The Phone wars are over...Samsung just won

[BuffOrange]

Right. Advantage in price does go to the Nexus. Every other possible comparison couldn't be more in the S4's favor.

Everyone talks about how great Stock, Vanilla Android is and why the fast updates make everything worth it. Google gives them a great flagship device with all of these "must-haves" and suddenly everyone thinks it's a bad idea because "the general public wont care." Just goes to show that some people will never be pleased under any circumstance.

Refutes of "phone wars are over" = "this phone will suck and I'll never be happy"?

 

[JeffDenver]

Jeff, I know you're new to Android

If by "new" you mean on Android since the Droid 1, then I agree.

Oh, and please educate yourself a bit before the "get what you pay for comments"

You first. The display and CPU and camera are significantly better. IMO, that is worth the money. The price is completely in line with any flagship phone...so I do not understand all the ******** and moaning over price. Every other flagship phone in the last year came out in the same price range. $650 is completely reasonable. The HTC One and Note 2 are ALSO $650 retail.

You get WAY more, and pay WAY less.

You do not get way more storage. You do not get way more battery life. You do not get better pixel density. You do not get a better camera. You get "way more" display and CPU maybe...but only compared to other $350 phones. But even <$350 phones will have more storage and probably better battery life with extended batteries.

If you want the best bang for the buck, the N4 is still it. I totally agree with that. But if you want the best stock Android experience, the N4 will not be the best. The google S4 will eclipse it in most ways. Often by a wide margin.

The next crop of devices, imo especially the next Nexus, will trump this special edition S4 in every way.

They have not even announced another Nexus device yet. And I am willing to bet Google will, once again, neuter it with no SD and a craptastic embedded battery. I predict HTC will do the same thing because they have chosen to ignore their customers, and will continue their downward spiral into oblivion.

 

[Suda]

Refutes of "phone wars are over" = "this phone will suck and I'll never be happy"?

No. People asking for a device outside of a Nexus to run stock Android = Google partners with Samsung = people still complain and will never be happy. If you look at the responses in this thread and in the other one, the responses are overwhelmingly negative. Why is that? If you're upset about the price then that's fine. But people have been wanting a phone like this but then it gets announced and you have people saying this phone is a mistake by Google and etc., well why is that?

And if there's any "war" (just sounds silly) to occur, it's been this phone and the HTC One. The N4 has been out for months and was meant to go up against last year's flagship phones. Comparing it to a One or S4 isn't exactly an apt comparison, although people want to because it's running stock. The S4/One are supposed to be better.

 

[omniusovermind]

All I got from this post is that is the same feeling I'm getting from seemingly a lot of elitist Nexus owners around the internet, threatened and butthurt. Especially from calling me a "fool" and a "non-Nexi owner", when I've iterated multiple times already that I own a Nexus 4. You can't take it that this phone is better than the Nexus 4 so to feel better about yourself you resort to name calling and dismissing any advantage that this phone has over the N4 by chalking it up as features you don't have to have. If you can't hold a discussion without name calling then don't engage in discussions, or better yet, pick up a passion for politics.

While this isn't a "Nexus" device per se they're one and the same because they both run stock and get updates straight from Google. The only different is the SD support and no on screen buttons. I don't care what Wikipedia has to say, it's not like pages can't be easily edited anyway. It's just easier to type "Nexus S4" instead of Samsung Galaxy S4: Google Edition every time I mention it by name. Nowhere did I make mention of the Nexus 4 having viewable pixels, I said Samsung stepped it up in terms of their pentile displays. It doesn't matter if you turn the gimmicks off, TouchWiz is still a heavy skin. While no one knows how this phone will compare to the N4 because no one has used this phone, I think it's safe to say you'll see better performance since they're both running the same skin but one has a more advanced chip set. That's just common sense. And that's great you can do all that with the cloud, that just means I'll have 80GB of native storage in addition to whatever I use with the cloud if I even choose to use the cloud. You have to use the cloud with the N4 if the space you're left with after the OS takes up some of the 16GB isn't enough.

