Nexus 10 2013 or Windows Surface 2

[GreatCanadian]

Hello folks,
For the past couple of months I have been researching diligently for a new tablet. My current tablet is the Blackberry Playbook, but my eyes want a bigger tablet. I have narrowed it down to the N10 and Surface 2 for a variety of reasons that I won't get in to. Let's just say I don't need suggestions to get an iPad, Asus Transformer, or whatever other tablet that might be suggested. It's the N10 or the Surface 2. I know the N10 2013 isn't out yet, but it will be at least as good as the current, but more than likely a bit more powerful. So here's how my thinking goes, along with a few questions:

1.The N10 screen. I have seen it and it's AWESOME. I have not seen the Surface 2 screen, but hear that even though it has a lower ppi, it's still a great screen. So I can't pick a winner there as I have not seen the Surface screen.
2. I need to run Citrix Receiver. Can either of these do it?
3. I need to be able to edit Office documents. I know I can do this on the Surface, but is there a good (decent) android app for that as well. I'm assuming there is.
4. I keep reading about "android issues" with regard to the N10 (rebooting, lagging, wi-fi, etc). I realize that this may not be the majority of users experiencing this, so I don't know how much I should be concerned.
5. Video: I like to watch a movie every now and then. Don't care about sound as I use headphones. Which tablet plays the greatest variety of formats (if I need an app I'll get an app).
6. I'm not a gamer, but who's to say that I might not want to give it a shot. I don't care about the number of games available as I know Android blows Windows out of the water there. But I'm also certain that Windows will have a suitable selection for me to try.
7. I don't care about app selection. If I did I'd go Apple.
8. My main use will be web browsing, email, a little bit of facebook, a bit of twitter, and skype. Don't care about instagram.
9. I work with computers all day long, and when I relax at night I want a trouble-free experience. I have read about some lagging on both Surface and Nexus 10, some freezing on Surface, some reboots on N10. Of the current N10 and the Surface 2, which should be the most trouble-free.
10. I like the expandability of the Surface (MicroSD) but am also aware that there's a workaround for the N10. I use Cloud storage so I'm not overly concerned. However Remote Desktop is available on Surface I believe?? How about N10. That is a feature I would certainly make use of.

So, any comments? I need to get my order into Santa ASAP I'm told. I know a lot of the answers you can give will have to be based on the current N10 as the new one hasn't been released. But when it is, if it has the rumored 3 GB RAM, and the Snapdragon 800 processor, then I am thinking I will jump all over it. Would that be wise?

Either way, if the N10 isn't released in the next week (or at least details), my mind will have been made up. I will be getting the Surface. I am the type that suffers terribly from Buyer's Remorse!!

I realize this is an Android forum so I've posted in the Windows forum as well.

Thanks for any advice you can offer.

GC

 

[Joey_C]

I've been doing a crazy amount of research on this as well but I haven't ruled out the iPad Air.

Here's my line of thinking-
After holding the Surface 2 at 1.5 lbs it just doesn't seem like it would be as comfortable as holding the N10 refresh (rumored to be less than 1.25lbs. It might not seem like a big difference but for some reason it is like the 1.5lb surface is just outside of the long term couch/bed comfort range.

I feel similarly to you about apps, there aren't too many that i use on my first gen iPad that are critical to me to have. Dropbox, twitter, wordpress, feedly, and the suite of google apps are all pretty much cross platform so that isn't the deciding factor.

I love the idea of the usb and expandable micro sd card slot on the surface but when I really think about the way i use my current tablet (the iPad) I use it 95% for consumption. I create content on my desktop or my laptop. The tablet IMO is firstmost a convenient couch/bed/travel device.

If you didn't have access to a laptop or desktop for the heavy lifting when you need it I'd buy the Surface 2 but if you did and you mainly seeing yourself using the device for the couch/bed/travel companion I'd buy the Nexus 10 refresh which will be lighter and easier to hold.

If they shaved .25 lbs off the Surface 2 I wouldn't hesitate getting that.

You ought to go to a Best Buy and feel both devices in your hand before you make a decision and ask yourself how you truly seeing yourself using the device. After reading the surface 2 user reviews on Best Buy's website they all like the device but a recurring gripe is the awkwardness to hold. To me I don't care how functional it is, if it is not comfortable to hold for long periods I might as well buy an ultrabook.

