Android Cheap iPhones?

[Johnly]

 

[Ry]

Is it 3.7 or 3.5? Either way, I totally agree, for me, it's too small. I honestly fee like Apple has painted itself into a corner, so to speak, with the screen size. At this point it will be difficult for them to go with a larger screen, not impossible, just difficult. Given the incredible amount of apps that exist for that screen size, asking all developers to update (or not, at the risk of their app looking bad on a larger screen) is a huge task. I hope they do, though, it would be nice.

I think I'm in the minority. I don't think Apple needs to go bigger than 3.5" for the iPhone screen. They're in such a great position that they don't have to change right now.

 

[Ry]

Because they made android affordable to everyone!
Which is Great!
The only reason why apple users feel their product is superior is because they pay so much for it... that's all. The allure of the iPhone/iPad is dying off quickly though.

sent from a Android device
I'm always on!

Pay so much? Let me go get a 3GS from Walmart for 99 cents on contract.

 

[Ry]

But it seems many Android developers are not being diligent enough in updating the apps for ICS then... It's a little blunt to say it but some people do care about using the apps they want on a device they want...

It might also have to do with ICS's market penetration. If only 3% of all Android devices, as a developer how.much effort would you put into ICS development?

It's sort of a chicken/egg situation.

Same thing with apps in general. Android users tend to use free versions of games and apps. I work in the mobile gaming industry and have seen the difference. In our products that have both iOS and Android versions, the iOS version usually outsells the Android version, sometimes 100 to 1.

A good friend of mine has the same game available for iOS and Android - both Play Store and Amazon App Store. He makes more from the Amazon App Store than the Google Play Store.

 

[Speedygi]

It might also have to do with ICS's market penetration. If only 3% of all Android devices, as a developer how.much effort would you put into ICS development?

It's sort of a chicken/egg situation.

Same thing with apps in general. Android users tend to use free versions of games and apps. I work in the mobile gaming industry and have seen the difference. In our products that have both iOS and Android versions, the iOS version usually outsells the Android version, sometimes 100 to 1.

Thank you!

 

[pazzo02]

I think I'm in the minority. I don't think Apple needs to go bigger than 3.5" for the iPhone screen. They're in such a great position that they don't have to change right now.

The only problem I have with that is the fact that my Inspire with its 4.3" screen is almost exactly the same size as my wife's iPhone with its 3.5" screen. So iPhone loses for a person who's first preference is screen size, although that is probably a small percentage of consumers.

 

[Maikai.Guy]

NBA Jam also runs with bugs on ICS, and so does DrawSomething...

I am not just saying these things aren't available, some are, and others work poorly or doesn't work at all on ICS. This is just one concern of mine and I am just putting them out here.

Based on the conversation I have prior to you replying to this particular train of thought was just me proving that maybe the IOS app store seems more reliable in providing updated apps for their current OS versions.

Is all I am saying...

haha did I do something to your coffee this morning? :-!

I thought that coffee tasted funny!!

There were a few posts about incompatibilities and it seemed like the problem was rampant. This struck me odd, since I've never heard of the issue before.

I'm not sure how you got to the conclusion that the iOS apps store (or it's developers) are more reliable. Lanhoj seems to be involved specifically in this segment of the market and it certainly seems to me he's saying iOS developers are generally worse than Android developers.

I work for a major Developer and games as simple as Words With Friends, Tetris, or Scrabble take months to just put out an update due to how many things need to be checked. With the Android versions, Developers generally want to go back as far as 1.5 whereas on iOS most don't bother with anything below 3.0 anymore.

Personally, even if it was the other way 'round, I don't think this matters much. If a developer was making money on an app, you can bet he's going to update that app, whether it's on iOS or Android or both. If the money train left the station, all bets are off... again... not matter the platform. This is a business decision related thing, not an OS related thing.

...and it's certainly not a "build quality" related thing, which is supposed to be the subject matter of this thread.

 

[Ry]

I thought that coffee tasted funny!!

There were a few posts about incompatibilities and it seemed like the problem was rampant. This struck me odd, since I've never heard of the issue before.