This phone is just better than the Nexus 4 and if priced in the same range it would sell more than the N4 (not including T-Mobile store sales, although I'm sure the majority of N4 sales have come through the play store). I'm sorry you can't see these things, or yet, refusing to see them.

THANK you. My feelings exactly. N4 owners need to get over themselves. I own the N4 and love it, but it has plenty of flaws. it is far from an ideal google phone IMO.


It is as much a Nexus device as the Galaxy Nexus...which is close enough IMO.


I think the Google S4 will blow away the N4...it will not even be a contest. Even current comparisons have them roughly equal despite the fact that the current S4 is polluted with Touchwiz. Touchwiz is the entire reason the S4 does not already blow away the N4...it's hardware is clearly better in every way.

Way to paint everyone with the same brush people.
But I'll concede that the first poster at least in a round about way agreed that the nexus 4 is better specs for the money charged. (And slightly more diplomatic) I personally can't see myself ever paying $650 for phones anymore because I strongly disagree with the implied inflation agreement between OEMS and carriers

Sent from my (fill in the blank) phone using (fill in the blank software)

 

[Ry]

It is as much a Nexus device as the Galaxy Nexus...which is close enough IMO.

Oh great.

The Galaxy Nexus is a Nexus because Google calls it a Nexus. End of story.

 

[Ry]

Way to paint everyone with the same brush people.
But I'll concede that the first poster at least in a round about way agreed that the nexus 4 is better specs for the money charged. (And slightly more diplomatic) I personally can't see myself ever paying $650 for phones anymore because I strongly disagree with the implied inflation agreement between OEMS and carriers

Sent from my (fill in the blank) phone using (fill in the blank software)

Sounds like you should only by Blu phones. Or maybe you should buy the parts and build your own phone.

Do you get angry when you go out to eat and it only costs the restaurant 15 cents on the dollar to make your food?

 

[Suda]

Way to paint everyone with the same brush people.
But I'll concede that the first poster at least in a round about way agreed that the nexus 4 is better specs for the money charged. (And slightly more diplomatic) I personally can't see myself ever paying $650 for phones anymore because I strongly disagree with the implied inflation agreement between OEMS and carriers

Sent from my (fill in the blank) phone using (fill in the blank software)

I never said all N4 owners. I even prefaced by saying "a lot", I don't speak in absolutes because not everyone is the same. And it was mostly in regards to the responses I've seen on various websites as well as to the person I quoted. There are N4 owners who like this thing but don't like the price and then those that don't care either way. Both are perfectly acceptable. I just don't see how this phone is a bad thing, or why one would feel the need to put it down when we hardly know anything about it or say it's a mistake on Google's part.

That last part is in reference to comments I've seen around the internet yesterday, not necessarily anything said here.

 

[TheLibertarian]

The "market" will respond to the new S4 well. All you have to do is talk about all the extra features the S4 will have *with* stock Android and viola... They get lost in it and forget about why they need a *phone* in the first place. I can just hear it now, "Well my phone does this... Blah blah blah."
IMO, stock android in a flagship phone within the galaxy series and samsungs name, is really the best Smartphone around.
Oh, and most people are already paying that much for their phones except in the span of 2 yrs, er 24 mos.

Nexus 7|Android Forums

The market won't even notice this device exists.

Let's take ten seconds now and talk about the "extra features" you mention that stock Android has over Touchwiz. Because I can't think of any.

Do you know what stock Android is?

This phone is just better than the Nexus 4 and if priced in the same range it would sell more than the N4 (not including T-Mobile store sales, although I'm sure the majority of N4 sales have come through the play store). I'm sorry you can't see these things, or yet, refusing to see them.

But, back to reality, it's NOT priced like the Nexus 4.

Not only will this device likely have a minimal impact on the entire of Samsung's S4 sales, but one simply cannot ignore the $300 premium price over another phone that it's being sold next two.

I think you'll be hard pressed to find a general consumer than heads to the Play Store (that in itself would be rare) and compares the Nexus 4 and S4 side-by-side and agrees that the S4 is $300 more of a device. Because it's not.

But, the Samsung enthusiasts will rejoice.

I just hope Google works out this type of arrangement with other major Android manufacturers, it would be great to see a half dozen devices exist directly supported by Google.