If the N10 refresh isn't announced and available tomorrow I'm gonna grab a 32GB iPad Air.

 

[GreatCanadian]

Thanks for the comments. Good points made. Like you, I am not going to wait much longer for the N10 2 announcement. Also like you, a tablet for me is firstly a couch device, but I would appreciate productivity features as well.

 

[Joey_C]

You probably already know this but if you already have a Microsoft live account they say that once you log on all your settings are ported over seamlessly on the Surface.

 

[GreatCanadian]

No I didn't know that. I don't have a Live account. I've used strictly google for my mail, calendar, etc.

 

[kitkatpaintjob]

No matter what, if u go non android u won't have android.... So. What's the question and what is this windows thing u speak of

Sent from my HTCONE using AC Forums mobile app

 

[snake2332]

In my Android-bias opinion...

1) N10 (original and 2013) screen will still be quite a bit better due to the pixel density and possibly other factors
2) Yes Citrix Receiver exists on Android. I haven't tried it in a couple years. Hopefully they improved it because it wasn't too great back then. Citrix Receiver Beta has 4 stars and 100,000+ downloads.
3) Yes there are multiple competing Android apps that can edit & create Office documents
4) Nexus 10 (2013) will likely have great community support to squash any unlikely flaws that would cause things as major as random reboots or bad lag
5) Not sure about Windows RT apps, but for Android, MX Player plays all the video formats I have. It's the best media player and is free. Check it out here: https://sites.google.com/site/mxvpen/features I'm sure Android will always have an app to play any format you could want. Where there is a need, there is almost always an app.
6) Not sure about Windows RT game selection, but it would probably be ample for you it sounds like. If you want to play games with your friends, you'd probably want an Android device over Windows RT, though.
7) Android app selection is often times better than Apples, so I wouldn't be so quick to knock it. There are some iOS games that don't have iPad versions, so they look like absolute garbage on iPads because iOS sucks at scaling (Draw Something, an app with over 10 million downloads, didn't have an iPad version so we get to play it in 1024x768 with giant pixels). On the other hand, Android scales all apps beautifully, though some developers are still behind-the-times and don't design stuff well for WQXGA screens like the N10's so you end up with tiny buttons or tiny fonts, but again that is only with crappy developers so it only affects more obscure apps.
8) OK...all tablets will do these things. I don't know which is better, but I imagine the apps are pretty similar.
9) Both are pretty trouble-free. I haven't seen Windows RT reliability stats, but it's been proven that iOS apps actually crash more than Android apps, and Nexus devices are the most reliable of all Androids, so any Nexus device is a safe bet. However, the new 4.4 version of Android might see some apps having issues dealing with the new OS until the devs update the apps. Random reboots aren't likely and might be the sign of bigger problems like hardware issues and you might want to replace the tablet. I wouldn't worry about lag with the N10 (2013).
10) Yes RDP is available in several apps including free ones like 2X Client. You can also use other free apps for remote control like TeamViewer or LogMeIn. Regarding expandable storage, 32GB would probably be more than enough for you if you stream stuff. I wouldn't go with 16GB as that only gives you 10GB of free space (approximately), but again that might be plenty for you if you don't plan on installing multiple GameLoft or EA games (commonly over 1GB each).

What about the Surface keyboard/cover? Does that entice you? That is a big selling point of the Surface line and something the Nexus will surely lack (other than crappy 3rd party ones). All the Nexus devices I've had or read about really lack accessories. The Galaxy Nexus never even got a dock to utilize the pogo pins that were on the device (except for the $70 dock in the UK that didn't fit the LTE version of the GNEX).

What about the USB port available on the Surface? Any need for that?

And what about the Lumia 2520? The case with keyboard + battery + ports sounds pretty wicked, kind of like the ASUS Transformer series. And built-in LTE? That makes it $230 cheaper than an iPad with LTE & 32GB. Plus it has SnapDragon 800 chipset versus Surface2's TEGRA4. Pretty sure the Qualcomm chip running 500mhz faster smokes the TEGRA4 in benchmarks and real-world performance.

 

[snake2332]

Oh also, you may way to wait for the Intel Bay Trail chip to make it into tablets. It's supposedly a great chip and I think it opens up the possibility of dual-booting Windows & Android on the same device and actually doing it well.