I'm not sure how you got to the conclusion that the iOS apps store (or it's developers) are more reliable. Lanhoj seems to be involved specifically in this segment of the market and it certainly seems to me he's saying iOS developers are generally worse than Android developers.



Personally, even if it was the other way 'round, I don't think this matters much. If a developer was making money on an app, you can bet he's going to update that app, whether it's on iOS or Android or both. If the money train left the station, all bets are off... again... not matter the platform. This is a business decision related thing, not an OS related thing.

From my experience, supporting Android takes two to three times more effort than supporting iOS especially if you're not using cross-development tools like Unity or Corona.

 

[Johnly]

Simple, Android gets cheap fast. Remember, it is freeware and these companies want to turn hardware like cookies. The galaxy nexus drops hard (33%) and nothing is in the future to replace it. http://http://forums.androidcentral.com/verizon-galaxy-nexus/169166-verizon-drops-price-199-a.htmlApple wont do that, they are in the software business......4s holds price and will continue. Remember the nexus on sprint below 100 ducks.....truth.

 

[Speedygi]

Plus Android phone manufacturers have each other for competition, it tends to get price elastic.

Apple can rely on its prestige status to justify the higher prices because well the latest is really the latest for them.

Add to them the shorter life cycles of Android phones it's no wonder they get cheap fast, even for high end phones. It is important to note that it's not just the material or the build quality. If you judge solely on the Android mid-range and low-end, sure, Android does seem cheaply built. But it goes beyond that if you look at it holistically IMHO.

Just because Apple pieces its phones with supposedly powerful and therefore über glass doesn't mean the pricing is expensive because of that. Apple has a lot of brand equity and thrives on pricing their products based on that. Their ecosystem is exclusive and the perceived value seems high. No wonder Apple can get away with some of the things they force Carriers to do ...

Does that make Android any less appealing? Look at the market share. I don't think so. It is a different market out there for Android handset manufacturers than it is for Apple.

The market too is catching up. The Galaxy Nexus does price higher than a iPhone these days at least where I live. But they get cheaper fast because as I said, shorter life cycles.

Now, people might be judging the platform by its low end and I don't think the perception is entirely wrong but it tends to be like this in a large industry. Sometimes people generalise.

 

[Ry]

Some people say Android is for people who can't afford the iPhone.

But the way I see it, the prices for iOS devices match up well with Android. iPhones don't seem expensive to me.

 

[Speedygi]

Some people say Android is for people who can't afford the iPhone.

But the way I see it, the prices for iOS devices match up well with Android. iPhones don't seem expensive to me.

But it is, right? With mid range offerings like HTC One V and Sony Xperia Ray?

 

[Ry]

But it is, right? With mid range offerings like HTC One V and Sony Xperia Ray?

Apple has all of the on-contract price points covered.

 

[Johnly]

for a long time too

 

[phonejunky]

The question was:


This is not really a question, but more of a premise that Android hardware is considered cheap and second class by the public. It's just worded as a question, but quickly makes a statement.

IMHO, phonemaster123 (and others) fall victim to the human nature trait of thinking everyone else is like them.

I do not believe "the american tech public" agrees with phonemaster123's premise. If they did, Android phones wouldn't have kicked the ass of iPhone so quickly after being released nor continued to kick iPhone's ass like they have.

And people like me (owned the first 3 iPhones) would have never switched in the first place if we thought Android did not represent the best-in-class phone.

I've tried to point out one very obvious reason why many people might prefer an Android phone, its durability, but the iPhone lovers here tend to vehemently reject any criticism of the iPhone and 100% discount anything good said about Android phones.

Look at your own words regarding an Android phone dropped from shoulder height and surviving, which is a pretty impressive thing if you ask this engineer.



Seriously? Aren't you being just a little unreasonable here? Don't Android phones earn a little green check mark under "durability" and don't iPhones earn a little red minus sign?

Another very striking shortcoming of the iPhone is the small display. Of course Apple immediately tried to head this off with their "retina display" cow pie, but 3.7 inches is so yesterday for most people. Even my sister-in-law, who I believe to be Queen of the iPhone fan-girls, has openly admitted she yearns for a larger screen.

But I'm sure this criticism too will be met with an immediate vehement rejection.