In the way that Neo was given the red pill and his eyes were opened, so Google should open the eyes of the general public.

 

[ConTejas]

But the developer support that matters are the developers making apps/games, not the developers making ROMs.

I disagree. If you see how much faster, smoother, and better on battery my N4 is than stock while running Franco's kernel(s), you'd understand (one example). He's already said "no way' to developing for the GES4. Not wasting $650 on a device he will never use was his exact quote. I'm willing to bet that's what most developers think. The resounding laughter after they announced the $650 pricetag at Google I/O says so.

Suda, Jeff - First of all, Suda, I'm guilty of not reading the threads. "Fools" was not harsh, and not directed soley at you..it was directed at all, including you, that refer to this GES4 as a Nexus. Now...LOL I'm a huge fan on the Nexus, the program has EARNED that over the years...and I've owned non-Nexus devices at the same time. You're on a tech site, so we talk tech, but I'm certainly not elitist in any way. I offered you my opinion, based on facts that you don't like or disagree with, so you call me a name. I am guilty of turning a few real life persons on to Nexi devices, but all in all, I only talk about this stuff here. My N4 is not stock. The AOKP PUB (project unicorn butter) is regular AOKP compiled with Bionic/Krait (S4 Pro) optimizations and the linaro toolchain. This is thee reason why a GES4 will likely be slower even running vanilla Android. It will not get that kind of developer support. Software > hardware. I proved this to myself owning a LTE gnex and SGS3 at the same time. Same rom, but optimized kernel on the Gnex, and it SMOKED my SGS3 despite its hardware advantage. Call me elitist, ok, I'll take it as a compliment

 

[Suda]

But, back to reality, it's NOT priced like the Nexus 4.

Not only will this device likely have a minimal impact on the entire of Samsung's S4 sales, but one simply cannot ignore the $300 premium price over another phone that it's being sold next two.

I think you'll be hard pressed to find a general consumer than heads to the Play Store (that in itself would be rare) and compares the Nexus 4 and S4 side-by-side and agrees that the S4 is $300 more of a device. Because it's not.

But, the Samsung enthusiasts will rejoice.

I just hope Google works out this type of arrangement with other major Android manufacturers, it would be great to see a half dozen devices exist directly supported by Google.

In the way that Neo was given the red pill and his eyes were opened, so Google should open the eyes of the general public.

We're basically going in circles with stuff that has already been repeated by others and even myself ad nauseum. There's not much Google can do about a price subsidy because this was an independent project by Samsung with Google piggybacking with the software, so it's Samsung's price. And it's the same price as an original S4 unlocked, so everything is fair. It's not hard to see why someone would choose this over a Nexus 4 if price isn't an issue, it's not hard to see why someone would choose the N4 over it if price is.

It's not meant for everyone, it's only meant for those who've wanted something like it. And that's what keeps getting lost.

 

[TheLibertarian]

We're basically going in circles with stuff that has already been repeated by others and even myself ad nauseum. There's not much Google can do about a price subsidy because this was an independent project by Samsung with Google piggybacking with the software, so it's Samsung's price. And it's the same price as an original S4 unlocked, so everything is fair. It's not hard to see why someone would choose this over a Nexus 4 if price isn't an issue, it's not hard to see why someone would choose the N4 over it if price is.

It's not meant for everyone, it's only meant for those who've wanted something like it. And that's what keeps getting lost.

We have been going in circles, but I think that's your best summarizing post.

I agree with that.

 

[ConTejas]

Once again caught not reading the post. You guys are easily offended. I wouldn't dare talk politics, religion, or about anything of importance with either of you. Chill out. Made a post with facts and opinions, and all you read was insults. Who needs to grow up? LOL. Super sorry about the "non-Nexi owning fools" comment.

Last thing, I've been talking specifically about my N4. I've already said I don't think the N5, which will likely have the 800 cpu, will be any faster than MY N4, becuase you can't get any faster than "instant." I'll get it because I want it, that's all.

