AT&T bought T-Mobile us

[krazy]

My metaphor is flawed, the constant static should be many shorter but less intense bursts.

I don't really follow and it really doesn't matter. Let's say they both use the same amount of bandwidth and leave it at that.

 

[ls377]

You're just making excuses for why they are weaker. There may be plenty of reasons why AT&T's network sucks but the fact remains it does in fact suck. Meanwhile VZW has not has issues with android and not it does not have issues with android + iphone. It is also at least a year ahead of AT&T in terms of what really matters going forward: LTE. Perhaps AT&T will be able to make up being behind VZW by a year all while integrating a $40B merger. I have my doubts that they'll be able to do this while VZW continues to move forward itself but we'll see.

Not making excuses for why they are weaker, just comparing how good a significantly less built up AT&T is compared to AT&T now.

Have you ever heard the tortoise and the hare?

 

[krazy]

Krazy, I sure hope you know more about investing than you do mobile networks. You'll see what a boost this ends up being for AT&T.

Yeah, we'll see. I'm sure integrating a $40B company will be totally seamless and is not an act of desperation whatsoever.

 

[krazy]

Not making excuses for why they are weaker, just comparing how good a significantly less built up AT&T is compared to AT&T now.

Have you ever heard the tortoise and the hare?

The tortoise is laying on it's back with it's arms and legs flailing. Are you really suggesting that AT&T is a year plus behind VZW in LTE on purpose? What advantage are they gaining by not have LTE up and running in their top 50 markets? And providing LTE service to their top customers?

 

[ls377]

The tortoise is laying on it's back with it's arms and legs flailing. Are you really suggesting that AT&T is a year plus behind VZW in LTE on purpose? What advantage are they gaining by now have LTE up and running in their top 50 markets? And providing LTE service to their top customers?

They have it on one band, 700mhz. AT&T is probably going to have it on two. Plus, they'll be working with whatever developments have happened in the last year.

I doubt they did it on purpose, but compare it to 3G: T-mobile was late to the game, and their 3G network, while limited, is vastly superior to everyone else's. AT&T is far more ahead of where T-mobile was, and has better resources to work with.

 

[krazy]

You keep bring up 700mhz like it's the end all be all. By the time it matters 500mhz will be open and VZW will have all of it because they didn't have to spend $40B just not to become irrelevant and will outbid everyone for it.

I agree both T-mobile and AT&T's networks have major weaknesses. You and some others on this thread seem to think that by combining the two companies they will be able to fill each others holes seemlessly. I on the otherhand have seen enough companies merge and realize how much crap goes along with it to not be nearly as optimistic. I actually hope you're right because competition will be good for all of us but I fear that they are going to just spend time spinning their wheels integrating while VZW continues to pull ahead. Time will tell...

 

[ls377]

You keep bring up 700mhz like it's the end all be all. By the time it matters 500mhz will be open and VZW will have all of it because they didn't have to spend $40B just not to become irrelevant and will outbid everyone for it.

AT&T has their second frequency (or will have it soon). Verizon doesn't. How do you know they'll get it? Sprint is still around, as are all the smaller carriers.

I agree both T-mobile and AT&T's networks have major weaknesses. You and some others on this thread seem to think that by combining the two companies they will be able to fill each others holes seemlessly. I on the otherhand have seen enough companies merge and realize how much crap goes along with it to not be nearly as optimistic. I actually hope you're right because competition will be good for all of us but I fear that they are going to just spend time spinning their wheels integrating while VZW continues to pull ahead. Time will tell...

I don't think it'll go seamlessly, but I think T-mobile has what AT&T needs. It just makes sense for AT&T.

 

[Verdes8891]

You keep bring up 700mhz like it's the end all be all. By the time it matters 500mhz will be open and VZW will have all of it because they didn't have to spend $40B just not to become irrelevant and will outbid everyone for it.

I agree both T-mobile and AT&T's networks have major weaknesses. You and some others on this thread seem to think that by combining the two companies they will be able to fill each others holes seemlessly. I on the otherhand have seen enough companies merge and realize how much crap goes along with it to not be nearly as optimistic. I actually hope you're right because competition will be good for all of us but I fear that they are going to just spend time spinning their wheels integrating while VZW continues to pull ahead. Time will tell...

Are you just going to keep argueing with everyone till we agree verizon is the best? I dont think its going to happen. You are the only one singing that song here. Just relax as this buyout doesnt even affect verizon. Again, relax fan boy

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[krazy]

No one is going to be able to outbid VZW. AT&T will likely add financial leverage (i.e. debt) to do this deal since they aren't likely to issue $40B in stock to pay for it. Sprint is not in a financial position to outbid Verizon and the smaller carriers are at an even greater disadvantage financially.

It does make sense for AT&T, it'll keep them relevant (hopefully) but I still think they'll be a distant second as they have been for the past few years.

 

[krazy]

Are you just going to keep argueing with everyone till we agree verizon is the best? I dont think its going to happen. You are the only one singing that song here. Just relax as this buyout doesnt even affect verizon. Again, relax fan boy

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No facts so you have to move to name calling?

 

[ls377]

No one is going to be able to outbid VZW. AT&T will likely add financial leverage (i.e. debt) to do this deal since they aren't likely to issue $40B in stock to pay for it. Sprint is not in a financial position to outbid Verizon and the smaller carriers are at an even greater disadvantage financially.

