Anandtech - "Investigating the Galaxy Nexus LTE Signal Issue"

[Holsum]

I believe that can be explained by the relationship between signal strength and download speeds. The weaker the signal, the slower the download speed. So if you are in a marginal area with weaker 4G signals than milan, that would explain it.

As someone else posted, the way VZW upgraded to 4G LTE was to upgrade some towers in an area to 4G LTE and leave some as only 3G capable. Eventually all will be 4G LTE, but for now, you have spotty 4G LTE coverage except in the major metro areas. The closer you are to the 4G towers, the stronger the signal and the faster the download speeds.

There are other factors you guys aren't taking into affect. Like how many other people are hitting the same tower you are? What is the back haul like for that tower, etc?

The reason some people in NY are seeing 71mbps is because that is a prime convention spot for verizon so obviously it has the latest and great coverage and 10gb backbone pipes to transfer the data.

Where as those that are seeing 8 - 10mbps they might be in high population area with a less robust back plane. There are also other factors like attrition that come in to play when the signal has to travel further distances. It isn't as simple as, “i have 4 bars I should be getting 60mbps“

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk

 

[bplewis24]

It is weird Brandon. As you know my tests were probably more indicative of the results you got in your apartment (another marginal 4G signal area?). Both my Bionic and, particularly my Rezound did a better job holding on to 4G in these marginal areas.

I really don't think mine is defective as each and every VZW store I went into showed very similar performance between their display Nexus and mine. It seems that given locations are very critical in your experiences...not overly surprising.

It's possible that my apartment is a "fringe" area and the other areas I've tested are not. The problem is, since I never considered my Bionic to have coverage issues, I never tested it at my apartment to see what kind of connection it had. I always let it switch over to wireless. Now that I've deactivated the Bionic, I can no longer check.

There is something I can do though. There are 2 blocks where, virtually every time I would drive through with my Bionic, the signal would drop to 3G. I think it is a legitimate fringe area or a dead zone. It's been a few weeks since I've been over there, but I may go over there today with the Nexus and see how it compares.

Brandon

 

[bplewis24]

True the 4g signal seems to get worse indoor on this phone. I can walk outside my work and I will get all full bars and around -85dbm but walk inside 4g connects at around -100dbm and only 2 bars. However I have rooted the phone and with the new leaked radios.

I thought that as well, but at my job the signal is just as strong indoors as it is outdoors. I tested this two days ago at work. I drove to work on 4G and made sure the wireless radio was turned off so that it wouldn't lock in once I got near my office.

I work in a huge building, probably 10,000-20,000 sq. ft. On the way to work I got anywhere from 2-4 bars and it seems like this is a strong-signal area. Standing just outside the building, I made sure to check the signal and run a speed test. I got 3 bars and good test results.

Then I went in the building and into my office, and still got 3 bars. So I decided to go into the bathroom, which is smack dab in the middle of the entire building. 2 bars, good speed results (for me good speed results are between 15 and 30Mbps.

So I decided to go up to the 2nd floor bathroom and test there (yes, by this time I DID look like a crazy person). The result? 4 bars!

I was a bit shocked by two things: Not only did I have one of my strongest signals ever, but the signal appeared to improve being on the 2nd floor. It actually makes me wonder if there is some type of tower very close by, or some signal extender IN the building somewhere near the top of the building.

Brandon

 

[willstilson]

Last night, at around 8pm, I was pulling into a parking lot in Manhasset NY. I was on the phone (headset of course) and as soon as I pull into a space, the call drops. I look at the phone and have no 3G, no 4G, no bars, nothing. Just an empty, grey, right triangle.

I sit there for about a minute, waiting for the signal to come back, so I can call back. It comes back and I have full 4G bars. I check the strength and it is -78 dbm. Thats the strongest I have yet to see with my Nexus. I did a speed test and got 30.67 down and 10.12 up. Thats the fastest I've seen yet, on the Nexus.

