Help Understanding 2.5mhz and 5mhz bands with Chromcast

[Maximillianrg]

Hello All

My Netgear WIFI Router supports 2.5mhz and 5mhz bands. I have 4 Chromcasts in the home and a Plex Server and am able to stream any move to any Chromcast but sometimes I get some blocks on both my samsung and sharp TV's. I've read that most people can get their Chromcasts working on the 2.5mhz but the Chromcast does not support the 5mhz band and I was curious if someone knew of this was a hardware limitation of the Chromcast or perhaps a firmware update later will fix the issue. My netgear supports 450mbps on the 2.5 but over 1000mbps on the 5mhz and I'd love to take advantage of that if possible.

Thanks

Max

 

[mavrrick]

Don't forget that your 5ghz band that supports 1000gbps+ is using the 802.11ac standard.

The CC uses 150 mbps 802.11n on just the 2.4ghz band. It is capable of a single spatial stream. This is for compatibility reasons.

I thinks for it to also support 5ghz it would need another antenna. There just isn't much room in that little dongle.

Posted via Android Central App on my Note 3

 

[anon(4903109)]

Oh brother... Some corrections people.

802.11n is a connection of 300 Mbps and a single client throughput of 130Mbps

802.11ac is a Gigabit connection (1 Gbps) with a maximum single client throughput of 500 Mbps.

Your router will likely support 2.4Ghz and 5Ghz not mhz.

Chromecast is a silly little device that does not support the 5Ghz due to earlier testing and compatibility... If you have a dual band router, you'll need to keep the 2.4Ghz frequency enabled.


Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

 

[mavrrick]

Oh brother... Some corrections people.

802.11n is a connection of 300 Mbps and a single client throughput of 130Mbps

802.11ac is a Gigabit connection (1 Gbps) with a maximum single client throughput of 500 Mbps.

Your router will likely support 2.4Ghz and 5Ghz not mhz.

Chromecast is a silly little device that does not support the 5Ghz due to earlier testing and compatibility... If you have a dual band router, you'll need to keep the 2.4Ghz frequency enabled.

If you are going to make a point of correcting people please make sure your facts are actually correct.

The 802.11n standard was the first Wifi standard based on MIMO(Multi in Multi out) and allowed for multiple numbers of spatial streams. Each stream ran at a maximum of 150mbps, and the spec allowed for up to 4 spatial streams. That means a max theoretical speed of 600mbps. This was for both 2.4ghz and 5ghz. The problem is that not only does the router have to support multiple spatial streams to get that speed so do your endpoint device. Most devices don't support more then one. That is why it would appear that the connection is limited to 150mbps. If you went out and got a high end wifi card you could potentially see speeds much higher then 150mbps. Very few routers actually ever got the 4x4 configuration though. So most of the time the best could ever see is 450mbps from a laptop or computer very close to the router.

Most portable devices only run with a single spatial stream and so are limited to 150mbps.

the 802.11AC spec is essentially a extension of the N spec only on the 5ghz band. Spec requires Beam-Forming to improve reception and speed. It is also on the 5ghz band because of the increased channels available for channel bonding to increase speed. A single 802.11ac stream can run at 866mbps and can have up to 8 streams for nearly 7gbps. There is no gear that supports the max streams yet though and i think the highest I have seen is 3x3 setup with channel bonding to allow 443mbps per stream. There are some good resources online that explain all of this

Either way the CC's current limitations is all based on compatibility.

The key to remember is all of those speeds are theoretical. In most cases they will all be much lower then that.

 

[anon(4903109)]

If you are going to make a point of correcting people please make sure your facts are actually correct.

The 802.11n standard was the first Wifi standard based on MIMO(Multi in Multi out) and allowed for multiple numbers of spatial streams. Each stream ran at a maximum of 150mbps, and the spec allowed for up to 4 spatial streams. That means a max theoretical speed of 600mbps. This was for both 2.4ghz and 5ghz. The problem is that not only does the router have to support multiple spatial streams to get that speed so do your endpoint device. Most devices don't support more then one. That is why it would appear that the connection is limited to 150mbps. If you went out and got a high end wifi card you could potentially see speeds much higher then 150mbps. Very few routers actually ever got the 4x4 configuration though. So most of the time the best could ever see is 450mbps from a laptop or computer very close to the router.

