen itself nobody could answer when I called the call center at least twice, and I admit I never checked my bill to see no Edge payment because I was fixated on a mysterious discount.
-- For May 10, I am told that something somewhere somehow (they theorized a purchase I made, didn't like, and returned) triggered a cancellation of my Edge agreement, so they had to restart it all over and recharge me for everything. They claim every dime I invested into the Edge on the January-March bills was refunded, including taxes, and now I have a large bill to restart it all, but I'd have to sit down and do the math on the five bills due in 2015 and see if it's true or BS.

My thing is, when I did the Edge agreement in early December, I had to verbally over the phone make statements and all that jazz to agree to the Edge agreement. I agreed to a contract at that time. Isn't cancelling like they did and then restarting it without notifying me against any rules? I checked my receipt inbox, I got a receipt saying in December I agreed to the Edge, but nothing in 2015 at all. So now instead of my terms being starting in December and going for two years, it is now May going for two years. Nobody notified me at all the Edge agreement ended, cancelled, whatever, and then restarted. Nobody.

One question I have is if what they did was wrong, then wouldn't paying the May 10 bill essentially accept the new contract? It's not that I don't want to pay for the phone and data service I used, but at the same time... well, look, something doesn't add up here and I don't want to be screwed over, know what I mean?

It's all so confusing and my brain wants to explode. Meanwhile, off to find the terms of agreement for the Edge program...

 

[Rukbat]

-- For May 10, I am told that something somewhere somehow (they theorized a purchase I made, didn't like, and returned) triggered a cancellation of my Edge agreement, so they had to restart it all over and recharge me for everything. They claim every dime I invested into the Edge on the January-March bills was refunded, including taxes, and now I have a large bill to restart it all, but I'd have to sit down and do the math on the five bills due in 2015 and see if it's true or BS.

Whether it's true or not, "they theorize" isn't admissible as evidence when you sue them, they have to present proof that something canceled the contract or they're in breach.

As far as paying a bill, a bill can be due upon receipy, it cvan't be due before receipt, so if they fail to send you a bill, or the postal service fails to deliver it (and they do - they guarantee to make their best effort to deliver, they don't guarantee delivery), it's not due. They'd have to present a signed receipt showing that you received the bill (which most utilities don't ever do, so they have to accept the consequences of choosing an uncertain delivery method).

(I've actually seen a letter carrier running in a heavy rain, trying to get to the portico of the next building, bag bouncing, when a few envelopes fell out of the bag and into a puddle. He didn't slow down, didn't retrieve them - nothing. If they were bills, they never got delivered.)

See if a local attorney is interested in taking Verizon on. (One letter will probably have their legal department ordering their billing department to revert you back to the original contract - and hand in someone's resignation immediately after that. One little national news story about the fact that they cancel contracts at will could cost them millions in lost customers.)

Oh, to answer your original question - unless it says in your contract that Verizon has the right to change the terms of the contract without notifying you and allowing you to cancel it without penalty, they can't just change it. The FTC isn't happy when a company does that, and Washington is bigger than Verizon.

 

[Moo Cow]

Whether it's true or not, "they theorize" isn't admissible as evidence when you sue them, they have to present proof that something canceled the contract or they're in breach.

As far as paying a bill, a bill can be due upon receipy, it cvan't be due before receipt, so if they fail to send you a bill, or the postal service fails to deliver it (and they do - they guarantee to make their best effort to deliver, they don't guarantee delivery), it's not due. They'd have to present a signed receipt showing that you received the bill (which most utilities don't ever do, so they have to accept the consequences of choosing an uncertain delivery method).

(I've actually seen a letter carrier running in a heavy rain, trying to get to the portico of the next building, bag bouncing, when a few envelopes fell out of the bag and into a puddle. He didn't slow down, didn't retrieve them - nothing. If they were bills, they never got delivered.)

See if a local attorney is interested in taking Verizon on. (One letter will probably have their legal department ordering their billing department to revert you back to the original contract - and hand in someone's resignation immediately after that. One little national news story about the fact that they cancel contracts at will could cost them millions in lost customers.)

Oh, to answer your original question - unless it says in your contract that Verizon has the right to change the terms of the contract without notifying you and allowing you to cancel it without penalty, they can't just change it. The FTC isn't happy when a company does that, and Washington is bigger than Verizon.

I am paperless billing so I am not getting stuff and pitching it. I go digital with my bills. So I got the bill. That isn't in question.

I never did receive a contract other than in my digital inbox, I have a generic thing saying I signed up for Verizon Edge in December. I didn't get one for this so-called reboot. So I have no contract at all to refer to and I'm pretty much feeling screwed.

If they have the right to cancel and restart my contract, don't I have the right to go in and turn in my phone and demand they give me my old phone (well, an equivalent) back? I just can't shake this feeling that if I pay my May 10 bill, that I'm agreeing de facto or whatever to this new reboot of the contract, and that's not right.

 

[dpham00]

I would try Verizon executive relations first before a lawyer.

http://forums.androidcentral.com/showthread.php?p=4400769

Sent from my Pearly White Verizon Samsung Galaxy S6 Edge

 

[Moo Cow]

I would try Verizon executive relations first before a lawyer.

I don't trust Verzion after the stunt they pulled on me! - Page 2 - Android Forums at AndroidCentral.com

Sent from my Pearly White Verizon Samsung Galaxy S6 Edge

I did that before to resolve an issue and it was resolved... until this snafu came out of absolutely nowhere. I did contact them this time around, and no response as of yet. Last time it was rather quick and extremely effective. This one? Not so much. Don't know why.

