Is T-Mobile asking OEMs to remove Band 12 support?

[Ry]

Why are manufacturers of unlocked smartphones removing features at T-Mobile’s request? | Pocketnow

Reportedly, T-Mobile doesn’t want phones without VoLTE capabilities using its band 12, citing risks where users may be unable to complete voice calls, despite their handsets indicating strong reception. Rather than allow users of these non-VoLTE handsets to enjoy band 12 data connectivity (even without voice support), T-Mobile is convincing phone-makers to remove their support entirely.

If true, how uncarrier of them..

 

[raino]

Yeah...insane. The customer loses because their choices are limited. Oh, but TMO gets to sell their own b12 phones.

 

[worldspy99]

That sucks but I guess they are trying to mimic what the fruit stand from Cupertino does on the iPhone....

 

[Shilohcane]

It is simple since all T-Mobile Band 12 is 100% LTE. There is no GSM on Band 12 on T-Mobile. Phone that have Band 12 support will lock on Band 12 where it has a strong signal and the person won't be able to make a simple phone call. This is issue is in areas that has strong Band 12 and weak Band 2 or 4 that may have a combination of LTE and GSM. T-Mobile should not put sub-standard phones that don't work 100% on their network that doesn't support VoLTE. T-Mobile is moving to a 100% LTE network as fast as they can but granted it will take a few years to ditch GSM/Units/Edge. There are over 18 phones that support VoLTE with Band 12 so I can see why T-Mobile like Verizon restricts some phones. Other than the Nexus 6 or iPhone, Verizon won't allow any non-branded Verizon phones on their network.

These issues with Band 12, VoLTE and VoWiFi are abilities that T-Mobile wants their customer to have. If a phone won't make a voice call when the phone shows strong signal conection then I can see why T-Mobile doesn't want sub-quality phones on their network.

There are 18 plus phones that does support these features.


Devices compatible with 700 MHz A block spectrum http://www.spectrumgateway.com/compatible-phones

 

[raino]

The 'we care about band 12 markets' customers' line from TMO is a bunch of crock. Why don't they open up voLTE for all band 12 phones' OEMs, then; why only restrict it to phones they sell? Make it available for all unbranded phones. In fact, if customers' coverage is what they're so concerned about, why keep WFC proprietary--surely opening it up will greatly expand call coverage for all customers?

And I have yet to see a proper explanation for why Motorola phones that had their band 12 revoked are "sub-standard" for voLTE/WFC. Here are specs shared by one such phone--the moto G and the LG G Stylo (which is a branded b12 phones that comes with voLTE):

-MSM8916 Snapdragon 410 SoC
-Quad-core processors (moto G's is 1.4 GHz whereas the Stylo's is 1.2...not that it matters)
-1 GB RAM
-Android 5

Motorola also is not an OEM unfamiliar to voLTE/WFC: the Nexus 6 has both.

 

[Shilohcane]

Motorola made a sub-standard phone without VoLTE that doesn't support the two major networks (USCC and TM) that use Band 12 with LTE only.. Moto phones with Band 12 are useless without VoLTE since they don't work in all cases to make a voice call. Moto needs to fix their phones to add VoLTE like other manufactures have that support Band 12 in the USA. Band 12 for the most part is LTE only in the USA. Moto took the easy way out and disabled their Band 12 so it could continue sell it's sub-standard phones to T-Mobile and US Cellular customer.

T-Mobile doesn't want their customers to complain that they have "bars" but can't make phone calls because Moto sold them a cheap sub-standard Band 12 phone. This is a Motorola issue that only Motorola can fix by making a better quality product that supports VoLTE if it going to have Band 12.

 

[Ry]

Motorola made a sub-standard phone without VoLTE that doesn't support the two major networks (USCC and TM) that use Band 12 with LTE only.. Moto phones with Band 12 are useless without VoLTE since they don't work in all cases. Moto needs to fix their phones.

T-Mobile doesn't want their customers to complain that they have "bars" but can't make phone calls because Moto sold them a cheap sub-standard Band 12 phone. This is a Motorola issue that only Motorola can fix by making a better quality product that supports VoLTE if it going to have Band 12.