Most portable devices only run with a single spatial stream and so are limited to 150mbps.

the 802.11AC spec is essentially a extension of the N spec only on the 5ghz band. Spec requires Beam-Forming to improve reception and speed. It is also on the 5ghz band because of the increased channels available for channel bonding to increase speed. A single 802.11ac stream can run at 866mbps and can have up to 8 streams for nearly 7gbps. There is no gear that supports the max streams yet though and i think the highest I have seen is 3x3 setup with channel bonding to allow 443mbps per stream. There are some good resources online that explain all of this

Either way the CC's current limitations is all based on compatibility.

The key to remember is all of those speeds are theoretical. In most cases they will all be much lower then that.

What part of this conversation did we go into talking about high end WiFi cards. The issue is involving Chromecast which does not support 5Ghz and ergo does not support Gigabit wireless. Your facts might be correct in a theoretical sense but as you said in typical situations the output is much lower.

You even went as far as bringing up theory irrelevant to the conversation. Wireless AC is not supported by CC and therefore your point is moot.

My numbers 130mbps and 500mbps are not inaccurate... they are based on averages for devices that only support single stream (you know.. the Chromecast). Please stick to relevance rather than going on into theory irrelevant to the subject matter.

 

[mavrrick]

My response was based directly at your comment regarding needing to make corrections and then being equally inaccurate. I was explaining how the speeds for the various standard was reached and then pointed out exactly how the CC works with them.

This is as much a question about how the wifi standards work as it is about what the CC supports.

Also any assertion on a WIFI standards performance without using the theoretical is a poor choice since wifi is so sensitive to interference. The best thing to realize is the potential and know that is absolute best case scenario.

 

[mavrrick]

I would also add that if you worried about reception one thing you can do is try to minimize the amount of 2.4ghz interference in the house. Anytime you have a dual-band device run it on the 5ghz band. If you don't have a DECT wireless house phone most likely it is running on 2.4ghz. Look at other wireless devices and see what bands they are using. You could also download a app like Wifi analyzer and check what the wifi networks are like around your home. If you see a bunch running on the same channel you are on think about modifying what channel your 2.4ghz band is using in the router.

 

[anon(4903109)]

indeed... many things run on the 2.4Ghz band. Even your microwave lol

I would also note that my numbers are not inaccurate... So to state that I was equally inaccurate would be far from the truth.

 

[mavrrick]

Oh brother... Some corrections people.

802.11n is a connection of 300 Mbps and a single client throughput of 130Mbps

802.11ac is a Gigabit connection (1 Gbps) with a maximum single client throughput of 500 Mbps.

Your router will likely support 2.4Ghz and 5Ghz not mhz.

Chromecast is a silly little device that does not support the 5Ghz due to earlier testing and compatibility... If you have a dual band router, you'll need to keep the 2.4Ghz frequency enabled.

The way the above is stated is done as a mater of fact. Not a opionion.

indeed... many things run on the 2.4Ghz band. Even your microwave lol

I would also note that my numbers are not inaccurate... So to state that I was equally inaccurate would be far from the truth.

There are to many factors to make the blanket statement you did make, and that is why it is very inaccurate and invalid. Not all N gear is 300mbps. If you have the right gear router and device the connection can go much faster. well beyond 130mbps you claim. 802.11ac isn't a Gigabit connection. In most cases a single stream 802.11ac connection will be maxed at 433 (because of channel bonding)or lower depending on how the router is configured.

My issue here is it is bad to make blanket statements that will end up misleading people. Others could read this and take your comments as how it is suppose to be and be very let down when they find out it is more complicated then you are making it out to be.

 

[Maximillianrg]

To begin, I'd like to thank everyone who took the time to respond to my post and secondly, I'd like to apologize the mistakes I made in my post regarding the frequencies. My wife and I live in a large home and I've used Wi-Fi Analyzer on my android phone to validate that I have incredible signal strength in and outside the home. We also have a lot of WIFI devices running in the home and while I was hoping to throw away my boxee box, western digital TV Live, Linksys Media Center Extender and a slew of other media streaming devices and just use the Chromcast / Plex solution, until I can figure out how set up my WIFI network so I do not get the bpixelation on the TV?s while watching movies, the Chromcast may not be the best solution.