After making it through this entire thread this is the post that stuck out to me. The reason being this quote here

"IMHO, phonemaster123 (and others) fall victim to the human nature trait of thinking everyone else is like them. "

I don't at all believe everyone else is like me, I don't see how you could draw the conclusion from one paragraph. Using the way the question was worded as a basis for that statement is a weak argument. I'm sure most people here and the world abroad don't have an android and iPhone, and don't see the advantages of both as this thread and others have proven. The only thing I believe we all have in common in this forum and others I participate in, is we all have our own opinions on subjects hence why I posed the question I did to see what others had to say about the matter.

End of rant.

 

[Maikai.Guy]

After making it through this entire thread this is the post that stuck out to me. The reason being this quote here

"IMHO, phonemaster123 (and others) fall victim to the human nature trait of thinking everyone else is like them. "

Well... first... it wasn't meant as an insult. It is human nature for us to want to believe everyone is like ourselves. Salespeople exploit this by sometimes mimicking the gestures and posture of the person they are selling to. They only do it for a short time and just to get the person into the proper mindset. Although people's first reaction to sales people is caution, this human frailty of thinking people are similar can be a powerful tool in breaking down interpersonal barriers. Another trick is to remember something someone said that did not relate to business. A month later, repeat that thought back to them as if it were your own. Once a person feels a small connection, the rest comes automatically. They will assume similar moral and ethical positions, even religious and political positions.

After a person thinks this for awhile, with no evidence to the contrary, the assumed similarity fixes itself as fact in the mind. From that point onward, there is a solid foundation for that relationship.

This is a well studied fact of our psyche, something that we are all vulnerable to. The only difference seems to be the young and the old are most susceptible to this kind of manipulation, but we all have this fundamental assumption that other people are like us... even you. This, of course, is assuming you are "normal"... don't have a chemical imbalance and/or are psychotic or something. ;-)

I don't at all believe everyone else is like me, I don't see how you could draw the conclusion from one paragraph. Using the way the question was worded as a basis for that statement is a weak argument. I'm sure most people here and the world abroad don't have an android and iPhone, and don't see the advantages of both as this thread and others have proven. The only thing I believe we all have in common in this forum and others I participate in, is we all have our own opinions on subjects hence why I posed the question I did to see what others had to say about the matter.

End of rant.

You just choose to believe you don't assume people are like you.

It's the way you built the context of your question/statement. You asked a question, but immediately created an assumed condition... the "tech public" believes Android is an inferior, second class device. But your assumed condition is not born out of any data. It's born out of your opinion. The available data tells the opposite story. Looking through the posts, many of them are laundry lists of things bad about Android and good about iPhone, yet the market numbers don't support these assumptions at all.

I believe the group of you prefer iPhone, probably have many friends that prefer iPhone, therefore have a tendency to believe everyone is like you and your friends... thinking Android is inferior and a second class device. You've had no reason to think otherwise for so long that this assumption has fixed itself as fact in your minds.

That's why simple stuff like pointing out the iPhone is recognized by some people as being too small or too fragile or not flexible enough elicits posts of near outrage. Scoffing at the very ideas. This is not normal behavior. Normal behavior would be to provide a counterpoint and back it up with observations and data. Scoffing or proclaiming the argument isn't worth it are telltale signs the assumption is unsupportable... born out of an unreasonable and unsupported belief.

As for the reason you posted the question... Just look at the titles of the threads you started in this section alone... and your original posts within them.

Is Android too open in some aspects?
Google Looking to lose monumental case
Android Cheap iPhones?

They ask a question but only in the context of an assumption... mostly anti-Android/Google. This screams to me of someone wanting to draw like minded people to agree with them... to assure themselves they are correct in their beliefs... to be affirmed.

IMHO, you post these question/assumptions here because only here can you get affirmation. There would be no point in asking the questions or posing the assumption on an Apple forum. Of course everyone would agree with you. But by getting a few people from an Android forum to agree, you feel affirmed... and your unconscious desire to be like everyone else is satisfied.

Until I come along. ;-) Your 45 minutes is up. Next patient please!