T-Mobile doesn't sell the Moto E.

The only Motorola phone T-Mobile has is Google's Nexus 6.

MetroPCS doesn't currently list any Motorola phones on their site for sale.

 

[raino]

Motorola phones (E, G) don't have WiFi calling/voLTE because TMO sits on approval like a hen on its eggs. You can't have voLTE/WFC on TMO unless TMO carries the phones (i.e. sells and supports via software updates.)

 

[Shilohcane]

Motorola phones (E, G) don't have WiFi calling/voLTE because TMO sits on approval like a hen on its eggs. You can't have voLTE/WFC on TMO unless TMO carries the phones (i.e. sells and supports via software updates.)

Moto can fix this if they make better quality phone that supports VoLTE like many other phone makers have already done. This is a Motorola only problem that only Motorola can fix by making better phones that meets T-Mobile's higher standards with VoLTE.

VoWiFi is a carrier solution at this point and I can see why T-Mobile doesn't have the time or money to develop the software for every cheap sub-standard phone in the world when there are so many phones that work with VoWiFi today on T-Mobile.

 

[raino]

Moto can fix this if they make better quality phone that supports VoLTE like many other phone makers have already done. This is a Motorola only problem that only Motorola can fix by making better phones that meets T-Mobile's higher standards with VoLTE.

What are Motorola phones lacking in terms of quality, vis a vis voLTE? Which "high" standards are they not meeting that the LG Leon, LG G Stylo (comparable to moto G--see above) and the Kyocera Hydro Wave are meeting?

 

[Shilohcane]

What are Motorola phones lacking in terms of quality, vis a vis voLTE? Which "high" standards are they not meeting that the LG Leon, LG G Stylo (comparable to moto G--see above) and the Kyocera Hydro Wave are meeting?

The LG Leon and LG G Stylo can make voice calls over Band 12's LTE and VoWiFi where the Moto E/G can't. Now with T-Mobile getting VoLTE roaming on other carries network T-Mobile is right to encourage customers to get phones that supports VoLTE and VoWiFi so get the full quality of T-Mobile's networks they are paying for. It not as if T-Mobile is keeping the Moto E/G off it's network they just won't allow the phone using Band 12 since the phone isn't up to T-Mobile's VoLTE standards and will lock up making voice calls under the right conditions. Time for Moto to make a better phone up to T-Mobiles standards.

I will bet the new iPhone 6s will support both Band 12 and VoLTE even if you buy it in the Apple store. Moto just needs to work with T-Mobile and make a higher standard of quality of phone that won't lock up making a voice call when it is connected to T-Mobile's band 12.

 

[Ry]

The LG Leon and LG G Stylo can make voice calls over Band 12's LTE and VoWiFi where the Moto E/G can't. Now with T-Mobile getting VoLTE roaming on other carries network T-Mobile is right to encourage customers to get phones that supports VoLTE and VoWiFi so get the full quality of T-Mobile's networks they are paying for. It not as if T-Mobile is keeping the Moto E/G off it's network they just won't allow the phone using Band 12 since the phone isn't up to T-Mobile's VoLTE standards.

I will bet the new iPhone 6s will support both Band 12 and VoLTE even if you buy it in the Apple store. Moto just needs to work with T-Mobile and make a higher standard of quality of phone that won't lock up making a voice call when it is connected to T-Mobile's band 12.

In the age of BYOD, that's very Uncarrier.

 

[raino]

The LG Leon and LG G Stylo can make voice calls over Band 12's LTE and VoWiFi where the Moto E/G can't. Now with T-Mobile getting VoLTE roaming on other carries network T-Mobile is right to encourage customers to get phones that supports VoLTE and VoWiFi so get the full quality of T-Mobile's networks they are paying for. It not as if T-Mobile is keeping the Moto E/G off it's network they just won't allow the phone using Band 12 since the phone isn't up to T-Mobile's VoLTE standards and will lock up making voice calls under the right conditions. Time for Moto to make a better phone up to T-Mobiles standards.

You're going in circles.

"Motorola phones don't meet the higher standards necessary for voLTE."

"What standards?"