My Plex Server has over 1000 movies and I can stream 5 movies at a time over cat5e without having any lag, buffering, or pixalation on the movies what so every. While streaming just one movie to a Chromcast, I will get a very small amounts of pixilation on the screen every 2-3 minutes which will last for about a second.

Right now I?m not using the 5GHZ Band for anything but will set up and see if I can push some of my other devices to it. Any other suggestions would be appreciated. I will admit I was hoping someone would tell me the Chromcast would support the 5ghz band someday.

Sincerely

Max

 

[anon(4903109)]

The way the above is stated is done as a mater of fact. Not a opionion.

Never said it was an opinion.

There are to many factors to make the blanket statement you did make, and that is why it is very inaccurate and invalid. Not all N gear is 300mbps.

Indeed... but again irrelevant when referring to the Chromecast. Please stick to the subject.

If you have the right gear router and device the connection can go much faster. well beyond 130mbps you claim.

Irrelevant once again.

802.11ac isn't a Gigabit connection. In most cases a single stream 802.11ac connection will be maxed at 433 (because of channel bonding)or lower depending on how the router is configured.

It is considered a gigabit connection. You and I both know this is not true in anything other than lab conditions and due to multiple stream compatibility with the end device. I think it is more confusing to go on about theory of the different WiFi standards rather than keeping things more relevant to the question regarding a device that isn't compatible with the standards you are posting about.

My issue here is it is bad to make blanket statements that will end up misleading people. Others could read this and take your comments as how it is suppose to be and be very let down when they find out it is more complicated then you are making it out to be.

I don't think anyone who reads "Chromecast isn't compatible with 5Ghz spectrum" would be disappointed to find out real world speed tests on the 5Ghz spectrum.
All you did was change the direction of the question to irrelevant theory.

 

[anon(4903109)]

To begin, I'd like to thank everyone who took the time to respond to my post and secondly, I'd like to apologize the mistakes I made in my post regarding the frequencies. My wife and I live in a large home and I've used Wi-Fi Analyzer on my android phone to validate that I have incredible signal strength in and outside the home. We also have a lot of WIFI devices running in the home and while I was hoping to throw away my boxee box, western digital TV Live, Linksys Media Center Extender and a slew of other media streaming devices and just use the Chromcast / Plex solution, until I can figure out how set up my WIFI network so I do not get the bpixelation on the TV’s while watching movies, the Chromcast may not be the best solution.

My Plex Server has over 1000 movies and I can stream 5 movies at a time over cat5e without having any lag, buffering, or pixalation on the movies what so every. While streaming just one movie to a Chromcast, I will get a very small amounts of pixilation on the screen every 2-3 minutes which will last for about a second.

Right now I’m not using the 5GHZ Band for anything but will set up and see if I can push some of my other devices to it. Any other suggestions would be appreciated. I will admit I was hoping someone would tell me the Chromcast would support the 5ghz band someday.

Sincerely

Max

Geez dude 1,000 movies?? LOL That's awesome.

I am personally running XBMC on my mini-ITX computer in the living room... I think I have a little over 400 movies. Yeah, I don't have issues with the Cat5e either.

I'm not too sure about the Chromecast device yet and I think it might have a few too many bugs at the moment. Might want to look into a Raspberry Pi Raspberry Pi - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I have a couple friends running with the Pi and so far they say it works great!

 

[mavrrick]

Check your system resources on the Plex Media Server. Look at the cpu when you are streaming. I have a suspicion the problem is the real time transcoding of the content and not the network bandwith.

Another possible solution is fluctuations in wifi bandwith. Video and audio require fairly consistent bandwith. Sometimes wifi fluctuates to much and can cause dropped data which will result pixelation. That is the exact reason i ran Cat5e to my HTPC.

