Droid Turbo: Lollipop software update?

[mobrules]

Not sure how you have to fight hard to keep UDP. It's not hard at all to keep unlimited.

Ry, they made it very difficult actually. Had to visit 2 stores and call customer service 3 times. I was trying to use other line upgrade to get it and then switch it to my line. They did not make it easy and I couldn't afford to buy it outright. Even had one store tell me they refused to sell it full price even if I wanted to.
Needless to say I got it. I usually use between 10 and 15 gb monthly. So I get my money's worth I feel.

 

[doogald]

Network performance/bug fix update seems more important than going up a full version of the OS.

Could you link to where Motorola was ready to submit 4.4.2?

Yep. https://plus.google.com/+DavidSchuster/posts/Dfpjj3F2K6T

Again - why not put the network update into the 4.4.2 build rather than make Motorola update it on the current build?

By the way, there is a later comment from David Schuster detailing Verizon requirements that wavered from stock Android, especially regarding the dialer.

There are some questions about getting some of the features (dialer for example) from Android upgrades for the 2013 DROID's. The DROID family in general have some specific requirements from the carrier that we are required to fulfill. Our Moto X, G and now E line is much more of a "pure" android experience. To answer the question about dialer specifically, this is one area that the DROID family does NOT use the same solution from stock Android, so we are required to maintain the existing dialer look and feel in the DROID line

So, Motorola needed to spend extra time to unnecessarily bring JB features to KK. We'll see if similar things happened with the LP update for the Turbo. I kind of doubt it in this case, as LP looks so much different already from KK, so they may as well go with the full updates from google. (I haven't tried the online simulator yet.)

Probably to prevent customer service calls post-update on "why are my icons not changing color anymore?"

But then they went to white icons with the 4.4.4 release, so why the initial reluctance?

And is the assumption that AOSP 4.4.2 or 4.4.4 would have resolved the problem? Or was the fix rolled into Motorola's fork of the 4.4.4 build?

The bugs as I recall were these: (1) There was a minor bug that made pressing the home key react as if it was pressed twice in a row, making some third party launcher not work right. Yes, it was minor, but I don't think it had anything to do with AOSP, as the Moto X 4.4 build did not have that problem (albeit it had on screen buttons.) I don't think any other phones with hardware home buttons received the 4.4 update - by the time the Samsung phones received KK, it was at 4.4.2, I believe. Some launchers ended up building updates that looked for the Droid and ignored the second home press. Again, this was unpatched for 5-6 months, depending on when you received the 4.4 update. (2). There was a serious bug that caused accounts to log out when your phone lost mobile data service without having another internet connection, such as WiFi, so they prompted you to log in when you regained connectivity. Some people had this happen to them every day, some people had it happen randomly (I had it randomly - it didn't happen every time this happened, but sometimes I went weeks without it happening, sometimes it happened multiple times a week.) As I had four Google accounts on my phone, two of them with second factor authentication, this was an enormous pain in the neck when it happened. I have no idea if this was an AOSP error or just an error with Motorola's radio driver, but it was unfixed with the May update and fixed with the 4.4.4 update.

I think there were more minor bugs, but I can't recall them at the moment.

 

[Ry]

Ry, they made it very difficult actually. Had to visit 2 stores and call customer service 3 times. I was trying to use other line upgrade to get it and then switch it to my line. They did not make it easy and I couldn't afford to buy it outright. Even had one store tell me they refused to sell it full price even if I wanted to.
Needless to say I got it. I usually use between 10 and 15 gb monthly. So I get my money's worth I feel.

Or you can just buy full price or buy used.

 

[Ry]

Yep. https://plus.google.com/+DavidSchuster/posts/Dfpjj3F2K6T

Again - why not put the network update into the 4.4.2 build rather than make Motorola update it on the current build?

Test cycle was probably accelerated for the Network Connectivity bug.

Make sense to me as doing a full test with it rolled into the 4.4.2 based build might have taken longer.

