Update Questions!

[Cwey55]

Surely I'm not the first and won't be the last...

Just got word of the 4.4 update coming out OTA. And have a quick question before I decide to take it or not.

I have rooted using saferoot but still on factory ROM, MK2. All I've done with my root access is delete a bunch of bloatware. Will this cause problems if if I take the update?

I know taking the update will lose root or so I've read, I'm more or less okay with that but wondering if the deleted bloatware will cause problems with the phone during or after updating.

Also should I remove my SD card prior to updating? Read mixed reactions on this.

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[tvouge]

I left my sd card in for the update. Shouldn't be a problem there. As for removing the bloatware--- I don't think it should be an issue. But I honestly don't know. Also, when you bite the bullet, I'd recommend a factory reset. Always do this after a significant update.

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[Cwey55]

I removed my card anyways just to be safe, and then unrooted via the superSU app menu. Then the update failed OTA.

What gives?

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[tvouge]

Hmm. So you're still on 4.3?? If so try to do a reset under that--- it should bring you back the old bloat ware. Once that's up, try the OTA to 4.4 again. Least that's my best guess pal.

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[Cwey55]

I am still on 4.3 MK2. What worries me is I am still getting the unlocked Samsung Custom screen when booting up. I've read before not to do a reset if you're rooted, Root Checker says not rooted but the unlocked custom boot screen makes me think I messed something up while I had root or I missed something in my unroot.

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[tvouge]

This post may help.

http://forums.androidcentral.com/verizon-samsung-galaxy-s4/354610-unroot-verizon-galaxy-s4.html

Sorry I'm not much help here bud. I used to play around a lot more on my Galaxy Nexus, but when they locked the bootloader to the s4 I took of my tinker hat.

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[bigredgonzo]

Typically, if the Bloatware has been removed, the OTA will fail. Do an FDR to bring your bloat back and then try the update. Or...since you are rooted, you could wait for some ingenious dev to bring the stock 4.4 sans bloatware into the world. It usually doesn't take long before those are available.

BigRedGonzo

 

[Glenuendo]

Here is an additional question. After updating, it is safe to root? I have heard some conflicting reports.

 

[Cwey55]

Typically, if the Bloatware has been removed, the OTA will fail. Do an FDR to bring your bloat back and then try the update. Or...since you are rooted, you could wait for some ingenious dev to bring the stock 4.4 sans bloatware into the world. It usually doesn't take long before those are available.

BigRedGonzo

I did a FDR and it didn't bring back the bloatware and I'm still getting the Custom with the unlocked lock on booting up.

Before all this I unrooted (in the superSU app settings menu) and root checker says I do not have root.

I'm thinking I need to re flash stock ROM?

 

[bigredgonzo]

I did a FDR and it didn't bring back the bloatware and I'm still getting the Custom with the unlocked lock on booting up.

Before all this I unrooted (in the superSU app settings menu) and root checker says I do not have root.

I'm thinking I need to re flash stock ROM?

I think you are correct. In the past, I do know that the absence of Bloatware would stop an update. Most of the time, root doesn't bother an OTA upgrade, but root will be lost. To re-root, you have to wait for the devs to develop a new root solution. I would recommend that you flash a stock 4.3 ROM (I assume one exists) with the Bloatware intact. That should allow you to take the OTA, but remember, if you take that OTA, you will lose root. You may also want to check your KNOX counter, if it has your phone branded as "Modified" I don't think you can take the OTA either. Supposedly there were some ingenious devs that developed a root solution that didn't trip KNOX, but since I have stayed away from rooting the S4 (thus far) I am a few steps away from my comfort zone.

To wrap up... Check KNOX condition first, if its tripped, I do not know what you should do other than wait for a Kit Kat ROM from the devs.
If KNOX is not tripped, flash a stock ROM with all the Bloat crap and try the OTA again.

I hope I am being helpful, if not, just say so and I'll stop.

BigRedGonzo

 

[Cwey55]

No this is good, thanks.