Do you have similar issues with Netflix or Google play movies

One thing to understand is you are comparing the best case scenario (cat5e) to the worst case scenario (wifi). Assuming your devices can provide the data fast enough Cat5e will run consistently at full speed. Wifi on the other hand is like a damn yoyo, and has tremendous fluctuations depending on the environment it is in. That doesn't mean it can't be used, just the setup needs to be a lot more tolerant

Posted via Android Central App on my Note 3

 

[mavrrick]

It is considered a gigabit connection. You and I both know this is not true in anything other than lab conditions and due to multiple stream compatibility with the end device. I think it is more confusing to go on about theory of the different WiFi standards rather than keeping things more relevant to the question regarding a device that isn't compatible with the standards you are posting about.

This actually speaks volumes. Have you ever used gigabit networking. Do you understand the bandwith differences. A gigabit cat5e cable will move at nearly the full 1gbps speed. The only loss in speed is TCP overhead. And most important it is consistent speed. 802.11AC isn't anywhere near that, and to try to tell anyone it is is just ridiculous.

I don't think anyone who reads "Chromecast isn't compatible with 5Ghz spectrum" would be disappointed to find out real world speed tests on the 5Ghz spectrum.
All you did was change the direction of the question to irrelevant theory.

This again says allot because 5ghz spectrum doesn't mean speed. It is the radio frequency the communication is taking place. Other then lack of interference it doesn't mean anything about real world performance. The 5ghz band has existed since 802.11a and was limited to 54mbps then.

The gear makes a big difference and you are making generalizations that aren't accurate.

 

[anon(4903109)]

This actually speaks volumes. Have you ever used gigabit networking. Do you understand the bandwith differences. A gigabit cat5e cable will move at nearly the full 1gbps speed. The only loss in speed is TCP overhead. And most important it is consistent speed. 802.11AC isn't anywhere near that, and to try to tell anyone it is is just ridiculous.

Sir, did you not read my post? I said that in fully aware that AC is not gigabit and doesn't reach gigabit speeds outside of lab conditions.

I never made mention of wireless speed variables either, I'm aware wireless networking is a god damned yo-yo.

This again says allot because 5ghz spectrum doesn't mean speed. It is the radio frequency the communication is taking place. Other then lack of interference it doesn't mean anything about real world performance. The 5ghz band has existed since 802.11a and was limited to 54mbps then.

The gear makes a big difference and you are making generalizations that aren't accurate.

No ****. All I said was that Chromecast doesn't support it.

You need to learn to stick with the conversation rather than going into irrelevant details. Look how vastly you've moved the question to theory about wifi. All the OP asked was whether or not the **** was supported.

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

 

[anon(4903109)]

Responding to you has become tiresome and you will get no further responses from me for it appears you have no understanding of the things that you read.

Your atrocious spelling doesn't move in your favor either. << And this is what we call bringing up an irrelevant point just so you're aware since you seem to have trouble in this category.

Either that or you're really that arrogant. No matter.

OP I hope your media server works out.

 

[mavrrick]

Responding to you has become tiresome and you will get no further responses from me for it appears you have no understanding of the things that you read.

Your atrocious spelling doesn't move in your favor either. << And this is what we call bringing up an irrelevant point just so you're aware since you seem to have trouble in this category.

Either that or you're really that arrogant. No matter.

OP I hope your media server works out.

This has nothing to do with arrogance, and all to do with providing proper information to help others understand. My first response was to the OP and was direct and to the point about compatibility with the CC. After that most of them have been to correct and respond to inaccuracies you keep saying. Pretty much all of the other information was to help you understand how inaccurate your comments were. Either way there is clearly a problem with communication.

I have worked in IT/computer support for over 15 years. To often a problem is a lack of understanding. The point is someone could come and read your comments and very easily get very wrong information. Though your points about wifi are accurate under certain cases they are far from universal, and they were stated as such.

 

[mavrrick]

Max,

Are the video files in HD. Do you know what bitrate of the encodes is. What are the specs of your Plex media Server

 

[mkhilario]

Keep in mind the range of 5Ghz is not as good as that of 2.4Ghz.
I have to change the wifi access point to the 2.4Ghz band on my devices when I am in my bedroom (the router being in the living room). Since my CC is in the bedroom, 5 Ghz compatibility is a moot point for me.

 

[mavrrick]

Beam forming is supposed to help offset that though.

Posted via Android Central App on my Note 3