By the way, there is a later comment from David Schuster detailing Verizon requirements that wavered from stock Android, especially regarding the dialer.

So, Motorola needed to spend extra time to unnecessarily bring JB features to KK. We'll see if similar things happened with the LP update for the Turbo. I kind of doubt it in this case, as LP looks so much different already from KK, so they may as well go with the full updates from google. (I haven't tried the online simulator yet.)

But then they went to white icons with the 4.4.4 release, so why the initial reluctance?

Did 4.4.4 also bring in the white dialer?

I suspect Verizon finally understood that there were battery life savings doing to the all white icons.

The bugs as I recall were these: (1) There was a minor bug that made pressing the home key react as if it was pressed twice in a row, making some third party launcher not work right. Yes, it was minor, but I don't think it had anything to do with AOSP, as the Moto X 4.4 build did not have that problem (albeit it had on screen buttons.) I don't think any other phones with hardware home buttons received the 4.4 update - by the time the Samsung phones received KK, it was at 4.4.2, I believe. Some launchers ended up building updates that looked for the Droid and ignored the second home press. Again, this was unpatched for 5-6 months, depending on when you received the 4.4 update.

Was this 100% reproducible? Did it affect the stock launcher?

It doesn't seem like it would be an AOSP issue.

And if Motorola pushed out a fix for it and it just went out as a patch to 4.4 rather than bringing the entire 4.4.2 (or 4.4.4) along with it, I suspect people on the forums would still be upset.

(2). There was a serious bug that caused accounts to log out when your phone lost mobile data service without having another internet connection, such as WiFi, so they prompted you to log in when you regained connectivity. Some people had this happen to them every day, some people had it happen randomly (I had it randomly - it didn't happen every time this happened, but sometimes I went weeks without it happening, sometimes it happened multiple times a week.) As I had four Google accounts on my phone, two of them with second factor authentication, this was an enormous pain in the neck when it happened. I have no idea if this was an AOSP error or just an error with Motorola's radio driver, but it was unfixed with the May update and fixed with the 4.4.4 update.

And this one too doesn't seem like an AOSP project issue. Nexus devices and GPes would have had that issue as well.

And again if Motorola pushed out a fix for it and it just went out as a patch to 4.4 rather than bringing the entire 4.4.2 (or 4.4.4) along with it, I suspect people on the forums would still be upset.

Begs the question -

If you're having issues with your device and the fix isn't explicitly a part of AOSP, would you rather take the bug fix as a patch or do you want OEMs spending the time to roll those fixes into an OS update?

 

[vzwuser76]

Volte on verizon works great on the nexus 6, even when using the non-verizon nexus 6 5.1.1 software. Whatever issues might have existed they cleared up before it hit the nexus 6.

I agree with you and doogald that AC works on the Nexus 6, but it also got it's AC update long after the others AC capable devices got theirs (2 AC updates for the Turbo). I'm thinking maybe there were issues with the earlier AC updates, our first one was last December and a second one in either January or February, while the Nexus 6 AC update didn't come out until I believe April or May. Say the Nexus 6 already had 5.1, and then they sent a modified AC update that works well with 5.1, but on the Turbo they've already got an update that doesn't work well with 5.1 and had to modify 5.1 to make it work. It would be much easier to modify something like an AC update vs an OS update, and modifying 5.1 may be more likely to mess up other stuff in the OS software.

I'm not stating this as a fact, just idly speculating to pass the time.

 

[doogald]

Yep. https://plus.google.com/+DavidSchuster/posts/Dfpjj3F2K6T

Again - why not put the network update into the 4.4.2 build rather than make Motorola update it on the current build?

Test cycle was probably accelerated for the Network Connectivity bug.

Make sense to me as doing a full test with it rolled into the 4.4.2 based build might have taken longer.

It was a network connectivity bug that was rare and affected very, very few customers. It was patched for the Razr/Razr Maxx in January 2014, so the 2013 Droids were updated a full 4 months later. I can't believe that Verizon could not have waited until it was incorporated into 4.4.2. But, again, I'm not Verizon.