So my problem is that, on the one hand I am excited that I finally pulled full signal, high speed, like I used to on my TB. On the other hand, my phone dropped the call I was on, seconds earlier, in an area that obviously had strong signal. Has anyone out there been experiencing similar? I don't get how my device can constantly just lose ALL signal, and then regain it a minute or two later. Its not because I am in a fringe area.

 

[cerktman]

Great comparison and pretty much what I've found. But I'm surprised you're having issues with calls, I've yet to drop one yet. The sound quality is OK on calls, but I know the Motorolas will usually be better.

OTOH, the best down speed I've gotten was last night, and that was only about 18.

So my question to you is, if you had to keep one phone from your arsenal, which would it be?

Hard question there. I love the form factor of the GNex. Feels great in the hands. Android 4.x is a great mobile platform. On the other hand, with signal performance like I observed this morning, I'm not sure what is going to occur with the GNex with regards to the radios. I still think they need to be looked at by engineers from Samsung and Verizon. See example screenshot below while in Walmart this morning. Have never seen it that bad. It switched to 3G approximately 2 minutes later and I never regained 4G while in the store. It finally switched back to 4G data on the way out of the parking lot. I'll swap back to the 4.02 radios and test again later in the "land of signal emptiness", the vast wasteland of Walmart.

If I really had no choice (i.e., forced ) and had to get rid all of my phones and go to only one, it would have to be the RAZR at this time. While a bit strange to hold, it's performance has been fantastic. No random reboots, data and voice signal are great, I don't have the "bugs" that are seen on the GNex/Android 4.x with it. To boot, battery life is a bit better with the RAZR too and that's always a plus.

Sad thing is that I like the "bugs". I like to fix stuff and make it better by flashing different roms or patches. So I guess that means I should be "forced" to keep all my toys.

 

[theduder]

There are other factors you guys aren't taking into affect. Like how many other people are hitting the same tower you are? What is the back haul like for that tower, etc?

The reason some people in NY are seeing 71mbps is because that is a prime convention spot for verizon so obviously it has the latest and great coverage and 10gb backbone pipes to transfer the data.

Where as those that are seeing 8 - 10mbps they might be in high population area with a less robust back plane. There are also other factors like attrition that come in to play when the signal has to travel further distances. It isn't as simple as, “i have 4 bars I should be getting 60mbps“

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk

Correct. Also, some of the difference can be due to who is hosting the Speedtest server. I was doing tests this morning with "full" bars. Was getting 10ish until I changed to the DC server hosted by Speedtest, and then got close to 30.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk

 

[cerktman]

I thought that as well, but at my job the signal is just as strong indoors as it is outdoors. I tested this two days ago at work. I drove to work on 4G and made sure the wireless radio was turned off so that it wouldn't lock in once I got near my office.

I work in a huge building, probably 10,000-20,000 sq. ft. On the way to work I got anywhere from 2-4 bars and it seems like this is a strong-signal area. Standing just outside the building, I made sure to check the signal and run a speed test. I got 3 bars and good test results.

Then I went in the building and into my office, and still got 3 bars. So I decided to go into the bathroom, which is smack dab in the middle of the entire building. 2 bars, good speed results (for me good speed results are between 15 and 30Mbps.

So I decided to go up to the 2nd floor bathroom and test there (yes, by this time I DID look like a crazy person). The result? 4 bars!

Click to view quoted image


I was a bit shocked by two things: Not only did I have one of my strongest signals ever, but the signal appeared to improve being on the 2nd floor. It actually makes me wonder if there is some type of tower very close by, or some signal extender IN the building somewhere near the top of the building.

Brandon

I have similar results with it too. Just in my house, if I move approximately 10 feet (same floor, just the other side of the room), I can loose a bar of indicated signal (anywhere from 8-10 dBM). LTE signal seems to be very picky with regards to positioning. If I go 1/4 mile from my house, with CLOS (clear line of sight) to tower, I can get full strength signal, an indicated -60 to -70 dBm, and get speed tests above 40mbps down and 20mbps up. But alas, I can't just stand there with CLOS to the towers. I actually need to move around and perform day to day tasks, thus loosing my performance as the signal varies and/or degrades depending on where I'm at.