It does make sense for AT&T, it'll keep them relevant (hopefully) but I still think they'll be a distant second as they have been for the past few years.

I wouldn't bet against some of the smaller carriers merging together, or maybe just partnering up on a network.

Sprint needs the frequency a lot more than Verizon. The one they got for Wimax is just crap. They'll be willing to spend more than Verizon because their future might depend on it. It might not be enough to beat Verizon, but Verizon won't be as willing to open up the purse as Sprint will.

 

[Verdes8891]

No facts so you have to move to name calling?

And what facts could i possibly bring up to this? It has gone on long enough from boths sides. The facts are att bought out tmobile and it is going to help them, and here you come and throw verizon into the mix. No matter what we say or post or find, there youll come to find some kind of hole to fill with something about verizon and talk down about the rest. So, again, relax fan boy.

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[krazy]

I wouldn't bet against some of the smaller carriers merging together, or maybe just partnering up on a network.

Sprint needs the frequency a lot more than Verizon. The one they got for Wimax is just crap. They'll be willing to spend more than Verizon because their future might depend on it. It might not be enough to beat Verizon, but Verizon won't be as willing to open up the purse as Sprint will.

I don't think you understand how weak Spring is compared to AT&T and VZW. Do you know what "junk bonds" are? Sprint's bonds are "junk" meaning they are non-investment grade. They pay a lot more to borrow money and people are much less willing to lend them money. If Sprint outbids Verizon on bandwidth it's because Verizon lets them. If they both really want the bandwidth there is no way Sprint will outbid VZ. I'm guessing it'll come out that Spring was involved in the bidding for T-Mobile but just didn't have the financial power to get the deal done. That was really Sprints only chance to remain in the game. At this point Sprint's best hope is to buy the prepaid companies and become the premier prepaid company.

 

[krazy]

And what facts could i possibly bring up to this? It has gone on long enough from boths sides. The facts are att bought out tmobile and it is going to help them, and here you come and throw verizon into the mix. No matter what we say or post or find, there youll come to find some kind of hole to fill with something about verizon and talk down about the rest. So, again, relax fan boy.

How do you know it'll help them? What type of M&A analysis did you do to suggest that $39B isn't overpaying? And it'll actually end up hurting them?

 

[ls377]

I don't think you understand how weak Spring is compared to AT&T and VZW. Do you know what "junk bonds" are? Sprint's bonds are "junk" meaning they are non-investment grade. They pay a lot more to borrow money and people are much less willing to lend them money. If Sprint outbids Verizon on bandwidth it's because Verizon lets them. If they both really want the bandwidth there is no way Sprint will outbid VZ. I'm guessing it'll come out that Spring was involved in the bidding for T-Mobile but just didn't have the financial power to get the deal done. That was really Sprints only chance to remain in the game. At this point Sprint's best hope is to buy the prepaid companies and become the premier prepaid company.

If they were involved, Sprint now has that money to do whatever they want with.

I agree that Verizon could easily smash Sprint's bid, I just question their willingness. It depends on how soon they go up for bidding.

 

[krazy]

If they were involved, Sprint now has that money to do whatever they want with.

I agree that Verizon could easily smash Sprint's bid, I just question their willingness. It depends on how soon they go up for bidding.

They didn't have money they probably lined up some financing and planning to issue stock for the rest.

If the bandwidth (700mhz or in the case of the likely next auction 500mhz) is as important as you suggest why wouldn't Verizon smash them? Verizon has been paying down billions of dollars of debt annually in CellCo (their wireless business). It wouldn't even be a strain to outbid Sprint for bandwidth.

 

[ls377]

They didn't have money they probably lined up some financing and planning to issue stock for the rest.

If the bandwidth (700mhz or in the case of the likely next auction 500mhz) is as important as you suggest why wouldn't Verizon smash them? Verizon has been paying down billions of dollars of debt annually in CellCo (their wireless business). It wouldn't even be a strain to outbid Sprint for bandwidth.

Because they might not realize they need it yet. LTE is going to hold up fine on one band for a few years. It's when they start shutting down CDMA that they have to worry about it.

I doubt they'll let it go though. We'll have to wait and see.

 

[krazy]

Because they might not realize they need it yet. LTE is going to hold up fine on one band for a few years. It's when they start shutting down CDMA that they have to worry about it.

I doubt they'll let it go though. We'll have to wait and see.

If you are able to see the importance I'm guessing VZW will but like you said, we'll see.

 

[Baconator]

Because they might not realize they need it yet. LTE is going to hold up fine on one band for a few years. It's when they start shutting down CDMA that they have to worry about it.

I doubt they'll let it go though. We'll have to wait and see.

Yeah, when they start shutting down CDMA for LTE which is GSM, correct, they will run into problems. I am positive it will take them a while to shut it down but over time it might be switched. We will have to see what happens.

All I care about is that I get coverage. I was on that LTE coverage map and hope that in 2-3 yrs it will come. Hopefully 3G by the end of the year.

 

[Verdes8891]

How do you know it'll help them? What type of M&A analysis did you do to suggest that $39B isn't overpaying? And it'll actually end up hurting them?

And what, just because your an investor makes you more qualified to make that call? I think a team of consultants on both companies that can to that choice are more understanding of it then all of us on these forums.

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