I'm not sure how to check my Knox counter, however I do recall seeing something about Knox not being tripped while I was rooting with Saferoot. How do I check my Knox counter? When I open up Knox from my app tray it just says I need to download and set it up. Does this in fact mean it isn't tripped?

To be honest I've been pretty happy with how my phone runs on 4.3 rooted and debloated. I'm just curious as hell and I guess you could say jumping on the 4.4 bandwagon. Maybe I should just stick with 4.3 rooted and be happy and flash myself a good custom ROM. I've got like another year with the phone though...I'd hate to have 4.3 be as good as it gets for another year since I know in due time 4.4 will be easily enough to root and flash ROMs.

 

[MrHost]

The custom bout is showing up because you rooted. You didn't use the root that actually does allow ROM so it didn't trip the Knox thing. Reflashing stock should get you up and the OTA will work then.

I used the same root you did. I didn't even remove it and I updated fine. Removing bloatware is what screwed you up. If you delete the apps an FDR does nothing to bring them back, because they are deleted. An FDR only clears out data and leaves the system alone because it is already secured, unless you root it. It clears DB info and removes anything outside of system including SD if you tell it too.

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[Cwey55]

So all I have to do is odin flash the stock rom and I should be back to normal? I'm assuming xda is the source for that...

Thanks guys

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[bigredgonzo]

In the about phone section of Settings, under Status there is a slot at the very bottom that shows Device status. Official = not tripped, Modified = tripped. Of course, as stated above, if you just rooted with one of the root methods that doesn't trip KNOX, you should be fine by just reflashing the stock 4.3 ROM. There may be a copy out on XDA somewhere, but you should also be able to find the 4.3 stock ROM on SamMobile.

BigRedGonzo

 

[Cwey55]

Ok I just flashed the stock rom with odin using the no wipe method. It did bring back all the bloatware so I should be good to go...

This has been quite the learning experience for this noob...

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[Cwey55]

And now that I did all that work to get rid of the custom boot screen and reflash the stock rom so I could take the 4.4 update.........I'm really not sure I want to take it just yet.......

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[bigredgonzo]

Of course, taking the OTA is completely up to you. I feel as though my phone is running smoother since the update. My battery life is about the same, some folks are reporting better battery life.

BigRedGonzo

 

[tech_head]

just for you noobs. A FDR will NOT ever restore bloatware.
It is a data reset that removes applications, cleans the data and the cache on the phone.
If you remove something in the system, it is gone. Just like if you remove a system file from Windows or Linux, etc.
You delete it and it's gone. You need factory disks to get it back. An ODIN file is the equivalent of a factory disk.

The typical OTA will fail if you have deleted just about any system file.
It will also fail if some files that they check for have been modified.
If the root method leaves the system intact then the OTA can succeed.
If on the other hand the root method is intrusive, like the ones on the S4 have been, you typically need to flash back to stock.
There is no method to root KitKat in place on the phone.
The root method that exists requires a rooted phone on MJ7, MK2, or NC2.
You can go straight from a rooted phone into SS and flash an update.zip, then go into ODIN and fix up the system.
From and OTA you will need to downgrade your system to MK2 in ODIN, root via Saferoot, install SS, then follow the instructions.
Go over to XDA and look at this thread.
[HOW-TO]Upgrade to 4.4.2 VRUFNC5 and keep root (for NC2 and MK2 devices) [05/02/2014] - xda-developers

 

[bigredgonzo]

just for you noobs. A FDR will NOT ever restore bloatware.
It is a data reset that removes applications, cleans the data and the cache on the phone.
If you remove something in the system, it is gone. Just like if you remove a system file from Windows or Linux, etc.
You delete it and it's gone. You need factory disks to get it back. An ODIN file is the equivalent of a factory disk.

...

You are correct, I believe I misspoke in my first post about the FDR. When he originally posted that he "deleted" most of the Bloatware, my brain must have read disabled.

I'll try my best to not make any more mistakes.

BigRedGonzo