 

[Ry]

I disagree. If you see how much faster, smoother, and better on battery my N4 is than stock while running Franco's kernel(s), you'd understand (one example). He's already said "no way' to developing for the GES4. Not wasting $650 on a device he will never use was his exact quote. I'm willing to bet that's what most developers think. The resounding laughter after they announced the $650 pricetag at Google I/O says so.

But what's the direct result of a ROM developers work? A small subset now have a custom ROM on their phone. So what now? What comes out of it? Do those get checked back into the AOSP source to make Android better?

In the grand scheme of things, ROM developers are largely irrelevant to the masses that continue to buy into Android. The apps matter. Without them, smartphones would be dumbphones.

 

[ConTejas]

But what's the direct result of a ROM developers work? A small subset now have a custom ROM on their phone. So what now? What comes out of it? Do those get checked back into the AOSP source to make Android better?

In the grand scheme of things, ROM developers are largely irrelevant to the masses that continue to buy into Android. The apps matter. Without them, smartphones would be dumbphones.

Absolutely. That's the beauty of AOSP. I will offer that the percentage of Nexi running custom software is pretty high. Perhaps not as high on the N4 as it's much more mainstream than previous Nexi, but it's still a developer and/or techy device. BTW there's a difference between ROM and kernel devs. Kernel devs are more likely to be electrical engineers for starters, the rest is technical.

 

[Suda]

Hands-on with the Samsung Galaxy S 4 running stock Android 4.2

It'll be a big bummer if it doesn't have any of the gesture features while still having all the sensor to operate the features. If that's the case then I can't really justify buying it. But I suppose if it had those features then it wouldn't be pure. It is a pre-production model so fingers crossed I guess.

 

[omniusovermind]

Sounds like you should only by Blu phones. Or maybe you should buy the parts and build your own phone.

Do you get angry when you go out to eat and it only costs the restaurant 15 cents on the dollar to make your food?

I'll take that ridiculous jab to mean you don't have anything.

Sent from my (fill in the blank) phone using (fill in the blank software)

 

[TheLibertarian]

Hands-on with the Samsung Galaxy S 4 running stock Android 4.2

It'll be a big bummer if it doesn't have any of the gesture features while still having all the sensor to operate the features. If that's the case then I can't really justify buying it. But I suppose if it had those features then it wouldn't be pure. It is a pre-production model so fingers crossed I guess.

I wouldn't expect it to, that's TouchWiz, not stock Android.

That's what one user was complaining about, that the device costs near as much as a standard GS4 but lacks all the software innovation that TouchWiz brings.

 

[Suda]

I wouldn't expect it to, that's TouchWiz, not stock Android.

That's what one user was complaining about, that the device costs near as much as a standard GS4 but lacks all the software innovation that TouchWiz brings.

Yep, sucks. I was of the impression that since it'll have the same sensors that it'll still be able to run those features out of the box. Guess not, although there maybe a kernel somewhere down the line to activate it if need be.

 

[scorpiodsu]

Hands-on with the Samsung Galaxy S 4 running stock Android 4.2

It'll be a big bummer if it doesn't have any of the gesture features while still having all the sensor to operate the features. If that's the case then I can't really justify buying it. But I suppose if it had those features then it wouldn't be pure. It is a pre-production model so fingers crossed I guess.

I mean people can't say on one hand Touchwiz sucks but then be upset if Vanilla doesn't have the same features. That's the point to Samsung and HTC having their skins on the devices.... so they can offer features that Google does not provide. Unfortunately, we can't have our cake and eat it to when it comes to these things. I guess Samsung's "bloat" is good for something, huh?

 

[Suda]

I mean people can't say on one hand Touchwiz sucks but then be upset if Vanilla doesn't have the same features. That's the point to Samsung and HTC having their skins on the devices.... so they can offer features that Google does not provide. Unfortunately, we can't have our cake and eat it to when it comes to these things. I guess Samsung's "bloat" is good for something, huh?

Is this in reference to me? I have an S4 and TouchWiz is my preferred OS right behind stock. I obviously knew Samsung Hub and all thing like it would be left out, but this phone has the same front facing sensors as the TouchWiz S4, unless those aren't really sensors and are only there to match the original S4 with the aesthetics. I don't why I'm disappointed as this means I get to save $650, but I am.