The bugs I listed affected far more people - they actually made the Motorola Forums board, even here on Android Central. I never saw a single post on any forum complaining about roaming problems in Toronto on a 2013 Droid (though I'll admit that doesn't mean that Verizon didn't have some customers with this issue.)

As Schuster said, they had a 4.4.2 build ready to test. The network connectivity fix was a very small update. I'm still not sure why they couldn't have waited until the 4.4.2 was ready and incorporate it there instead. I'm not Verizon, but priorities seem weird.

Oh, and now that I think about it, I think that they changed to the white icons with the May update rather than with the July 4.4.4 update...


(I think we've exhausted this topic, though, don't you think?)

By the way, there is a later comment from David Schuster detailing Verizon requirements that wavered from stock Android, especially regarding the dialer.

Did 4.4.4 also bring in the white dialer?

I suspect Verizon finally understood that there were battery life savings doing to the all white icons.

No, it still has the JB dialer. And, as I understand the issue, the all white icons do not save battery. Google not only removed the color with KK, they removed the network traffic animations. It was the animations they said when KK was released that was causing battery issues as much as the color - spending CPU time to update the icons was taking battery resources and stealing CPU cycles that could be used doing something else. Today both the 2013 Droids and the Turbo retain the network activity animations, so they are clearly still not stock.

The bugs as I recall were these: (1) There was a minor bug that made pressing the home key react as if it was pressed twice in a row, making some third party launcher not work right.

Was this 100% reproducible? Did it affect the stock launcher?

Yes, 100% reproducible, yes, it affected the stock launcher. If you moved away from the default home screen (in any launcher) and opened an app (tapping an icon, from the app drawer, from a notification, from a widget), while you were in the app and pressed home, it would go back to the last home screen, and then it would go back to the default - as if you pressed home twice. This affected everybody. (Of course, some people *liked* this behavior - it saved a step for them.) However, that, as you know, is not standard Android behavior, and it affected a launcher like Aviate, which used the home button not to return to default, but to toggle a particular feature. If you pressed home in Aviate, it toggled on, then toggled right back off.

Nova launcher finally released a version that looked specifically for a 2013 Droid and ignored the second immediate button press.

Begs the question -

If you're having issues with your device and the fix isn't explicitly a part of AOSP, would you rather take the bug fix as a patch or do you want OEMs spending the time to roll those fixes into an OS update?

It depends. It doesn't have to be binary, every time must be this way. Is the problem serious? Is there an OS update waiting to roll out anyway? Does the OS update fix the problem anyway?

Right now there are people with Turbos who have some issues with WiFi routers. If they could have patched the problem back in December or January without an OS update - great, they should just have done it if they could. At this point, 8 months on, knowing that 5.1 is in the testing lab, though, I'd rather they spend the time getting 5.1 done and out already.

They've already made that choice with the Turbo. They decided to patch problems with VoLTE (and emergency dialing) and keep 4.4.4 and also decided to wait for 5.1 because AOSP brought native VoLTE support. These are things we know already.

 

[MattRevs]

That's because we're all enjoying our 5.1 lollipop update

You're joking... Right?

Posted via the Android Central App

 

[KPMcClave]

Or..

Updates for the first and second generation Moto X, Moto G, and Moto E are all ahead of it.

Didn't this happen with the 2013 DROIDs too? While it got 4.4 rather quickly, it skipped 4.4.2 and got 4.4.4 later.

I've been pointing that out for quite a while myself. Of course, I'm pretty sure it's now gone much longer than the wait for 4.4.4 on the Maxx.

 

[Ry]

It was a network connectivity bug that was rare and affected very, very few customers. It was patched for the Razr/Razr Maxx in January 2014, so the 2013 Droids were updated a full 4 months later. I can't believe that Verizon could not have waited until it was incorporated into 4.4.2. But, again, I'm not Verizon.