Good benchmark here:
http://www.engadget.com/2013/10/08/intel-bay-trail-benchmarks/

Bay Trail can run full Windows 8, whereas the SnapDragon800 & Tegra4 are ARM-based and can only run Windows RT. Kind of a big deal for Windows tablets.

 

[GreatCanadian]

Yes, the Surface keyboard does indeed entice me. Perhaps the only thing for me right now that MAY put the N10 out front is the display. Other than that, I think the Surface (for me) is quite suffice. I want the keyboard, and certainly could use the USB, and I like the MicroSD capability. I guess I have to decide if the trade-off of a 300 ppi screen is worth it.

Ss for the Lumia, I don't want LTE, but that is one beautiful looking tablet!!

Baytrail. Isn't that already in some tablets???

 

[Cobravision]

There is simply no way the Surface 2 screen is going to match the 300ppi screen on the Nexus 10.

Android has many RDP apps. I use Pocket Cloud, but 2X is a good free one. There's even an official MS RDP app.

There are Android apps like Polaris or Documents to Go that will open and edit Word & Excel, but I don't think they can save to docx and xlsx formats.

The biggest complaint about the Surface line is the 16:9 aspect. It's unwieldy in landscape and too skinny in portrait. Also, at 1.49lbs, it's almost a quarter pound heavier than the Nexus 10 spec. Really, anything over 1.3 lbs is just too heavy, and the 16:9 aspect makes it even worse if you want to hold the tablet in landscape in one hand -- because the center of gravity is further out, it feels even heavier.

The Surface 2 (not to be confused with the more expensive and even heavier Surface Pro 2) only runs Windows RT apps. And if you think Android doesn't have enough tablet apps, Windows RT will make you wish you had a Playbook. You cannot install regular Windows compatible programs on the Surface 2. You can on the Surface Pro 2.

I don't know what video players they have for Windows RT, but there are dozens of video players for Android, almost all are free, and they will play practically any codec and format. A couple of them will play DTS audio if you install the codec manually (due to licensing restrictions, none have the codec installed out of the box).

If you absolutely must be able to edit Office 2010/2013 files natively, then Surface 2 is the better option (although I'd spend the extra bucks and get the Surface Pro 2 instead). I can't think of any other reason to go that way other than this one little thing with RDP -- if you are using a keyboard, you cannot Alt+Tab to switch between programs inside the RDP window. Alt+Tab toggles between the Android apps instead. I really hope someone fixes that. If you really want the SD card support, the Note 10.1 2014 edition is also a better option than the Surface 2 (it's even lighter too).

And oh yeah -- Receiver for Android 3.4.13 - Citrix. Straight from the source.

 

[JW4VZW]

I am looking at the Nexus 10, and haven't seen anything too bad about it.

 

[snake2332]

Ya the Bay Trail is in some tablets already, like Dell, HP, and Lenovo (I think). I would just want it for the fact that it's cheap and can run full Windows 8, not just RT. The reason I would want a Windows 8 tablet is for existing Windows apps, personally. Windows RT doesn't entice me at all since it can't run Windows (x86) programs.

 

[GreatCanadian]

@cobravision: You say "There are Android apps like Polaris or Documents to Go that will open and edit Word & Excel, but I don't think they can save to docx and xlsx formats." Whatever format they are saved in, can they be open in Word and Excel after editing in Polaris or Documents to go? I am assuming yes???

@snake: I see your point entirely. I don't really need full-fledged windows. The device would be used for mainly media consumption. With Office and Remote Desktop, I think that would work for me as far as productivity goes.

Yesterday I had made my "final decision" to go with the Surface. Now I'm back on the fence again!! Hoping for N10 specs to be announced today. Can't wait much longer.

 

[minnemike]

For me it just comes down to the fact that I don't want to use windows casually while laying around on a couch. Android fits the bill in that area for me with swipes, touchscreen, etc. and has done it better and for a much longer development time - not to mention the apps available. I do prefer windows for my main office desktop though, as long as the hardware platform is strong enough to power through it.

 

[TMorss]

I have the current Nexus 10 and I just purchase the Surface 2. I am surprised how much I enjoy using the Surface 2. It is actually a really nice tablet the type cover cover really makes it phenomenal. I can run all of my google stuff in a full browser so there really is not much need for the apps. The Gmail syncs to the mail app and the Office Apps work very well. This is coming from a guy who owns 2 Nexus 7 2012 and 2013, Nexus 10, Chrome Book, 2 Chrome Casts, Moto X, and a Nexus 5 on the way. I loooovvveee my Google stuff. But the Surface is just a great product.