So, basically, since I no longer have the time or energy during the week to deal with stuff (12 hours total invested in work a day can be draining, and then I need family time), and because my bill is due next weekend, I either get an amicable fix somewhere, somehow from Verizon this weekend, where I can stand back and say, "Yes, I am upset, but they did do this as sincere apology instead of 'Screw you, we did this so take it and shut up'", or I'm going T-Mobile.

Each move has it's pros/cons, I've weighed them carefully, I've read everything I can read -- I did so the last time I had a Verizon issue, and not much has changed. Today's issue is principle. They did pay me back the money (allegedly) that was invested, but it is principle of the matter. You don't restart something without notifying someone and then shocking them with a bill that is larger than expected. That's just bad business.

 

[Moo Cow]

So Saturday, after a round trip and visit of 60-90 minutes total to a Verizon store, where a guy called his boss' boss on a home number, here is what happened in theory, yet to be confirmed, but 99 percent plausible.

I had a previous ordeal (I discussed it here) where I turned in my Maxx for the early Edge to the Turbo and Verizon lower levels claimed it was lost and charged me $300 for it and corporate had to wipe that charge off as it promised in fixing the fiasco. So corporate did side with me and overruled the call center and it proves contacting corporate does help IF you know darn well you have the facts to back it up.

Anyway, the Maxx phone then turned up as a found phone in March, before the bill due April 10 was printed on March 15, and I remember being alerted of this. The April 10 bill had no Edge charge and all the money previously invested in Edge over three month's worth was refunded in various ways. I did go back and check all my bills yesterday and came within $1.47 of this -- and that was Verizon paying me that in tax difference. I was close enough and my brain was cramping so I indeed said close enough. What the call center rep claimed to me on Friday was true; all of my Edge money was returned to me.

So the finding of the supposedly lost phone has triggered the computers to redo my Edge agreement automatically. That is the theory.

The amicable resolution was that I was refunded all taxes on my phone on my May bill so I'd have a normal bill. I would then agree to effectively restart my contract in essence, even if it shows I started in December with the original purchase. It keeps me at my normal bill price, and of course doesn't affect the ETFs or contract end dates of the others on my plan. Plus we are on a grandfathered Nationwide plan (minutes over X amount charged, double the data promotions) cheaper than what is out there now, and while T-Mobile would have compared if I switched, it is still money saved over T-Mobile to stay put. (And less money than any other share everything-type plan on the market we would have considered -- Sprint was not an option for us for our own reasons.)

With that said, when it comes time and ETFs are either very negligible or contracts are done for the others, and I am all that is left, then if we wish to switch at that time, we will pay off my phone as the ETF (since you don't have a old school contract under Edge except price of the phone you owe still), and go wherever. If VZW customer service gets cleared up, we will not rule them out, but we won't be diehard loyal either. We will cross that bridge when we come to it again, as deep down, I expect we will. VZW customer service has gone rapidly downhill in six months. And that can happen everywhere, but let us see if this storm FINALLY can calm down as apparently this Turbo has caused more havoc than anything ever before.

So that is that. They also do not have a fine print contract for their Edge agreement so I never did find out if this situation was legal or not, and a lack of a contract that's printable detailing the fine print is concerning. It puts the customer at a disadvantage. Mine got resolved to both sides agreeing, but what about the next guy down the line? Pretty much if you can't use bills they print to prove a point, you're screwed. That's my take anyway.

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[oscarnyc]

To be fair, Verizon has 100mm customers, under dozens of different plans, and your situation was rather unique and it isn't hard to see how it threw the computers into a tizzy. And they did refund the money.
It sucks that it drained time from your life and added unnecessary aggravation, but I don't see it as a particular indictment of Verizon customer service.

Posted via Android Central App

 

[ahamick]

I had something very similar happen with my wife's note e to note 4 edge up.

She pre ordered the note 4 back in October as an early edge up from her note 3. When she received her new note 4 she shipped the note 3 back in the provided shipping bag and label.

Verizon sent the note 3 back since the imei numbers did not match (she required a warranty replacement months prior due to a faulty usb port, so the original imei was different and Verizon Never updated their system regarding the warranty replacement) after a few phone calls and shipping labels the note 3 was shipped and never seen by is again, wife goes on using her new note 4.

Fast forward to last month we get hit with a $300 extra on our bill. The bill claimed the 300 was a payoff for the rest of the note 3 balance and that the note 4 had only received 2 edge payments out of 24!

Customer service claimed it was a computer glitch and that they should have it fixed in a week or so. I'm still waiting for the return call from CS to confirm the issue was resolved...

Posted via Android Central App

 

[dpham00]

I had something very similar happen with my wife's note e to note 4 edge up.

She pre ordered the note 4 back in October as an early edge up from her note 3. When she received her new note 4 she shipped the note 3 back in the provided shipping bag and label.

Verizon sent the note 3 back since the imei numbers did not match (she required a warranty replacement months prior due to a faulty usb port, so the original imei was different and Verizon Never updated their system regarding the warranty replacement) after a few phone calls and shipping labels the note 3 was shipped and never seen by is again, wife goes on using her new note 4.

Fast forward to last month we get hit with a $300 extra on our bill. The bill claimed the 300 was a payoff for the rest of the note 3 balance and that the note 4 had only received 2 edge payments out of 24!

Customer service claimed it was a computer glitch and that they should have it fixed in a week or so. I'm still waiting for the return call from CS to confirm the issue was resolved...

Posted via Android Central App

You would have to call in again if not fixed. Or escalate to executive Relations.

Sent from my Pearly White Verizon Samsung Galaxy S6 Edge