It was a network connectivity bug that was rare and affected very, very few customers. It was patched for the Razr/Razr Maxx in January 2014, so the 2013 Droids were updated a full 4 months later. I can't believe that Verizon could not have waited until it was incorporated into 4.4.2. But, again, I'm not Verizon.

The bugs I listed affected far more people - they actually made the Motorola Forums board, even here on Android Central. I never saw a single post on any forum complaining about roaming problems in Toronto on a 2013 Droid (though I'll admit that doesn't mean that Verizon didn't have some customers with this issue.)

As Schuster said, they had a 4.4.2 build ready to test. The network connectivity fix was a very small update. I'm still not sure why they couldn't have waited until the 4.4.2 was ready and incorporate it there instead. I'm not Verizon, but priorities seem weird.

Affected population is one of the factors when risk assessing a bug/defect. Another is severity. One would think that a Network Connectivity bug would be severe enough that it would need to be addressed sooner than rolling out an Android OS update.

I work for a medical device company that manages medications for hospital systems. If there was an issue were drugs aren't being routed correctly, which I will equate "network connectivity for a mobile phone" to, you can be sure we're addressing that ahead of rolling out our next big system update (we are pretty much on a yearly cycle).

IOh, and now that I think about it, I think that they changed to the white icons with the May update rather than with the July 4.4.4 update...

(I think we've exhausted this topic, though, don't you think?)

No, it still has the JB dialer. And, as I understand the issue, the all white icons do not save battery. Google not only removed the color with KK, they removed the network traffic animations. It was the animations they said when KK was released that was causing battery issues as much as the color - spending CPU time to update the icons was taking battery resources and stealing CPU cycles that could be used doing something else. Today both the 2013 Droids and the Turbo retain the network activity animations, so they are clearly still not stock.

Chalk that up to the DROID line not being the Moto line.

Yes, 100% reproducible, yes, it affected the stock launcher. If you moved away from the default home screen (in any launcher) and opened an app (tapping an icon, from the app drawer, from a notification, from a widget), while you were in the app and pressed home, it would go back to the last home screen, and then it would go back to the default - as if you pressed home twice. This affected everybody. (Of course, some people *liked* this behavior - it saved a step for them.) However, that, as you know, is not standard Android behavior, and it affected a launcher like Aviate, which used the home button not to return to default, but to toggle a particular feature. If you pressed home in Aviate, it toggled on, then toggled right back off.

Nova launcher finally released a version that looked specifically for a 2013 Droid and ignored the second immediate button press.

It depends. It doesn't have to be binary, every time must be this way. Is the problem serious? Is there an OS update waiting to roll out anyway? Does the OS update fix the problem anyway?

Right now there are people with Turbos who have some issues with WiFi routers. If they could have patched the problem back in December or January without an OS update - great, they should just have done it if they could. At this point, 8 months on, knowing that 5.1 is in the testing lab, though, I'd rather they spend the time getting 5.1 done and out already.

They've already made that choice with the Turbo. They decided to patch problems with VoLTE (and emergency dialing) and keep 4.4.4 and also decided to wait for 5.1 because AOSP brought native VoLTE support. These are things we know already.

Home button sounds like an issue that should have been patched immediately.

 

[william gatrelle]

Good luck to updates

 

[vzwuser76]

i love my motorola droid turbo with lollipop software. Lollipop is a good update.

Me too, oh wait....

 

[zen45]

was it released in another country first ?

 

[joe_fresh]

was it released in another country first ?

No, someone was trying to stir the pot.

 

[vzwuser76]

was it released in another country first ?

No, the Motorola Droid Turbo is only available on Verizon in the US. For any areas outside the US, there's the Moto Maxx and it does have LP.

 

[JJ Jones]

YES! Finally got 5.1.1...................……….......... for my Moto 360.