"That they can't make voLTE calls."

"And why is that?"

"Because they don't meet TMO's standards."

Of course TMO wants its customers to buy voLTE phones--it's more revenue for them! All but two phone models are exclusively TMO branded (i.e. sold by TMO.) Plus phones sold by them=higher chance of an EIP being started=higher chance a customer sticks around.

EIPs are the new contracts. #Uncarrier

 

[Shilohcane]

You're going in circles.

"Motorola phones don't meet the higher standards necessary for voLTE."

"What standards?"

"That they can't make voLTE calls."

"And why is that?"

"Because they don't meet TMO's standards."

Of course TMO wants its customers to buy voLTE phones--it's more revenue for them! All but two phone models are exclusively TMO branded (i.e. sold by TMO.) Plus phones sold by them=higher chance of an EIP being started=higher chance a customer sticks around.

You can still use the inferior Moto E/G on T-mobile that you buy on Ebay only it will have Band 12 disabled since it doesn't meet T-Mobile standards.

EIPs are the new contracts. #Uncarrier

Really it is simple you just want to go in circles ignoring the fact that Moto E/G with Band 12 enabled won't even make a simple voice call in some cases. What part of that don't you understand?

 

[raino]

I will bet the new iPhone 6s will support both Band 12 and VoLTE even if you buy it in the Apple store. Moto just needs to work with T-Mobile and make a higher standard of quality of phone that won't lock up making a voice call when it is connected to T-Mobile's band 12.

Yes, because the iPhone 6s will be carried and supported by TMO. Apple has TMO over a barrel, but that's a discussion for another time. TMO just does not allow phones they don't sell to get voLTE or WiFi calling. That's the barrier to entry--Motorola can work all it wants on voLTE and WFC for its phones, but if TMO isn't selling them, they aren't getting the two features. And even if we overlook this, disabling bands is just too ridiculous.

 

[raino]

Really it is simple you just want to go in circles ignoring the fact that Moto E/G with Band 12 enable won't make even a simple voice call in some cases. What part of that don't you understand?

The part where TMO is not only not giving a voLTE capable phone the feature, they are actually asking for the band to be disabled citing those "some" cases. Whatever happened to "the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few?"

BTW, how many of those "some" cases' customers are in an area where they can't roam on other carriers to make their calls, like AT&T for example? Does TMO not want to pay for roaming, is that it? Of course, the problem is also somewhat mitigated by WFC--people making calls over available WiFi networks--but that's another egg the hen likes to sit on.

 

[Shilohcane]

Yes, because the iPhone 6s will be carried and supported by TMO. Apple has TMO over a barrel, but that's a discussion for another time. TMO just does not allow phones they don't sell to get voLTE or WiFi calling. That's the barrier to entry--Motorola can work all it wants on voLTE and WFC for its phones, but if TMO isn't selling them, they aren't getting the two features. And even if we overlook this, disabling bands is just too ridiculous.

Motorola makes that phone that is missing VoLTE not T-Mobile. If Moto wants to T-Mobile to sell their phone they need to make a phone that supports VoLTE. Expecting T-Mobile to put a phone on their network that won't even make a simple voice call when connected is just too ridiculous.

 

[raino]

That is just your opinion and I don't care about your opinion since I know your real agenda.

Opinion? OK. Let's go to facts then. I'll ask you a question I've asked you before:

Name one phone that TMO does not sell or never sold that can do voLTE and WiFi calling on TMO.

 

[Ry]

Motorola makes that phone that is missing VoLTE not T-Mobile. If Moto wants to T-Mobile to sell their phone they need to make a phone that supports VoLTE. Expecting T-Mobile to put a phone on their network that won't even make a simple voice call when connected is just too ridiculous.

Here's the thing... T-Mobile is not selling the Moto E.

 

[Shilohcane]

Here's the thing... T-Mobile is not selling the Moto E.

I know what is your point? Moto doesn't make phones that support VoLTE, so T-Mobile shouldn't sell sub-standard phones that are missing VoLTE by the manufacture. There are at least 18 phones that do support VoLTE now.

No US Carrier that I know of sells Sony phones either.