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    JeffDenver's Avatar
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    Default Majority of Android phones are not "junk" phones

    The average sales price of an Android phone is around $300 right now. The One+1, a phone with flagship specs, sells for $300. That means the average Android consumer can now afford a flagship Android device.

    IDC data shows 66% of Android's 81% smartphone share are junk phones selling for $215

    Windows Phones sell for about the same price. Contrary to popular belief, Android marketshare is not driven by cheap phones. The best selling Android Devices are high end, not low end, phones.
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    z33dev33l's Avatar
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    Default Re: Majority of Android phones are not "junk" phones

    Quote Originally Posted by JeffDenver View Post
    The average sales price of an Android phone is around $300 right now. The One+1, a phone with flagship specs, sells for $300. That means the average Android consumer can now afford a flagship Android device.

    IDC data shows 66% of Android's 81% smartphone share are junk phones selling for $215

    Windows Phones sell for about the same price. Contrary to popular belief, Android marketshare is not driven by cheap phones. The best selling Android Devices are high end, not low end, phones.
    Windows Phone has a phone that sells for $50 lowering that average drastically, especially with it being the highest selling Windows Phone device by a long shot.. Most people aren't getting the Oneplus for $300, they're getting mostly junk phones and the occasional Nexus in that price range and of course the best selling individual devices are the high end, those are the only ones people know about. However, there are many more phones on the low end that people pick up without concern for brand and the like.
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    Default Re: Majority of Android phones are not "junk" phones

    Quote Originally Posted by z33dev33l View Post
    Windows Phone has a phone that sells for $50 lowering that average drastically
    Oh gee, you seem to be suggesting that "cheap" does not necessarily mean "junk". omg imagine that.
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    Default Re: Majority of Android phones are not "junk" phones

    Quote Originally Posted by JeffDenver View Post
    Oh gee, you seem to be suggesting that "cheap" does not necessarily mean "junk". omg imagine that.
    That term was used by the website, not me. That said, most budget Android handsets do not have a GPU accelerated UI, no update map, very little support, all that jazz. Motorola seems to genuinely want to change that now that there is an Android version that can operate better on low-end hardware and I wish them well in that regard.
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  5. #5  

    Default Re: Majority of Android phones are not "junk" phones

    You should probably define "junk".

    My assumption in this context is that "junk" = an OEM's non-flagship devices.
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    z33dev33l's Avatar
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    Default Re: Majority of Android phones are not "junk" phones

    Quote Originally Posted by Ry View Post
    You should probably define "junk".

    My assumption in this context is that "junk" = an OEM's non-flagship devices.
    I wouldn't say that, junk is a phone that lacks support and lacks features that make the phone usable (For instance, my cousin's "junk" galaxy S Centura started having memory issues when she'd installed nothing but Facebook and Tumblr)
  7. Thread Author  Thread Author    #7  
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    Default Re: Majority of Android phones are not "junk" phones

    Quote Originally Posted by z33dev33l View Post
    That term was used by the website, not me. That said, most budget Android handsets do not have a GPU accelerated UI, no update map, very little support, all that jazz. Motorola seems to genuinely want to change that now that there is an Android version that can operate better on low-end hardware and I wish them well in that regard.
    Any Android phone can have a GPU accelerated UI...just enable it in developer options. I have it enabled on all my devices (ASUS Transformer tablet, HTC Rezound, Galaxy Nexus, Samsung Galaxy S3, ect..). I have noticed no impact on battery life. And I don't know for a fact that the Moto E does not already use the GPU for UI acceleration. But even if it doesn't, it can still have it, like any Android phone.
  8. #8  

    Default Re: Majority of Android phones are not "junk" phones

    I think this data could suggest that the lower price point phone market is becoming more and more disposable. People with limited incomes or needs are buying up more prepaid packages that include phones and network service and ditching land line service or buying phones
  9. #9  
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    Default Re: Majority of Android phones are not "junk" phones