Sent from my Ballistic Turbo

 

[travaz]

Let me ask the collective group here this question. If the Droid Turbo is Verizon's "Flagship" device why do I always get asked when I go into a VZW store if I can be upgraded to an I-Phone? I always put my phone in my pocket so they can't see it and when asked what they can help me with I say I what to shop phones to upgrade. Three different store in the Phoenix area (all corporate stores) all said the same thing like it was a company script. Rep always says "you should check out the I-Phone. " I say no I want to stay with Android. Rep "Oh than check out the S-6" The three reps I talked to all were carrying I-Phones. Most of the staff had I-Phones or S-6. I saw not one Rep carrying a Turbo. I would ask "what about the Turbo" The response I generally get is like "Oh yea they are over here" Very lukewarm response. Is this the way you instruct your sales staff to sell your "flagship" I think Verizon see's it as a loadstone they can't wait to unload so they can get rid of the stock. Also when I do say I have a Turbo they all ask " How do you like it?" And I have to educate them on how it works. I think the S6 and the I-Phone are the "Flagship" for Verizon, hence the lack of update.

 

[Moo Cow]

Let me ask the collective group here this question. If the Droid Turbo is Verizon's "Flagship" device why do I always get asked when I go into a VZW store if I can be upgraded to an I-Phone? I always put my phone in my pocket so they can't see it and when asked what they can help me with I say I what to shop phones to upgrade. Three different store in the Phoenix area (all corporate stores) all said the same thing like it was a company script. Rep always says "you should check out the I-Phone. " I say no I want to stay with Android. Rep "Oh than check out the S-6" The three reps I talked to all were carrying I-Phones. Most of the staff had I-Phones or S-6. I saw not one Rep carrying a Turbo. I would ask "what about the Turbo" The response I generally get is like "Oh yea they are over here" Very lukewarm response. Is this the way you instruct your sales staff to sell your "flagship" I think Verizon see's it as a loadstone they can't wait to unload so they can get rid of the stock. Also when I do say I have a Turbo they all ask " How do you like it?" And I have to educate them on how it works. I think the S6 and the I-Phone are the "Flagship" for Verizon, hence the lack of update.

Speculation from me, nothing more, but those phones are on multiple carriers so maybe they are trying to entice people loyal to those brands to be Verizon or remain as such. Especially when you have T-Mobile buying out contracts and giving those same top phones.

But, wouldn't you also want to promote exclusives so people would want to switch and get that exclusive? Seems like we got an initial marketing litz and Early Edge campaign in November and then it slipped into obscurity. This current promotion of different colors isn't the same as we saw previously.

I am not a marketing exec, and quite frankly, sometimes, it makes no sense what they do. If you know, I'd buy you a beer if you were my neighbor.

Posted via the Android Central App

 

[travaz]

Speculation from me, nothing more, but those phones are on multiple carriers so maybe they are trying to entice people loyal to those brands to be Verizon or remain as such. Especially when you have T-Mobile buying out contracts and giving those same top phones.

But, wouldn't you also want to promote exclusives so people would want to switch and get that exclusive? Seems like we got an initial marketing litz and Early Edge campaign in November and then it slipped into obscurity. This current promotion of different colors isn't the same as we saw previously.

I am not a marketing exec, and quite frankly, sometimes, it makes no sense what they do. If you know, I'd buy you a beer if you were my neighbor.

Posted via the Android Central App

I don't disagree with you at all and I am not a marketing guru either but I think your right to promote the exclusive to entice people to your network. If I can get a I-Phone or S6 on any of the networks I am going to shop price and coverage. If I get all hot and bothered over the Turbo then I have to go to VZW. Also in my opinion VZW and AT&T are more in a battle of retention to keep current customers. When you have 100 million plus customers how many more can you realistically expect to get? I don't know I guess that is why I am not a CEO of VZW or ATT. :-$

 

[PowrDroid]

Let me ask the collective group here this question. If the Droid Turbo is Verizon's "Flagship" device why do I always get asked when I go into a VZW store if I can be upgraded to an I-Phone?

There must be more margin, hence more of a commission for the sales person in the iphone and S6.

 

[mobrules]

YES! Finally got 5.1.1...................……….......... for my Moto 360.

Sent from my Ballistic Turbo

Not nice. Not nice at all.