As far as the apps the problem Windows RT has is that the Media has beat it up and so people won't give it a chance. This has created a viscous cycle of people not buying it cause they hear of a lack off apps, and developers not making apps because people wont buy it. Try one you will be surprised.

One last thought, if you are all about Google and want a good productivity tool then get a Chromebook.

 

[JW4VZW]

I have the current Nexus 10 and I just purchase the Surface 2. I am surprised how much I enjoy using the Surface 2. It is actually a really nice tablet the type cover cover really makes it phenomenal. I can run all of my google stuff in a full browser so there really is not much need for the apps. The Gmail syncs to the mail app and the Office Apps work very well. This is coming from a guy who owns 2 Nexus 7 2012 and 2013, Nexus 10, Chrome Book, 2 Chrome Casts, Moto X, and a Nexus 5 on the way. I loooovvveee my Google stuff. But the Surface is just a great product.

As far as the apps the problem Windows RT has is that the Media has beat it up and so people won't give it a chance. This has created a viscous cycle of people not buying it cause they hear of a lack off apps, and developers not making apps because people wont buy it. Try one you will be surprised.

One last thought, if you are all about Google and want a good productivity tool then get a Chromebook.

I am considering purchasing a ten inch tablet to replace my Motorola Droid Xyboard. I am leaning towards the Nexus 10, but use Microsoft Office alot. Decisions decisions.

 

[GreatCanadian]

Hello folks. I thank you all so much for your most helpful posts. It was difficult to decide between these 2 great tablets. In the end I've decided on the Surface 2. Again, thanks to all.

GC

 

[coolqf]

I am considering purchasing a ten inch tablet to replace my Motorola Droid Xyboard. I am leaning towards the Nexus 10, but use Microsoft Office alot. Decisions decisions.

If you use MS Office a lot and would like to do it on your tablet, then get the Surface 2. I use Office a lot and Google Docs a lot. The way i divide it is, for personal or team intense documents I use Google Docs, and for business or highly complex documents I use Office.
For sure, MS Office is only practical if you get the keyboard.

An alternative is the Asus T100.

One thing I do love about MS is that they control the updates, which means you get them quicker regardless of the manufacturer.

 

[maj71303]

I have a windows RT tablet and I say I love to use it and don't hardly even pick up my android tablet anymore. The surface has gotten a bad rap from the media for sure that just unjustified. The app thing is overblown as even on my android phone i don't use all the apps on there and can't find many people that do. They just download them because thats what their friend has. Mine is an Asus Windows RT tablet that has at&t mobile access built in so it is extremely mobile and even came with a free keyboard dock. I can't tell you how good it has been to be able to use two apps on the same screen at the same time and be able to truly do what a laptop can do. But it is extremely light and thin and the dock has an extra battery built in and it last me 16 hours one time using it.

 

[snake2332]

If you use MS Office a lot and would like to do it on your tablet, then get the Surface 2. I use Office a lot and Google Docs a lot. The way i divide it is, for personal or team intense documents I use Google Docs, and for business or highly complex documents I use Office.
For sure, MS Office is only practical if you get the keyboard.

An alternative is the Asus T100.

One thing I do love about MS is that they control the updates, which means you get them quicker regardless of the manufacturer.

The T100 is a nice budget tablet w/dock. If you don't mind a low-res screen, it's a great deal at $399 considering you get Office & Windows with it.
If you are leaning more towards Android, the TF701 just came out today on newegg & bestbuy for $449 with no dock ($149). It's screen is basically 4x the resolution of the T100 (WQXGA 2560x1600). The SoC comparison is actually pretty close in the benchmarks I saw. Basically, it seems like BayTrail, Tegra4, and SnapDragon 800 are all pretty close in performance.
The TF701 would cost quite a bit more, but you'd get a little better build quality (build quality was better in the TF700 than the TF701, I hear). Depends on whether or not you can live with Android apps for your MS Office needs, or if you need the full-blown Office apps.

Just thought I'd point out the TF701 since it is probably the closest thing to a Nexus 10 (2013) in existance, plus it's out today and the N10 isn't even official yet.