 

[Tom in Bristol]

I've never seen that 'Network Signal Type - LTE:14' before on mine or anyone's screen shots.

Anyone know what that means?

 

[Droid800]

Whatever it is, whatever we call it, the bottom line is that the Nexus does not give us 4G where other phones do in marginal areas. I just hope the damage done by the Anandtech article can be undone. It's important for the parties involved to understand that this whole bars/displayed signal issue is different than the problem many are seeing in these marginal area. The article should not be used as 'cover' for a real issue.

Damage? Are you kidding me? Its more informative than 99% of the posts here AND its backed up with cold hard facts. If there's any damage, its from people like you trying to diminish what they're saying.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk

 

[bplewis24]

I've never seen that 'Network Signal Type - LTE:14' before on mine or anyone's screen shots.

Anyone know what that means?

That's what mine shows when I'm in LTE mode for "Mobile Network Type." If I change to CDMA mode, it shows "eHRPD:13"

Brandon

 

[CarryMe]

There are other factors you guys aren't taking into affect.

I understand, but certainly the number of 4G LTE towers in your area and how close you are to them is one of the factors that plays into download speeds.

 

[majiklantrn]

I understand, but certainly the number of 4G LTE towers in your area and how close you are to them is one of the factors that plays into download speeds.

Also, the towers have a download and upload bandwidth limit set. For example, the tower I'm connected to is .98 miles away that has a download cap of 5 - 12 Mb/s.

 

[CarryMe]

Also, the towers have a download and upload bandwidth limit set. For example, the tower I'm connected to is .98 miles away that has a download cap of 5 - 12 Mb/s.

I am sure that is responsible for some of the differences then.

 

[majiklantrn]

I am sure that is responsible for some of the differences then.

Oh totally... From bandwidth throttling to tower saturation. Those are just a couple of things that users need to take into consideration.

And I still blame Occupy and the economy for low download speeds, that's just me though.

 

[CarryMe]

Damage? Are you kidding me? Its more informative than 99% of the posts here AND its backed up with cold hard facts.

Clearly there is more to the problem than just the GNex bars showing 4G LTE signal vs. the CDMA signal shown by the bars on the other phones. I think the perceived damage here is that instead of trying to address the other issue(s), V, G and Sammy will say they fixed the bars so nothing more to see here, move along.

The problems are more than just the bars, unless people here are outright lying about what is going on with their phones and I don't see what benefit there would be to them to do that.

 

[Holsum]

I understand, but certainly the number of 4G LTE towers in your area and how close you are to them is one of the factors that plays into download speeds.

Yes absolutely

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk

 

[Ken7]

It's possible that my apartment is a "fringe" area and the other areas I've tested are not. The problem is, since I never considered my Bionic to have coverage issues, I never tested it at my apartment to see what kind of connection it had. I always let it switch over to wireless. Now that I've deactivated the Bionic, I can no longer check.

There is something I can do though. There are 2 blocks where, virtually every time I would drive through with my Bionic, the signal would drop to 3G. I think it is a legitimate fringe area or a dead zone. It's been a few weeks since I've been over there, but I may go over there today with the Nexus and see how it compares.

Brandon

Well I went ahead and picked up a Razr because this whole thing is driving me nuts. I added a line so I have both the Nexus & Razr.

I did some preliminary testing and the results are not quite what I expected. Sitting outside the VZW store, I did a speed test and got about 12 down on the Nexus and about 16 down on the Razr. Did several tests and each time the Razr did a bit better. But, as I've questioned before about these speed tests and their practical meaning, it seemed to make little difference in loading graphic-intensive web pages. Both were very close.

The second thing I did was go to my problematic mall. Parked outside the mall, both phones had 4G and the Razr again beat the Nexus by a fair, but not huge amount. I was ready to go into the mall and decided to do one more test. Surprise on this one! The Nexus out of nowhere pulled down my highest #s yet, about 25 down and 12 up. The Razr did about 12 down and 6 up. I did a couple of tests with similar results. Why? I don't have a clue. Go figure.