But seriously, none of this should be taken as an insult. I'm sure if someone peered into my posts and/or life, they'd find similar things. We are all human. We all want to belong. IMHO, the younger you are, the more you want to deny this, but in the end we are all mostly the same. Evidence to this is all around you. It's really undeniable. Cars, clothes, houses, expressions, even the support-for / desire-to-own an iPhone.

 

[Johnly]

Well... first... it wasn't meant as an insult. It is human nature for us to want to believe everyone is like ourselves. Salespeople exploit this by sometimes mimicking the gestures and posture of the person they are selling to. They only do it for a short time and just to get the person into the proper mindset. Although people's first reaction to sales people is caution, this human frailty of thinking people are similar can be a powerful tool in breaking down interpersonal barriers. Another trick is to remember something someone said that did not relate to business. A month later, repeat that thought back to them as if it were your own. Once a person feels a small connection, the rest comes automatically. They will assume similar moral and ethical positions, even religious and political positions.

After a person thinks this for awhile, with no evidence to the contrary, the assumed similarity fixes itself as fact in the mind. From that point onward, there is a solid foundation for that relationship.

This is a well studied fact of our psyche, something that we are all vulnerable to. The only difference seems to be the young and the old are most susceptible to this kind of manipulation, but we all have this fundamental assumption that other people are like us... even you. This, of course, is assuming you are "normal"... don't have a chemical imbalance and/or are psychotic or something. ;-)


You just choose to believe you don't assume people are like you.

It's the way you built the context of your question/statement. You asked a question, but immediately created an assumed condition... the "tech public" believes Android is an inferior, second class device. But your assumed condition is not born out of any data. It's born out of your opinion. The available data tells the opposite story. Looking through the posts, many of them are laundry lists of things bad about Android and good about iPhone, yet the market numbers don't support these assumptions at all.

I believe the group of you prefer iPhone, probably have many friends that prefer iPhone, therefore have a tendency to believe everyone is like you and your friends... thinking Android is inferior and a second class device. You've had no reason to think otherwise for so long that this assumption has fixed itself as fact in your minds.

That's why simple stuff like pointing out the iPhone is recognized by some people as being too small or too fragile or not flexible enough elicits posts of near outrage. Scoffing at the very ideas. This is not normal behavior. Normal behavior would be to provide a counterpoint and back it up with observations and data. Scoffing or proclaiming the argument isn't worth it are telltale signs the assumption is unsupportable... born out of an unreasonable and unsupported belief.

As for the reason you posted the question... Just look at the titles of the threads you started in this section alone... and your original posts within them.

Is Android too open in some aspects?
Google Looking to lose monumental case
Android Cheap iPhones?

They ask a question but only in the context of an assumption... mostly anti-Android/Google. This screams to me of someone wanting to draw like minded people to agree with them... to assure themselves they are correct in their beliefs... to be affirmed.

IMHO, you post these question/assumptions here because only here can you get affirmation. There would be no point in asking the questions or posing the assumption on an Apple forum. Of course everyone would agree with you. But by getting a few people from an Android forum to agree, you feel affirmed... and your unconscious desire to be like everyone else is satisfied.

Until I come along. ;-) Your 45 minutes is up. Next patient please!

But seriously, none of this should be taken as an insult. I'm sure if someone peered into my posts and/or life, they'd find similar things. We are all human. We all want to belong. IMHO, the younger you are, the more you want to deny this, but in the end we are all mostly the same. Evidence to this is all around you. It's really undeniable. Cars, clothes, houses, expressions, even the support-for / desire-to-own an iPhone.

Okay, why are you directing the context of your responses to how people use the forums? Really, bringing in phonemasters other threads to make a point about his character? Wow, just wow.
I think it I healthy to question things....the propensity to question ones motives is fine with your friends and family, but what happened to the topic? Semantics.

 

[Maikai.Guy]

Okay, why are you directing the context of your responses to how people use the forums? Really, bringing in phonemasters other threads to make a point about his character? Wow, just wow.
I think it I healthy to question things....the propensity to question ones motives is fine with your friends and family, but what happened to the topic? Semantics.

Where do you see I'm making any comments about someone's character? Show me exactly. Show everyone exactly where I made such a comment. Now you're projecting intent where no such intent exists.