    Quote Originally Posted by JeffDenver View Post
    Any Android phone can have a GPU accelerated UI...just enable it in developer options. I have it enabled on all my devices (ASUS Transformer tablet, HTC Rezound, Galaxy Nexus, Samsung Galaxy S3, ect..). I have noticed no impact on battery life. And I don't know for a fact that the Moto E does not already use the GPU for UI acceleration. But even if it doesn't, it can still have it, like any Android phone.
    Android as a whole wasn't able to have a fully GPU accelerated UI until Ice Cream Sandwich so I know that's not the case and either way it has to be programmed specifically for the chipset for it to function in full. That's where most of the early android lag arguments stemmed from, the lack of that. Now, it's just general lag.
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    Default Re: Majority of Android phones are not "junk" phones

    Quote Originally Posted by z33dev33l View Post
    Android as a whole wasn't able to have a fully GPU accelerated UI until Ice Cream Sandwich so I know that's not the case
    Whats not the case? ICS and above has been the majority of Android phones for a while now. At least a year.
    File:Android historical version distribution - vector.svg - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    As of right now, Jellybean and above is on the vast majority of Android devices. My $40 tablet I bought from Microcenter before Christmas had Jellybean installed, and has GPU acceleration.
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    Default Re: Majority of Android phones are not "junk" phones

    Quote Originally Posted by JeffDenver View Post
    Whats not the case? ICS and above has been the majority of Android phones for a while now. At least a year.
    File:Android historical version distribution - vector.svg - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    As of right now, Jellybean and above is on the vast majority of Android devices. My $40 tablet I bought from Microcenter before Christmas had Jellybean installed, and has GPU acceleration.
    It's still not the case for all phones. Also, I just checked into the Hardware acceleration that you can enable there. It is to be used within apps that don't use it.

    The reason Android has a choppy UI is because of the way the framework was laid down in like, what? 05? It was basically created where touch takes the same priority as every other bit of processing whereas both Windows Phone and iOS use what's called Real Time Processing which sets the touch on a higher priority than the other processing. Now, with your higher end Android phones, they often have the ram to mostly compensate for this minus a few hiccups but the lower end models don't.
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    Default Re: Majority of Android phones are not "junk" phones

    Quote Originally Posted by z33dev33l View Post
    It's still not the case for all phones. Also, I just checked into the Hardware acceleration that you can enable there. It is to be used within apps that don't use it.
    I know for a fact this is false. I have tested it myself. The difference is dramatic and immediate in the regular UI. It's not just used within apps.

    My Asus Tablet feels like new after enabling it. It is faster than it has ever been.

    The reason Android has a choppy UI is because of the way the framework was laid down in like, what? 05? It was basically created where touch takes the same priority as every other bit of processing whereas both Windows Phone and iOS use what's called Real Time Processing which sets the touch on a higher priority than the other processing. Now, with your higher end Android phones, they often have the ram to mostly compensate for this minus a few hiccups but the lower end models don't.
    Whatever the reason, it does not apply anymore. Even low end phones have roomy amounts of RAM now. Even the Moto E has a gig.
  13. #13  
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    Default Re: Majority of Android phones are not "junk" phones

    Quote Originally Posted by JeffDenver View Post
    I know for a fact this is false. I have tested it myself. The difference is dramatic and immediate in the regular UI. It's not just used within apps.

    My Asus Tablet feels like new after enabling it. It is faster than it has ever been.
    Outside of the general UI that is quite likely, that'd be acknowledging that there was lag prior to that though. Hmm...

    Quote Originally Posted by JeffDenver View Post
    Whatever the reason, it does not apply anymore. Even low end phones have roomy amounts of RAM now. Even the Moto E has a gig.
    $139 is not low end for everyone though. Sure, it's a decent price for a smartphone but there are several cheaper offerings with 512 and even 256 MB of ram. Also, dependent on the background activity, 1 gig of ram isn't going to be enough to counteract this in a lot of situations.
  14. Thread Author  Thread Author    #14  
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    Default Re: Majority of Android phones are not "junk" phones

    Quote Originally Posted by z33dev33l View Post
    Outside of the general UI that is quite likely, that'd be acknowledging that there was lag prior to that though. Hmm...
    On my Asus tablet? Of course there was lag. The hardware is almost 2 years old and it was polluted with LG's UI. Why would it be a surprise that it had lag?