Into the mall I went fully expecting the Razr to hold the 4G in the problem area of the mall. Well, another surprise. The Razr dropped 4G and went to 3G while the Nexus held on a bit longer. It too eventually dropped down to 3G. But at that point the Razr dropped all data for a minute or so while I still had a viable connection on the Nexus. Will wonders never cease?

I walked a bit toward the other end of the mall and saw the Razr again dropped all data while the Nexus maintained a 3G, but pretty fast connection. Looked like the Nexus was afraid of being dethroned and did its best to embarrass the Razr.

I came home and results in my house were all over the place. At times I lost the 4G on the Nexus while the Razr had it and then I'd go to a different part of the house and the situation would do a 180.

There was a time the Nexus lost all data for about 5 minutes while the Razr lost it for a few seconds and went back to 4G. I don't know what happened there, but it's clear the results I'm getting so far are all over the place and I couldn't pick a clear winner at this point.

So this actually makes me pretty happy so far, although I still think the Rezound had a better radio than either the Razr or the Nexus.

The rest of the phone is definitely in favor of the Nexus, but man, the speaker in the Razr just trounces the Nexus...just day & night. The screen on the Razr is very nice and despite the higher rez of the Razr, I wouldn't feel badly having the Razr on that count. ICS of course is much nicer than the Razr's OS at this point.

More testing to come. Back to the Giants game.

 

[Ken7]

Hard question there. I love the form factor of the GNex. Feels great in the hands. Android 4.x is a great mobile platform. On the other hand, with signal performance like I observed this morning, I'm not sure what is going to occur with the GNex with regards to the radios. I still think they need to be looked at by engineers from Samsung and Verizon. See example screenshot below while in Walmart this morning. Have never seen it that bad. It switched to 3G approximately 2 minutes later and I never regained 4G while in the store. It finally switched back to 4G data on the way out of the parking lot. I'll swap back to the 4.02 radios and test again later in the "land of signal emptiness", the vast wasteland of Walmart.

Click to view quoted image


If I really had no choice (i.e., forced ) and had to get rid all of my phones and go to only one, it would have to be the RAZR at this time. While a bit strange to hold, it's performance has been fantastic. No random reboots, data and voice signal are great, I don't have the "bugs" that are seen on the GNex/Android 4.x with it. To boot, battery life is a bit better with the RAZR too and that's always a plus.

Sad thing is that I like the "bugs". I like to fix stuff and make it better by flashing different roms or patches. So I guess that means I should be "forced" to keep all my toys.

Wow, I'm surprised you're even showing 4G with a lousy strength like that!

So far I'm not seeing any big differences between the Razr and Nexus, they both are all over the place. I would say the Razr down speeds, on average, are somewhat higher than the Nexus, but I just don't see that translate to real world differences. For me, the loading of web pages is where 'the rubber meets the road'. Despite differences in Speed Test results it doesn't seem to translate to web page loading.

 

[Ken7]

Correct. Also, some of the difference can be due to who is hosting the Speedtest server. I was doing tests this morning with "full" bars. Was getting 10ish until I changed to the DC server hosted by Speedtest, and then got close to 30.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk

And this is why I'm just not sure how valuable these tests are. We're all comparing different locations on different servers and we've seen that even at the same location speeds can vary depending on what server you choose. It might be more valuable to time the loading of a graphics-intensive web page.

 

[Ken7]

Damage? Are you kidding me? Its more informative than 99% of the posts here AND its backed up with cold hard facts. If there's any damage, its from people like you trying to diminish what they're saying.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk

I'm not trying to 'diminish' what they're saying, but my concern is that it causes the parties that can initiate improvements in the phone's radio to take their eyes off the ball. There is a difference. The problems that people are having don't relate, IMO, to what Anandtech was discussing. Some can, potentially, use their findings to say 'see, there's nothing wrong with the radio'.

If you don't agree that's fine, we shall agree to disagree.