You're accusing me of a personal attack, where none exists, simply because you don't like (and are completely unable to counter) what I write. Another sweeping condemnation without a shred of evidence or backup.

The very act of asking what people think about something is, in effect, an act of asking for affirmation. I do it. You do it. People's grandmas do it.

Nothing I said was meant to be insulting, just explaining the root thought process of my opinion, which the OP reacted to. What's your problem? Why not read what I actually write and assume the best, rather than assume the worst and put words in my mouth?

If you ask me about (or react to) something I wrote, I back it up with my thought process. You are more than welcome to tell me where my thought process failed. If you can.

Yeah, what happened to the topic? My comment which the OP reacted to was all about the topic... whether Android was a second class phone. I merely stated that the assumption was flawed and not backed up. I added the reason for this assumption is probably human nature... the fact that people feel most other people are like themselves. He reacted negatively to one sentence in a post that was all about the topic. I simply offered my thought process for that sentence.

Then POW! How dare you! ...and all that. Sheesh.

 

[Speedygi]

MaiKai, The thing that you fail to see in all this is that people don't always operate on Logic, even when it comes to the purchase or a preference for a certain product. People perceive value in a product through usage, and if that usage is met some things can be overlooked. Just look at the Maslow's Hierachy of Needs.

That said, I do agree wholeheartedly that most top-end Android phones have a more durable build quality than the Iphone 4/4S, but that is not the only factor that draws people to a product. It's not the only thing within the Product mix. That's just what I have been pointing out for a long time...

 

[Johnly]

Where do you see I'm making any comments about someone's character? Show me exactly. Show everyone exactly where I made such a comment. Now you're projecting intent where no such intent exists. Look at your last few post, I have fallen victim to an inherent human flaw. Well thank god you have not, because we would all be victims then lol. Why are those types of generalizations always a part of your post? Are you trying to compensate for something?

You're accusing me of a personal attack, where none exists, simply because you don't like (and are completely unable to counter) what I write. Another sweeping condemnation without a shred of evidence or backup.Where did I accuse you of a personal attack? I was referring to the nature of your thread collections and the feeble attempt to process that in your own personal light (perspective.) Why are you trying to call peoples AC characteristic behaviors to make your points about the topic? There are better ways, and you don't need to be an elitist authority to make a good point.

The very act of asking what people think about something is, in effect, an act of asking for affirmation. I do it. You do it. People's grandmas do it.Of course, some people need an adda boy to move forward. Not everyone needs affirmation sir. Sweeping wide generalizations like that, why?

Nothing I said was meant to be insulting, just explaining the root thought process of my opinion, which the OP reacted to. What's your problem? Why not read what I actually write and assume the best, rather than assume the worst and put words in my mouth?Never said you insulted anyone; however, I would never group people into categories by making statements of broad generalizations.

If you ask me about (or react to) something I wrote, I back it up with my thought process. You are more than welcome to tell me where my thought process failed. If you can.I can't tell you if a your process is failed or not, I think you are smart guy. But why try and discredit people here?

Yeah, what happened to the topic? My comment which the OP reacted to was all about the topic... whether Android was a second class phone. I merely stated that the assumption was flawed and not backed up. I added the reason for this assumption is probably human nature... the fact that people feel most other people are like themselves. He reacted negatively to one sentence in a post that was all about the topic. I simply offered my thought process for that sentence.The fact is, it is freeware and android is a advertisement machine and the manufactures may make a few buck by elusive skins, but it is a hardware game. Moto,HTC,Samsung and many others are selling hardware. That is why there is a new android phone every few weeks. It is a business model that sets Androids growth, just like Apples, two different models. You can get a Galaxy nexus for practically nothing these days, where is the "not cheap" in that. I took OP's post to the cost point, it isn't so much about hardware vs hardware, android has some killer hardware with the OS. I want a topi shelf android device of a premium nature with some real cult like following, but as long as Android is open source, it is everyone's game and the differentiation exist by the exotic flavors of android, which is not a bad thing. Android or Apple will never have it all. That is why I like both OS's. It is advantageous to own both, but I concede, Android is kinda the cheep iPhone.

Then POW! How dare you! ...and all that. Sheesh.

You dish it, you can take it.