    $140 is low end by anyone's standards. And you can get them lower than that anyway.
    Moto G $99 - Best Buy Selling Off-Contract Moto G for $99 | News & Opinion | PCMag.com
    Moto E $130 - Amazon.com: Motorola Moto E - Global GSM - Unlocked - 4GB (Black): Cell Phones & Accessories
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    Default Re: Majority of Android phones are not "junk" phones

    Quote Originally Posted by z33dev33l View Post
    Outside of the general UI that is quite likely, that'd be acknowledging that there was lag prior to that though. Hmm...



    $139 is not low end for everyone though. Sure, it's a decent price for a smartphone but there are several cheaper offerings with 512 and even 256 MB of ram. Also, dependent on the background activity, 1 gig of ram isn't going to be enough to counteract this in a lot of situations.
    For instance, the highest selling smartphone on Straight Talk is the galaxy I mentioned earlier, the Galaxy Centura. It has 512 megabytes of ram and it's absolute torture to use. Sure, it's an older phone but it's still heavily advertised and pushed through Straight Talk so it is relevant.
  16. #16  

    Default Re: Majority of Android phones are not "junk" phones

    Quote Originally Posted by z33dev33l View Post
    For instance, the highest selling smartphone on Straight Talk is the galaxy I mentioned earlier, the Galaxy Centura. It has 512 megabytes of ram and it's absolute torture to use. Sure, it's an older phone but it's still heavily advertised and pushed through Straight Talk so it is relevant.
    Its also being used by people who won't care as long as their phone works and had access to the apps they use.

    Posted via Android Central App
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    Default Re: Majority of Android phones are not "junk" phones

    Quote Originally Posted by A895 View Post
    Its also being used by people who won't care as long as their phone works and had access to the apps they use.

    Posted via Android Central App
    As stated above, she downloaded Facebook and Tumblr and was already getting errors that the memory was almost full and frequent force closes.
  18. #18  

    Default Re: Majority of Android phones are not "junk" phones

    Quote Originally Posted by z33dev33l View Post
    As stated above, she downloaded Facebook and Tumblr and was already getting errors that the memory was almost full and frequent force closes.
    From what I see from Straight Talks website, they have a lot of phones around the Centuras price point, why didn't she spring for those? I found at least 2 that had better specs with a ~$50 price difference from the Ventura. Did you not advise into this situation? I would have gotten her a Lumia 520 before that POS device.

    Posted via Android Central App
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    Default Re: Majority of Android phones are not "junk" phones

    Quote Originally Posted by A895 View Post
    From what I see from Straight Talks website, they have a lot of phones around the Centuras price point, why didn't she spring for those? I found at least 2 that had better specs with a ~$50 price difference from the Ventura. Did you not advise into this situation? I would have gotten her a Lumia 520 before that POS device.

    Posted via Android Central App
    I got her into the Lumia 521 soon after thanks to a $40 sale. She barely has any income working fast food as a 16 year old with scummy parents. She wanted a phone and it was the cheapest one they had at Wal Mart that was a smartphone and she'd heard the Galaxy name so she figured it was good.
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    Default Re: Majority of Android phones are not "junk" phones

    Since Project Butter touching the screen ramps CPU up to increase UI responsiveness.

    That has nothing to do with the amount of RAM.

    Also, memory equals RAM, not storage.

    Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Tapatalk
  21. #21  

    Default Re: Majority of Android phones are not "junk" phones

    This is getting heated!! Nice!!

    Posted from Google Nexus 5
  22. #22  

    Default Re: Majority of Android phones are not "junk" phones

    I saw it coming the minute z33 and Jeff showed up in the same thread. <3
  23. #23  
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    Default Re: Majority of Android phones are not "junk" phones

    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin O'Quinn View Post
    Since Project Butter touching the screen ramps CPU up to increase UI responsiveness.

    That has nothing to do with the amount of RAM.

    Also, memory equals RAM, not storage.

    Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Tapatalk
    Yes, it also upped the hardware specs considerably. Project Svelte, introduced in Kit Kat is the one that made Android usable on low end handsets. It's still highly based on what you have in the background though as Android, as you stated in another thread, utilizes true multitasking. There are still several games that will send you back to feeling like you're using Cupcake.

    The fact of the matter is, prior to the Moto G, the handsets one could afford for under $210 were limited at best. That's what made the Moto G such a big deal for Android user. It was functional and low end. Since then, there's been a very minor dip into the water in that regard but most of the $210 handsets out there in Android aren't going to run so well as they'd have to be hardware optimized for Kit Kat, the newest iteration of Android with comparably light adoption thusfar.

    I believe this statement talks about Project Svelte best.

    "The first thing that I was working on was Project Butter to make the system smoother," explained Google Head of Engineering Dave Burke in an interview with ReadWrite. "The thing is, butter puts on weight. So then I did Project Svelte to lose weight. So now my contribution to Android is basically zero."
    The way they ultimately did this is by giving the developers access to procstats which gave developers deeper access to their apps CPU usage and by stripping Google Play services from the OS and making them standalone apps instead because one of the most RAM-hungry parts of the OS was the Google Play services.

    It's improvement, they are making leaps and strides forward but they're still working on it. Kit Kat was built to work on a 1.4 GHz dual core processor with a qHD screen and 512 megabytes of RAM and any less in any of those regards, you'll still encounter issues. Also, add apps that haven't been modified to adhere to procstats or generally heavy apps, you'll still get a bad experience.
  24. #24  

    Default Re: Majority of Android phones are not "junk" phones

    Quote Originally Posted by z33dev33l View Post
    Yes, it also upped the hardware specs considerably. Project Svelte, introduced in Kit Kat is the one that made Android usable on low end handsets. It's still highly based on what you have in the background though as Android, as you stated in another thread, utilizes true multitasking. There are still several games that will send you back to feeling like you're using Cupcake.

    The fact of the matter is, prior to the Moto G, the handsets one could afford for under $210 were limited at best. That's what made the Moto G such a big deal for Android user. It was functional and low end. Since then, there's been a very minor dip into the water in that regard but most of the $210 handsets out there in Android aren't going to run so well as they'd have to be hardware optimized for Kit Kat, the newest iteration of Android with comparably light adoption thusfar.

    I believe this statement talks about Project Svelte best.



    The way they ultimately did this is by giving the developers access to procstats which gave developers deeper access to their apps CPU usage and by stripping Google Play services from the OS and making them standalone apps instead because one of the most RAM-hungry parts of the OS was the Google Play services.

    It's improvement, they are making leaps and strides forward but they're still working on it. Kit Kat was built to work on a 1.4 GHz dual core processor with a qHD screen and 512 megabytes of RAM and any less in any of those regards, you'll still encounter issues. Also, add apps that haven't been modified to adhere to procstats or generally heavy apps, you'll still get a bad experience.
    And all of that means better performance on devices that have KitKat low or high end. In the end consumers will barely notice the difference really. We talk about how fast things feel on the web but in real life, the changes are minimal to the average consumer.

    Posted via Android Central App
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    Default Re: Majority of Android phones are not "junk" phones

    Quote Originally Posted by A895 View Post
    And all of that means better performance on devices that have KitKat low or high end. In the end consumers will barely notice the difference really. We talk about how fast things feel on the web but in real life, the changes are minimal to the average consumer.

    Posted via Android Central App
    Lag is something that most everyone notices regardless of your walk of life and is something you won't find on other OSes due to the way they manage memory. Either way, that helps all of two percent of Android users as per the chart posted earlier and even then, it does little to help when a skin like Touchwiz is lobbed over Android lessening that number even more.
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